My (temporary) Medicare Card arrived this week...

[DKW 86 7,410]

First, apologies to Tex and homer. In have been a prick this week and i know it.

I have been a little over the top this week and i am going to confess why. Wednesday, Christmas Eve, i got a letter from the VA. If you know me, you know that i have been fighting the VA over my records/benefits for 8+ Years. I have dealt with the insanity of the Federal Government more than some of you ever will.

The VA dismissed me 2-3 times depending on who is counting. They shut down my application process without warning at least twice. At one point, i was part of 980K applications backlogged at the VA. I got the shaft multiple times from the VA in other ways as well: appointments cancelled, etc. After 8 years, with the help of Senator Sessions, Senator Shelby, and Representative Mo Brooks, i finally got to actually talk with a real live VA Rep. She was so interested in me that she asked me about my military service.

PhD VA Rep: "Mr Ward, what did you do in the military?"

Me: "I was a nuclear qualified mechanical operator serving on submarines."

Swear to God the next line is absolutely true...

PhD VA Rep: "And what branch of the service were you in?"

Me: (totally f'in disgusted with the entire federal govt at this point) "The US Navy, you know, the one with the submarines in it."

Anyone that is under the delusion that the "Federal Family" gives a damn about you is just stupid.

After 8 years of run around, after total indifference from every single member of the VA, after getting how much they could not care less about me shoved down my throat, you want to know the best part?

Wednesday, they sent me my Medicare Card. ( I am only 52) The Federal Govt has now officially declared the VA to be so f'ed up that they are sending VA folks out into the real world to get medical coverage. Hey, at least the Federal Govt has admitted what the rest of the thinking world has known for years, They are sssooo f'in incompetent that they cant run what was just a few years ago pointed to as a beacon of Fed Govt wisdom and efficiency.

[around4ever 4,139]

Unbelieva... Wait, no it's not.

[AURaptor 1,121]

So... the answer the VA has to treat those in its care is to direct them to the private sector ?

Huh.

[icanthearyou 4,462]

I wonder if you would get better results by going to the press rather than your "representatives"?

[WarTim 3,456]

So typical. Prayers for getting to the end of this MESS. Thank you for your service to our Country.

[DKW 86 7,410]

I know some of you dont understand my bitterness about this. But i dont think it is about ME why i am so freakin bitter. It is about those guys i served with that dont have 8 years to wait to get simple VA matters taken care of. It is about the buck privates from Korea and Vietnam that were denied their benefits and werent able to fight the system for 8 years. It is about the high school dropout or barely graduated that gets intimidated by the VA dealing with them and fighting them and being lied to and just flat out being dismissed because they VA folks are just not going to be bothered.

My visit to the VA in HSV it was sssooo crowded that i had to go sit in the mentally ill section and ponder just what the VA means to some folks. It means they get treated so the can continue to work and be the bread winner for their family a few more years. Some of the folks there spend hours waiting to see a doctor, or a specialist, or for meds. It is a sad sad joke that borders on a crime.

On the upside, maybe the folks in DC have finally admitted defeat and are just going to hand out Medicare-like cards. Mine is temporary. It is not longterm. But maybe that is THE answer.

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

[homersapien 11,347]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

Not to worry. The oil alone will pay for everything. :-\

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

Not to worry. The oil alone will pay for everything. :-\

Wishful thinking by the Cheney lovers.

[DKW 86 7,410]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

To Tex's point: Yes the one of the two wars werent necessary at all. But you know, the VA should have still been prepared, It is not like there were 200K wounded veterans that showed up over nite. To EMT's Point: My fight with the VA started in 2006. Things have only gotten worse since then. They have not gotten better.

PBO campaigned on making the VA better. While he tried, he did get the VA budget increased, the VA Bureaucracy just would not let the care/service get any better.

AND i know some on here are saying: "Well, you are getting covered now." That is true, but you have to remember, it took 8+ years to get here.

[homersapien 11,347]

Well if we really want to examine the partisan political aspects of supporting veterans, let's examine some recent history:

Senate GOP Obstructionists Throw Veterans Under The Bus-Vote Down Bill To Help Vets In Need Of Jobs

9/23/2012 @ 4:29PM

For those who continue to believe that obstructionism at any cost is not the goal of the Senate Republicans, consider the behavior of the GOP Senators who, on Friday, blocked a bi-partisan effort to pass a bill that would put veterans to work

in jobs that look after the nation’s federal land while also giving our fighting men and women a leg up when it comes to getting them hired by local police and fire departments.

The legislation would have provided a relatively small allocation of $1 billion in funds to accomplish the goals of the program.

In order to bring the bill to the floor, a procedural vote was required to waive a technical limit placed on such spending as agreed to in Congress during last year’s budgetary fiasco.

Despite the sum of money having been fully offset by cuts and modifications to other planned expenditures, Senate Republicans used the required vote to shoot down the proposed legislation

as the Democrats, with some Republican assistance, were able to manage only 58 of the 60 votes required to accomplish the waiver.

GOP blocks COLA on benefits for disabled veterans and survivors

September 28, 2012

Despite what has traditionally been overwhelming support both in the past and unanimous support earlier this year in the U.S. House of Representatives,

the Chairperson of the U.S. Senate Committee on Veterans’ Affairs announced on Thursday that at least one Republican Senator was holding up a bill which would provide a cost of living adjustment (COLA) on benefits for disabled veterans and the spouses and children of deceased veterans.

...

Earlier in September Republicans in the Senate blocked a bill which would have helped veterans gain employment.

Meanwhile at the end of August President Barack Obama signed an Executive Order improving the mental health services for veterans

, military members and their families.

Meet the 40 Senate Republicans Who Betrayed Veterans By Killing $1 Billion in Jobs

Forty Republican members of the United States Senate betrayed veterans today when they decided that denying President Obama a victory was more important than spending $1 billion to create jobs for vets.

The Veterans Job Corps Act of 2012 would have spent $1 billion over five years to put veterans to work tending to federal lands, and in the nation’s police and fire departments. Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA) based her plan of FDR’s Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC), but Republicans opposed the bill because they said there is no proof that it would work.

Republican Sen. Tom Coburn claimed that there is no evidence that jobs for vets will work,

“What we have is a bill that’s brought to the floor that has good intentions behind but shows the absolute laziness of congress in terms of really digging things out.

...

Here are the 40 Republicans who voted to keep America’s veterans unemployed,

Alexander (R-TN)

Ayotte (R-NH)

Barrasso (R-WY)

Blunt (R-MO)

Boozman (R-AR)

Burr (R-NC)

Chambliss (R-GA)

Coats (R-IN)

Coburn (R-OK)

Cochran (R-MS)

Corker (R-TN)

Cornyn (R-TX)

Crapo (R-ID)

DeMint (R-SC)

Enzi (R-WY)

Graham (R-SC)

Grassley (R-IA)

Hatch (R-UT)

Hoeven (R-ND)

Hutchison (R-TX)

Isakson (R-GA)

Johanns (R-NE)

Johnson (R-WI)

Kyl (R-AZ)

Lee (R-UT)

Lugar (R-IN)

McCain (R-AZ)

McConnell (R-KY)

Moran (R-KS)

Paul (R-KY)

Portman (R-OH)

Risch (R-ID)

Roberts (R-KS)

Rubio (R-FL)

Sessions (R-AL)

Shelby (R-AL)

Thune (R-SD)

Toomey (R-PA)

Vitter (R-LA)

Wicker (R-MS)

GOP Voted Against 7 Bills to Help Veterans

MAY 16, 2012

War on Error

...

Bill's Blocked By Republican's Since President Obama Took Office.

David Gregory, John McCain, and the media aren't covering this story so we have to.

Here's a concise extraction for easy viewing for those who are INTERESTED IN VETERANS ISSUES and need to know which party supports veterans and which party does not.

The rejected Bills are named:

H.R. 466 – Wounded Veteran Job Security Act became H. R. 2875.

H.R. 1168 -- Veterans Retraining Act

H.R. 1171 – Homeless Veterans Reintegration Program Reauthorization

H.R. 1172 -- Requiring List on VA Website of Organizations Providing Scholarships for Veterans

H.R. 1293 -- Disabled Veterans Home Improvement and Structural Alteration Grant Increase Act of 2009

H.R. 1803 -- Veterans Business Center Act

H.R. 2352 – Job Creation Through Entrepreneurship Act

DETAILS OF BILLS REJECTED BY REPUBLICANS:

H.R. 466 – Wounded Veteran Job Security Act – This bill would actually provide job security for veterans who are receiving medical treatment for injuries suffered while fighting in defense of their country. It would prohibit employers from terminating employees who miss work while receiving treatment for a service-related disability.

H.R. 1168 -- Veterans Retraining Act – This bill would provide for assistance to help veterans who are currently unemployed with their expenses while retraining for the current job market.

H.R. 1171 – Homeless Veterans Reintegration Program Reauthorization – This bill would reauthorize programs in support of homeless veterans, to assist them with job training, counseling, and placement services through the Department of Veterans Affairs through 2014.

H.R. 1172 -- Requiring List on VA Website of Organizations Providing Scholarships for Veterans which does nothing more than direct the Department of Veterans Affairs to include information about scholarships for veterans.

H.R. 1293 -- Disabled Veterans Home Improvement and Structural Alteration Grant Increase Act of 2009 – Here’sanother bill in support of those who have fought for their country, passed by House Democrats and blocked from becoming law by Republicans.

This would increase the amount paid by the VA to disabled veterans for necessary home structural improvements from $4,100 to $6,800 for those who are more than 50% disabled, and from $1,200 to $2,000 who are less than 50%, disabled. This means, if a veteran lost the use of his legs in service of his country, the country will pay for the wheelchair ramp so that he can live at home.

By the way, the last time this ceiling was lifted was in 1992. There isn't even a fiscal reason for being against this bill, as the total cost of this bill, according to CBO estimates, would be a “whopping” $20 million. That's about a quarter (25 cents) per family of four.

H.R. 1803 -- Veterans Business Center Act – This bill would set up a Veterans Business Center program within the Small Business Administration, which would specialize in such programs as grants for service-disabled veterans, help them develop business plans and secure business opportunities. In other words, folks, it would create jobs and offer opportunities those who have fought in defense of our country.

H.R. 2352 – Job Creation Through Entrepreneurship Act – This bill essentially combines a number of other bills that Republicans had blocked in the Senate previously, and adds a few elements. The bill would again establish a Veterans Business Center Program; .... it would establish a Military Entrepreneurs Program; ...

Republicans Vote Against Increased VA Funding

Two billion to rescue our ailing VA system as new vets flood the system? Not necessary. apparently.

From the <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 />Washington Post: (with thanks to jmarshall on our comment board)

"

Republicans beat back a Democratic attempt to provide almost $2 billion in additional health care funding for veterans. rejecting claims that Department of Veterans Affairs hospitals are in crisis.

"

VA hospitals are doing just fine. huh? Tell that to Jeremy Lewis or Denver Jones - just two of the thousands of Iraq vets who came home to months of bureaucracy and delayed treatment. But it's not just Iraq vets who think the VA needs some help.

Major GOP Donor Arrested in $100 Million Veteran Charity Scam

May 02, 2012 08:30 AM

The U.S. Marshal Service announced Tuesday that it had captured one of America’s Most Wanted fugitives who is accused of creating a fake charity for Navy veterans that funneled some of the $100 million collected to Republican candidates.

Between the early 2000s and 2010, a man using the alias "Bobby Thompson" collected millions from unsuspecting donors for the charity U.S. Navy Veterans Association (USNVA), which claimed to provide support for members of the U.S. Armed Forces. Officials believe that very little, if any, of the money was ever used as intended, according to the U.S. Marshal Service.

To help legitimize his charity, Thompson allegedly donated part of the ill-gotten funds to Republican candidates like former President George W. Bush, former Republican presidential candidate John McCain and House Speaker John Boehner.

Republican Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli reportedly personally pleaded with Thompson for donations and received $55,000 for his effort, making Thompson Cuccinelli's second-largest donor. Cuccinelli was eventually forced to turn over the tainted money to veterans support groups.

Walter Reed Scandal Unfolds with General's Firing

Questions are being raised about the new commander in charge of the Army's Walter Reed Army Medical Center, a day after the previous general in charge was fired.

The shuffle at Walter Reed takes place two weeks after a series of articles in The Washington Post exposed troubling conditions at the Washington, D.C., facility.

The paper described a medical bureaucracy that left hundreds of wounded Iraqi vets wading through mountains of paperwork as they tried to obtain medical care. The Post also reported on the poor condition of rooms used by some veterans receiving treatment at the hospital.

Witness slams 'nightmares' of Army medical system

POSTED: 1:51 a.m. EST, March 6, 2007

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Witnesses told a House panel Monday that wounded U.S. soldiers are forced to struggle against a nightmarish and untrustworthy Army medical system that leaves veterans stranded in unfit conditions.

Two Iraq war veterans and the wife of a third gave heartbreaking, at times stunning, tales of neglect at the now notorious Walter Reed Army Medical Center.

The panel was convened in the wake of a scandal triggered by The Washington Post's detailing of problems at the hospital.

Bachmann Takes Heat From Veterans' Group for Proposing Benefits Cuts

Conservative Rep. Michele Bachmann is taking heat from the nation's largest combat veterans' organization for proposing, as part of a broad list of spending cuts, a combination of reductions and caps in veterans' benefits.

"No way, no how, will we let this proposal get any traction in Congress," Richard Eubank, head of Veterans of Foreign Wars, said in a written statement released Friday.

The Minnesota Republican congresswoman, who is positioning herself as a leading critic of the Obama administration in the wake of the midterm elections, earlier this week outlined $400 billion worth of possible spending cuts. The plan projected huge savings from drastic measures like abolishing the Department of Education, overhauling farm subsidies and eliminating a host of Justice Department grants and programs.

Tucked into the outline was $4.5 billion in cuts targeting veterans. She proposed capping increases for health care spending at the Department of Veterans Affairs and cutting disability payments

"to account for (Social Security) disability payments."

Will any responsible journalist confront the GOP hypocrites about this?

*not comprehensive, I don't have all day.

http://www.dailykos....rting-veterans#

[DKW 86 7,410]

homer i hear your point loudly, but even after the VA Budget was increased by $800M+ it didnt improve the care/service at all.

The Reps have been too zealous in trying to cut the budget. The Dems have been too lax in their oversight.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

[autigeremt 6,560]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

Yes, but you rarely accept your sides fault throughout our nations history. It's a two party failure and both sides have irrational motives in relation to the peoples individual freedom. Good to know you are willing to accept it.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

Yes, but you rarely accept your sides fault throughout our nations history. It's a two party failure and both sides have irrational motives in relation to the peoples individual freedom. Good to know you are willing to accept it. ;)/>

My side? I'm not a big fan of either party nor have I ever been registered with either. Over the last 15 years Republicans have been the least reasonable, on the whole, and on this forum most of the attacks on Obama are excessive and over the top and that's what you typically see me responding to. Our country has made plenty of bipartisan mistakes over the years, including the wars we've discussed. In about a year we will be enduring an uninspired election between two candidates who are unlikely to provide much reason for excitement or optimism. Hooray.

[alexava 6,972]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

Yes, but you rarely accept your sides fault throughout our nations history. It's a two party failure and both sides have irrational motives in relation to the peoples individual freedom. Good to know you are willing to accept it. ;)/>

My side? I'm not a big fan of either party nor have I ever been registered with either. Over the last 15 years Republicans have been the least reasonable, on the whole, and on this forum most of the attacks on Obama are excessive and over the top and that's what you typically see me responding to. Our country has made plenty of bipartisan mistakes over the years, including the wars we've discussed. In about a year we will be enduring an uninspired election between two candidates who are unlikely to provide much reason for excitement or optimism. Hooray.

what does that mean? i may be showing some ignorance but i have always heard of people being a "registered (party).." I vote in every election since '91 and i have not to my knowledge registered or been asked to register for a party.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

Yes, but you rarely accept your sides fault throughout our nations history. It's a two party failure and both sides have irrational motives in relation to the peoples individual freedom. Good to know you are willing to accept it. ;)/>

My side? ;)/> I'm not a big fan of either party nor have I ever been registered with either. Over the last 15 years Republicans have been the least reasonable, on the whole, and on this forum most of the attacks on Obama are excessive and over the top and that's what you typically see me responding to. Our country has made plenty of bipartisan mistakes over the years, including the wars we've discussed. In about a year we will be enduring an uninspired election between two candidates who are unlikely to provide much reason for excitement or optimism. Hooray.

what does that mean? i may be showing some ignorance but i have always heard of people being a "registered (party).." I vote in every election since '91 and i have not to my knowledge registered or been asked to register for a party.

Depends on the states primary laws. Some require party affiliation to vote. In others, folks may still choose party membership.

[autigeremt 6,560]

Oh.....so now Texas has decided to become unaffiliated? You are seeing the light. Welcome to the new generation.

[alexava 6,972]

YOU have every right to talk about it and it serves the rest of us if we have to request service through the VA. And liberals wonder why some of us have so little faith in government.

Neo-cons start the two longest wars in our history, flood the VA Hospital system (which has historically worked reasonably well) with patients and then finds a way to slam liberals. Sounds about par for the course.

Yeah....it's all on them (never mind those who supported those actions from the left).The VA has been suspect for many, many years. Have you ever heard of LBJ? How screwed up did that war leave us????

VN was bad enough that folks should have learned a lesson. We are still incurring financial costs as a nation and many veterans still suffer from that mistake. Now we've greatly compounded those problems.

Btw , I was responding to the gratuitous political shot you needlessly worked into this thread.

They are intertwined. The GOP is equally at fault, but Democrats can't hide from the fact that they haven't done a thing to provide support to Vets through the VA. They had a chance and like their counterparts they blew it.

BTW, Afghanistan should have happened. Iraq not so much.

Attacking Al Qaeda in Afghanistan needed to happened. 13+ years of failed nation building did not. That was always folly.

That's not my point of contention but Democrats have failed at these long, drawn out wars so it's not just a GOP or Democrat trait.

Never claimed it was.

Yes, but you rarely accept your sides fault throughout our nations history. It's a two party failure and both sides have irrational motives in relation to the peoples individual freedom. Good to know you are willing to accept it. ;)/>

My side? ;)/> I'm not a big fan of either party nor have I ever been registered with either. Over the last 15 years Republicans have been the least reasonable, on the whole, and on this forum most of the attacks on Obama are excessive and over the top and that's what you typically see me responding to. Our country has made plenty of bipartisan mistakes over the years, including the wars we've discussed. In about a year we will be enduring an uninspired election between two candidates who are unlikely to provide much reason for excitement or optimism. Hooray.

what does that mean? i may be showing some ignorance but i have always heard of people being a "registered (party).." I vote in every election since '91 and i have not to my knowledge registered or been asked to register for a party.

Depends on the states primary laws. Some require party affiliation to vote. In others, folks may still choose party membership.

you may already know but you choose which party to vote in each primary in alabama but i never considered that as a registration. i may be wrong. i never lived anywhere else.