cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2560750 Edited February 27, 2015 by cooltigger21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexava 6,769 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 The military is not happy with it either. On a totally different subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUTUmike 79 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtone...article/2560750 I've seen this statement made and it certainly appears to be baseless. Can you explain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtone...article/2560750 I've seen this statement made and it certainly appears to be baseless. Can you explain? The handguns that use this ammo are around a grand each so your average street criminal isn't going to get one. They'd rather go with something else cheaper. The ammo isn't exactly cheap either. Police have often said they worry more about the small gun that is easier to hide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarAJEagle 5 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtone...article/2560750 I've seen this statement made and it certainly appears to be baseless. Can you explain? The handguns that use this ammo are around a grand each so your average street criminal isn't going to get one. They'd rather go with something else cheaper. The ammo isn't exactly cheap either. Police have often said they worry more about the small gun that is easier to hide. Exactly. I don't think a criminal is going to go out and buy a $1500 FN 5.7 either. Another gross encroachment on the second amendment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDM4AU 280 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 There really aren't many people out there that have AR's in the whole scheme of things. There are a ton more people out there with .308 hunting rifles. The government just keeps kicking that nest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarTim 3,192 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I wonder...Will "We the People" allow this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 I wonder...Will "We the People" allow this? This is one issue where people will not roll over and just take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 14,619 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Obama/Bloomberg couldn't win their gun control goals in the recent elections so now they are trying this tactic. I'm pretty sure they will fail and about all they will accomplish is driving the price of that ammo way, way up as those that have such a firearm will start hoarding. Really, in the past six years this administration has done more for gun and ammunition manufacturers than anything short of a world war could have done. "If you don't have over 1,000 rounds stored up, you aren't trying!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Obama/Bloomberg couldn't win their gun control goals in the recent elections so now they are trying this tactic. I'm pretty sure they will fail and about all they will accomplish is driving the price of that ammo way, way up as those that have such a firearm will start hoarding. Really, in the past six years this administration has done more for gun and ammunition manufacturers than anything short of a world war could have done. "If you don't have over 1,000 rounds stored up, you aren't trying!" Hoarding has been going on for some time now. Ever since the DHS starting stockpiling ammo, people started buying it and stocking it in large quantities themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strychnine 1,756 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 On my list of least favorite law enforcement agencies, the BATFE comes in at number one. I do find them perplexing and inconsistent though. For example, they can get quite anal about 922r compliance parts in imported parts kit AK's, but they allow Sig's stabilizing brace to be fitted to AK or AR pistols (and used in the manner of a stock) without requiring them be registered as SBR's. They also allow the Magpul angled-foregrip or hand stops to be used on AK or AR pistols without requiring them to be registered as SBR's. Both of those rulings surprised us firearm enthusiasts; they were unexpectedly permissive. Prior to that, the common assumption was that if you are asking the ATF if you can do something, expect the answer to be "no". Then they move to reclassify a specific 5.56 round as AP, which is more of a nod to their 922r anal nature. I obviously disagree with the ATF on issues of ammo classification, but I must confess that I never understood the appeal of M855 to AR owners. The military created the M855A1 to replace it for a reason, primarily its poor performance in the field with the shorter barrels of M4's (it was designed to pass penetration tests with longer-barreled LMG's). The biggest problem it faces for AR users is that it was designed to burn and accelerate in a 20" barrel. In the shorter barrel of M4's (14.5"), or most AR's (16-18"), the muzzle velocity drops fast beyond 100 meters and more debris gets pushed back in the gas tube. In the civilian world, classic M193 is still better in AR's than M855, until M855A1 becomes widely available. That said, I always suggest avoiding the issue by putting away the .22's and buying 7.62. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) This country is headed for a defining moment. We may have already passed it for all I know. We're either going to go full scale socialist, which is where the democratic party wants to go, or we're going to have a huge backlash to all this power grabbing. I don't know honestly what will happen. Edited February 27, 2015 by cooltigger21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 9,752 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 This country is headed for a defining moment. We may have already passed it for all I know. We're either going to go full scale socialist, which is where the democratic party wants to go, or we're going to have a huge backlash to all this power grabbing. I don't know honestly what will happen. :-\ How old are you anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 This country is headed for a defining moment. We may have already passed it for all I know. We're either going to go full scale socialist, which is where the democratic party wants to go, or we're going to have a huge backlash to all this power grabbing. I don't know honestly what will happen. :-\/> How old are you anyway? How blind are you anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 9,752 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 This country is headed for a defining moment. We may have already passed it for all I know. We're either going to go full scale socialist, which is where the democratic party wants to go, or we're going to have a huge backlash to all this power grabbing. I don't know honestly what will happen. :-\/> How old are you anyway? How blind are you anyway? About +4, but assuming you are speaking figuratively, how about setting me straight. Direct me to whatever site you are getting this from. Or just expound on what you think it is specifically that I am so blind to. And what do you mean by "full scale socialist"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUTUmike 79 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtone...article/2560750 I've seen this statement made and it certainly appears to be baseless. Can you explain? The handguns that use this ammo are around a grand each so your average street criminal isn't going to get one. They'd rather go with something else cheaper. The ammo isn't exactly cheap either. Police have often said they worry more about the small gun that is easier to hide. Exactly. I don't think a criminal is going to go out and buy a $1500 FN 5.7 either. Another gross encroachment on the second amendment. That makes sense. Is this ammunition armor-piercing though? To me, no ammo should be legal that is armor-piercing regardless of the price of the weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strychnine 1,756 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 In s breathtaking act of hubris the ATF now wants to ban the 5.56 mm ammo by classifying it as armor piercing. This is supposed to protect police but that's just the talking point since criminals don't use this. Anybody still think this administration isn't anti 2nd amendment and anti constitution? http://m.washingtone...article/2560750 I've seen this statement made and it certainly appears to be baseless. Can you explain? The handguns that use this ammo are around a grand each so your average street criminal isn't going to get one. They'd rather go with something else cheaper. The ammo isn't exactly cheap either. Police have often said they worry more about the small gun that is easier to hide. Exactly. I don't think a criminal is going to go out and buy a $1500 FN 5.7 either. Another gross encroachment on the second amendment. That makes sense. Is this ammunition armor-piercing though? To me, no ammo should be legal that is armor-piercing regardless of the price of the weapon. In order to address that question, you must first define what type of "armor" you are talking about. If you are talking about the standard body armor / ballistic vest worn by police officers, then basically all centerfire rifle rounds are "armor-piercing" in street engagement ranges. The 5.7 mentioned above was indeed designed for higher velocities, flatter trajectory, less ammo weight, and yes, to penetrate ballistic vests. Standard 5.7 duty load (SS190) is classified as armor-piercing, and is not commercially available. 5.7 is also limited in that the ammo is not as widely available as standard calibers, it is more expensive than standard calibers, and there are not many weapons that use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AURaptor 1,113 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oh sure, everyone will agree that THESE bullets should be illegal, and harder to obtain. Then the next ban comes... and the next... and another... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oh sure, everyone will agree that THESE bullets should be illegal, and harder to obtain. Then the next ban comes... and the next... and another... It's like everything else. They are never satisfied. Once they achieve infringing on your freedom a little they then move a little further down the road. If he thought he could get away with it, he'd just confiscate all the guns right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarAJEagle 5 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 In other news: I went and bought an M&P 15 Sport today on sale for $535 at my LGS. Thanks Obama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 9,752 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oh sure, everyone will agree that THESE bullets should be illegal, and harder to obtain. Then the next ban comes... and the next... and another... Yeah, next thing you know rpg's are banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autigeremt 5,677 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) The courts will decide it. Most people I know who have AR's reload their rounds. This will only increase the demand for powder, lead heads, e And on top of that....most AR platform firearms that I've seen around here come in .22 or .308 cal. This new rule will do nothing. Personally I would rather have the .308 anyway. Edited February 28, 2015 by autigeremt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) The courts will decide it. Most people I know who have AR's reload their rounds. This will only increase the demand for powder, lead heads, e And on top of that....most AR platform firearms that I've seen around here come in .22 or .308 cal. This new rule will do nothing. Personally I would rather have the .308 anyway. Don't get bogged down in the details. It's not the particular gun or ammo that is the issue. It's about the hubris and attitude of the left and this administration in particular toward the 2nd amendment. Gun ownership is the essence of self reliance and that is anathema to the left. The left despises gun ownership and some members of congress even have just advocated scrapping it altogether. They won't ever do that but at least that would be honest. No they just incrementally encroach on your freedom. Make you jump through a few more hoops take away one firearm or piece of ammo at a time. It's like the old frog and a pot of water on a stove. If they did it all at once there would be a revolt. If they do it a little at a time and make it for the children or to protect the police or some such something they can move a little further down the road until you wake up one day and wonder what happened to your freedom. By that time it's too late. Rest assured they will not stop here. Even if a court strikes it down, they'll just adjust tactics. They'll use tools like making it near impossible for gun and ammo manufacturers to get financing to run their businesses. Oh wait they've already done that with operation choke point. They make the move ahead of time and by the time it eventually gets struck down by the courts the damage has been done. Edited February 28, 2015 by cooltigger21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexava 6,769 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oh sure, everyone will agree that THESE bullets should be illegal, and harder to obtain. Then the next ban comes... and the next... and another... Yeah, next thing you know rpg's are banned. then land mines and pipe bombs. We're oppressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 9,752 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oh sure, everyone will agree that THESE bullets should be illegal, and harder to obtain. Then the next ban comes... and the next... and another... Yeah, next thing you know rpg's are banned. then land mines and pipe bombs. We're oppressed. Well, at least they can't ban "Molotov cocktails"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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