Muschamp discusses linebacker position

[1TexasTiger 55]

So you just keep throwing bodies at one (singular) problem till fixed?

Seems there's disconnect in logic somewhere. Gus's offensives have been effective because of judicious use of available talent. He's tailored the program around the facts at hand, and not based on wishes or preferred scheme. Here's to hoping Coach Will is equally as savvy, because these "if a frog had wings" arguments seem to have a high failure rate. Personally I'm glad to hear he's not as far removed (coach speak aside) from being able to produce results....or has a plan that doesn't require half a defense squad of LB's.... as some seem to preach.

LBs with potential should include more than Tre Williams. Geez. I'm sometimes pessimistic, but that's outlandish.

In the last four years, we've signed Cass McKinzy, Javiere Mitchell, Cameron Toney (moved back to defense at Muschamp's request), Deshaun Davis (entering his redshirt freshman season), Tre Williams, Jeff Holland, Richard McBryde, and Darrell Williams. Plus, a swing guy like Montavious Atkinson.

I'd say we've signed more than one high school LB with potential in recent years. It's a way too early to write the obits for guys like Toney and Davis, and it may be too early to write off Mitchell's career if he can stay healthy. You certainly can't ignore the haul we had this season.

We haven't killed LB recruiting, but it isn't as bleak as folks sometimes make it out to be either. McKinzy, Tre Williams, and this year's class alone would make a decent signing history. If Mitchell, Toney, Davis or Moncrief (now at LB) or Flowers have a solid year, we'll have plenty to depth to mix with McKinzy, Frost, Garrett, and Williams without getting anything from the incoming freshmen (which I think some of those guys are going to play).

Amen, Amen, and Amen !!!!

[AuburnSpider 2]

It is sooooo awesome to have a REAL D genius on the Auburn staff. After watching him in his press meetings it's soaking into my thick skull just how fortunate we are. Think about it, we now have the best D mind and the best O mind in the history of Auburn football. Not only the best in our history but one could argue they are the best in college football. It's not just that but it's the fact we have them both at the SAME TIME. How often does that happen to a program. The stars and moons and planets are for sure aligned. Gonna be a hellofa ride. We are truely blessed to be Auburn people in these times.

[Tigerbelle 5,299]

It is great to have coach Muschamp back on our staff. Our defense is going to be awesome.

Let's hope he stays for a few years. I agree with 1TexasTiger. These kids need some consistency in coaching in order to develop their potential.

[NoALtiger 3,850]

Davis film and production in high school leads me to believe he may be better than many think

I expect him to do very well. He has all the attributes and just seems to be a baller.

[alexava 6,973]

Davis film and production in high school leads me to believe he may be better than many think

me too

[lutzcammed 469]

I have actually agreed with many of mikey's thoughts. In a way I still do. I'm thinking Coach Muschamp is going with the mindset of its a new age and time boys. Numbers not needed, I will have quality players.

[Mikey 16,576]

LBs with potential should include more than Tre Williams. Geez. I'm sometimes pessimistic, but that's outlandish.

In the last four years, we've signed Cass McKinzy, Javiere Mitchell, Cameron Toney (moved back to defense at Muschamp's request), Deshaun Davis (entering his redshirt freshman season), Tre Williams, Jeff Holland, Richard McBryde, and Darrell Williams. Plus, a swing guy like Montavious Atkinson.

I'd say we've signed more than one high school LB with potential in recent years. It's a way too early to write the obits for guys like Toney and Davis, and it may be too early to write off Mitchell's career if he can stay healthy. You certainly can't ignore the haul we had this season.

We haven't killed LB recruiting, but it isn't as bleak as folks sometimes make it out to be either. McKinzy, Tre Williams, and this year's class alone would make a decent signing history. If Mitchell, Toney, Davis or Moncrief (now at LB) or Flowers have a solid year, we'll have plenty to depth to mix with McKinzy, Frost, Garrett, and Williams without getting anything from the incoming freshmen (which I think some of those guys are going to play).

Lots of names, not a single one of them has done anything to earn even an honorable mention all-SEC position. Potential is not the question, production is and until we get production we better keep recruiting guys that might pan out.

Muschamp can't be feeling too good about LB, he brought Moncrief in from safety and brought Toney in from the offense. Were Muschamp sold on our other linebackers those guys wouldn't have been moved.

Again, it's not about numbers. We have a lot of numbers. We need a few guys that can excel at the position and so far not a one of the above numbers or names has excelled.

[mcgufcm 4,096]

It kinda is about numbers. He's already on the record about Williams and Garrett looking solid at the third LB spot. That's a built in statement. McKinzy and Frost have the other two locked down. So it's sort of about numbers.

[Mikey 16,576]

It kinda is about numbers. He's already on the record about Williams and Garrett looking solid at the third LB spot. That's a built in statement. McKinzy and Frost have the other two locked down. So it's sort of about numbers.

Numbers are meaningless if the numbered have accomplished little or nothing. Again, if Muschamp was satisfied with the available linebackers he wouldn't be pulling guys in from other positions. It's rather obvious that we under-recruited the linebacker position, both in terms of numbers and quality, from 2011 through the 2014 classes. Hopefully the 2015 group will be the start of a turnaround.

[mcgufcm 4,096]

I don't think he pulled Cam Toney over in hopes that he'd find a starter over Frost or McKinzy. So it is kind of a numbers thing.

[FHeal 4]

It kinda is about numbers. He's already on the record about Williams and Garrett looking solid at the third LB spot. That's a built in statement. McKinzy and Frost have the other two locked down. So it's sort of about numbers.

Numbers are meaningless if the numbered have accomplished little or nothing. Again, if Muschamp was satisfied with the available linebackers he wouldn't be pulling guys in from other positions. It's rather obvious that we under-recruited the linebacker position, both in terms of numbers and quality, from 2011 through the 2014 classes. Hopefully the 2015 group will be the start of a turnaround.

Isn't simply picking a number and plugging in a desired number of players just text-book thinking at best?

And if you don't have a plethora of quality linebackers at hand, and you don't have replacement's coming in, isn't it obvious (captain) that you have to look elsewhere on team? Just because these replacements were not recruited at linebacker doesn't necessarily (and unequivocally) mean they can't be effect. How many a QB remain a QB? And how many a RB has never seen the field, been dismal, or changed positions for the better? No one seems immune to being moved around, short of the kicker and possibly the ball boy.

So how many fine hope full's never pan out at other positions?

I may be reading you wrong... but to continuously maintain AU has under recruited the position, isn't that a slap in the face to all those who have relentlessly tried to do just that? Yes, the result's may be less than stellar; however do you really think no one tried to get the best they could? Or that they didn't see a need? Do you think the players recruited for the position weren't deemed the best possible get's considering the staff and availability? Nothing personal, for you bring a lot to the table, and indeed there's been a lack at the position; However I hardly think it was a planned, malicious, or coldly calculated misdeed. And only 20/20 hindsight (and too many painful losses) that we now know we don't have the players we hoped for.

[PoetTiger 1,896]

I agree - I don't think it was with intent the position was under recruited - AU swung at a lot of LB targets but missed. With that said from the tail end of the Chizik era and first two under EJ I could see why most legit LB prospects took a pass. The defense was bad and EJ could not connect with a lot of the elite LB prospects. This is all my opinion and with that said I think the LB corps will suprise us this year - they are experienced and talented - so don't be suprised if one ends up ALL SEC

[Ronin 2]

I agree - I don't think it was with intent the position was under recruited - AU swung at a lot of LB targets but missed. With that said from the tail end of the Chizik era and first two under EJ I could see why most legit LB prospects took a pass. The defense was bad and EJ could not connect with a lot of the elite LB prospects. This is all my opinion and with that said I think the LB corps will suprise us this year - they are experienced and talented - so don't be suprised if one ends up ALL SEC

Or perhaps we have the LBs we need on the team already and EJ just could't get what we needed out of them. Time will tell.

[Mikey 16,576]

.......And if you don't have a plethora of quality linebackers at hand, and you don't have replacement's coming in, isn't it obvious (captain) that you have to look elsewhere on team? ......

My point exactly. Were the LB numbers and quality up to par we wouldn't be looking elsewhere.

quoting mcgufcm:"I don't think he pulled Cam Toney over in hopes that he'd find a starter over Frost or McKinzy. So it is kind of a numbers thing."

Yet you used these very names to claim we had plenty of numbers. What's hard to understand? If the linebackers were of sufficient quality we'd be ok. Numbers don't matter if, as you did, it's possible to list eight, ten or even 35 and your LB corps is still not getting it done on the field.

In context, I didn't mean "numbers don't matter"'. In context, my statement meant "Numbers don't matter, one can list 35 names and if they aren't getting it done on the field then what difference does listing a bunch of names make?" It's not accurate to claim that since we have a bunch of names there we're ok. Until some of those names are getting it done on the field we're not ok.

[PoetTiger 1,896]

coaching has been the biggest issue IMO - the players can not reach All Sec level without all sec coaching....how can u get all sec players when your scheme allows over 400 yds per game. Let's just see how these guys perform this fall ...

[AU Counsel 64]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

[PoetTiger 1,896]

That guy post above this one was on point..

[AUIH1 1,515]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

Amen. Not having talent at any D position goes to the coaching staff in terms of recruiting (on the field coaching can make up for deficiencies in talent, see Tuberville's D coaching staffs, but we have not had that since 2008). We absolutely have to have better play on the field at all levels on D period. Muschamp is by far the best DC we have have since......Muschamp.

wde

[1TexasTiger 55]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

spot on

[Dom1ni0n 51]

Counsel hit it home. The problem has been the total defensive package. I believe average coaching has been the primary culprit.

Here's to hoping that Muschamp was the elixir all along.

[war eagle6 0]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

HOMERUN!!

[keesler 5,924]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

Lock this thread - this is all that needs to be said!

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

I'm told CWM has not been very impressed with Cass or Frost so far. FWIW.

[Tiger 8,818]

I have listened to Mikey rant and rave about linebackers for a long time. And while I generally agree with a lot of what Mikey says, the rant is short-sighted. Our problem has been across the board on the defense. At the end of the day, our secondary has been weak, our linebackers have been weak, and our defensive line has been weak. We've had the occasional player excel at these positions, but our defensive problems have been systematic. I don't even blame the line backing crew as much as the defensive line for their inconsistency. But we have had problems at every level, & I blame coaching for that, both in the lack of proper technique, and in the less than stellar recruiting, although at the recruiting may not have been so bad. We have gotten a lot of four star players on that defense. Who knows if we simply recruited mediocre players who were overrated, or if our staff at the time was never able to successfully develop them. But I'm not going to pretend that the problem is linebacker more so than any other position. We may have scheme issues, we definitely have player development issues, and we may have recruiting issues. Going to Will Muschamp is a good change of pace that may pay huge results. I'm not going to pretend he is the best defensive mind in college football or anything similar. But he is a solid capable and proven defensive coordinator. I look forward to the results. At the very least, the recruiting appears to have picked up big time. It's a good start.

I'm told CWM has not been very impressed with Cass or Frost so far. FWIW.

Interesting...I wonder how this will shake out.

[AU_Twisterman 83]

I'm told CWM has not been very impressed with Cass or Frost so far. FWIW.

No surprise there. Thankfully CWM has a spring and fall camp to coach them up.