IT'S ABOUT THE TRAGEDY

[Tigermike 2,603]

IT'S ABOUT THE TRAGEDY - NOT MORE BUSH-BASHING

By JOHN PODHORETZ

December 31, 2004 --

THE political and ideological exploitation of perhaps the worst natural disaster in all our lifetimes is almost beyond belief — were it not for the fact that nothing these days is beyond belief.

Even as tears spring into the most hard-hearted person's eyes at both the unimaginable scope of the tragedy and at the wrenching individual stories of loss, opinion leaders just can't help themselves.

They are using this cataclysm as little more than cheap debate fodder about the nature and character of the United States, its president and its citizens.

Don't misunderstand.

It is fine and proper to have a debate and discussion about the degree of generosity the United States could, should and must show in the wake of this literally earth-shaking event.

But at this moment, the United States is not the issue.

The foreign-aid budget of the United States is not the issue.

Our government should not be the focal point of the discussion right now.

Don't we owe the dead, dying and injured the minimal grace not to convert their suffering into a chat-show segment — the latest left-right clash over the Bush presidency?

And couldn't the editorialists at The New York Times have forborne — even just for a week — making use of the tsunami to complain about U.S. government spending on "development aid"?

Development aid is the blanket term for American grant money handed out to other countries, supposedly to help their economies grow. Development aid has nothing — nothing — to do with what has happened.

The aid at issue now is disaster relief.

Secretary of State Colin Powell found himself in the position of having to remind the world that over the past four years the United States has provided more such aid than all other nations on the planet combined.

It is appalling that he had to mention this, and that President Bush was compelled to cite the same information on Wednesday, because you're not supposed to brag about how charitable you are. But once a United Nations official decried the American aid pledge as "stingy," the administration had little choice.

Any rational person would have understood without having to be told what the president told the world on Wednesday morning, which is that the $35 million pledge "is only the beginning of our help."

But maybe people are looking for a sideshow to distract them from the sickening pictures and the keening cries of the untold numbers of mothers whose babies were swept away.

http://www.nypost.com/commentary/37436.htm

[Auburn85 413]

We are just not liked, simple as that

It wouldn't have mattered what we gave.

I despise the New York Times, but yet they are still acclaimed a great paper.

All we can do is help all we can and just ignore the ignorants of the world

[TexasTiger 10,991]

The President could have stepped outside and made a simple statement. At a minimum, leaders do that. It goes with the territory.

So many on the right continually say, "What ever happened to personal responsibility?" And then many of them balk at any attempt to hold Bush responsible for his actions or inactions. If you want to be "leader of the free world" expect the world to take notice and to comment on how you do your job. If you think the criticism is unfair, make your case. But don't just dismiss it as "bashing" that somehow takes away from the disaster. That is ridiculous. Critiques can have a positive influence. Anyone who thinks the critiques haven't influenced increased aid is fooling themselves. We might have eventually given more anyway, but this is an opportunity to lead instead of merely react.

The administration originally said 15 million, while it was busy planning a 40 million dollar inaugural party. This was handled badly, period. To say that is not a condemnation of the entire administration. One can support the adminstration and give an honest appraisal about specific actions.

[AURaptor 1,113]

It's completely about Bush bashing. no question about it.

TexasTiger,

Please, stop your whining. You sound like a fussy 4 yr old.

Giving lip service about this tragic event isn't what you want, all you care about is taking cheap shots at President Bush. I say ' lip service' because no matter what Bush does, the Left will criticize him.

We'll be sending more than $ 500 million in aide before it's all done, but as for right now, tons of goods are just piling up and sitting at drop points because of poor organization over in the affected areas.

$40 million for a Inaguration ? Big damn deal. Not only is most of that $ coming from the private sector ( only $ 12 million being paid by the Gov't. ) Bill Clinton's Inagural marathon was in excess of $ 41 Million dollars, and that was over 10 yrs ago.

This is utterly unfair and asinine criticisim of the President . Using a tragedy of this magnitude for the sole purpose of playing the political hate game is woefully inappropriate and flat out disgusting.

Give it a damn rest.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

It's completely about Bush bashing. no question about it.

TexasTiger,

Please, stop your whining. You sound like a fussy 4 yr old.

Giving lip service about this tragic event isn't what you want, all you care about is taking cheap shots at President Bush.  I say ' lip service' because no matter what Bush does, the Left will criticize him.

We'll be sending more than $ 500 million in aide  before it's all done, but as for right now, tons of goods are just piling up and sitting at drop points because of poor organization over in the affected areas.

$40 million for a Inaguration ? Big damn deal. Not only is most of that $ coming from the private sector ( only $ 12 million being paid by the Gov't. ) Bill Clinton's Inagural marathon was in excess of $ 41 Million dollars, and that was over 10 yrs ago.

This is utterly unfair and asinine criticisim of the President .  Using a tragedy of this magnitude for the sole purpose of playing the political hate game is woefully inappropriate and flat out disgusting.

Give it a damn rest.

135085[/snapback]

And you sound like a spoiled three-year girl, only less mature.  You posted a whine piece to start the thread.  Any criticism of Bush gets the same whiny response from you guys.  Don't criticize "Dear Leader."  Living in a democracy is sometimes hard for you guys to take.  You seem to want a totalitarian state where no criticisim is allowed.  What criticisms have you not considered "cheap shots?"

Besides, I hadn't criticized him over this.  I simply pointed out that the whiny reaction to criticism on this matter is uncalled for.

Read the quote from Teddy Rooselvelt in my sig line.  Wisdom from a real Republican and a real, no-nonsense leader.

[Auburn85 413]

You can step up to the mic all you want to, but ACTIONS speak louder than words.

The other countries and people shouldn't criticize. They should send more money than us. Try to out do us by helping the VICTIMS. This is what it should be about.

Bush only has 4 years left. Then someone else will come in.

Bush has stepped up to the plate during tragedies: 9/11, hurricane victims

[AURaptor 1,113]

TexasTiger,

When you graduate to something beyond a " I know you are,but what am I ? " reply, please, feel free to let us know.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

TexasTiger,

When you  graduate to something beyond a " I know you are,but what am I ? "  reply, please, feel free to let us know.

135153[/snapback]

There's far more to my reply than that, but you're obviously not ready for any meaningful discussion. You seem to think Bush is beyond all criiticism. It's supposed to be a democracy, not a divine king.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

You can step up to the mic all you want to, but ACTIONS speak louder than words.

The other countries and people shouldn't criticize. They should send more money than us. Try to out do us by helping the VICTIMS. This is what it should be about.

Bush only has 4 years left. Then someone else will come in.

Bush has stepped up to the plate during tragedies: 9/11, hurricane victims

135137[/snapback]

Conservatives often claim that government should run more on business principles. Business is about results, but it is also about public relations. Managing the message matters when it comes to being a world leader. This was a great opportunity to step up instead of appearing to follow. Deny and critique that all you want, but its pretty simple and pretty obvious.

[AURaptor 1,113]

TexasTiger,

The US IS stepping up to the plate, and its actions are speaking far louder than some empty , meaningless expression of a President who comes out in front of the cameras to bite his lower lip, gently wipe a phony tear away and promise to.... " work harder than he's ever worked on anything in his life to ___________(fill in the blank ) " .

Seriously..stop being so DAMN PETTY and superficial, especially in a time when real help is being offered.

Oh, btw... the U.S. IS fighting a war right now too. We're fighting 2 wars, or one war on 2 different fronts. It makes no difference what you FEEL about that tiny factoid, but it DOES have an impact on what we are capable of doing. Maybe it helps in some regard, maybe it hurts. But that's how it is. Stop whining, we're doing far more than other countries who aren't fighting are, and we were among the first ones in, offering aid.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

Oh, btw... the U.S. IS fighting a war right now too. We're fighting 2 wars, or one war on 2 different fronts.  It makes no difference what you FEEL about that tiny factoid, but it DOES have an impact on what we are capable of doing.

135174[/snapback]

You're right. How about another tax cut for Bill Gates!

Seriously, Bush's handling of this didn't motivate me to jump on this forum and criticize him. I was responding to what I saw as a whiny column that those who did critique the President's handling of the matter were somehow distracting from or diminishing the relief effort. The President's defenders go to extremes to suggest that he should be immune from criticism. It is unhealthy for a democracy.

[Tigermike 2,603]

Once again the left thinks that making a photo opt statement about how bad the situation is and how really, really sorry we are that it happened is somehow more substantive than actually doing something.

[DKW 86 6,934]

Once again the left thinks that making a photo op statement about how bad the situation is and how really, really sorry we are that it happened is somehow more substantive than actually doing something.

135256[/snapback]

:clap:

[AURaptor 1,113]

TexasTiger -

The President's defenders go to extremes to suggest that he should be immune from criticism. It is unhealthy for a democracy. 

You're missing the point. There IS nothing here for the President to be criticized ABOUT!! It's all manufactured, artificial indignation by the extreme LEFT who has nothing else better to do than to dream up imaginary reasons to jump on W's case.

And what is this whining what 'democracy' is ??? First, where did you the nothion that democracy some how means being contrarian for the sake of being adversarial? Sure, you CAN do it, but that isn't what democracy is about. Bitching just because you can is probably more of a misuse of democracy than anything.

Also, is anyone keeping you from sounding like a complete moron? Nope. Is anyone keeping others from voicing their opinion of just what a moron you are? Nope. So there's nothing there to your charge about some ( once again ) phony supresion of anyone's freedom or rights.

Understand that all those who are whining about the President doing or not doing something in this case are simply looking for a reason to ridicule him for the sake of politics. They want to poison the well of political discourse by fabricating a wide spread public temper tantrum. It's a tired old trick , most often used by the Democrats. However, one must question the wisdom of using this tactic NOW, in a time when its far more important to focus on what can be done to IMMEDIATLY facilitate help to those who need it. Inane bickering and petty finger pointing at this time shows not how great we can be, but how small and simple minded we can be instead.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

TexasTiger -

The President's defenders go to extremes to suggest that he should be immune from criticism. It is unhealthy for a democracy. 

You're missing the point. There IS nothing here for the President to be criticized ABOUT!! It's all manufactured, artificial indignation by the extreme LEFT who has nothing else better to do than to dream up imaginary reasons to jump on W's case.

And what is this whining what 'democracy' is ??? First, where did you the nothion that democracy some how means being contrarian for the sake of being adversarial? Sure, you CAN do it, but that isn't what democracy is about. Bitching just because you can is probably more of a misuse of democracy than anything.

Also, is anyone keeping you from sounding like a complete moron? Nope. Is anyone keeping others from voicing their opinion of just what a moron you are? Nope. So there's nothing there to your charge about some ( once again ) phony supresion of anyone's freedom or rights.

Understand that all those who are whining about the President doing or not doing something in this case are simply looking for a reason to ridicule him for the sake of politics. They want to poison the well of political discourse by fabricating a wide spread public temper tantrum. It's a tired old trick , most often used by the Democrats. However, one must question the wisdom of using this tactic NOW, in a time when its far more important to focus on what can be done to IMMEDIATLY facilitate help to those who need it. Inane bickering and petty finger pointing at this time shows not how great we can be, but how small and simple minded we can be instead.

135276[/snapback]

The largest natural disaster in our lifetime and it takes the President three days to step in front of a camera, express his condolences and say we'll pledge to do what we can. You think that's fine. Okay, that's a point of view. Defend it. Many people wonder why the delay? That's a valid point of view. It is not just the left who think that. I'll bet any reasonable political consultant of any stripe at least privately thinks he should have spoken up sooner. Even his harshest critics are hardly saying it is an impeachable offense, but a blunder, nonetheless. People in leadership positons have opportunities to make such blunders several times a day. Most make their share. That is all I'm saying, buy you can't recognize even the possibility that Bush could have handled it better. Fine.

[Tigermike 2,603]

The largest natural disaster in our lifetime and it takes the President three days to step in front of a camera, express his condolences and say we'll pledge to do what we can.  You think that's fine.  Okay, that's a point of view.  Defend it.  Many people wonder why the delay?  That's a valid point of view.  It is not just the left who think that.  I'll bet any reasonable political consultant of any stripe at least privately thinks he should have spoken up sooner.  Even his harshest critics are hardly saying it is an impeachable offense, but a blunder, nonetheless.  People in leadership positons have opportunities to make such blunders several times a day.  Most make their share.  That is all I'm saying, buy you can't recognize even the possibility that Bush could have handled it better.  Fine.

135287[/snapback]

I said earlier, "Once again the left thinks that making a photo opt statement about how bad the situation is and how really, really sorry we are that it happened is somehow more substantive than actually doing something."

I will ask now would it have helped anyone in the devastated areas for the President of the United States to make a speech about how sorry he was? Or would they benefit more if he is actually doing something like ordering our military (which is in the region) to send emergency aid immediately.

You folks loved Bill Clinton because he said "I feel your pain." Now you want to somehow vilify George W. Bush because he didn't come out earlier weeping and say, "I'm so sorry, I feel their pain", "We will send so, so much money".

[TexasTiger 10,991]

The largest natural disaster in our lifetime and it takes the President three days to step in front of a camera, express his condolences and say we'll pledge to do what we can.  You think that's fine.  Okay, that's a point of view.  Defend it.  Many people wonder why the delay?  That's a valid point of view.  It is not just the left who think that.  I'll bet any reasonable political consultant of any stripe at least privately thinks he should have spoken up sooner.  Even his harshest critics are hardly saying it is an impeachable offense, but a blunder, nonetheless.  People in leadership positons have opportunities to make such blunders several times a day.  Most make their share.  That is all I'm saying, buy you can't recognize even the possibility that Bush could have handled it better.  Fine.

135287[/snapback]

I said earlier, "Once again the left thinks that making a photo opt statement about how bad the situation is and how really, really sorry we are that it happened is somehow more substantive than actually doing something."

I will ask now would it have helped anyone in the devastated areas for the President of the United States to make a speech about how sorry he was? Or would they benefit more if he is actually doing something like ordering our military (which is in the region) to send emergency aid immediately.

You folks loved Bill Clinton because he said "I feel your pain." Now you want to somehow vilify George W. Bush because he didn't come out earlier weeping and say, "I'm so sorry, I feel their pain", "We will send so, so much money".

135295[/snapback]

As I said before, as in business, there are bottomline results AND the public relations aspect. One does not necessarily impact the other, but both are important. If your business does something really well, but the public is left with a contrary impression, your business may suffer.

This disaster impacted the Muslim world. We are in not only a military battle but one for "hearts and minds." That's not a liberal view. That's not just my view. Public relations is not everything, but it matters.

[Tigermike 2,603]

You are correct, PR is a huge tool, but I would also say that those Muslim's at the ravaged areas will see just who is sending aid. They will see the US military planes and helicopters bringing food, water, clothing and medical supplies. What will Ben Laden and alquada be bringing? Those people who need the help will see the US troops helping. But they will never hear any leader of any country make a statement.

[AURaptor 1,113]

  The largest natural disaster in our lifetime and it takes the President three days to step in front of a camera, express his condolences and say we'll pledge to do what we can.

I guess W was just lying on the floor, passed out from a night of binge drinking and snortin coke. At least that's probably what you'd like folks to think. Just because Bush isn't all full of phony, touchy feely love for the camera doesn't mean he isn't getting the important work done, behind the scenes. You might call it a fault of his that Bush isn't biting his lower lip and shedding croc tears, but it's perfectly fine by me. The impact of this tragic quake was unfolding every hour, so it would have been silly for Bush to make a statement before all the facts were known.

Of course, had he come out and said we mourn the loss of 20,000 when the number continued to rise, I'm sure there's someone out in LEFT field who would start whining that Bush intentionally 'mislead ' us about the scale of this event..or that he LIED.

Please, stuff a sock in it. Your charges and whines are w/ out merrit. Get a grip and send some aide money or do something positive for once, instead of bitching and moaning.

[TexasTiger 10,991]

  The largest natural disaster in our lifetime and it takes the President three days to step in front of a camera, express his condolences and say we'll pledge to do what we can.

I guess W was just lying on the floor, passed out from a night of binge drinking and snortin coke. At least that's probably what you'd like folks to think. Just because Bush isn't all full of phony, touchy feely love for the camera doesn't mean he isn't getting the important work done, behind the scenes. You might call it a fault of his that Bush isn't biting his lower lip and shedding croc tears, but it's perfectly fine by me. The impact of this tragic quake was unfolding every hour, so it would have been silly for Bush to make a statement before all the facts were known.

Of course, had he come out and said we mourn the loss of 20,000 when the number continued to rise, I'm sure there's someone out in LEFT field who would start whining that Bush intentionally 'mislead ' us about the scale of this event..or that he LIED.

Please, stuff a sock in it. Your charges and whines are w/ out merrit. Get a grip and send some aide money or do something positive for once, instead of bitching and moaning.

135301[/snapback]

You're right. There is absolutely no merit in any criticism ever lodged against George W. Bush by anyone at any time. It is all the result of partisan sniping. The man is perfect and his administration is marked by its inability to make a mistake or misjudgment. It is truly startling how competent these guys are! Anyone suggesting otherwise is just jealous! Bush is perfect! Bush is perfect! Bush is perfect!

[AURaptor 1,113]

Bush is perfect! Bush is perfect! Bush is perfect!

Now that's more like it.

[DKW 86 6,934]

The real problem here is not that "Bush is Perfect", he obviously is not. The Problem here is..... Bush Won!

We will, as always out give every country on earth. If we willy-nilly go running into a situation without looking at it in totality, that is wrong. Then I suggest you look at Iraq. The Left criticize Bush because we did not look far enough into Iraq before intervening. Now Bush is now criticized for taking a few moments and trying to do it right. Make up your MINDS!

The real truth here is that Bush is getting criticized for doing it too fast and too slow. Bush is being criticized because the Left just got killed in another election....

[Auburn85 413]

But we were brainwashed, gosh I wished I voted for Kerry

The economy is on the way up( but I hear a voice saying that it couldn't go anywhere, but up)

On a side note.... People want jobs to quit going oversees, but we want Canada's prescription medicines? We can't always have it both ways

Incentives shouldn't be given for companies that stay here in the US(like Kerry wanted) they already have a free system, isn't that incentive enough? Plus Bush gives them tax breaks.

I also feel incentives shouldn't be given to move jobs oversees as well.

Kerry all, but called Bush a racists because he feels Bush is neglecting affirmative action and that he won't visit the NAACP enough.

"More has to be done. This president has not done enough"

Kerry should have just made it simple by singing "Anything you can do , I can do better!"