Confererate Statues Removed in Memphis

[AU64 10,122]

I love the Carter plan:   especially shifting our emphasis to coal.....and reducing dependence on foreign supply.  Turns out other than trying to improve efficiency, he actually had it backwards........wanting us to shift from oil and natural gas to coal......and even had economic incentives to industry to do that.

Mostly what I remember about Carter's presidency were gas lines, energy shortages and 16-20% interest rates for home loans and price control guidelines that were voluntary .....except that they weren't 'cause the government threatened to hammer companies that failed to comply.

Basically he brought about a reduction in energy consumption by making it less affordable. 

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=7373

[SaltyTiger 7,789]

9 hours ago, McLoofus said:

English measurement is soooooooooooooo dumb.

We tried that in the 90's. Military projects in metric on plan. Cost us a bit in learning with estimating. Real world problem came to light when we issued hands own trades shop drawings in metric. Bigger problem when craftsmen where issued metric tapes for real work......big mess, tossed in the dumpster quickly

[SaltyTiger 7,789]

12 hours ago, AU64 said:

Guess you are talking about Alaska...where the protected land is about as big as the typical US state and space being released for development is maybe the size of the city of Auburn....no impact whatsoever.     Same in western US........where you an drive for three or four hours in several different states and see nothing but sage brush or grass.....and now windmills of course. ...and of course nobody is complaining about that.   Nobody is eating up or giving away all that federal land.    Need to save your anger for something more worthwhile.

I wish someone would protect a beautiful part of Georgia between Byron and Columbus. Only thing other than beautiful country is is a big solar farm........want to talk about about a rape of nature.

[I_M4_AU 7,796]

15 hours ago, McLoofus said:

English measurement is soooooooooooooo dumb.

Yeah, I used to weigh almost 18 stones, lost a few stones over the last year or so.

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Yeah, I used to weigh almost 18 stones, lost a few stones over the last year or so.

Nice! Except I found them...

[AUDub 11,147]

10 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

We tried that in the 90's. Military projects in metric on plan. Cost us a bit in learning with estimating. Real world problem came to light when we issued hands own trades shop drawings in metric. Bigger problem when craftsmen where issued metric tapes for real work......big mess, tossed in the dumpster quickly

There will be some growing pains short term if the switch is made, but the future benefits far outweigh immediate problems. 

[homersapien 11,362]

13 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

We tried that in the 90's. Military projects in metric on plan. Cost us a bit in learning with estimating. Real world problem came to light when we issued hands own trades shop drawings in metric. Bigger problem when craftsmen where issued metric tapes for real work......big mess, tossed in the dumpster quickly

Too logical?  

 

 

[homersapien 11,362]

http://www.economist.com/node/262812

"..... Mars Climate Orbiter, an unmanned probe that was supposed to start circling its eponymous planet in September, was lost thanks to a mix-up by its flight controllers over imperial and metric units...." 

[homersapien 11,362]

13 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

I wish someone would protect a beautiful part of Georgia between Byron and Columbus. Only thing other than beautiful country is is a big solar farm........want to talk about about a rape of nature.

Oh good grief.  

 

[TexasTiger 12,829]

14 hours ago, AU64 said:

I love the Carter plan:   especially shifting our emphasis to coal.....and reducing dependence on foreign supply.  Turns out other than trying to improve efficiency, he actually had it backwards........wanting us to shift from oil and natural gas to coal......and even had economic incentives to industry to do that.

Mostly what I remember about Carter's presidency were gas lines, energy shortages and 16-20% interest rates for home loans and price control guidelines that were voluntary .....except that they weren't 'cause the government threatened to hammer companies that failed to comply.

Basically he brought about a reduction in energy consumption by making it less affordable. 

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=7373

But he didn't quadruple the debt. That was the next guy who engaged in 8 years of stimulus spending to boost the economy. Put us on the road we're on now.

[AU64 10,122]

8 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

But he didn't quadruple the debt. That was the next guy who engaged in 8 years of stimulus spending to boost the economy. Put us on the road we're on now.

I thought we were talking about Carter and his energy policy.....otherwise, your defense tells me that unlike me, you were not trying to buy a house when interest rates were 16% and more....or waiting in gas lines to try and get 5 gallons of whatever they had.   The old days....not so good in some ways.   

[TexasTiger 12,829]

1 hour ago, AU64 said:

I thought we were talking about Carter and his energy policy.....otherwise, your defense tells me that unlike me, you were not trying to buy a house when interest rates were 16% and more....or waiting in gas lines to try and get 5 gallons of whatever they had.   The old days....not so good in some ways.   

Carter was not a strong leader, but that time period has been cast in overly simplistic ways.

[AU64 10,122]

12 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

  Carter was not a strong leader, but that time period has been cast in overly simplistic ways.

I'm curious of your age.?    I find that those who lived (as adults) through the 1960s-1980s) often have different views of those times from people who have just read about them.   I head stuff about the Reagan years in TV commentary and actually wonder what they are talking about as they provide a selective version of history....from both sides.  

At my age, I've pretty much learned that every period of our history has its' problems.....and Carter's were no more difficult than any other president (this was post Vietnam after all).   Problems were different but, IMO, many of his problems were self inflicted.   For a former Naval Officer, he was remarkably impractical in dealing with domestic and foreign issues.

And as regards his energy policies.....as per the link I sent, his were pretty conservative.....conserve your way out of trouble but other than that, his push toward coal, his anti-nuclear policies and failure to actually promote oil and gas exploration were not forward looking at all.   His idea of energy security was the petroleum reserve which turned out not to be much of a deterrent  to our middle eastern enemies .....and some rather modest (but probably realistic) solar energy goals. . 

[TexasTiger 12,829]

1 hour ago, AU64 said:

I'm curious of your age.?    I find that those who lived (as adults) through the 1960s-1980s) often have different views of those times from people who have just read about them.   I head stuff about the Reagan years in TV commentary and actually wonder what they are talking about as they provide a selective version of history....from both sides.  

At my age, I've pretty much learned that every period of our history has its' problems.....and Carter's were no more difficult than any other president (this was post Vietnam after all).   Problems were different but, IMO, many of his problems were self inflicted.   For a former Naval Officer, he was remarkably impractical in dealing with domestic and foreign issues.

And as regards his energy policies.....as per the link I sent, his were pretty conservative.....conserve your way out of trouble but other than that, his push toward coal, his anti-nuclear policies and failure to actually promote oil and gas exploration were not forward looking at all.   His idea of energy security was the petroleum reserve which turned out not to be much of a deterrent  to our middle eastern enemies .....and some rather modest (but probably realistic) solar energy goals. . 

I'm old enough to have opted to not vote for either Reagan or Carter. Carter was inept at messaging and an ineffective leader. Reagan was excellent at messaging and a feel good President. But the bill comes due later. Folks repeatedly ignore how reckless he was fiscally.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

4 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

I'm old enough to have opted to not vote for either Reagan or Carter. Carter was inept at messaging and an ineffective leader. Reagan was excellent at messaging and a feel good President. But the bill comes due later. Folks repeatedly ignore how reckless he was fiscally.

THANK YOU

[AU64 10,122]

1 minute ago, TexasTiger said:

I'm old enough to have opted to not vote for either Reagan or Carter. Carter was inept at messaging and an ineffective leader. Reagan was excellent at messaging and a feel good President. But the bill comes due later. Folks repeatedly ignore how reckless he was fiscally.

He kind of got hoodwinked by the Dems.....agreed to their tax program expecting to get something later.......which he did not get.   Tip outsmarted him IMO. ..so we got the worst of both economic theories...but at least interest rates came down.....when the prime was nearly 20 I though t it would be a decade to get it down below 10...but happened pretty quickly. 

[TexasTiger 12,829]

19 minutes ago, AU64 said:

He kind of got hoodwinked by the Dems.....agreed to their tax program expecting to get something later.......which he did not get.   Tip outsmarted him IMO. ..so we got the worst of both economic theories...but at least interest rates came down.....when the prime was nearly 20 I though t it would be a decade to get it down below 10...but happened pretty quickly. 

Poor old Ron. His supporters still don't hold him accountable. He never submitted a balanced budget. He never cared about it.

[AU64 10,122]

31 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

Poor old buy Ron. His supporters still don't hold him accountable. He never submitted a balanced budget. He never cared about it.

likely so....but neither did the Dems who controlled the House his entire term of office...which is where spending bills originate.   In fact, there have been only four or 5 balanced budgets in the past 50 years......so I'm guessing that nobody really thinks it is very  important...at least not important enough to try to match revenue with spending. Both parties talk about it but nobody actually tries very hard.   

[TexasTiger 12,829]

13 minutes ago, AU64 said:

likely so....but neither did the Dems who controlled the House his entire term of office...which is where spending bills originate.   In fact, there have been only four or 5 balanced budgets in the past 50 years......so I'm guessing that nobody really thinks it is very  important...at least not important enough to try to match revenue with spending. Both parties talk about it but nobody actually tries very hard.   

Except in war times and severe economic distress both parties tried to stay at least in the ball park until Reagan. Carter did, even with a Dem congress. The Reagan admin said deficits didn't really matter, percentage of GDP, blah blah blah. Republicans have never suffered for it. Reagan certainly didn't. 

[TexasTiger 12,829]

And Carter was right about metric and solar-- he was lousy at selling them.

[AU64 10,122]

5 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

Except in war times and severe economic distress both parties tried to stay at least in the ball park until Reagan. Carter did, even with a Dem congress. The Reagan admin said deficits didn't really matter, percentage of GDP, blah blah blah. Republicans have never suffered for it. Reagan certainly didn't. 

All true....but neither have Dems........there is always a reason.  Carter left the country in a state of economic disaster so that provided an excuse for economic stimulation...blah, blah, ...etc. etc.   so what's the point?....that was 50 years ago...things could have changed if anyone was serous about it.....

[TexasTiger 12,829]

10 minutes ago, AU64 said:

All true....but neither have Dems........there is always a reason.  Carter left the country in a state of economic disaster so that provided an excuse for economic stimulation...blah, blah, ...etc. etc.   so what's the point?....that was 50 years ago...things could have changed if anyone was serous about it.....

Just adding perspective to the Carter years I don't often see.

The only person to ever get the country focused on the deficit was Perot. Too bad he was crazy.

[AU64 10,122]

12 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

And Carter was right about metric and solar-- he was lousy at selling them.

Right about metric perhaps...but never gave enough thought to what it would take to convert the world's largest manufacturing economy to metric with everything and every one accustomed to the English system  I worked for a fortune 500 textile company and we would have had to replace most of our machines to adapt to metric and of course chemical formulations, packaging and more.  We spend millions just changing packaging and then most of our customers did not want metric so we had to have both systems and dual identifications and in the end just abandoned it.  In my view it wasn't about selling it....the problem was coming up with some plan that was workable and had to start with kindergarten kids to even convert our labor force.   So now we are creeping into it I guess with more imported machinery with metric fasteners so I now have two sets of tools for working on my car...  

 

[TexasTiger 12,829]

56 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Right about metric perhaps...but never gave enough thought to what it would take to convert the world's largest manufacturing economy to metric with everything and every one accustomed to the English system  I worked for a fortune 500 textile company and we would have had to replace most of our machines to adapt to metric and of course chemical formulations, packaging and more.  We spend millions just changing packaging and then most of our customers did not want metric so we had to have both systems and dual identifications and in the end just abandoned it.  In my view it wasn't about selling it....the problem was coming up with some plan that was workable and had to start with kindergarten kids to even convert our labor force.   So now we are creeping into it I guess with more imported machinery with metric fasteners so I now have two sets of tools for working on my car...  

 

It needed to be very gradual, but at some point it has to happen. Our kids are hamstrung in the sciences and industries that want to export are more tempted to just relocate. We did get 2 liter Cokes out of it, though.

[SaltyTiger 7,789]

3 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

It needed to be very gradual, but at some point it has to happen. Our kids are hamstrung in the sciences and industries that want to export are more tempted to just relocate. We did get 2 liter Cokes out of it, though.

Good point Tex. Maybe we should go metric on football fields tomorrow...............Get rid of a lot Bammers