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Tigermike

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What's the best approach to get federal spending under control?

Cut spending to the bone?

Raise taxes?

Send congress home and only allow them to be in session one month per year?

Other

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A combination of spending cuts, major restructuring of large dollar programs like Medicare (to cut spending in them) and some raising of taxes.

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Raising taxes is nonsensical, as a lack of tax revenue in no way was instrumental in this crisis. It's the hyper over spending, by the govt. Cut spending, get people back to work, delete O-care, and you'll see the economy recover.

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Raising taxes is nonsensical, as a lack of tax revenue in no way was instrumental in this crisis. It's the hyper over spending, by the govt. Cut spending, get people back to work, delete O-care, and you'll see the economy recover.

If all we needed to do was break even, I'd agree with you. But if actually take the debt down (not just the yearly deficit), it's going to require both.

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Raising taxes is nonsensical, as a lack of tax revenue in no way was instrumental in this crisis. It's the hyper over spending, by the govt. Cut spending, get people back to work, delete O-care, and you'll see the economy recover.

If all we needed to do was break even, I'd agree with you. But if actually take the debt down (not just the yearly deficit), it's going to require both.

No, it won't. And if we're going to do anything w/ taxes, lowering them would be what I'd recommend, not raising them.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

This.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

This.

Nope, not this. And i didnt fail math, either. It's a spending problem. Only.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

This.

Nope, not this. And i didnt fail math, either. It's a spending problem. Only.

Obviously you do fail math.

I agree, it is a spending problem. But it cannot be fixed by cutting spending only. To say so is ignoring math. It is to not understand what interest on debt is.

It is this thought process that ignores math in favor of empty ideology that will risk the United States defaulting on its debt.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

This.

Nope, not this. And i didnt fail math, either. It's a spending problem. Only.

It was a spending problem. But to get out of it, it's going to take more than just cutting spending. If I charge up my credit cards and saddle myself with a ton of debt and can't pay my bills, certainly it's a spending problem. But cutting up the card and no longer spending extravagantly is only part of the solution. I need more income too so I can actually pay the debt down, get current and do more than minimum payments. If I want to get out of debt, I need to be able to pay larger chunks of it off each month and correcting bad spending habits won't do that. I might need to find a better paying job or get a second job.

That's where we are right now. We've kicked the can down the road so far, the debt is too large for spending cuts alone to solve it.

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Our problem is we have elected federal officer holders that have The power to spend money to influence voters.

1. There needs to be constitutional limits on their spending power.

2. A constitutionally mandated balanced budget with allowances for national emergency spending.

3. Term limiting might to good, but even better is a maximum age to be allowed to take office. We do not need elected officials in their 80s, 90s and even late 70s. They need to go home. For example if you are 75 years old or older on the day you would be sworn in to office, you would not be allowed to run for office. We have minimum ages now. We need maximum ages too.

If we have the above we can then cut spending and simplify the tax code bringing the budget under control.

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Raise taxes (at least cut out various loopholes), cut spending.

If you do not combine both, you do not solve the problem. Anyone who says otherwise failed math, but are experts at empty ideology.

This.

Nope, not this. And i didnt fail math, either. It's a spending problem. Only.

It was a spending problem. But to get out of it, it's going to take more than just cutting spending. If I charge up my credit cards and saddle myself with a ton of debt and can't pay my bills, certainly it's a spending problem. But cutting up the card and no longer spending extravagantly is only part of the solution. I need more income too so I can actually pay the debt down, get current and do more than minimum payments. If I want to get out of debt, I need to be able to pay larger chunks of it off each month and correcting bad spending habits won't do that. I might need to find a better paying job or get a second job.

That's where we are right now. We've kicked the can down the road so far, the debt is too large for spending cuts alone to solve it.

I never said spending cuts alone. I said cutting spending and lowering taxes. Stimulate the economy, get more people working , off the public dole, and starting to get pay checks, making purchases and there by paying taxes. THAT is how we'll raise revenue, not by saddling people and businesses with more of a burden.

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Obviously you do fail math.

I agree, it is a spending problem. But it cannot be fixed by cutting spending only. To say so is ignoring math. It is to not understand what interest on debt is.

It is this thought process that ignores math in favor of empty ideology that will risk the United States defaulting on its debt.

Sorry, but I don't fail math, regardless of how much you want to say it. And it's not an empty ideology when it's been proven to work, time and time again. SPENDING like crack addicted sailors has gotten us here, not because we've not raised enough tax revenue. Logic 101. It's not a tax issue, but a spending issue.

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Obviously you do fail math.

I agree, it is a spending problem. But it cannot be fixed by cutting spending only. To say so is ignoring math. It is to not understand what interest on debt is.

It is this thought process that ignores math in favor of empty ideology that will risk the United States defaulting on its debt.

Sorry, but I don't fail math, regardless of how much you want to say it. And it's not an empty ideology when it's been proven to work, time and time again. SPENDING like crack addicted sailors has gotten us here, not because we've not raised enough tax revenue. Logic 101. It's not a tax issue, but a spending issue.

Do you understand that we've accumulated interest on our debt? Do you understand that there is tons of spending we can't cut, such as benefits to the current and soon to be 65+ in medicare that they've paid into and their life is depending on? Even the Tea Party says "Government out of my Medicare."

Lowering tax rates to boost revenues worked when effective tax rates were at their all time highest. To expect the same when effective tax rates are at their all time lowest is getting a bit silly. The Bush tax cuts didn't increase revenues. "Time and time again" is what, when Reagan was in office?

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Currently in the United States, the unemployment rate is 9.1%. That equates to 27,937,596 people out of work.

The National Debt at the moment is $14,344,566,636,826.26

The average taken out for Federal, Social Security, and Medicare is 23% of your annual income.

The average income in the United States is $50,221 (according to the Census Bureau).

If EVERY one of those were to get a job with a median income of $50,221 a year.

ASSUMING that none of the 9.1% of people out of work paid had their taxes, or had no taxes to file, that would generate $322,702,422,004.86 a year.

In a perfect society, where everyone pays their taxes in full, in the United States' current state, that extra income would takes roughly 43 years to pay of the debt, assuming all other portions of the spending/taxes are balanced. And you want to lower that?

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Not to mention you cant really get below 2-3% unemployment.

With the policies this administration is pushing we will never see 2-3% unemployment again.

This administration would be prancing around like a bunch of roosters if the unemployment rate were to drop by 2-3%. And I wouldn't blame them.

Speaking of unemployment, what is the real unemployment rate? It's much higher than what is reported.

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Eliminate the Dept of Education and return education to the states.

Eliminate the Dept of Energy and return energy management to the private sector.

Cut back OSHA and reduce burdensome regulations that hinder business and raise costs unnecessarily.

Reform the tax system to simplify and make fair and equal.

Repeal Obama care.

What does the Dep of Transportation do that can't be done elsewhere?

Encourage energy production and keep energy inexpensive.

Promote job growth by getting out of the way and revenues will increase without raising taxes.

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Not to mention you cant really get below 2-3% unemployment.

With the policies this administration is pushing we will never see 2-3% unemployment again.

This administration would be prancing around like a bunch of roosters if the unemployment rate were to drop by 2-3%. And I wouldn't blame them.

Speaking of unemployment, what is the real unemployment rate? It's much higher than what is reported.

No - as in its impossible to get below 2-3% unemployment - regardless of what policies exist. That's macro-economics 101.

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Speaking of unemployment, what is the real unemployment rate? It's much higher than what is reported.

It's always much higher than what is reported. Every single administration takes advantage of that little loophole in how the number is calculated.

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Not to mention you cant really get below 2-3% unemployment.

With the policies this administration is pushing we will never see 2-3% unemployment again.

This administration would be prancing around like a bunch of roosters if the unemployment rate were to drop by 2-3%. And I wouldn't blame them.

Speaking of unemployment, what is the real unemployment rate? It's much higher than what is reported.

No - as in its impossible to get below 2-3% unemployment - regardless of what policies exist. That's macro-economics 101.

The only question I asked was, what is the real unemployment rate?

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Mandatory Spending:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_United_States_federal_budget

$695 billion – Social Security

$571 billion – Other mandatory programs

$453 billion – Medicare

$290 billion – Medicaid

$164 billion – Interest on National Debt

Discretionary spending:

$663.7 billion – Department of Defense (including Overseas Contingency Operations)

$78.7 billion – Department of Health and Human Services

$72.5 billion – Department of Transportation

$52.5 billion – Department of Veterans Affairs

$51.7 billion – Department of State and Other International Programs

$47.5 billion – Department of Housing and Urban Development

$46.7 billion – Department of Education

$42.7 billion – Department of Homeland Security

$26.3 billion – Department of Energy

$26.0 billion – Department of Agriculture

$23.9 billion – Department of Justice

$18.7 billion – National Aeronautics and Space Administration

$13.8 billion – Department of Commerce

$13.3 billion – Department of Labor

$13.3 billion – Department of the Treasury

$12.0 billion – Department of the Interior

$10.5 billion – Environmental Protection Agency

$9.7 billion – Social Security Administration

$7.0 billion – National Science Foundation

$5.1 billion – Corps of Engineers

$5.0 billion – National Infrastructure Bank

$1.1 billion – Corporation for National and Community Service

$0.7 billion – Small Business Administration

$0.6 billion – General Services Administration

$11 billion – Potential disaster costs

$19.8 billion – Other Agencies

$105 billion – Other

Every dollar of tax revenue that comes into the treasury barely covers Mandatory spending. Basically, everything on the Discretionary side is funded through borrowing.

To balance the budget on cuts alone, things like the following would have to be zeroed out: Defense, Medicare, and Medicaid. That's not going to happen anytime soon.

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Not to mention you cant really get below 2-3% unemployment.

With the policies this administration is pushing we will never see 2-3% unemployment again.

This administration would be prancing around like a bunch of roosters if the unemployment rate were to drop by 2-3%. And I wouldn't blame them.

Speaking of unemployment, what is the real unemployment rate? It's much higher than what is reported.

No - as in its impossible to get below 2-3% unemployment - regardless of what policies exist. That's macro-economics 101.

The only question I asked was, what is the real unemployment rate?

16-17%.

But when you reply to my post with inaccuracies, expect a correction.

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Here's a list of some subsidies:

http://money.cnn.com/2011/02/15/news/economy/mortgage_interest_deduction/index.htm

high-income earners' tax deduction for mortgage interest payments and charitable contributions.

$32.1 billion 1yr average/$321 billion 10 yr

http://money.cnn.com/2011/04/26/pf/taxes/tax_credits/index.htm

Home Mortgage Deduction on everyone - $97 billion 1yr average

Capital Gains/ Dividends tax break - $81 billion 1yr average

Earned Income Credit- $54 billion 1yr average

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/166369-senate-votes-to-preserve-6-billion-in-ethanol-subsidies

ethanol subsidies - $6 billion a year

http://www.heritage.org/research/commentary/2011/03/farm-subsidies-ripe-for-reform

farm subsidies - around $25 billion a year

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/02/01/us-obama-budget-oil-idUSTRE6103RM20100201

oil, gas subsidies- $3.65 billion 1yr average/ $36.5 billion 10yr

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-b-keegan/why-i-support-the-ronald_b_872395.html?ir=Business

Closing foreign bank loophole- $6.9 billion a year

Here's a list of tax increase proposals that's been floated around:

http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/23/news/economy/bush_tax_cuts_affordability/index.htm

Tax cuts on top two income brackets- $70 billion 1yr average/ $700 billion 10yr

Tax cuts on remaining brackets - $300 billion 1yr average/ $3 trillion 10yr

http://schakowsky.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2877&catid=22

Rep. Jan Schakowsky Millionaires & Billionaires Tax proposal- $78 billion 1yr average

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a1mC.vDFKsw4

Transaction tax proposal

$150 billion 1yr/ $1.5 trillion 10yr

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=455

Estate tax

$67 billion 1yr average/ $670 billion 10yr

Other ideas to cut and raise revenue that's been floated around include:

Raise the Social Security cap

Means Test Social Security/Medicare

Reduce our military presence around the world

Legalize online poker/gaming

Legalize pot

Should Obama break his pledge not to raise taxes on the middle class in order to help get our budget defict and national debt under control?

Next week Congress could raise taxes/cut spending by $400 billion a year, and we'd still have to borrow about $1 trillion a year.

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