Is anyone surprised that Bama had nobody drafted? I'm not......

[runswithscissors 33]

Saban has sent players to the NFL by the bucket load. I don't understand why ONE year at Bama and us not sending players in the draft is his fault.

If all of your statements above were correct, we would have seen a pattern of him not sending players to the NFL.

Nick Saban hadn't coached a single game before 6 of those 8 were arrested. Are you telling me that going through spring training alone should be enough for his fingerprint to be over the ENTIRE program...and erase 3 years of learning under another coach?

I heard Saban take the blame for a loss more than once this year.

How he treats the media has NOTHING to do with draft status. You telling me some team isn't going to take a bad ass player just because the guys coach isn't nice to reporters? Give me a break.

If you are going to blame Saban for one year at Bama being the reason we didn't draft players...then he gets credit for every LSU player that gets drafted who played even one day under Saban.

Most backwards logic ever.

What don't you get about this?

Shula recruited guys who were ALL-SEC talent going into 2008. They go through the 2008 season under Coach-Does-No-Wrong as Seniors. That's their most important season. A good coach takes good players and makes them great. A sh***y coach takes All SEC players and makes them skipped over by the draft.

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Give me a break.

i guess CNS made the seniors forget how to play football? you guys have spent years saying how the team and its players suck, but now that its convenient to change that storyline, all of the sudden you're trying as hard as you can to prove that these guys are world beaters. so i guess the previous 3 years of football are automatically erased from their memories and have no bearing on their skill, attitude, ethic, etc? no bearing whatsoever? these guys knew nothing about football prior to CNS arriving and all the blame is squarely on his shoulders because he is the only coach that has ever taught them anything about football? interesting concept.

[BamaGrad03 0]

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Why do you respond to my posts without reading them?

I'm saying IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them. Which means you then MUST give him the same credit for the one year players at LSU.

I'm not giving him credit for either.

[SouthLink02 8]

That is what we "Bammers" tried to tell you last year. We have NO talent.....and the NFL agrees.

Interesting. Yet back in early October, you apologized for how Alabama fans had thought you all were going undefeated

Well, at least expectations have fallen back to earth. I think they got out of hand after the Arkansas win. It was painfully obvious vs. UGA and FSU that we just do not have the horses to keep up right now. After the Arkansas game, people were saying we would win every game but LSU. Welcome back to reality.

http://www.aunation.net/forums/index.php?s...mp;#entry416519

[BamaGrad03 0]

I think we had talent last year. I think we had some good starters. Gilberry showed that in the Auburn game. DJ Hall broke a ton of records. Keith Brown stayed in the dog house, but he's a good WR. Simeon is a good DB...regardless of draft status or 40 time.

But none of that is assured to translate to the NFL. And the problem last year wasn't having some talented players. It was depth. When our starting RB and two starting OLs get suspended...that's when our season goes into the tank. It was because we couldn't backfill with SEC quality players.

I don't think Shula's last team was more talented than this one overall...certainly didn't have any more depth...just happened to have a couple of guys get drafted late.

[Nay4AU 2]

That is what we "Bammers" tried to tell you last year. We have NO talent.....and the NFL agrees.

Riiiiiight.

I neeeeever heard a bammer (you included) tout DJ Hall, Simeon Castille, or Wallace Gilberry as a world beater...

We get it. Saban's the scapegoat. You know, the guy who recruited these aforementioned all-important highly ranked recruits. Wonderkid Saban really coached them to their full potential their Senior year...

This will certainly set you up for 'Cruitin Champeenship '09.

"Come to Bama. Where we recruit top talent and digest them into turds that no NFL team wants. You have a better chance making it to the NFL through an upper tier D-II school."

none of the three guys you mentioned were "highly ranked recruits". at least i don't think 3* guys are "highly ranked"......jmo.

Hall & Gilberry weren't highly ranked but Castille was.

2004 Class

[BamaGrad03 0]

That is what we "Bammers" tried to tell you last year. We have NO talent.....and the NFL agrees.

Riiiiiight.

I neeeeever heard a bammer (you included) tout DJ Hall, Simeon Castille, or Wallace Gilberry as a world beater...

We get it. Saban's the scapegoat. You know, the guy who recruited these aforementioned all-important highly ranked recruits. Wonderkid Saban really coached them to their full potential their Senior year...

This will certainly set you up for 'Cruitin Champeenship '09.

"Come to Bama. Where we recruit top talent and digest them into turds that no NFL team wants. You have a better chance making it to the NFL through an upper tier D-II school."

none of the three guys you mentioned were "highly ranked recruits". at least i don't think 3* guys are "highly ranked"......jmo.

Hall & Gilberry weren't highly ranked but Castille was.

2004 Class

CSTV? That's who we are quoting now for recruiting rankings? Castille was a 3 star on Rivals and Scout.

[runswithscissors 33]

That is what we "Bammers" tried to tell you last year. We have NO talent.....and the NFL agrees.

Riiiiiight.

I neeeeever heard a bammer (you included) tout DJ Hall, Simeon Castille, or Wallace Gilberry as a world beater...

We get it. Saban's the scapegoat. You know, the guy who recruited these aforementioned all-important highly ranked recruits. Wonderkid Saban really coached them to their full potential their Senior year...

This will certainly set you up for 'Cruitin Champeenship '09.

"Come to Bama. Where we recruit top talent and digest them into turds that no NFL team wants. You have a better chance making it to the NFL through an upper tier D-II school."

none of the three guys you mentioned were "highly ranked recruits". at least i don't think 3* guys are "highly ranked"......jmo.

Hall & Gilberry weren't highly ranked but Castille was.

2004 Class

because he is ranked in sportswriter Bill Hodge's Top 150 that makes him "highly ranked"? seriously? you're going to have to come up with something better than that.

[AUChizad 0]

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Why do you respond to my posts without reading them?

I'm saying IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them. Which means you then MUST give him the same credit for the one year players at LSU.

I'm not giving him credit for either.

Why don't you read mine?

For one, I stated that it had been stated on this board many times. I did not imply by you. Although you did try to draw that ridiculous comparison that "IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them."

And I'm saying that that is ridiculous logic.

One year as coach your freshman year and being coached up and developing late in your college career (or not, and faltering late in your career) is apples and oranges to going three seasons of constant improvement, culminating in All-SEC status, and then your senior season tanking due to poor coaching (as opposed to a new coach coming in and taking talented players to that next level and actually IMPROVING their draft status their Senior year).

It's clear as day if you'd take of the Nick Saban is an infallible God glasses.

Do I need to draw you a chart?

[runswithscissors 33]

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Why do you respond to my posts without reading them?

I'm saying IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them. Which means you then MUST give him the same credit for the one year players at LSU.

I'm not giving him credit for either.

Why don't you read mine?

For one, I stated that it had been stated on this board many times. I did not imply by you. Although you did try to draw that ridiculous comparison that "IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them."

And I'm saying that that is ridiculous logic.

One year as coach your freshman year and being coached up and developing late in your college career (or not, and faltering late in your career) is apples and oranges to going three seasons of constant improvement, culminating in All-SEC status, and then your senior season tanking due to poor coaching (as opposed to a new coach coming in and taking talented players to that next level and actually IMPROVING their draft status their Senior year).

It's clear as day if you'd take of the Nick Saban is an infallible God glasses.

Do I need to draw you a chart?

so what you're saying is somehow when CNS came on board they magically forgot how to play football? there are lots of reasons somebody could tank their SR season. for example, i guess Brandon Cox tanked his SR season because of poor coaching? afterall, he has always played with his illness and has seemed to do well. the only reason you are so convinced that it is because of poor coaching is because that is what most conveniently fits to what you want to think. if a guy has 3 years of great coaching and is a remarkable athlete, he is not going to just forget it all when a coach comes in for his senior season. what did CNS do, have his memory erased and start training him from scratch?

[AUChizad 0]

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Why do you respond to my posts without reading them?

I'm saying IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them. Which means you then MUST give him the same credit for the one year players at LSU.

I'm not giving him credit for either.

Why don't you read mine?

For one, I stated that it had been stated on this board many times. I did not imply by you. Although you did try to draw that ridiculous comparison that "IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them."

And I'm saying that that is ridiculous logic.

One year as coach your freshman year and being coached up and developing late in your college career (or not, and faltering late in your career) is apples and oranges to going three seasons of constant improvement, culminating in All-SEC status, and then your senior season tanking due to poor coaching (as opposed to a new coach coming in and taking talented players to that next level and actually IMPROVING their draft status their Senior year).

It's clear as day if you'd take of the Nick Saban is an infallible God glasses.

Do I need to draw you a chart?

so what you're saying is somehow when CNS came on board they magically forgot how to play football? there are lots of reasons somebody could tank their SR season. for example, i guess Brandon Cox tanked his SR season because of poor coaching? afterall, he has always played with his illness and has seemed to do well. the only reason you are so convinced that it is because of poor coaching is because that is what most conveniently fits to what you want to think. if a guy has 3 years of great coaching and is a remarkable athlete, he is not going to just forget it all when a coach comes in for his senior season. what did CNS do, have his memory erased and start training him from scratch?

That might be a decent point if Brandon Cox "tanked" his Senior year instead of showed marked improvement over his Junior year...but alas it isn't.

So, if I begin coaching at Florida tomorrow, is Tim Tebow going to win another Heisman? Due to the fact that I don't know dick about coaching football, Florida may lose to a team like LA Monroe, and Tebow probably decline in performance.

[lca408 366]

From 2001-2005 Saban had 2 first round picks.

You may want to recheck the bucket load comment against the reality.

From 2001-2005 only 22 players from LSU were drafted. During his tenure not as much NFL action occurred. Once a new coach was at the reigns those players that were young on the NC team began to pile out into the NFL. 2006 and 07 drafts sucked up a lot of LSU players.

From 2001-2005 Alabama has had 20 players taken in the draft.

from 2001-2005 only 7 LSU players were drafted in the first 3 rounds of the draft.

From 2006-2007 Lsu had 12 players recruited into the draft and 7 of them were in the first 3 rounds, and 5 were first rounders. Thats under the tight fitted cap era.

I would agree that Saban has recruited a number of players that ended up in the NFL but I wouldn't say he as a coach has prepped a lot of players for the nfl.

*Updated with interesting stuff.*

I guess my point is that during his tenure LSU became a place the NFL looked for players but it wasn't until after he left that all the talent started getting snapped up. You can not credit him for instructing drafties to maximise their draft ability and work the system. I can tell you right now Saban was a douche bag to enough people interested in these players and didn't stick up for them to help them get drafted. A few of these guys were worthy of some sort of late round picks. Alabama has never missed a single draft without having a player get picked. It just seems like it can't be a coincidence that the last 2 years saban has been a head coach at bama during the draft the players have done poorly when Shula helped a number of his guys get picked.

Actually I believe Bammer didn't have anyone picked in 1970 also.

I haven't heard a Bama fan here try to dispute your info yet. Digging it back up cause its quite telling vs. the Bama misconception that Saban did such an outstanding job getting players drafted when "probation riddled" Bama got just two less players in at the same time. I think, more than anything, that stat is more telling of the overall talent and perhaps coaching in the SEC. For Saban to have top ranked classes at LSwho, and still have Auburn beating them every other year, as well as the likes of Georgia and Florida just goes to show how well other teams are at evaluating and coaching up talent in this league.

I don't necessarily think its Saban's fault that no players got drafted. In fact, I think its a shame that Gilberry didn't go, at least in rounds 5-7. It just goes to show that Bammuh's program is that far back from the likes of LSwho, Auburn, Georgia, or Florida.

Ryan

[runswithscissors 33]

Meanwhile you guys want to credit Saban for all the LSU guys in the draft this year (Yes, it's been said multiple times on this board). Because Saban's Midas touch for one year was all these guys needed. They required no further guidance for their final three years.

Why do you respond to my posts without reading them?

I'm saying IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them. Which means you then MUST give him the same credit for the one year players at LSU.

I'm not giving him credit for either.

Why don't you read mine?

For one, I stated that it had been stated on this board many times. I did not imply by you. Although you did try to draw that ridiculous comparison that "IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF you blame Saban for coaching players for one year and them not getting drafted...then you are saying that one year is enough time for a coach to have a huuuuuuuge imprint on them."

And I'm saying that that is ridiculous logic.

One year as coach your freshman year and being coached up and developing late in your college career (or not, and faltering late in your career) is apples and oranges to going three seasons of constant improvement, culminating in All-SEC status, and then your senior season tanking due to poor coaching (as opposed to a new coach coming in and taking talented players to that next level and actually IMPROVING their draft status their Senior year).

It's clear as day if you'd take of the Nick Saban is an infallible God glasses.

Do I need to draw you a chart?

so what you're saying is somehow when CNS came on board they magically forgot how to play football? there are lots of reasons somebody could tank their SR season. for example, i guess Brandon Cox tanked his SR season because of poor coaching? afterall, he has always played with his illness and has seemed to do well. the only reason you are so convinced that it is because of poor coaching is because that is what most conveniently fits to what you want to think. if a guy has 3 years of great coaching and is a remarkable athlete, he is not going to just forget it all when a coach comes in for his senior season. what did CNS do, have his memory erased and start training him from scratch?

That might be a decent point if Brandon Cox "tanked" his Senior year instead of showed marked improvement over his Junior year...but alas it isn't.

So, if I begin coaching at Florida tomorrow, is Tim Tebow going to win another Heisman? Due to the fact that I don't know dick about coaching football, Florida may lose to a team like LA Monroe, and Tebow probably decline in performance.

seriously? so you propose that he showed such marked improvement over his JR year that they felt the need to pull him to put in a true freshman QB in the MSU game (third game of the season)? a game which he was 4/10 with two INTs? please tell me how he showed "marked improvement". he threw for less yards, had a lower completion percentage, lower yards per throw average, shorter long ball, 5 less TDs, and 4 more INTs in his SR season than he did in his JR season. his JR season his rating was a 138.69. his SR season it was a 115.95. and need we even discuss the UGA game? 1 TD and 4 INTs? i had to look twice because i couldn't believe you actually wanted to make that argument.

[BamaGrad03 0]

One year as coach your freshman year and being coached up and developing late in your college career (or not, and faltering late in your career) is apples and oranges to going three seasons of constant improvement, culminating in All-SEC status, and then your senior season tanking due to poor coaching (as opposed to a new coach coming in and taking talented players to that next level and actually IMPROVING their draft status their Senior year).

DJ Hall had a 1005 yard season last year and 1056 his junior year. He had 5 TDs his Junior year and 6 last season. Man he sure did tank.

Simeon's INT numbers dropped, but he was also playing a different position. He had 8 fewer tackles.

Wallace had 80 tackles, 27 for a loss and 10 sacks. In 06 he had: 43 tackles, 3.5 sacks.

Keith Brown's numbers went down because he didn't play. Guys like Matt Caddell started over him and he now has a shot at making an NFL roster. Something that was UNTHINKABLE for him going into last year.

FURTHERMORE...you guys were using preseason and last year's all SEC teams to say that these guys sucked their senior year...uh HELLO...DJ, Wallace and Simeon all made ALL SEC. Simeon and Wallace both made first team all SEC.

So remind me, how did these guys tank in their senior season? Can you do better than 1st team all SEC? Interesting also, that you guys expect all these players to play lights out while picking up a new system.

[weagle251 1]

So, if we've established that Gilberry/Hall/Castille didn't tank their senior seasons, then we're left with two scenarios.

1. Their coaching staff failed to render them assistance in getting to the NFL.

2. They weren't very good to begin with.

Which is it?

[BamaGrad03 0]

So, if we've established that Gilberry/Hall/Castille didn't tank their senior seasons, then we're left with two scenarios.

1. Their coaching staff failed to render them assistance in getting to the NFL.

2. They weren't very good to begin with.

Which is it?

Ha. That's funny.

As I've already said, they just didn't have the combine measurables. And DJ had off the field issues. You can be a good college player and not have it translate to NFL $$$.

[WinCrimson 61]

It doesn't really matter, but Antione Caldwell would have been selected had he entered the NFL draft.

[BamaGrad03 0]

I just think it's so funny that you guys are SO desparate to assign blame on Nick Saban. The only acceptable solution to us not drafting 15 guys off of a 7-6 team HAS to be that Saban did something wrong.

That way you can keep moving forward with your mindset that Alabama will always suck under Saban and that things are going to stay the way they have been the last few years.

Keep thinking it.

[weagle251 1]

I just think it's so funny that you guys are SO desparate to assign blame on Nick Saban. The only acceptable solution to us not drafting 15 guys off of a 7-6 team HAS to be that Saban did something wrong.

That way you can keep moving forward with your mindset that Alabama will always suck under Saban and that things are going to stay the way they have been the last few years.

Keep thinking it.

That's not what I was saying at all. Gilberry in particular just felt kind of hung out to dry, that's all. I completely agree that college talent does not always equal pro talent. But no picks? I didn't expect 15, but at least one or two. You have to agree with that, don't you?

Regardless of what the bama boards are saying this week, you guys don't lack talent, and past recruiting rankings bear that out. Probation ensured you lacked depth. No doubt everyone across the state has had this conversation before in some form or fashion, but I've heard many a Bama fan tell me, "I'll put my starters up against any other starters in the SEC." Again, you succinctly pointed out that they didn't forget how to play football last season, and I've tried to make the case that at least your starting team is SEC-caliber. So that leaves the coaching staff's support of their draft-eligible players. Wouldn't you agree?

There's also the matter of the team's '07 record, and the fact that non-standout players from underperforming teams tend to get overlooked in the draft, but who should take responsibility for that?

[BamaGrad03 0]

If a player is good enough to be drafted, I doubt his coach campaigning for him or not is gonna lock him out of the draft.

I will say, if anybody got hurt for something like that, it'd be DJ. Saban, given the opportunity to vouch for him, may have informed NFL teams about what DJ was like off the field.

Saban loves Wallace, I'd guess he called everybody he could to get him employed.

Say what you want about Saban, but he's got NFL connections.

[WAR-MATT 2]

If a player is good enough to be drafted, I doubt his coach campaigning for him or not is gonna lock him out of the draft.

I will say, if anybody got hurt for something like that, it'd be DJ. Saban, given the opportunity to vouch for him, may have informed NFL teams about what DJ was like off the field.

Saban loves Wallace, I'd guess he called everybody he could to get him employed.

Say what you want about Saban, but he's got NFL connections.

Saban has to take some of that responsibility as well. Remember the first half suspension against La. Monroe? Saban acted as an enabler to the problem instead of trying to fix it.

[BamaGrad03 0]

Saban has to take some of that responsibility as well. Remember the first half suspension against La. Monroe? Saban acted as an enabler to the problem instead of trying to fix it.

No argument here. I thought bringing him in at halftime was a very bad move.

[AUslug 1]

Saban may have NFL connections but he also burned some bridges when he left. I think the fact that Bama had no players drafted is getting blown way out of proportion. I don't see it as Saban's fault and it isn't a sign that Bama is some bottomfeeding program. Right now Alabama is a middle of the pack team in terms of overall talent and their record since 2000 shows it, probation and coaching changes are the main reasons why. The NFL is a funny place and the draft is just as weird.

[WAR-MATT 2]

Chris Capps signed a FA deal with the Texans. Anyone can get a FA deal if ole "turnstile" can. WOW!!!

[Legionfield 0]

Saban may have NFL connections but he also burned some bridges when he left. I think the fact that Bama had no players drafted is getting blown way out of proportion. I don't see it as Saban's fault and it isn't a sign that Bama is some bottomfeeding program. Right now Alabama is a middle of the pack team in terms of overall talent and their record since 2000 shows it, probation and coaching changes are the main reasons why. The NFL is a funny place and the draft is just as weird.

Agreed. Great post............

Chris Capps signed a FA deal with the Texans. Anyone can get a FA deal if ole "turnstile" can. WOW!!!

LOL!!!

[SouthLink02 8]

Yes. I knew Bama wasn't recruiting lights out the last few years but I did not expect them to be at this point of nobody being drafted.