AOC, Ilhan Omar Call Out Republican Racism in Fiery Speeches

[arein0 983]

1 hour ago, jj3jordan said:

No. Pharisees were Jews that denied Jesus was the Messiah. I believe Jesus is the Messiah. So Pharisees and me would be on opposite sides.  You are welcome to believe in whatever God you choose.  Why does your belief have anything to do with me? If you don’t believe the Bible Old or New Testament is truth then it’s no problem.  I believe it.  

What I believe obviously does bother you. You just told me to pick a new saviour because you didnt agree with my beliefs, which you did ask for. And if that is all you got from the Pharisees, I cant help you. They were called out for their hypocrisies and strict observance of the traditional and written law. You know kind of like the people using religion to claim gays shouldnt be allowed to be married, when they know its impossible to live a life without sin and Jesus came to save us from our sins.

[homersapien 11,513]

On 2/3/2023 at 11:50 PM, icanthearyou said:

You consistently lie.  You are a liar.  You do not know the truth.

https://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/was-hillary-clinton-the-original-birther/

He's not exactly lying.  He's simply susceptible to misinformation (falsehoods) because it confirms his bias.  Like George Constanza said, "it's not a lie if you believe it".

Now if he repeats it, it's definitely a lie.

Edited February 5, 2023 by homersapien

[jj3jordan 2,081]

14 hours ago, arein0 said:

What I believe obviously does bother you. You just told me to pick a new saviour because you didnt agree with my beliefs, which you did ask for. And if that is all you got from the Pharisees, I cant help you. They were called out for their hypocrisies and strict observance of the traditional and written law. You know kind of like the people using religion to claim gays shouldnt be allowed to be married, when they know its impossible to live a life without sin and Jesus came to save us from our sins.

What I said:  You are welcome to believe in whatever God you choose. 

I did not tell you to pick a new savior.  To me the Bible is clear. Jesus said that no one comes to the father except through Him. If you dispute that Jesus said this or what it means, then you are free to do so. You are the one who brought up Pharisees, not me. I don't think you can be a strict observer of traditional and written law and be a hypocrite also. That would mean you didn't follow the law you demanded everyone else follow.  My statement regarding the pharisees is 100% true and so simple anyone can understand it.  None of that is relevant to anything because of Jesus. Seems like the theme of you and others on this board is a refusal to believe in the truth of the Bible. I believe the Bible is truth. Maybe some people have a hard time understanding it and the reason God wrote it as He did.  Gay marriage is a popular issue for Bible deniers and atheists/agnostics/humanists and yes, even some Christians. I think they are wrong to endorse or participate in gay marriage. That will be decided between them and God on Judgement day. No one, especially me, can judge another person regarding salvation. If you refuse to believe the Bible and what It clearly says regarding homosexuality, that is your choice. 

[homersapien 11,513]

These discussions always remind me of what Ghandi said:  "I like your Christ but not your Christianity".

No doubt, Ghandi is burning it hell at the very moment, right?    

Edited February 6, 2023 by homersapien

[I_M4_AU 8,056]

On 2/4/2023 at 11:16 AM, homersapien said:

The same way not owning an electric tractor (which doesn't even exist) makes me a global warming hypocrite.

After a couple of days of thinking this conversation over, I have come to the conclusion that you are the only person who would take information about an upcoming surgery and make it political.  Good job.

Good luck on your surgery.

[jj3jordan 2,081]

8 minutes ago, homersapien said:

These discussion always remind me of what Ghandi said:  "I like your Christ but not your Christianity".

No doubt, Ghandi is burning it hell at the very moment, right?    

Did Ghandi believe in Jesus and accept Him as his Lord and Saviour?

[arein0 983]

18 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

What I said: 

 You are welcome to believe in whatever God you choose. 

I did not tell you to pick a new savior.  

Are you really trying to gaslight me when there is a recorded history of what you said?

21 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

Jesus said it. If you go thru Him you are good. Doesn’t really seem to need much interpretation. But you do you and pick a different Saviour.

 

18 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

I don't think you can be a strict observer of traditional and written law and be a hypocrite also. That would mean you didn't follow the law you demanded everyone else follow.  My statement regarding the pharisees is 100% true and so simple anyone can understand it.  None of that is relevant to anything because of Jesus. Seems like the theme of you and others on this board is a refusal to believe in the truth of the Bible. I believe the Bible is truth. Maybe some people have a hard time understanding it and the reason God wrote it as He did.  Gay marriage is a popular issue for Bible deniers and atheists/agnostics/humanists and yes, even some Christians. I think they are wrong to endorse or participate in gay marriage. That will be decided between them and God on Judgement day. No one, especially me, can judge another person regarding salvation. If you refuse to believe the Bible and what It clearly says regarding homosexuality, that is your choice. 

I never thought I would see this, but you are a modern day Pharisee. Let me ask you this. Do you believe what Jesus said that all sin are equal? Do you believe that it is impossible to go through life sinless unless your name is Jesus? If your answer is yes to both of these then you are a hypocrite with your stance on gay marriage. Jesus preaches forgiveness not condemnation. 

[homersapien 11,513]

36 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

After a couple of days of thinking this conversation over, I have come to the conclusion that you are the only person who would take information about an upcoming surgery and make it political.  Good job.

Good luck on your surgery.

Uh, that doesn't change what you said one iota. 

You implied I was a hypocrite for considering AGW as a serious issue when I don't own an electric tractor!   Obviously, you are not a serious person who is capable of serious debate.  You're here to fling poo, not to engage. 

There is zero reason for me to think you are sincere in wishing me "good luck".  You'll just turn right around and insult my integrity five minutes later.  **** you.

Edited February 5, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,513]

10 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

Did Ghandi believe in Jesus and accept Him as his Lord and Saviour?

Thanks for proving my point.

[jj3jordan 2,081]

1 minute ago, arein0 said:

Are you really trying to gaslight me when there is a recorded history of what you said?

 

I never thought I would see this, but you are a modern day Pharisee. Let me ask you this. Do you believe what Jesus said that all sin are equal? Do you believe that it is impossible to go through life sinless unless your name is Jesus? If your answer is yes to both of these then you are a hypocrite with your stance on gay marriage. Jesus preaches forgiveness not condemnation. 

My mistake I was referencing the post just prior. You sounded like you thought there were other saviors to be had so you didn't have to believe in Jesus. My apologies.

Call me whatever you want it does not matter.

Yes all sin is sin. Yes sinless life is impossible for us. The Bible has a stance on gay marriage. I believe the Bible and try to follow It.  Jesus does forgive us for our sin. In order to receive this you must repent, turn away from your sinful behavior, change your life (be "born again", and follow Jesus from that point forward. That's the part people like you forget. Actively practicing sin is still a rejection of Jesus. There is a difference between sinning inadvertently which we all do and practicing sin in defiance of God such as gay marriage, robbery, murder, idolatry, covetousness, etc.  This is just my understanding of the salvation process. It is not an indictment of anyone. If some one feels judged by this then it is because they feel some innate guilt in their life. 

 

[jj3jordan 2,081]

8 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Thanks for proving my point.

You're welcome. What is your point?

[homersapien 11,513]

Just now, jj3jordan said:

You're welcome. What is your point?

I'll bet you're the only one who didn't get it.

[I_M4_AU 8,056]

14 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Uh, that doesn't change what you said one iota. 

You implied I was a hypocrite for considering AGW as a serious issue when I don't own an electric tractor!   Obviously, you are not a serious person who is capable of serious debate.  You're here to fling poo, not to engage. 

There is zero reason for me to think you are sincere in wishing me "good luck".  You'll just turn right around and insult my integrity five minutes later.  **** you.

This is typical of you.  I must not have been clear; you ARE a hypocrite.  It’s not about an electric tractor, they do make electric *gator* type vehicles and electric cars and pickup trucks; I haven’t heard you say anything about owning those.

I am capable of separating issues of political importance with life issues that involve health and well being even thought you obviously aren’t.

[icanthearyou 4,464]

54 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

What I said: 

 You are welcome to believe in whatever God you choose. 

I did not tell you to pick a new savior.  To me the Bible is clear. Jesus said that no one comes to the father except through Him. If you dispute that Jesus said this or what it means, then you are free to do so. You are the one who brought up Pharisees, not me. I don't think you can be a strict observer of traditional and written law and be a hypocrite also. That would mean you didn't follow the law you demanded everyone else follow.  My statement regarding the pharisees is 100% true and so simple anyone can understand it.  None of that is relevant to anything because of Jesus. Seems like the theme of you and others on this board is a refusal to believe in the truth of the Bible. I believe the Bible is truth. Maybe some people have a hard time understanding it and the reason God wrote it as He did.  Gay marriage is a popular issue for Bible deniers and atheists/agnostics/humanists and yes, even some Christians. I think they are wrong to endorse or participate in gay marriage. That will be decided between them and God on Judgement day. No one, especially me, can judge another person regarding salvation. If you refuse to believe the Bible and what It clearly says regarding homosexuality, that is your choice. 

So for you, belief in the bible is critical to salvation?  Belief in Jesus is unimportant?

Who told you that we must believe all that is in the bible?  Did Jesus not warn the children of Israel that they had lost God in their tradition, customs, scripture, law?

I am simply saying, man has created religion, created tradition, created the bible (sure, the bible can still be inspired by God but,,, that in itself holds many, many meanings).  Jesus gave us a very simple commandment.  I will follow that commandment rather than some cultural bias of men.

IMHO, judgment will have little to do with "law".  Judgment will be about how loving, kind, generous, forgiving we are.  Did we do as Jesus asked or,,, were we too entrenched in worldly concepts, ideas, norms, traditions.

[arein0 983]

21 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

My mistake I was referencing the post just prior. You sounded like you thought there were other saviors to be had so you didn't have to believe in Jesus. My apologies.

Call me whatever you want it does not matter.

Yes all sin is sin. Yes sinless life is impossible for us. The Bible has a stance on gay marriage. I believe the Bible and try to follow It.  Jesus does forgive us for our sin. In order to receive this you must repent, turn away from your sinful behavior, change your life (be "born again", and follow Jesus from that point forward. That's the part people like you forget. Actively practicing sin is still a rejection of Jesus. There is a difference between sinning inadvertently which we all do and practicing sin in defiance of God such as gay marriage, robbery, murder, idolatry, covetousness, etc.  This is just my understanding of the salvation process. It is not an indictment of anyone. If some one feels judged by this then it is because they feel some innate guilt in their life. 

 

You are contradicting yourself. At the beginning you say all sin is sin but then continue on and say there are layers of worse sin. Also, that is a long list of things to do to be forgiven of your sins. Do you believe you have to be born again everytime you sin? That would be a lot of being born again as it is in our nature to sin. I believe that the only way to recieve forgiveness is to ask for it. You know, 1 John 1:9.

[jj3jordan 2,081]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

I'll bet you're the only one who didn't get it.

Articulate it for us.

[homersapien 11,513]

On 2/5/2023 at 4:02 PM, jj3jordan said:

Articulate it for us.

You implied Mahatma Ghandi would not go to heaven - and therefore be relegated to hell - unless he accepted Jesus Christ as his savior, and (of course) that is the only way a person goes to heaven (instead of hell).

That is exactly the sort of religious dogma that all religious extremists have in common - only their specific belief system allows a person "eternal life in paradise.  All others are condemned to hell. They are unworthy of paradise because they don't share your specific dogma.

This is very dangerous thinking.

It leads to the obvious conclusion that those who don't share your specific religious beliefs are really unworthy of living at all - after all, they reject (your) God and he is going to relegate them to hell. There's really no difference between rejecting your God (Jesus) and opposing him, right?

Such thinking has been used throughout history in both the old and new worlds as a justification for genocide of whole populations, from conquistadors in the new world - who gave native populations a choice between converting and accepting Christ or die by the sword - to constant Jewish pogroms in Europe, to the Crusades against Muslims.  Religious extremists think they are doing God's work based on similar dogma. 

Never mind that Christians represent only as small fraction of the global population.  God doesn't want them because they have not accepted Christ, never mind they've never even heard of Christ or happen to have been brought up under a different religious tradition.

I am not saying you would necessarily approve of murdering Jews, Muslims, atheists, Hindus, etc. but your core beliefs provide the architecture to do just that in the minds of many.  It also means you are susceptible to being persuaded to kill non-believers in the right circumstances.  You already possess the foundational architecture of belief to take that step.

You probably consider your belief that Jesus is "the only way" to enter into eternal life with God is a positive for Christianity.  I am telling you that it is not, at least to rational people who haven't been indoctrinated to believe such a thing.  Such a belief may empower believers but it will ultimately doom Christianity. It's irrational to believe those who don't believe what you do are relegated to hell.  It is a prescription for doing evil.

IMO, it's possibly the only bad thing Christ is (reputed to) have said.

Bottom line, you are ultimately equivalent to the Taliban or any other religious extremist.  You just haven't (yet) worked your way up mentally and emotionally (like them) to exercise their convictions. 

Hope this helps in your understanding.

Edited February 7, 2023 by homersapien

[icanthearyou 4,464]

42 minutes ago, homersapien said:

IMO, it's possibly the only bad thing Christ is (reputed to) have said.

Perhaps, accepting Jesus is living as he commanded?

To acknowledge Jesus and,,, then live as the world dictates, seems rather hollow.  It is the inherent hypocrisy the church has repeated throughout history.

[jj3jordan 2,081]

25 minutes ago, homersapien said:

You implied Mahatma Ghandi would not go to heaven - and therefore be relegated to hell - unless he accepted Jesus Christ as his savior, and (of course) that is the only way a person goes to heaven (instead of hell).

That is exactly the sort of religious dogma that all religious extremists have in common - only their specific belief system allows a person "eternal life in paradise.  All others are condemned to hell. They are unworthy of paradise because they don't share your specific dogma.

This is very dangerous thinking.

It leads to the obvious conclusion that those who don't share your specific religious beliefs are really unworthy of living at all - after all, they reject (your) God and he is going to relegate them to hell. There's really no difference between rejecting your God (Jesus) and opposing him, right?

Such thinking has been used throughout history in both the old and new worlds as a justification for genocide of whole populations, from conquistadors in the new world - who gave native populations a choice between converting and accepting Christ or die by the sword - to constant Jewish pogroms in Europe, to the Crusades against Muslims.  Religious extremists think they are doing God's work based on similar dogma. 

Never mind that Christians represent only as small fraction of the global population.  God doesn't want them because they have not accepted Christ by definition, never mind they've never heard of Christ or happen to have been brought up under a different religious tradition.

I am not saying you would necessarily approve of murdering Jews, Muslims, atheists, Hindus, etc. but your core beliefs provide the architecture to do just that in the minds of many.  It also means you are susceptible to being persuaded to kill non-believers in the right circumstances.  You already possess the foundational architecture of belief to take that step.

You probably consider your belief that Jesus is "the only way" to enter into eternal life with God is a positive for Christianity.  I am telling you that it is not, at least to rational people who haven't been indoctrinated to believe such a thing.  Such a belief may empower believers but it will ultimately doom Christianity. It's irrational to believe those who don't believe what you do are relegated to hell.  It is a prescription for doing evil.

IMO, it's possibly the only bad thing Christ is (reputed to) have said.

Bottom line, you are ultimately equivalent to the Taliban or any other religious extremist.  You just haven't (yet) worked your way up mentally and emotionally (like them) to exercise their convictions. 

Hope this helps in your understanding.

It is my belief that one does not get to heaven through works alone.  I don't know what was in Ghandi's heart, or if he is in heaven or hell.

No, it is not my specific beliefs that mean anything. It is the words of Jesus, you know, the only 'bad' thing He said. I don't see it as bad.  It is literally the path to eternal life with Him in heaven, and the best part is it is freely given.

Personally I don't believe that you can murder people for not converting to Christianity and claim to have had a genuine acceptance of Jesus. Those groups have been misled by Satan into doing things Jesus did not direct his disciples and followers to do in the great commission. They placed themselves on the level with God and they should not have.  I don't approve of murdering anybody.  People can believe what they want.  Call me whatever you would like and it is irrelevant to my life.

When I get to the judgement seat, I will face the same God you will.  I am placing my eternity on my faith in Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. You can give your opinion regarding the Bible and identify to Jesus His bad quotes.

Bottom line, I am just a Christian man with an unshakeable belief in Jesus as the redeemer of mankind and the only path to eternal life in Heaven with God.  If that makes me an extremist then I shall wear the mantle. You seem to think that my 'convictions', should I work my way up to them would result in violence. That sir is proof of your complete misunderstanding of Jesus, Christians in general, and me.

[homersapien 11,513]

19 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

It is my belief that one does not get to heaven through works alone.  I don't know what was in Ghandi's heart, or if he is in heaven or hell.

No, it is not my specific beliefs that mean anything. It is the words of Jesus, you know, the only 'bad' thing He said. I don't see it as bad.  It is literally the path to eternal life with Him in heaven, and the best part is it is freely given.

Personally I don't believe that you can murder people for not converting to Christianity and claim to have had a genuine acceptance of Jesus. Those groups have been misled by Satan into doing things Jesus did not direct his disciples and followers to do in the great commission. They placed themselves on the level with God and they should not have.  I don't approve of murdering anybody.  People can believe what they want.  Call me whatever you would like and it is irrelevant to my life.

When I get to the judgement seat, I will face the same God you will.  I am placing my eternity on my faith in Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. You can give your opinion regarding the Bible and identify to Jesus His bad quotes.

Bottom line, I am just a Christian man with an unshakeable belief in Jesus as the redeemer of mankind and the only path to eternal life in Heaven with God.  If that makes me an extremist then I shall wear the mantle. You seem to think that my 'convictions', should I work my way up to them would result in violence. That sir is proof of your complete misunderstanding of Jesus, Christians in general, and me.

First, let's not forget you implied Ghandi would be in hell if he hadn't specifically accepted Jesus as his "savior".  Presumably, you believe that's literally true.

I just don't have it in me to actually believe such an irrational notion.  So, it's not so much as me understanding as it is me rejecting.

Now, I will say I don't understand how so many people can accept this as real or true.  (Like I've said before, I apparently didn't get the "God gene" and you did.) 

If one has the "God gene" they are apparently inclined to actually believe such a notion - or whatever else regarding a given religion - as true. 

No doubt the "God gene" bestows advantages. It's likely been evident throughout our (human) history.  Obviously, there are evolutionary advantage (sociologically speaking).  Such a religious belief obviously makes for excellent motivation for wiping out other "tribes", as I alluded to.  (And don't kid yourself, people who murdered fellow humans for being non-believers believed just as convincingly as you do. You have no more standing to say otherwise than you do to insist Ghandi is in hell.)

Such belief also bestows a hope - if not expectation - for an after-life.  I am sure that's comforting.

Bottom line, as long as you don't persecute others for not sharing your beliefs, you are "welcome to them" (as Titan would say).  

Live and let live.

 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2023 by homersapien

[jj3jordan 2,081]

5 hours ago, homersapien said:

First, let's not forget you implied Ghandi would be in hell if he hadn't specifically accepted Jesus as his "savior".  Presumably, you believe that's literally true.

I just don't have it in me to actually believe such an irrational notion.  So, it's not so much as me understanding as it is me rejecting.

Now, I will say I don't understand how so many people can accept this as real or true.  (Like I've said before, I apparently didn't get the "God gene" and you did.) 

If one has the "God gene" they are apparently inclined to actually believe such a notion - or whatever else regarding a given religion - as true. 

No doubt the "God gene" bestows advantages. It's likely been evident throughout our (human) history.  Obviously, there are evolutionary advantage (sociologically speaking).  Such a religious belief obviously makes for excellent motivation for wiping out other "tribes", as I alluded to.  (And don't kid yourself, people who murdered fellow humans for being non-believers believed just as convincingly as you do. You have no more standing to say otherwise than you do to insist Ghandi is in hell.)

Such belief also bestows a hope - if not expectation - for an after-life.  I am sure that's comforting.

Bottom line, as long as you don't persecute others for not sharing your beliefs, you are "welcome to them" (as Titan would say).  

Live and let live.

 

 

 

As far as I know there is not a God gene. I will pray that God will soften your heart and allow His message to filter through to you. 

[jj3jordan 2,081]

On 2/4/2023 at 10:16 AM, homersapien said:

The same way not owning an electric tractor (which doesn't even exist) makes me a global warming hypocrite.

Well let’s review a little.

At 65 you are required by law to pay into Medicare. That becomes your primary insurance. 
 

The doctor is also required by law to file the charges against the Medicare policy. I don’t think the doctor has the option of not filing to Medicare. So his surgery and subsequent coverage he has paid into has nothing to do with socialism or his political belief or lack thereof.

You however are not required to have a hobby farm. Nor are you required to use a diesel tractor to work it. I don’t know if there are capable electric tractors out there or not.  But if there are then a person as vested in global warming/cooling/warming again/climate change would absolutely demand one. Does your hobby farm produce anything worthwhile? Garden crops, hay, pecans, blueberries, anything for others to benefit from? At my farm in Laurel Hill FL (owned from 2011-19) I used gas mowers and weed eaters and a diesel tractor to work 2 acres, @1000 plants of blueberries which I did sell as a U pick operation, gave away a lot, and I sold hay to some neighbors. Doesn’t matter I loved my tractor as it did the job well. 
 

If you did not produce anything and your hobby farm was just that, a hobby, then yes, you are a climate hypocrite for not using an electric tractor.

[AUDynasty 585]

12 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

As far as I know there is not a God gene. I will pray that God will soften your heart and allow His message to filter through to you. 

I will pray that God will soften your heart and allow you to be less judgmental towards gay people sharing genuine love for each other with or without marrying. Spend less time embracing the Bible and embrace the way of Jesus more. God bless.

[homersapien 11,513]

12 hours ago, jj3jordan said:

As far as I know there is not a God gene. I will pray that God will soften your heart and allow His message to filter through to you. 

I'd rather you pray for God to provide me an electric tractor, preferably made in America. 

[jj3jordan 2,081]

6 hours ago, AUDynasty said:

I will pray that God will soften your heart and allow you to be less judgmental towards gay people sharing genuine love for each other with or without marrying. Spend less time embracing the Bible and embrace the way of Jesus more. God bless.

Well at least we will all be praying.