Harsin: Firing Williams couldn't wait

[Tigerpro2a 5,650]

8 minutes ago, DAG said:

That doesn't mean he is salty. He doesn't work for Auburn anymore, so why would he have anything auburn related on his personal page. I am sure Auburn doesn't have his stuff on their page. Let the man be.

Yea that's a little speculative. If I worked for a company and they fired me, or I quit, Either way I would more than likely remove things like that. I don't think that gives any indication that he is "salty" either.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

4 minutes ago, AU80cruiser said:

Not only that but the entire game is no longer available on youtube. The only entire recording has been taken down. The one that claims to be a full game is chopped up and doesnt show the last quarter of play.

Had him ignored so didn’t realize he quoted me. If you make claims that that something happened it’s on you to provide the evidence not the other way around. 

if they don’t want to then that’s fine but you can’t expect people to take their word on it without evidence. If you do that then I can say “ I saw Bo flipping TJ off behind is back on 4 plays. But I’m too lazy to prove it so just believe me. “

[Tigerpro2a 5,650]

1 hour ago, W.E.D said:

I honestly don't think Bobo has been that bad.  He's had WRs running open pretty frequently.  Our QBs haven't been able to get them the ball, especially deep to make "big" plays

This^^^^. He made one horrible play call in the PSU game and we are ready to fire him. What about all the open TDs missed by Bo. What about Tank not hitting the right gap or cutting the wrong way. I think he has called pretty good plays for the most part. If I had one criticism other than the goal line fade it would be to quit worrying so much about being balanced. Put tank and Hunter in and smash until they show they can stop it.

 

That is one compliment I will give Gus. When he had a solid OL and he got the run game going.....he didn't worry about balance. He pounded the rock and dared them to try to stop it. Hell, everybody in the stadium, and everybody watching on tv knew we were running the ball and they still couldn't stop it.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Tigerpro2a

[tgrogan21 6,198]

5 minutes ago, Tigerpro2a said:

Circumstances matter.

Like when the players refuse to turn their head when defending so they consistently get a DPI? Or is that not on coaching. The other guy chose to ignore things that didn’t fit what he wanted. So I gave him more similar issues. Might not be the exact same but still looks bad on the coaches. 

[AU80cruiser 1,102]

58 minutes ago, tgrogan21 said:

Definition of a scapegoat. Bobo should have been fired or at least demoted because his play calling as been not good and the QB play has been bad as well. But what does Harsin do? Fire the position coach of the one group that has the LEAST amount of experience on the entire team. You can then also lump in that our defense has been awful so there's good reason to fire Mason, Eason, and Etheridge. Watts is the only coach on the defensive side where his group hasn't s*** the bed.

Our OL has been trash as well but Friend wasn't held accountable for "football performance". He fired the young coach instead of everyone else so he can install his own guy. I'm fine with that but to think that other coaches shouldn't be held accountable to the same standards is why I'm so frustrated. You can't say it's football performance, look at how our team has played and then only punish one guy.

scape·goat

/noun

noun: scapegoat; plural noun: scapegoats

1. 1.

   a person who is blamed for the wrongdoings, mistakes, or faults of others, especially for reasons of expediency.

Thats where we diagree. I think Williams had a good reason to be fired. Harsin made that decision from his knowledge of whats going wrong with the team. His inside perspective. If he thought it was play calling then Bobo would be gone. 

From my outside perspective I didnt think the receivers were screwing up that badly however I trust Harsin made the correct decision because he could have fired either. 

[tgrogan21 6,198]

1 minute ago, Tigerpro2a said:

This^^^^. He made one horrible play call in the PSU game and we are ready to fire him. What about all the open TDs missed by Bo. What about Tank not hitting the right gap or cutting the wrong way. I think he has called pretty good plays for the most part. If I had one criticism other than the goal line fade it would be to quit worrying so much about being balanced. Put tank and Hunter in and smash until they show they can stop it.

I don’t want him fired or demoted. I’m just pointing out there’s a double standard. Bobo is the QB coach if we fired someone for football performance we should look long and hard at the QB coach for Bo missing all of those open receivers. That’s what I’m trying to get at. 

[Tigerpro2a 5,650]

1 minute ago, tgrogan21 said:

Like when the players refuse to turn their head when defending so they consistently get a DPI? Or is that not on coaching. The other guy chose to ignore things that didn’t fit what he wanted. So I gave him more similar issues. Might not be the exact same but still looks bad on the coaches. 

Absolutely. Speaking of Dbs not turning their head, this has been a constant complaint about the defense for the last 4 years under Steele. Could it be that players are still reacting to how they were coached for years prior to just the last 6 months of new coaching? 

I used to break and train horses for a living. The absolute worst were when people brought horses in that had been taught bad habits. I could try to teach them good habits, but the bad habits would always try to come through. You have to unteach the bad and that takes time. That goes for the entire team, though.

[Tigerpro2a 5,650]

2 minutes ago, tgrogan21 said:

I don’t want him fired or demoted. I’m just pointing out there’s a double standard. Bobo is the QB coach if we fired someone for football performance we should look long and hard at the QB coach for Bo missing all of those open receivers. That’s what I’m trying to get at. 

I think anyone with decent vision has seen that Bo is what Bo is. He will never be accurate enough to not miss those throws. He is ok on short outs, hitches, screens (even then a lot of his throws do not give the WR an opportunity to catch in stride), but he is not good downfield. I am done blaming Bo's faults on coaches. He can't be fixed.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

2 minutes ago, Tigerpro2a said:

Absolutely. Speaking of Dbs not turning their head, this has been a constant complaint about the defense for the last 4 years under Steele. Could it be that players are still reacting to how they were coached for years prior to just the last 6 months of new coaching? 

I used to break and train horses for a living. The absolute worst were when people brought horses in that had been taught bad habits. I could try to teach them good habits, but the bad habits would always try to come through. You have to unteach the bad and that takes time. That goes for the entire team, though.

Okay now apply that same logic to the WRs. We've had a really simplistic offense with almost no route trees. Wouldn't it be logical to say that the WRs are still struggling because of old coaching? They've had the same amount of time trying to learn a completely new system and way of doing things so maybe when they miss an assignment or run the wrong route it's because they're just used to running straight down the field. That's the only thing I'm trying to get at.

If he was fired because Harsin wanted him fired, fine. I'm good with that. I just don't him coming out saying it's based on performance on the field when other positions aren't playing well either. If you're gonna fire someone (unless it was for off the field stuff which hasn't been confirmed) be honest and just say, "Hey, Coach Corn is a great guy but he just wasn't the right fit for us at this point in time. I want to give the reigns of the WRs to a guy I've known and trusted for many years."

We all would have been okay with that, I think.

[aubaseball 2,596]

7 minutes ago, tgrogan21 said:

I don’t want him fired or demoted. I’m just pointing out there’s a double standard. Bobo is the QB coach if we fired someone for football performance we should look long and hard at the QB coach for Bo missing all of those open receivers. That’s what I’m trying to get at. 

Dude…have you ever played?   You can coach until you are blue in the face.   If a player is not making plays when he has been put in a position to make a play, it’s not on the coach.  
 

[tgrogan21 6,198]

4 minutes ago, Tigerpro2a said:

I think anyone with decent vision has seen that Bo is what Bo is. He will never be accurate enough to not miss those throws. He is ok on short outs, hitches, screens (even then a lot of his throws do not give the WR an opportunity to catch in stride), but he is not good downfield. I am done blaming Bo's faults on coaches. He can't be fixed.

So then shouldn't it be on the coaches for still trotting him out there or calling those downfield passes despite knowing that Bo doesn't excel at those? Maybe call short passes to move the ball. Take what your personnel can give you. Don't force him to do something he's not good at.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

Just now, aubaseball said:

Dude…have you ever played?   You can coach until you are blue in the face.   If a player is not making plays when he has been put in a position to make a play, it’s not on the coach.  
 

Ah yes, the ole "have you played" defense. Most people on a forum haven't played at a high level and almost none of coached. So I guess everyone else should just shut up about their opinions.

Again, Bo Nix the STARTING QB for over 2 seasons doesn't perform despite the coaches KNOWING this. But he's still trotted out there as the starting QB. But that's not on coaching. That's on the player?

[aubaseball 2,596]

Just now, tgrogan21 said:

Ah yes, the ole "have you played" defense. Most people on a forum haven't played at a high level and almost none of coached. So I guess everyone else should just shut up about their opinions.

Again, Bo Nix the STARTING QB for over 2 seasons doesn't perform despite the coaches KNOWING this. But he's still trotted out there as the starting QB. But that's not on coaching. That's on the player?

What if he is the best option?   Maybe this staff see’s that this team sucks and they are just trying to get as many wins as they can.  

[tgrogan21 6,198]

Just now, aubaseball said:

What if he is the best option?   Maybe this staff see’s that this team sucks and they are just trying to get as many wins as they can.  

But why should we say It's okay if Bo sucks because he's the best we have. But when it comes to the WRs not performing (maybe they're the best we have) it's all because of coaching. Or about the OL, we've known they're not the greatest but they're the best we have so Friend gets a pass for the performance on the field.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

This will probably be my last post on the subject because I don't want to keep going around in circles with people.

I've said it earlier but I'm more disappointed about the reason given for the firing more than the firing. The WRs haven't looked great. There might have been plays where we only had 10 guys on the field. WRs might have missed assignments. All of these things happen every week in college and in the NFL. s*** happens.

The WRs have not played as badly as other positions. DL and DBs come to mind first. Experience and talent level in those two positions and I would expect to have pass rush against everyone. I would expect we wouldn't leave the TE wide open on multiple drives in multiple games. OL couldn't get a pass block or run block against GSU. QBs (both Finley and NIx) have missed wide open guys.

Don't give me the BS excuse of football performance being the reason a person was fired when other positions have also performed badly. People really need to be honest with themselves. The reason Corn was fired was because Coach Harsin wanted to get Coach Kiseau in the WR coaching position and possibly to groom him to take over for Bobo next year as OC. That's fine, I like Kiseau's resume and think he'll be an upgrade. I think he will possibly be better than Bobo as well. Just stop putting all of the blame on a coach of the most inexperienced position group.

[aubaseball 2,596]

8 minutes ago, tgrogan21 said:

But why should we say It's okay if Bo sucks because he's the best we have. But when it comes to the WRs not performing (maybe they're the best we have) it's all because of coaching. Or about the OL, we've known they're not the greatest but they're the best we have so Friend gets a pass for the performance on the field.

I don’t know why the guy was fired and honestly, I don’t care.    It’s Harsin’s team and staff and he can do whatever he likes.   After a few years, he will be judged by his performance and either given an extension or fired.   It’s really as simple as that.   No sense for anyone to speculate on why a coach was let go or why some are still on staff.  

[tgrogan21 6,198]

Just now, aubaseball said:

I don’t know why the guy was fired and honestly, I don’t care.    It’s Harsin’s team and staff and he can do whatever he likes.   After a few years, he will be judged by his performance and either given an extension or fired.   It’s really as simple as that.   No sense for anyone to speculate on why a coach was let go or why some are still on staff.  

What else are we gonna do on a message board? lol There's only so many times one can say LSUPoo and corndog, corndog, corndog. This has given us all something to talk about, discuss, and speculate on.

[Strychnine 1,802]

1 hour ago, tgrogan21 said:

I'm upset about the fade against Penn State and the fact that they called the same exact play at the end of the GSU game. That's shameful. Plus he's also the QB coach so the failure in that aspect should also be held against him.

I'm also upset about him not using Shivers more. You have a guy with track star speed that can spread the offense out and you run him 2 times. One of those being a big gain on the sweep. Running with Tank and Hunter is nice but you need to have a change of pace and someone who can break it outside. Bobo isn't doing that.

 

Bobo did not call for Bo to throw a fade, he made a call where fade was one of the options, and the QB decides where to go with the ball.  Harsin and Nix have both said this.

[Butthead 525]

There must be more to this story than we know.  If a coach is not doing a good job, but the coach is believed to be an up and coming coach AND a good recruiter AND you have to pay his contract anyway -- why not move him to an analyst role and let him improve.  Let the new guy mentor him.  Again, there must be more to the story than we will probably ever know.

[cole256 17,051]

It's just hilarious the lengths some will go. So now just saying something is good enough. The fact that nobody can come up with actually plays isn't a cause for a question. 

Half of you literally don't know. And just because it calls to question Harsin you're doing all you can to justify. 

It's amazing the simple concepts that are ignored. Just like that was done for that other coach. 

I can't wait to reflect on this lol

[W.E.D 11,070]

"Our WRs aren't making Big Plays"

 

We'll when our QB ranks 13 of 16 QBs behind Vandy/UT QBs....that's why

 

[steeleagle 2,945]

4 hours ago, tgrogan21 said:

Corn was a scapegoat plain and simple. Harsin also had the WR coach that he wanted in a support role so firing Corn was easy for Harsin. He now has his man in place so if the WRs still continue to struggle then we'll see if he has another scapegoat lined up to be fired.

If CWill does his job, has his WR playing at a consistent level, there IS no scapegoat. If Harsin still wants in a more experienced coach then he lets CWill go at the end of the year and brings in his guy.

There is no scapegoat. He could have just as easily moved CWill to a different position off the field, and still brought in his guy to make WR group better.

There are many parts to what has been posted here for the problems the WR group did not live up to their responsibilities. It wasn't all about just production on the field. 

[Tigerpro2a 5,650]

37 minutes ago, tgrogan21 said:

Okay now apply that same logic to the WRs

Maybe you didn't read the entire post of mine, I said the same could be said about the entire team.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

3 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

"Our WRs aren't making Big Plays"

 

We'll when our QB ranks 13 of 16 QBs behind Vandy/UT QBs....that's why

 

The War Repport has a thread with a bunch of those stats. Yikes, Nix's stats look really, really bad.

[tgrogan21 6,198]

Just now, Tigerpro2a said:

Maybe you didn't read the entire post of mine, I said the same could be said about the entire team.

It was more of a rhetorical post for anyone else who might have seen. Sorry about that.