NoALtiger 3,873 Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 People generally don't support a losing program, that's just human nature and not a ground breaking statement I know. Very few teams can lose like our basketball program and have large scale support- some pro teams like the Cubs and Browns have large passionate fan bases despite a general culture of losing but they are the exception to the rule. There's nothing magic about it, put a good product out, win some games, and folks will show up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 People generally don't support a losing program, that's just human nature and not a ground breaking statement I know. Very few teams can lose like our basketball program and have large scale support- some pro teams like the Cubs and Browns have large passionate fan bases despite a general culture of losing but they are the exception to the rule. There's nothing magic about it, put a good product out, win some games, and folks will show up. I hear ya ...and not wanting to be too negative but just look around the bottom rungs of the SEC in basketball...USCe, UGa, MSU, LSU, Bama, and lately TAMU, Tenn, Vandy and Arky. Most of them are changing coaches every several years trying to create a winning program....and nothing much happens. Sure they have a good year or two every now and then if they happen onto a couple good players at the same time...but usually it is only temporary and soon they are back down and then the ADs are back out looking for a new savior. You can look back a number of years and it's the same 5 or 7 teams at the bottom...and they just move up and down a couple places from one year to the next...but none really breakout despite coaches with pretty good records before they arrive in the SEC. JMO but I expect the word is out that the SEC is the graveyard of basketball coaching careers. I sure don't have an answer....just observing what goes on...at AU and at about half the other SEC schools too. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 16,734 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 There were a court full of 4* players on the Doc Robinson teams. Before that, Gerald White and Frank Ford. Both Persons. Mike Mitchell, Myles Patrick and Stan Petkavitch. The list goes on. We can get a few here so it shouldn't be that the two highest rated basketball prospects on campus are football players. That's a shameful first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 There were a court full of 4* players on the Doc Robinson teams. Before that, Gerald White and Frank Ford. Both Persons. Mike Mitchell, Myles Patrick and Stan Petkavitch. The list goes on. We can get a few here so it shouldn't be that the two highest rated basketball prospects on campus are football players. That's a shameful first. Man you are having to go back to your youth when you mention most of those guys...and five or six guys over a period of 20 years +/-.....I'm talking about the era of Cliff, Lebo and now Barbee....and the efforts at AU and at least half of the other SEC schools to get more than one 4* at any given time. Basketball at AU and the SEC is nothing like it was back in the 1980s. Personally I'm ambivalent about firing Barbee....but IMO it won't really matter because i don't care who the AD is, we will not get a coach that will make much difference...other than perhaps jump over LSU or UGa or MSU some of the time and we might even do that this season. And as for having a couple of 4* BB players on campus, if that were true at the moment, is would be because they are playing football and not basketball.....and just for the record, I see that Rivals had Nick and JJ both as 3* and not rated nationally.. Seems maybe the 4* business is a bit of an exaggeration and neither were highly sought after as basketball players... and far as I could learn, neither had a Div 1 offer...probably because they were considered football prospects. On the other hand, Kansas, Kentucky and Duke have more 4* and 5* basketball players out of 15 schollys than their football teams have out of 85...and probably always will in my lifetime. Other than KY and UF...and maybe Mizz, I consider SEC basketball a lost cause. We can fire coaches and scream at the AD as long as we want but the best I see is that AU improves to where we beat Bama a bit more and move from 14 to about 10 in the conference....and that is if all goes well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 16,734 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwmboom7 0 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. I guess that's a theory but at least 5 Nike basketball teams in the SEC are no better than AU over the past dozen years. Does not seem to be much correlation of bad basketball teams except they are all in the SEC. http://mobile.texags.com/Forums/5/Topics/2010120 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoALtiger 3,873 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 I just wanna go to the Big Dance every couple years that's all. Wouldn't think that's too much to ask given we are a D1 SEC school with a lot to offer a player and coach. March is so much more fun when ya got a dog in the fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Eye 7 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 we're 6-3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdofPrey76 0 Posted December 29, 2013 Share Posted December 29, 2013 we're 6-3 Isn't it obvious that Barbee has it turned around? j/k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 16,734 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. As AU64 pointed out above, the "Under Armour" excuse is almost as lame as the "Can't recruit AAU" excuse when there is only one AAU coach in the entire country that we can't work through. Not interested in excuses and there are no REASONS why we can't contend in basketball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuburnNTexas 7,172 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 There are two ways to have a good team and go to the NCAA's on a regular basis. The Kentucky and Louisville way where you recruit top talent and keep them 1 or 2 years or the small school way that we see every year where you recruit solid kids not great kids and they play together 3-4 years within a system and they beat you with well coached team defense and a solid well executed offensive plan. Auburn has to do it the second way that requires a coach who recruits solid kids and keeps them for the entire 4 year experience. I don't know why Barbee can't keep the kids he recruits. I don't know if it is the type of player he recruits or if he chases them away, or if he is just unlucky but since he can't keep his players around we will never develop a team concept under Barbee. Despite the last two wins which surprised me and many others we have already had another player leave this year it is time to start looking for a new coach. I personally would love to give Person's a shot with his NBA experience both playing and coaching and his love of Auburn I think we would do the job that our last few experiments have failed at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gAUlf 1 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 I just wanna go to the Big Dance every couple years that's all. Wouldn't think that's too much to ask given we are a D1 SEC school with a lot to offer a player and coach. March is so much more fun when ya got a dog in the fight. considering we have only done that 6 or so times in the programs history it might. I'm not saying barbee is the right man, but people need to realize we are no where near an elite program. It's gonna take time with whoever is the coach if we are going to do it the right way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cole256 17,084 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 The shoe company stuff matters more than some think in basketball. Not so much in football though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aufan57 922 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 There are two ways to have a good team and go to the NCAA's on a regular basis. The Kentucky and Louisville way where you recruit top talent and keep them 1 or 2 years or the small school way that we see every year where you recruit solid kids not great kids and they play together 3-4 years within a system and they beat you with well coached team defense and a solid well executed offensive plan. Auburn has to do it the second way that requires a coach who recruits solid kids and keeps them for the entire 4 year experience. I don't know why Barbee can't keep the kids he recruits. I don't know if it is the type of player he recruits or if he chases them away, or if he is just unlucky but since he can't keep his players around we will never develop a team concept under Barbee. Despite the last two wins which surprised me and many others we have already had another player leave this year it is time to start looking for a new coach. I personally would love to give Person's a shot with his NBA experience both playing and coaching and his love of Auburn I think we would do the job that our last few experiments have failed at. Which player left the team this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwmboom7 0 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. As AU64 pointed out above, the "Under Armour" excuse is almost as lame as the "Can't recruit AAU" excuse when there is only one AAU coach in the entire country that we can't work through. Not interested in excuses and there are no REASONS why we can't contend in basketball. You didn't answer the question, Mikey. Please name one out of the several Under Armour programs that are out there, that are good at basketball. Maryland, who used to be a very strong program, is now a bottom feeder in the ACC. All I want you to do is just name one program, though. Shouldn't be that hard, should it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoALtiger 3,873 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 I just wanna go to the Big Dance every couple years that's all. Wouldn't think that's too much to ask given we are a D1 SEC school with a lot to offer a player and coach. March is so much more fun when ya got a dog in the fight. considering we have only done that 6 or so times in the programs history it might. I'm not saying barbee is the right man, but people need to realize we are no where near an elite program. It's gonna take time with whoever is the coach if we are going to do it the right way. Pretty awful history all in all to be sure. Heck, most of our appearances were when Sonny was making his run in the 80's. Thank goodness Cliff managed to squeeze a couple out. Been a long time for us and appears its gonna be longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 16,734 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. As AU64 pointed out above, the "Under Armour" excuse is almost as lame as the "Can't recruit AAU" excuse when there is only one AAU coach in the entire country that we can't work through. Not interested in excuses and there are no REASONS why we can't contend in basketball. You didn't answer the question, Mikey. Please name one out of the several Under Armour programs that are out there, that are good at basketball. Maryland, who used to be a very strong program, is now a bottom feeder in the ACC. All I want you to do is just name one program, though. Shouldn't be that hard, should it? I have no idea which teams have deals with which shoe companies and I have zero incentive to research such a thing. The info provided above by AU64 should be all you need to see that the shoe excuse is bogus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwmboom7 0 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 If successful, nationally competitive basketball programs can be installed at places such as Ames, Iowa and Stillwater, Oklahoma, such a program can be installed at Auburn. It's only a matter of getting and keeping the right coach. Name a successful men's basketball program right now that is an Under Armour school...There isn't one. We have to change to Nike in order to have a shot. As AU64 pointed out above, the "Under Armour" excuse is almost as lame as the "Can't recruit AAU" excuse when there is only one AAU coach in the entire country that we can't work through. Not interested in excuses and there are no REASONS why we can't contend in basketball. You didn't answer the question, Mikey. Please name one out of the several Under Armour programs that are out there, that are good at basketball. Maryland, who used to be a very strong program, is now a bottom feeder in the ACC. All I want you to do is just name one program, though. Shouldn't be that hard, should it? I have no idea which teams have deals with which shoe companies and I have zero incentive to research such a thing. The info provided above by AU64 should be all you need to see that the shoe excuse is bogus. So according to your argument, every team in the SEC and country should be good if they have Nike? No, not every team can be good if they have Nike, but there are no good Under Armour basketball programs. That is my point. And it is not a coincidence whether you want to deny it or not. Could there be some good teams occasionally? Sure but there will be no consistency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey 16,734 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 So according to your argument, every team in the SEC and country should be good if they have Nike? If you'll go back and actually read you should be able to figure out that I was saying the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Sorry JW....you need to show us a few teams that improved their W-L because they went Nike.....and meantime there is ample evidence that good and bad teams wear Nike....whereas UA is relatively new to the picture and came in via the football schools. Maryland is a poor example because they were on a downhill slide before UA existed. This shoe argument just has no facts to support it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuburnNTexas 7,172 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 There are two ways to have a good team and go to the NCAA's on a regular basis. The Kentucky and Louisville way where you recruit top talent and keep them 1 or 2 years or the small school way that we see every year where you recruit solid kids not great kids and they play together 3-4 years within a system and they beat you with well coached team defense and a solid well executed offensive plan. Auburn has to do it the second way that requires a coach who recruits solid kids and keeps them for the entire 4 year experience. I don't know why Barbee can't keep the kids he recruits. I don't know if it is the type of player he recruits or if he chases them away, or if he is just unlucky but since he can't keep his players around we will never develop a team concept under Barbee. Despite the last two wins which surprised me and many others we have already had another player leave this year it is time to start looking for a new coach. I personally would love to give Person's a shot with his NBA experience both playing and coaching and his love of Auburn I think we would do the job that our last few experiments have failed at. Which player left the team this year? Chris Griffin for Personal Reasons and now Jordon Graenger for the same thing. They could come back but that is now 2 players since fall. Even though team is playing better right now we need continuity from year to year and this is just following the trend that has occurred since Barbee arrived. Would love to find out it is really family issues and they come back and the team does well this year but because of the ongoing trend I can't hold out much hope. It is really sad when you want to be wrong, I really want to be wrong and see Barbee turn things around this year but the reality is that it won't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jared52 4,354 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Griffin is back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuburnNTexas 7,172 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Griffin is back. Thank you I didn't realize that. Hopefully Granger will come back also. I would love to be wrong at see some continuity from year to year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cole256 17,084 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 It's not about shoes making you better but some of you were also complaining about recruiting and like it or not shoe companies play a part because of apparel. Kids know that they will have free access to it. To over come not having either Nike or adidas it would take a proven coach. A winner. But not coincidentally those coaches will be with one of those schools and they will recruit well. I know I'm not TOO old and I still have an ear to the young guys and I was pretty good myself and I'm respected and the young fellas talk to me. I also have been up close and personal with 3 guys the last 5 years that were recruited by everybody short duke and unc. It matters. When one guy was sending stuff back to friends from Oregon you should have seen the impact. Everybody that may have been a future college player was enamored. I heard out of my ears praise for Oregon and they were coming off a down year. Under armour made a name for themselves in football but they aren't respected in the b ball world at all. I won't lie you wouldn't catch me with any under armour shoes on, especially playing b ball. You would get laughed out of the gym Also naturally Nike hosting the big name camps means Nike schools will probably have easier access to those guys and while the top schools will get the biggest names there is always a Dwayne wade there showing potential. Who are going to be the coaches jumping on him first? The coaches that get the info on him first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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