icanthearyou 4,465 Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 https://www.yahoo.com/news/florida-republican-sponsored-don-t-224751326.html What a nice man. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeTiger 5,315 Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 In a statement released Wednesday night, Harding said he has pleaded not guilty. “I want the public and my constituents to know that I fully repaid the loan and cooperated with investigators as requested.” --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Translation: "I'm guilty as hell, but by paying back the money I'm hoping to get a slap on the wrist plea deal from prosecutors." 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeTiger 5,315 Posted December 9, 2022 Share Posted December 9, 2022 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/crime/joe-harding-resigns-dont-say-gay-b2241864.html?utm_source=reddit.com He has resigned his office. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 10, 2022 Share Posted December 10, 2022 On 12/7/2022 at 8:47 PM, icanthearyou said: https://www.yahoo.com/news/florida-republican-sponsored-don-t-224751326.html What a nice man. “Don’t say gay” is sloganeering. It is Florida HB 1557 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,508 Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 The only answer is he does real jail time. We must hold pols accountable. Losing his office? That was a done deal as soon as we heard about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeTiger 5,315 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 On 12/11/2022 at 8:08 AM, DKW 86 said: The only answer is he does real jail time. We must hold pols accountable. Losing his office? That was a done deal as soon as we heard about this. I do give him credit for resigning quickly and cleanly. Usually they'll act all defiant and make strong media statements about how they'll fight and hold their office till the end....before they eventually give in and resign a few weeks/months later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,508 Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 12 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said: I do give him credit for resigning quickly and cleanly. Usually they'll act all defiant and make strong media statements about how they'll fight and hold their office till the end....before they eventually give in and resign a few weeks/months later. You are right on this Gaetz and the youngish gay Republican dude in NC that I don’t even care to remember. They were both arrogant jerks when their scandals broke. How Gaetz survived is a wonder to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,637 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 On 12/9/2022 at 9:45 PM, SaltyTiger said: “Don’t say gay” is sloganeering. It is Florida HB 1557 And what does HB 1557 prohibit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 10 minutes ago, homersapien said: And what does HB 1557 prohibit? https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,637 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 (edited) 17 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557 1) Requires district school boards to adopt procedures that comport with certain provisions of law for notifying student's parent of specified information; 2) requires such procedures to reinforce fundamental right of parents to make decisions regarding upbringing & control of their children; 3)prohibits school district from adopting procedures or student support forms that prohibit school district personnel from notifying parent about specified information or that encourage student to withhold from parent such information; 4) prohibits school district personnel from discouraging or prohibiting parental notification & involvement in critical decisions affecting student's mental, emotional, or physical well-being; 5) prohibits classroom discussion about sexual orientation or gender identity in certain grade levels; requires school districts to notify parents of healthcare services; 6) authorizes parent to bring action against school district to obtain declaratory judgment; provides for additional award of injunctive relief, damages, & reasonable attorney fees & court costs to certain parents. 1, 2 and 3 sound good, but it fails to protect a LGBTQ child who is seeking help from a parent who might harm them - or otherwise disown them - if they found out. I wonder if this really is needed. It would seem to me that responsible parents wouldn't need their child's school to inform them of such matters, and the child needs to be protected from bad or abusive parents. Same with 4. What if the child's specific problem involves the perceived threat from their parent's? What's the child's alternative - go to the cops? 5. In other words, "don't say gay". (You're right, that's sloganeering but it's not false, and it's far more effective politically than a lengthy explanation of the pros and cons of a complex issue. And obviously, both sides do it.) 6. Fine, assuming they don't already have such recourse. This whole thing strikes me as an overt political response to fix a problem that doesn't really exist generally. It may make right wingers feel good, but it's liable to cause a lot of harm with the children at issue. Or to put it differently, this bill is nothing more than a political "sloganeering" - only on a legal basis that's going to have real world consequences. As they say, time will tell. For the sake of the children, I hope I'm wrong. Edited December 14, 2022 by homersapien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 11 hours ago, homersapien said: 5. In other words, "don't say gay". No, not “in other words”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeTiger 5,315 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: No, not “in other words”. Perception is reality. It's like how "Obama Care" isn't really the legal or official name of the Affordable Care Act, but whenever someone says 'Obama Care' everyone immediately knows what that person is talking about. A lot more people out in America would know immediately what you're talking about if you said the "Don't say Gay Bill". Almost none of them would recognize what FL HB 1557 is referring to. Edited December 14, 2022 by CoffeeTiger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_M4_AU 8,159 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 58 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said: Perception is reality. It's like how "Obama Care" isn't really the legal or official name of the Affordable Care Act, but whenever someone says 'Obama Care' everyone immediately knows what that person is talking about. A lot more people out in America would know immediately what you're talking about if you said the "Don't say Gay Bill". Almost none of them would recognize what FL HB 1557 is referring to. Perception is not reality, it only lives as reality in your head. If you haven’t lost all critical thinking skills you would accept this. Reality is hard, but ultimately has to be accepted. The only reason more people in America would recognize the bill as *Don’t Say Gay Bill* is the LGBTQoeirie coalition got the narrative out as fast as they could and a lot of times the first thing you are taught is what you stick with, whether it is correct or not. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,637 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 3 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: No, not “in other words”. Yes, "in other words". The intention of the clause in the bill is "don't say gay" only it uses legalistic words. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeTiger 5,315 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 36 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said: Perception is not reality, it only lives as reality in your head. If you haven’t lost all critical thinking skills you would accept this. Reality is hard, but ultimately has to be accepted. Ok...and the reality is that the majority of the nation and most people who are not Florida Republicans know and refer to the bill as the "Don't say gay bill" Someone can hem and haw and interject "Well...aktchually....it's called HB 1557...or the 'Florida Parental rights in education bill', all you want but its not going to stop everyone from calling it and knowing it by the "Dont say gay bill" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 2 hours ago, homersapien said: Yes, "in other words". The intention of the clause in the bill is "don't say gay" only it uses legalistic words. What “legalistic words”? Prohibiting sexual orientation and gender identity discussion in certain grades? When I was a young parent would have had no problem with the bill. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leftfield 2,803 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 1 hour ago, SaltyTiger said: Prohibiting sexual orientation and gender identity discussion in certain grades? When I was a young parent would have had no problem with the bill. You are really making it hard to take you seriously with statements like this. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icanthearyou 4,465 Posted December 14, 2022 Author Share Posted December 14, 2022 Purely political. Nothing more than playing to the "christian" base. Florida officially will not condone, will not protect, those who are gay. It is inhumane and shameful. Once again, the political right is creating an enemy. Once again, the political right is pandering to bigotry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,637 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 2 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: What “legalistic words”? Prohibiting sexual orientation and gender identity discussion in certain grades? When I was a young parent would have had no problem with the bill. Boy, are you ever missing the point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,637 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 40 minutes ago, icanthearyou said: Purely political. Nothing more than playing to the "christian" base. Florida officially will not condone, will not protect, those who are gay. It is inhumane and shameful. Once again, the political right is creating an enemy. Once again, the political right is pandering to bigotry. While using their favorite weapon - fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 1 hour ago, homersapien said: Boy, are you ever missing the point. Maybe so. I am with you in thinking that it was a needless bill though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icanthearyou 4,465 Posted December 15, 2022 Author Share Posted December 15, 2022 1 hour ago, SaltyTiger said: Maybe so. I am with you in thinking that it was a needless bill though. Then why pretend to defend it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mims44 1,932 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 22 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: What “legalistic words”? Prohibiting sexual orientation and gender identity discussion in certain grades? When I was a young parent would have had no problem with the bill. 20 hours ago, icanthearyou said: Purely political. Nothing more than playing to the "christian" base. Florida officially will not condone, will not protect, those who are gay. It is inhumane and shameful. Once again, the political right is creating an enemy. Once again, the political right is pandering to bigotry. I may be misremembering .... but doesn't the bill only cover elementary grade students? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_M4_AU 8,159 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 23 minutes ago, Mims44 said: I may be misremembering .... but doesn't the bill only cover elementary grade students? The bill only covers K-3 or up to 9 yo I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,017 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 17 hours ago, icanthearyou said: Then why pretend to defend it? Not pretending to defend it. Just commented on your OP and sloganeering. While thinking the bill was needless certainly not shouting that it is prosecution of the alphabet community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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