Old-timers

[kwagoner 214]

Old-timers meaning board-wise not and age-wise.

I have noticed that PT, stoic-one, ranger etc have been pretty quiet. I see a few posts popping in now and then.

What are your thoughts on all of this?

[aucanucktiger 1,805]

I'll await CTT's replacement before I render judgement. Right now I can't imagine a replacement that would make this firing a good choice. Stoops or Richt maybe.

[AUman43 5]

KK, I guess as a 65 year old, I qualify as an old timer. Boy, could I write a book. I have mixed emotions about this firing or resignation, whatever it is, and have enough history to suspect it was a firing rather than the latter. Truth is hard to come by at Auburn from the higher ups and always has been. Gogue and Jacobs seem to be no different at that than their predecessors.

If Tubs was fired, I think it was a ill advised move. My reasons for saying that is it will trash our recruiting unless they move rapidly to select a proven, name coach. Secondly, whatever was done wasn't done with the class we expect from our powers that be. Nobody with class would fire a head coach with Tubs record BEFORE they notify the assistant coaches who are on the road and in prospects homes trying to sell our program and coach when they learn they're fired. Class would have dictated that they were called and asked to return to campus. Thirdly, the powers that be are partly to blame for the situation we are in. Yes, CTF's hiring was a mistake which Tubs openly admitted, but this current senior class is comprised of the survivors of a subpar class that's the result of "jetgate." Now, they're creating another "jetgate" in terms of this year's recruiting. Who'll they blame next time when this group are seniors and our record is poor?

I also remember some 9 straight years when Bammer and Bear had their boots on our neck and were smothering us. I remember wondering if we would ever beat them again. Coaches Dye and Tuberville changed that. Dye also brought our home games HOME rather than at Bryant's legion Field to give us a level playing field. The results since then are obvious. Tubs was an outstanding person, both on and off the field and he ran a clean program, which is invaluable. He also disciplined our players and made sure they went to class and graduated. That too, is invaluable. These may be intangeables too the higher ups, but it is very important.

His mistake was being a victim of his own success and having a sinking spell while the Bammers hired Saban. His recruiting dropped off and the talent level did as well. We had no playmakers and it showed. His long time assistants probably became compacent and somewhat satisfied and as such. became lax. I don't know whether Tubs had lost his fire or not, but I know he's had health problems.

Finally, my concerns now are four fold. First of all, I have my doubts whether o r not the powers that be are capable of bringing in a proven, big name coach who can turn things around quickly and I doubt their urgency in doing so in a time frame to save our recruiting class. Secondly, I worry that the next coach won't have the character that Tubs did and may get us in trouble with the NCAA again. God knows we don't need that. Thirdly, I wonder if the next coach can compete with Saban,Miles, Myer and Richt in recruiting top talent and whether he will be as good at developing unknown players as Tubs, who was the best at that. Lastly, I wonder if the next coach will maintain control of the team like Tubs did, discipline wise, and not allow our boys to embarrass us like those at Alabama and Florida State. If WINNING all the games becomes a top priority at Auburn, and winning only, then we have ample reason to fear a new regime. I've lived through some rough times with Shug's retirement years, Barfield, the Bowden debacle, and 9 straight losses to the turds. Now this! Better be careful what you wish for and consider all the angles before you act, or you may be sorry. I hope we aren't very sorry this time next year. WDE!

[Tigermike 3,078]

AU survived Doug Barfield and Terry Bowden. Tubs left the program in better shape than either DB or TB.

At this point as AU people we need to make our minds up to get behind the new coach and support him, the team and the school.

The king is dead, long live the king.

WAR EAGLE!!!

[OldNewby 27]

AU survived Doug Barfield and Terry Bowden. Tubs left the program in better shape than either DB or TB.

At this point as AU people we need to make our minds up to get behind the new coach and support him, the team and the school.

The king is dead, long live the king.

WAR EAGLE!!!

[subterranean_jack 112]

I've been around since Shug, and I can see both sides of firing Tub. Auburn had a good coach who ran a clean program and won pretty regularly, but that wasn't good enough for some. Tub never scored many glamour points recruiting or delivering a knockout punch to the opposition (just scored enough points to win, not to make a statement), and he didn't show much passion on the sidelines.

Lowder wants a championship, but that is going to be very difficult to achieve at Auburn in this day and age. Recruiting is difficult being surrounded by Bama, LSU, UGA, Florida, and now Ole Miss. AU tradition is defense and running the ball, but that isn't going to get it done in the SEC nowadays, let alone on a national stage. With all the baggage associated with Lowder, the BOT, and JJ, it is going to be very difficult to bring in the type of coach who can meet all the requirements, regardless of the salary offered. What established coach would willingly step into this situation? What up and comer could overcome it?

It is going to take a coach in the mold of Urban Meyer, Steve Spurrier, etc to take control of the program and keep Lowder etal at bay, if that is even possible. Sad to say, but the chance JJ will make that kind of hire is virtually nil.

I fear the Dark Ages are upon us and Bobby Lowder is the Grand Inquisitioner.

[Strychnine 1,804]

Lowder wants a championship, but that is going to be very difficult to achieve at Auburn in this day and age. Recruiting is difficult being surrounded by Bama, LSU, UGA, Florida, and now Ole Miss. AU tradition is defense and running the ball, but that isn't going to get it done in the SEC nowadays, let alone on a national stage. With all the baggage associated with Lowder, the BOT, and JJ, it is going to be very difficult to bring in the type of coach who can meet all the requirements, regardless of the salary offered. What established coach would willingly step into this situation? What up and comer could overcome it?

I see this argument all the time and it still does not stick with me. Bama, LSU, UGA, Florida, and now Ole Miss have been recruiting alongside Auburn the whole time. Auburn has had the talent to get the job done. When things click on those teams Bama, Auburn, LSU, UGA, and UF can all get the job done. Auburn is not the recruiting doormat. Players come where it is the best for them. Sure, there are all kinds of variables that define that, but the bottom line is that players aiming for the NFL come where they can get good, play, and get exposure. People make recruiting a lot more complicated than it actually is, probably because it is adults trying to guess the future decisions made by teenagers.

The next head coach might hit the recruiting trail harder than Tuberville and his staff ever did. He might flop entirely. We do not even know who it is going to be, much less what he is going to do once he actually arrives. If LSU, UF, and now possibly Bama can compete for championships, then Auburn can too. Auburn was in a position to just 4 years ago, there just happened to be two other undefeated teams that started out ahead of us. For all we know, a different coaching staff could have had two BCS Championships and played for who knows how many SEC Championships during the last 10 years.

[stoic-one 1,552]

Old-timers meaning board-wise not age.

I have noticed that PT, stoic-one, ranger etc have been pretty quiet. I see a few posts popping in now and then.

What are your thoughts on all of this?

Since I was addressed directly, guess I will reply.

The fact of the matter, to me at least, is that there is way more speculation than fact shooting across the net.

I am personally withholding comment until the situation calms down, and we see what kinds of decisions have been made recently and going into the future.

I give most here the benefit of the doubt regarding motivations and what not, but frankly, who here really knows ALL the facts? My guess would be few, if any. Are there some here with close ties and good information, yep. All the facts and details, no frigging way.

I am as unhappy as most about how all the recent events have gone down. I prefer to take a guarded approach before making any definitive judgments or statements.

That is why we are the old timers, no? We have more patience? Well some

JMHO

[Strychnine 1,804]

The fact of the matter, to me at least, is that there is way more speculation than fact shooting across the net.

I am personally withholding comment until the situation calms down, and we see what kinds of decisions have been made recently and going into the future.

I give most here the benefit of the doubt regarding motivations and what not, but frankly, who here really knows ALL the facts? My guess would be few, if any. Are there some here with close ties and good information, yep. All the facts and details, no frigging way.

I agree with that completely. The facts are that Tuberville is no longer the coach, Auburn says he resigned, Auburn will be searching for a new coach. I have seen articles going both ways as far as Tuberville being fired and Tuberville resigning. At this point, I do not really think it matters what happened, nor does it help Auburn's cause to speculate loudly.

[kwagoner 214]

That is why we are the old timers, no? We have more patience? Well some

Well the time it takes to become an old-timer usually brings about some wisdom. I guess it is wise to wait and form comments and opinions witout spouting off with emotion. (Guilty)

[subterranean_jack 112]

Lowder wants a championship, but that is going to be very difficult to achieve at Auburn in this day and age. Recruiting is difficult being surrounded by Bama, LSU, UGA, Florida, and now Ole Miss. AU tradition is defense and running the ball, but that isn't going to get it done in the SEC nowadays, let alone on a national stage. With all the baggage associated with Lowder, the BOT, and JJ, it is going to be very difficult to bring in the type of coach who can meet all the requirements, regardless of the salary offered. What established coach would willingly step into this situation? What up and comer could overcome it?

I see this argument all the time and it still does not stick with me. Bama, LSU, UGA, Florida, and now Ole Miss have been recruiting alongside Auburn the whole time. Auburn has had the talent to get the job done. When things click on those teams Bama, Auburn, LSU, UGA, and UF can all get the job done. Auburn is not the recruiting doormat. Players come where it is the best for them. Sure, there are all kinds of variables that define that, but the bottom line is that players aiming for the NFL come where they can get good, play, and get exposure. People make recruiting a lot more complicated than it actually is, probably because it is adults trying to guess the future decisions made by teenagers.

The next head coach might hit the recruiting trail harder than Tuberville and his staff ever did. He might flop entirely. We do not even know who it is going to be, much less what he is going to do once he actually arrives. If LSU, UF, and now possibly Bama can compete for championships, then Auburn can too. Auburn was in a position to just 4 years ago, there just happened to be two other undefeated teams that started out ahead of us. For all we know, a different coaching staff could have had two BCS Championships and played for who knows how many SEC Championships during the last 10 years.

I'm not saying Auburn can never recruit well. I'm saying it is harder because 1) Auburn is not the state university 2) Auburn is not the only football program in the state 3) it will take a coach with a more potent offensive philosophy to attract star recruits on that side of the ball.

It will take a special coach for Auburn to do more than just compete in the current state of the SEC. Under different circumstances, I think Auburn could attract a big-time coach. I just don't think it will happen this time around because the program is run by JJ and Lowder, and I have zero confidence in their judgement and they way they handle things.

[Strychnine 1,804]

I'm not saying Auburn can never recruit well. I'm saying it is harder because 1) Auburn is not the state university 2) Auburn is not the only football program in the state 3) it will take a coach with a more potent offensive philosophy to attract star recruits on that side of the ball.

It will take a special coach for Auburn to do more than just compete in the current state of the SEC. Under different circumstances, I think Auburn could attract a big-time coach. I just don't think it will happen this time around because the program is run by JJ and Lowder, and I have zero confidence in their judgement and they way they handle things.

I know. I am saying that I do not believe it is any harder for Auburn to recruit than it is for the others. I do not think a WR prospect from Georgia, Florida, or Mississippi that is 17-18 really cares about whether or not Auburn is the state school. No football program has free reign over the entire state, but I guess you could present that argument for LSU. I have no doubt that the Texas schools recruit their eastern neighboring state too. MSU, they have obstacles for recruiting to overcome, but Auburn does not. We have the facilities, we have the stadium, we have the atmosphere, and we get the exposure. Auburn has the things that potential college football players are looking for. The SEC is not changing anymore than college football as a whole has been. I do not expect Auburn to be in Atlanta every December or the whole season was a failure. I expect Auburn to be on the same level as anyone else in this conference or country, and I do not consider "recruiting" to be a reason that we cannot be there or stay there. Tuberville is gone, but he laid the groundwork for a good coach to come in and be successful. We obviously do not need an idiot, but an idiot would ruin anything, regardless of the circumstances.

I think Auburn can get a big-time coach. Salaries have gone up tremendously, and so have expectations. The university expects a return on their multi-million dollar investment. Coaches know that their career is a potentially lucrative one, but it is also a stressful and unstable one. They know that the modern college football world is a game of musical chairs.

#3 is the real valid point. Auburn could previously recruit RB's with little difficulty, we were producing NFL RB's like a factory. Auburn could recruit defensive players with little difficulty too, and for the same reason. Someone looking to install an offensive juggernaut would probably recruit better offensively, thus making an improvement.

['76 Tiger 108]

To date me, I met Shug as a student. I mainly read, rather than post. Guys like StatTiger dwarf my knowledge.

I don't know if CTT could turn it around. He has a history of bad offense under good circumstances. I still thought he was our best bet.

I am very suspicious of Jacobs saying that CTT quit, but we are paying him $5.1M to quit.

I hope, but do not expect the next guy to be better.

Bob in Winter Haven, FL.

[weagl1 1,789]

My first Auburn game was 1962, when I was 9 years old. We have been through some good times and we have been through some bad times over the past 46 years. I have done my best to support our program through all of it. I was in the student section when we blocked the punts in 1972, and then sat through the 9 losses in a row to Bama that followed. I was in the West upper deck for it's first game (1976?)only to see us get murdered by Tennessee. Then I was in the GA Dome when we finished them off to cap the undefeated season in 2004. But I have to tell you guys something from the bottom of my heart. For the first time ever yesterday I was ashamed to be an Auburn Tiger. It seems that the folks in control today are so interested in getting their way that they are not capable of seeing the big picture. We had a good coach who was running a clean program. We haven't even had a sniff from the NCAA in 10 years and that is what has almost brought our program down several times over the past 50 years. The players are graduating and are never on the nightly news like GA, AL and FSU. When they get out of line the discipline is swift and sure. The man wins 50 games in 5 years and our leaders run him off for one bad season. I guess I will eventually get over it but I think we just went way off the tracks again. I don't know why any good coach in his right mind would walk into this situation.

[Points 2]

I am 54 years old and have never felt this bad about AU. It seems to me that the AU spirit is on life support. Jay Jacobs is a snake in the grass.

[rocketman37 13]

I've bled Orange and Blue for over a half century.

I'm a Scholarship donor, Tigers Unlimited member, Alumni Association Life member, and Samford Society member. I've given a lot back to my beloved Auburn.

I've listened to, read about, and watched on TV (and websites) the hype, spin, bloodletting, and media frenzy.

The innuendos, nuances, vagaries, and vicissitudes have transmogrified me into a hotbed of neutrality.

Therefore, I'm not commenting nor judging until the facts are clear.

Let there be no doubt...I'll be an Auburn man and love the Auburn family forever, new HC notwithstanding.

I will continue my 26-year scholarship annual donation in 2009 and beyond (including my eternal time in Heaven-with a celestial HDTV, of course.)

Our hearts are troubled. This, too, shall go away.

We're Auburn. We're family. But, my brothers and sisters, WE DON'T KNOW THE FACTS...YET!

Go Gators (for a day)!

War Eagle!

[kwagoner 214]

I've bled Orange and Blue for over a half century.

I'm a Scholarship donor, Tigers Unlimited member, Alumni Association Life member, and Samford Society member. I've given a lot back to my beloved Auburn.

I've listened to, read about, and watched on TV (and websites) the hype, spin, bloodletting, and media frenzy.

The innuendos, nuances, vagaries, and vicissitudes have transmogrified me into a hotbed of neutrality.

Therefore, I'm not commenting nor judging until the facts are clear.

Let there be no doubt...I'll be an Auburn man and love the Auburn family forever, new HC notwithstanding.

I will continue my 26-year scholarship annual donation in 2009 and beyond (including my eternal time in Heaven-with a celestial HDTV, of course.)

Our hearts are troubled. This, too, shall go away.

We're Auburn. We're family. But, my brothers and sisters, WE DON'T KNOW THE FACTS...YET!

Go Gators (for a day)!

War Eagle!

You'll have at least seven people pulling the dictionary out with posts like that.

[tiger78 13]

Many wise folks have already added their posts. I for one read much more than I post. As my name suggests, I graduated along with my wife in 1978. I sat in Legion (of Bama) Field for nine years waiting to beat the obnoxious, overconfident team from Tuscaloosa and their fans. I have seen many things good and bad in football and life. Only a complete idiot or a group of them would fire (yes that is how I think it went down) a coach without having a better option as a new head coach. We are very close to looking like Bama and that is not something to celebrate. I have stated the practical, but just as important is that Tommy has run the program in a way to make the entire Auburn family proud. I will support the new coach, and more importantly Auburn, in any case. I do see that we have seen the enemy, and he is us (or our administration). If you were born after the birth of my kids (1982 or later) you only see the 24/7 hype that has become college football. Auburn has always been and hopefully always be more than, what have you done for me lately? Keep in mind that the President of the United States only makes $200,000 per year and has much more responsibility than any coach. I still think if the salaries and egos weren't so high, you could get someone to excel without selling his soul to do it. It is a game folks. It means a lot, for sure. But do you want to win at any cost? SEC or National Championships or else? I may be older than most on this board, but I don't think that is what we want. Read the Auburn Creed. I don't think Auburn men or women think so either. I have been fortunate to have two daughters and a son in law graduate from Auburn, and my youngest son is a senior now. I hope they and all of you expect more from Auburn than just wanting to have it now at any cost. Coach Tubberville has been a class act, and I hope and pray that our next coach can do as well.

[Homan83 0]

I am not sure what constitues old but given that I now have 2 boys at Auburn, I guess I qualify. I have been attending Auburn games since 1979 when I was a Freshman and thus have a long term perspective. This is actually only second in the "Most Embarrassing moments in Auburn Football History". The worst was and will remain Jetgate in 2003. The brazen underhanded way that was conducted will live in infamy.

I will go out on a limb that most will disagree with but so be it. Tommy Tubberville has been the best coach in Auburn history. I say that as a football fan and a man who loves Auburn University. Our teams have been successful on the football field, in the classroom, and in life. He inherited a mess, not only on the football field, but academically and the overall character of those in the program. He cleaned it up and made this one of the most successful programs in the country. We are not USC, Texas, Florida, etc where 4 and 5 star recruits fall into the program. We coach them up and Tommy did so repeatedly. He represented the university well and was respected nationally. Simply put, a class act.

Shug is our legend but if you look back, you will find both probation and undisciplined football. Doug Barfield was a nice man but not a head football coach in the SEC. Pat Dye was my guy, the man who made us feel equal to UAT. Yet, for all he did for the positive, we ended up on probation yet again and had an feature on 60 minutes (many don't remember that one). Terry was a mistake and one that I supported. (I felt pretty smart in 1993, not so much in 1998). Auburn is great at burying the truth and in the case of Terry, I am glad they have. I have heard enough to know this one is really ugly.

Anyway, my younger son (Freshman) said something this week that suprised me. He was really dissapointed as CTT was the only Auburn coach he had ever known. Think about that one. A freshman at Auburn was in the 3rd grade when we last had a coaching change.

Excuse those of us who are "older" and thus go on an on. At the end of this, ask the question "Are we better off then we were yesterday"? Frankly, I cannot forsee an outcome where we will be in a better position with a new hire then we were with CTT.

Enough said

[Grumps 3,705]

I'm only 41, but my Auburn blood runs as deep as anyone's (AU Alums=Dad '57, Mom '58, Brother '81, Sister #1 '84, Sister #2 '88, me '89). I keep the Auburn Creed in my office and truly use it as a guide to how I should live my life. I am embarrassed that the Auburn University president and athletic director and BOT do not understand what Auburn is (or at least is supposed to be) and do not strive themselves to live by the Auburn Creed.

I hate it that the only choices I have are 1) continue to support the University that I love and turn a blind eye to the incompetence of those who run the programs thereby becoming a silent accomplice to their ineptitude or 2) diminish my support for the University as a form of personal protest and become less than a whole-hearted Auburn man for the first time in my life.