Prohibition is almost over

[Barnacle 9,064]

17 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

You can sue anyone for any reason at any time.  

What's your point?

[Barnacle 9,064]

29 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

 For the trucking example, the drivers are not employees of the company.  

Of what company? The specific company you were talking about? Who owns the trucks?

[AUsince72 11,084]

I don't really care one way or the other as...

#1, I'm a grown man so if I want to get blitzed at a football game it'll happen, sales or not.  Beyond me, of course, it's been going on for @ 130 years so not sure what the big deal is. 

#2, what makes Auburn People so incapable of handling their liquor (beer) compared to the other hundreds if sports arenas all over the world?  Some of these arguments make it sound like Auburn People are all like 16 year old kids waiting for their parents to take a weekend trip so that they can raid the liquor cabinet.  

No offense to either side of the argument but it seems that outside of PTB's (valuable) medical point of view the list of pro votes vs con votes seem (predictably) along the lines of those who *really* like to drink vs those who don't drink or drinking's not a "must".

[passthebiscuits 6,845]

^agree with @AUsince72. And it’s happening so let’s see how it works out.

 

I would like to ask the question (seriously, not trying to troll) : Why was alcohol prohibited at SEC football games to begin with? When I was a kid folks could buy beer no problem. I wonder what happened before? Why was that change made? 
 

Ok another angle:

For those wondering...let’s say the legal limit for driving with alcohol in the bloodstream is 0.08...now many hospitals calculate in dL so it moves the decimal to 80. (It makes it a little easier to compare levels this way.)
 

OK now, the “usual” intoxicated person with say 4-5 beers may have a level of around 120. (If they had their level checked.) They are walking, talking and maybe “buzzed” but over the legal limit. (Btw I encounter patients as young as 16-17yo with alcohol levels of 300 after the game...commonly. There’s also a “drunk tank” under the stadium for those that need some help in use already. Don’t even for sake of argument consider the folks that have alcohol-related dehydration or falls during those 90 degree LSU game days for our discussion.)
 

Now, alcohol metabolizes at a rate of 20-25 dL per hour...so if you do the math, if your alcohol level is 120, and you need to get to under 80, you’ll need about 2 hours minimum before you drive.

Does the 3rd quarter end a full 2 hours before the end of the game? How many people do you think will be on the road with alcohol levels a little steeper than 80? 
 

Now I understand that you’re gonna tell me that the same folks are going to drink and this won’t affect that...well you’re probably right. Again, I’m not against it, I just think it’s worth the conversation to discuss the logistics and the inevitable complications that arise when we are complicit with serving beverages at the game. 
 

Good discussion, everyone. Hopefully, people will be good stewards of this benefit of going to the games and enjoy themselves safely. wde! 
 

 

[abw0004 10,110]

1 hour ago, Barnacle said:

What's your point?

That you can sue Auburn even though they are contracting out the work.

 

1 hour ago, Barnacle said:

Of what company? The specific company you were talking about? Who owns the trucks?

Yes that is correct.  You made the point that if the work is contracted out and they are not employees the company cannot be at fault, so I made the example that the company can still be at fault, even if it is unfair.  The company I am referring to has a blend of trucks owned by the company and those owned by the contractors.  The semi trucks I would say is 30% owned by the company, and the crane trucks are 100% although the cranes haven't been involved in litigation... yet...

[abw0004 10,110]

@AUsince72 I like your new "interests" quote!

[Barnacle 9,064]

7 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

That you can sue Auburn even though they are contracting out the work.

Well, yeah. This is the risk of doing business. The objective is insulating yourself from liability, not suit. 

Yes that is correct.  You made the point that if the work is contracted out and they are not employees the company cannot be at fault, so I made the example that the company can still be at fault, even if it is unfair.  The company I am referring to has a blend of trucks owned by the company and those owned by the contractors.  The semi trucks I would say is 30% owned by the company, and the crane trucks are 100% although the cranes haven't been involved in litigation... yet...

I did not say they could not be at fault. I said it is extremely difficult to impute liability to a principal for the acts of his independent contractor. This is and always has been the general rule of law in Alabama. 

The question becomes one of agency. For the purposes of tort liability, the agency question is subject to a fact based analysis centered on control. How much control does the principal have over its independent contractor?

The reason I asked you whether the trucking company owns it's own trucks is because it would be a key fact in analyzing the control issue, and I'd be willing to bet my law degree that the employees driving trucks owned by the company would not be considered independent contractors for the purposes of tort liability. Whether the other "independent contractors" driving trucks not owned by the company would be considered employees would involve a lot more questions about the business that aren't important for this discussion. 

The point is that if a plaintiff can show that the principal has enough control over the contractor and his work, then the law treats the contractor like an employee and the principal can be held indirectly liable for that individual's tortuous conduct. 

Conversely, if the defendant can show that it didn't maintain sufficient control over the manner in which the contractor's business is to be conducted, then it becomes very unlikely that the principal would ever be held liable for the independent contractor's conduct. 

It would be up to the University's own counsel to arrange arm's length relationships with its vendors, in order to insulate itself from liability. Think of JHS like a strip mall leasing retail space to vendors. If done properly, suing Auburn for a vendor's actions would be like suing the owner of a strip mall for the bartender at Buffalo Wild Wings over-serving a patron. Good luck with that!

This isn't as clear cut an arrangement as the example I just used might be, and it will take careful consideration and counsel to execute.

[abw0004 10,110]

@Barnacle you are 100% correct.  The issue usually lies in my experience the insurers do not even let the suit play out.  You could have every fact in the world to support you are in the right and they will want to settle for the fact that it isn’t worth the legal fees.  So then you see the university settling all of these cases, which is like a mosquito lamp, it just attract more suits for easy cash.  That is where the real issue is.  And maybe to make a point Auburn takes all of them to court, I have no idea.  I will be interesting for sure.

Side note, I sent you a PM in regard to your profession.  

[Barnacle 9,064]

1 minute ago, abw0004 said:

@Barnacle you are 100% correct.  The issue usually lies in my experience the insurers do not even let the suit play out.  You could have every fact in the world to support you are in the right and they will want to settle for the fact that it isn’t worth the legal fees.  So then you see the university settling all of these cases, which is like a mosquito lamp, it just attract more suits for easy cash.  That is where the real issue is.  And maybe to make a point Auburn takes all of them to court, I have no idea.  I will be interesting for sure.

Side note, I sent you a PM in regard to your profession.  

For what it's worth, in my practice - and this is the area I practice in - disputed liability cases are never settled pre-suit. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

2 hours ago, abw0004 said:

@AUsince72 I like your new "interests" quote!

Thank you brother.  I mean it with all of my heart!

 

[CCTAU 3,318]

8 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

i just realized i never went to an auburn game in auburn without drinking. my mom used to smuggle in miniatures and we would have one drink per quarter and my poor old man had to be designated driver. the only time i was super drunk was with a friend. once after a game i bounced down about twelve rows before stopping.it must have been alarming at the time because several fans came to see if i was ok. i was. i also learned never again........

Since little kids bounce better, I’m sure you were fine. it was a different time back then...

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

On 2/14/2020 at 2:30 PM, McLoofus said:

Or possibly just wrong. Everything I've seen said that alcohol-related incidents at stadiums that recently went wet have gone down. And the fact that the number of wet stadiums doubled in the last year or two certainly doesn't suggest that it's "disasters" being modeled. I'm curious what's been disastrous about it. 

I never said it was right. 

I said what I have experienced. I dare you to tell me that what i saw with my own eyes didnt happen. Maybe you can convince my son that he didnt didnt have a lugi spit right in his 10 year old face... by some drunk douche... Good luck with that. 

 

However i also specifically stated that it was my opinion. I also said that my opinion could change. 

[auburnphan 6,050]

On 2/15/2020 at 12:10 PM, aubiefifty said:

hey man you ever get to catch many games live living in whiskey?

I have not made it down to an Auburn game in a few years.  Was at the Final Four last year.  Gonna try to make it back down there this year for a game as I am excited to see what Chad Morris does with this talent and this is the first time I believe Gus isn’t being less than honest to us.

[doc4aday 1,887]

On 2/12/2020 at 9:02 PM, AUsince72 said:

Instead of alcohol sales, maybe just push cannabis, like a Jimmy Buffett concert, and even the players can enjoy....the....uh.....

 

might be a bit safer! 😁

[keesler 5,924]

On 2/15/2020 at 8:28 AM, dyehardfanAU said:

It seems like the contract could be written to shift most of the legal liability to the vendor, but I'm not a lawyer.  Either way, I'm of the mindset that there will be very little binge drinking of $10-$12 beers when you can only grab 1-2 at a time and the queue is long the entire time they're serving. 

Cut it off after the 3rd quarter ends, have a system in place for ID verification, don't sell to obviously schnockered individuals.  I'm sure there are a ton of other reasonable barriers that can be put in place to limit abuse of they system.  This is not a new issue, concerts and sporting events far larger than a game at JHS have managed to make it work.

As to underaged drinking in the student section:  those kids are still gonna sneak their booze in, same as every generation before them.

If the Metallica concert I'm attending in May at Daytona (+100,000 capacity + infield) can handle beer sales then Auburn sure can.  I just fail to see the issue, I've bought beer at international football (soccer) events with the largest worldwide capacity in attendance and at professional sporting events for decades.

[McLoofus 35,182]

33 minutes ago, keesler said:

If the Metallica concert I'm attending in May at Daytona (+100,000 capacity + infield) can handle beer sales then Auburn sure can.  I just fail to see the issue, I've bought beer at international football (soccer) events with the largest worldwide capacity in attendance and at professional sporting events for decades.

Auburn fans don't handle change very well, I've decided. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

19 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Auburn fans don't handle change very well, I've decided. 

What happens when I get excited about major change...

 

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

47 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Auburn fans don't handle change very well, I've decided. 

Auburn has shown many times and will show many more that it's willing to cut off it's nose to spite it's face.

[McLoofus 35,182]

52 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

What happens when I get excited about major change...

 

WHEN. ARE. WE. GETTING. OUR. SEQUEL.

I swear. In a day and age where Hollywood can't seem to come up with any new ideas for summer movies, and with Kurt Russell and Kim Cattrall still very viable box office draws, and with the way the original ended, and with how tailor-made for CGI that whole concept is... it just frustrates the hell out of me. We get freaking live-action Call of the Wild with a fully CGI dog but no BTILC II? I'm calling BS. 

 

[keesler 5,924]

3 hours ago, dyehardfanAU said:

Auburn has shown many times and will show many more that it's willing to cut off it's nose to spite it's face.

All to put forth an honorable and wholesome appearance.  SMH

Some are so worried about the impression beer sales will give others and the possibility that an Auburn fan would disrespect an opposing fan if they had a few drinks that they'd give up the revenue it will bring in to athletics and what Auburn can do with the added income.  Never mind that many of our own SEC brethren opened up beer sales the moment the SEC lifted the ban and they've shown and actual decrease in alcohol related incidents.  

[creed 1,635]

I wonder what the local merchant is thinking about in stadium alcohol sales. Will it eat into their after game sales and profits? Do they think it's a good or bad move for their business. Thoughts.

[dyehardfanAU 2,117]

30 minutes ago, creed said:

I wonder what the local merchant is thinking about in stadium alcohol sales. Will it eat into their after game sales and profits? Do they think it's a good or bad move for their business. Thoughts.

I seriously doubt people downing a couple of overpriced beers during the game will effect after game drinking.  

[Barnacle 9,064]

8 minutes ago, dyehardfanAU said:

I seriously doubt people downing a couple of overpriced beers during the game will effect after game drinking.  

Wouldn't be surprised if it helped with after game sales.

[gr82be 14,423]

On 2/14/2020 at 12:28 PM, McLoofus said:

Amen.

I'd hope that it wouldn't lead to more plastic cups exiting the stadium, but I suppose that's very possible. Trash in the stands... that's an interesting thought. I imagine that people will continue to deal with their trash- or not- as they always have, but maybe there will be more trash? 

If they want to cut down on the potential of additional trash then maybe reduce the price of the second and additional beers by a dollar if you reuse your cup by taking it with you to the vendor booth. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

19 hours ago, McLoofus said:

WHEN. ARE. WE. GETTING. OUR. SEQUEL.

I swear. In a day and age where Hollywood can't seem to come up with any new ideas for summer movies, and with Kurt Russell and Kim Cattrall still very viable box office draws, and with the way the original ended, and with how tailor-made for CGI that whole concept is... it just frustrates the hell out of me. We get freaking live-action Call of the Wild with a fully CGI dog but no BTILC II? I'm calling BS. 

 

You gotta figure ol' Kurt's wearing them down to get that sequal.....