TitanTiger 20,472 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 5 hours ago, jj3jordan said: Heavily slanted opinion pieces are virtually all that is posted here. But that's not the point. The point is, taking a slanted piece and running with it as if it's the only legit take on the matter. Would you think it wise to only gather your information and form opinions from only Mother Jones on a highly disputed matter? Quote Call it what you want; I agree with his opinion regarding Biden’s implementation of his plan. And no, it’s not gospel. You just think when you post an article it’s fact not opinion. But when a Trump supporter does it it’s just heavily slanted opinion. I’m sure you will be all in for Joe until this shows up in your neighborhood. Let’s revisit this when that happens. We aren't having a debate about what sources a person likes. We're discussing the housing policy. I'd suggest looking at reporting from a variety of sources across the political spectrum before declaring something to be a certain way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,472 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Steven G. Calabresi is a co-founder of the Federalist Society and a professor at Northwestern University’s Pritzker School of Law. I just wanted to highlight this part again from my previous post. When guys like this are coming after his head, there's a big shift happening that has yet to fully come to the surface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,472 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, DKW 86 said: All of this points out that in fact, Mail-In ballots are exceedingly easy to commit fraud, or "get disqualified" for one of many reasons: Did the signature match? Who makes that judgment call? What are the qualifying standards for a signature match? Were those standards followed? What about challenges and appeals? How long do we wait to announce that Julie Sixpack got her ballot disqaulified? Did it really arrive before Midnite 11-3-20? How long does she have to appeal? On her watch she was on time. Was the Video was in error? Was that even Julie in the Video? What are those standards? Are they even written yet? When and Where do we count it as in US Postal Service hands? Who is watching the USPS? What qualifies as a "Legal Custodial Chain" for these ballots? Does the Custodial Chain vary by District? Is that Legal? Does one District's lax policies disqualify ballots? What Ballots? How many ballots? Who decides that? Who gets to disqualify a ballot? The duly elected Republican registrar? The US Postal Service Inspectors? Both? Neither? Can that vary by district? Is that Constitutional? And ALL THE LAWYERS IN AMERICA GET RICH FIGHTING THIS IN COURT with motion after motion, injunction after injunction, delay after delay. Oh hell no! Lets face it. In a country where dogs and the dead vote regularly... https://www.thecalifornian.com/story/news/2019/06/07/california-man-dogs-dead-father-vote-voter-fraud-elections-pacific-grove/3672406002/ anything other than REQUESTED ABSENTEE BALLOTS are pretty much BS. Totally support REQUESTED ABSENTEE BALLOTS. Carpet bombing the US with unsecured ballots is just stupid. Folks we live in the South. For decades half the cemeteries voted. We barely have voter checks now. Every time someone does a voter role purge, there are immediate accusations of fraud. Can you imagine the fight in America with say just 300 precincts having fraud allegations? IF ANYTHING, this plays right into Trump's hands of denying the election outcome. Use your damn heads... I think I have some different takeaways from this story. First, the story says up front that it's unclear how many ballot rejections were related to fraud. I think we'd all agree that mail-in/absentee ballots are and should be subject to more scrutiny. If they are rejecting 19% of the ballots done this way, I'm actually encouraged that this scrutiny is actually happening. And to be sure, there are some very specific requirements on how these ballots are to be filled out and mailed in. I received an absentee ballot for the July runoff in Alabama this year and can attest to this. Fail to complete any of these steps or fail to do them correctly, and your ballot can be disqualified. And even outside of these instructions and steps, there are other checks such as what's mentioned in the article - they check signatures and reject them if anything looks different or off compared to previous signatures they have. They look for telltale signs of tampering like stuffing mailboxes and such. I don't favor just sending out mail-in ballots willynilly. I think you should have to apply for one and provide the required ID to have it mailed to the address on file like I had to in Alabama. But there simply isn't enough evidence to support this position of faith Trump has on it being rife with fraud. He's preemptively floating excuses out there to cover for the real (and getting more real by the day) possibility of him losing (and perhaps getting smoked) this November. Just because it's one of his favorite ploys doesn't mean we should force crowds of people into physical voting locations during a pandemic that he has a big part in being as out of control as it is here. It's a phantom. On a side note, FYI: statistics indicate Republicans utilize mail-in/absentee ballots more than Democrats. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/25/us/vote-by-mail-coronavirus.html https://www.npr.org/2020/04/11/831978099/even-as-trump-denounces-vote-by-mail-gop-in-florida-and-elsewhere-relies-on-it https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/06/trump-republicans-vote-mail-arizona-florida/612625/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aubiefifty 16,766 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 19 hours ago, TitanTiger said: I agree. And while I'm with jj3jordan on it not exactly being a "call" to delay the election, he's definitely floating it out there because he's worried. He knows he can't actually delay the election. But it'll rile up the libs which gets his base frothing at the mouth cheering him on. And it serves to seed the eventual argument of the election being "stolen" if it plays out like the polling suggests right now. Because if the last four years have taught us anything, it's that the man almost never simply admits he was wrong about something or that he got beat. The normal go-to's are to act like it didn't happen or to deflect blame and make excuses. This is no different. i think he is testing the waters with his base and other gop folks to see if he might by chance get away with it if he tried. he knows hell is coing when he loses those presidential protections. and you righties can roll your eyes all you want but with trump it is very possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aubiefifty 16,766 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 15 hours ago, SocialCircle said: Hillary even today claims the election was stolen from her by the Russians. I would suggest to you her lack of work ethic during the campaign cost her the election more than anything. She took too many states for granted. you do realize the russians tried to hack hillarys puters and give her emails to the gop right? this is the truth.they hacked the dnc with more success. here ya go although i know i am wasting my time........... theatlantic.com The Coincidence at the Heart of the Russia Hacking Scandal David A. Graham 7-9 minutes A new indictment charges that Russians tried to hack Hillary Clinton’s emails on July 27, 2016—the same day that Donald Trump publicly asked them to do so. July 13, 2018 5 more free articles this month more free articles Sign in Donald Trump holds a press conference on July 27, 2016.Carlo Allegri / Reuters The broad outlines of Friday’s indictment by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, charging 12 Russians with conspiracy, identity theft, and money laundering in connection with hacking during the 2016 presidential election, are not surprising. The hacking of the Democratic National Committee has been public knowledge since July 2016, and even then, the authorities publicly stated that the perpetrators were Russian government officials. Other details, such as the apparent involvement of WikiLeaks and Trump adviser Roger Stone, were also known. Some of the details, however, are striking. On July 27, 2016, at a Trump press conference in Florida, the candidate referred to 33,000 emails that an aide to Hillary Clinton had deleted from the former secretary of state’s personal email server. The DNC had recently announced the Russian intrusion, and Trump speculated that if Russia broke into the DNC, it would have accessed Clinton’s emails, too. “By the way, if they hacked, they probably have her 33,000 emails,” Trump said. “I hope they do. They probably have her 33,000 emails that she lost and deleted. Because you’d see some beauties there.” That was perhaps irresponsible speculation, but it wasn’t crazy. There were widespread questions about Clinton’s information security, and whether she might have compromised government secrets. But a few minutes later Trump said something much stranger. “I will tell you this: Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing,” he said. “I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.” The president was encouraging a foreign adversary to illegally hack into messages by a former secretary of state that might contain sensitive information, then release them publicly. Trump had good reason to believe that Russia was listening. The previous month, his son, Donald Jr.; son-in-law, Jared Kushner; and campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, had a meeting at Trump Tower with Russians who they believed were offering damaging information about Clinton. (The meeting wasn’t revealed to the public until 2017, and both the Russians and the Trump campaign officials say no dirt was exchanged.) Prior to the meeting, Trump Jr. had received an email stating that the meeting was “ part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.” Mueller’s indictment offers new evidence that Russia was listening—and acting on Trump’s request. The indictment charges 12 officers of the GRU, Russia’s military-intelligence agency, with hacking intended to interfere with the election. According to the document: The Conspirators spearphished individuals affiliated with the Clinton Campaign throughout the summer of 2016. For example, on or about July 27, 2016, the Conspirators 7 attempted after hours to spearphish for the first time email accounts at a domain hosted by a third-party provider and used by Clinton's personal office. At or around the same time, they also targeted seventy-six email addresses at the domain for the Clinton Campaign. In other words, a Russian attempt to penetrate Clinton’s server and her campaign came around the same time that Trump was publicly pleading with Russia to do just that. (Mueller alleges that there had been attempts to hack Clinton’s campaign since at least March 2016.) Trump’s hacking request was so egregious that it earned immediate pushback from other Republicans. Speaker Paul Ryan’s spokesman issued a statement saying, “Russia is a global menace led by a devious thug. Putin should stay out of this election.” Even Mike Pence, Trump’s own vice-presidential nominee, contradicted his running mate. “If it is Russia [that hacked the DNC] and they are interfering in our elections, I can assure you both parties and the United States government will ensure there are serious consequences,” he said. The indictment notes other examples of Russia releasing documents at times engineered to benefit the Trump campaign, though it doesn’t offer any evidence that Trump aides directed, or were aware of, those releases before they happened. The indictment notes that WikiLeaks released a tranche of emails allegedly stolen by Russia on July 22, 2016—just three days before the DNC, a convenient stroke of timing for Trump. Then, on October 7, 2016, WikiLeaks released another batch of hacked emails within hours of the revelation of the Access Hollywood tape, in which Trump is overheard boasting about sexually assaulting women. In a statement responding to the indictment on Friday, the White House did not condemn Russian interference in the election, instead striking a purely defensive note regarding the president’s 2016 victory. “Today’s charges include no allegations of knowing involvement by anyone on the campaign and no allegations that the alleged hacking affected the election result,” a spokeswoman said. “This is consistent with what we have been saying all along.” Trump is scheduled to meet one-on-one with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday in Helsinki, Finland. At the time of Trump’s comments in July 2016, it was easy to write them off as the latest sideshow from his circus of a campaign. Though he was at that moment enjoying a brief post-Republican National Convention bounce in the polls, Trump was widely expected to lose the election, so his comments, while dangerous, were of limited relevance. That was incorrect, of course: Trump defeated Clinton. And since then, the public has learned a great deal about both Russian interference in the election and ties between the Trump campaign and Russia. Mueller indicted a coterie of Russians on charges of interfering in the election via online trolling. The public learned of the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, despite multiple attempts by Trump Jr. to mislead about it. Former National-Security Adviser Michael Flynn pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with the Russian ambassador. Former Trump campaign foreign-policy adviser George Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with Russians during the election. Another foreign-policy aide, Carter Page, offered confusing and sometimes contradictory evidence about his travels to Russia and elsewhere. Mueller has produced evidence showing Manafort’s deep pre-campaign ties to the Kremlin. Kushner reportedly attempted to establish a back-channel to communicate with Russia. And so on. As I have argued, the question of whether these ties existed ought to be closed. There is extensive evidence to support that they did. Friday’s indictment adds an astonishing new wrinkle. Trump campaign officials may or may not have been colluding with a Russian influence operation behind closed doors, but Trump himself was making no attempt to hide his own desires, with cameras and reporters watching. The Russians heeded his call. We want to hear what you think about this article. Submit a letter to the editor or write to letters@theatlantic.com. David A. Graham is a staff writer at The Atlantic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialCircle 570 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 6 minutes ago, aubiefifty said: you do realize the russians tried to hack hillarys puters and give her emails to the gop right? this is the truth.they hacked the dnc with more success. here ya go although i know i am wasting my time........... theatlantic.com The Coincidence at the Heart of the Russia Hacking Scandal David A. Graham 7-9 minutes A new indictment charges that Russians tried to hack Hillary Clinton’s emails on July 27, 2016—the same day that Donald Trump publicly asked them to do so. July 13, 2018 5 more free articles this month more free articles Sign in Donald Trump holds a press conference on July 27, 2016.Carlo Allegri / Reuters The broad outlines of Friday’s indictment by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, charging 12 Russians with conspiracy, identity theft, and money laundering in connection with hacking during the 2016 presidential election, are not surprising. The hacking of the Democratic National Committee has been public knowledge since July 2016, and even then, the authorities publicly stated that the perpetrators were Russian government officials. Other details, such as the apparent involvement of WikiLeaks and Trump adviser Roger Stone, were also known. Some of the details, however, are striking. On July 27, 2016, at a Trump press conference in Florida, the candidate referred to 33,000 emails that an aide to Hillary Clinton had deleted from the former secretary of state’s personal email server. The DNC had recently announced the Russian intrusion, and Trump speculated that if Russia broke into the DNC, it would have accessed Clinton’s emails, too. “By the way, if they hacked, they probably have her 33,000 emails,” Trump said. “I hope they do. They probably have her 33,000 emails that she lost and deleted. Because you’d see some beauties there.” That was perhaps irresponsible speculation, but it wasn’t crazy. There were widespread questions about Clinton’s information security, and whether she might have compromised government secrets. But a few minutes later Trump said something much stranger. “I will tell you this: Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing,” he said. “I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.” The president was encouraging a foreign adversary to illegally hack into messages by a former secretary of state that might contain sensitive information, then release them publicly. Trump had good reason to believe that Russia was listening. The previous month, his son, Donald Jr.; son-in-law, Jared Kushner; and campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, had a meeting at Trump Tower with Russians who they believed were offering damaging information about Clinton. (The meeting wasn’t revealed to the public until 2017, and both the Russians and the Trump campaign officials say no dirt was exchanged.) Prior to the meeting, Trump Jr. had received an email stating that the meeting was “ part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.” Mueller’s indictment offers new evidence that Russia was listening—and acting on Trump’s request. The indictment charges 12 officers of the GRU, Russia’s military-intelligence agency, with hacking intended to interfere with the election. According to the document: The Conspirators spearphished individuals affiliated with the Clinton Campaign throughout the summer of 2016. For example, on or about July 27, 2016, the Conspirators 7 attempted after hours to spearphish for the first time email accounts at a domain hosted by a third-party provider and used by Clinton's personal office. At or around the same time, they also targeted seventy-six email addresses at the domain for the Clinton Campaign. In other words, a Russian attempt to penetrate Clinton’s server and her campaign came around the same time that Trump was publicly pleading with Russia to do just that. (Mueller alleges that there had been attempts to hack Clinton’s campaign since at least March 2016.) Trump’s hacking request was so egregious that it earned immediate pushback from other Republicans. Speaker Paul Ryan’s spokesman issued a statement saying, “Russia is a global menace led by a devious thug. Putin should stay out of this election.” Even Mike Pence, Trump’s own vice-presidential nominee, contradicted his running mate. “If it is Russia [that hacked the DNC] and they are interfering in our elections, I can assure you both parties and the United States government will ensure there are serious consequences,” he said. The indictment notes other examples of Russia releasing documents at times engineered to benefit the Trump campaign, though it doesn’t offer any evidence that Trump aides directed, or were aware of, those releases before they happened. The indictment notes that WikiLeaks released a tranche of emails allegedly stolen by Russia on July 22, 2016—just three days before the DNC, a convenient stroke of timing for Trump. Then, on October 7, 2016, WikiLeaks released another batch of hacked emails within hours of the revelation of the Access Hollywood tape, in which Trump is overheard boasting about sexually assaulting women. In a statement responding to the indictment on Friday, the White House did not condemn Russian interference in the election, instead striking a purely defensive note regarding the president’s 2016 victory. “Today’s charges include no allegations of knowing involvement by anyone on the campaign and no allegations that the alleged hacking affected the election result,” a spokeswoman said. “This is consistent with what we have been saying all along.” Trump is scheduled to meet one-on-one with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday in Helsinki, Finland. At the time of Trump’s comments in July 2016, it was easy to write them off as the latest sideshow from his circus of a campaign. Though he was at that moment enjoying a brief post-Republican National Convention bounce in the polls, Trump was widely expected to lose the election, so his comments, while dangerous, were of limited relevance. That was incorrect, of course: Trump defeated Clinton. And since then, the public has learned a great deal about both Russian interference in the election and ties between the Trump campaign and Russia. Mueller indicted a coterie of Russians on charges of interfering in the election via online trolling. The public learned of the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, despite multiple attempts by Trump Jr. to mislead about it. Former National-Security Adviser Michael Flynn pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with the Russian ambassador. Former Trump campaign foreign-policy adviser George Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with Russians during the election. Another foreign-policy aide, Carter Page, offered confusing and sometimes contradictory evidence about his travels to Russia and elsewhere. Mueller has produced evidence showing Manafort’s deep pre-campaign ties to the Kremlin. Kushner reportedly attempted to establish a back-channel to communicate with Russia. And so on. As I have argued, the question of whether these ties existed ought to be closed. There is extensive evidence to support that they did. Friday’s indictment adds an astonishing new wrinkle. Trump campaign officials may or may not have been colluding with a Russian influence operation behind closed doors, but Trump himself was making no attempt to hide his own desires, with cameras and reporters watching. The Russians heeded his call. We want to hear what you think about this article. Submit a letter to the editor or write to letters@theatlantic.com. David A. Graham is a staff writer at The Atlantic. I have no doubt that Russia and China and others hacked Hillary’s lame “personal” computer. It is just speculation on the DNC computer because they never turned it over to the FBI. I suspect the Russian’s tried to hack the Dems and Reps computers and constantly have tried to do so for years.....sometimes successful and sometimes not. After all the Russians have tried to cause issues with our elections for decades just as Obama tried to influence the Israeli election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aubiefifty 16,766 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 4 minutes ago, SocialCircle said: I have no doubt that Russia and China and others hacked Hillary’s lame “personal” computer. It is just speculation on the DNC computer because they never turned it over to the FBI. I suspect the Russian’s tried to hack the Dems and Reps computers and constantly have tried to do so for years.....sometimes successful and sometimes not. After all the Russians have tried to cause issues with our elections for decades just as Obama tried to influence the Israeli election. you are not very smart are you? it was in fact hacked. listen to some real news............. washingtonpost.com How the Russians hacked the DNC and passed its emails to WikiLeaks Ellen Nakashima 8-10 minutes On a late July day in 2016, Donald Trump, the GOP nominee for president, stood at a lectern in Florida, next to an American flag, and urged a U.S. adversary to become involved in the election campaign and find tens of thousands of emails wiped from the server of his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton. “Russia, if you’re listening,” he said at a news conference at one of his resorts, “I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing.” That same day, July 27, several Russian government hackers launched an attack against the email accounts of staffers in Clinton’s personal office, according to a sweeping indictment Friday by special counsel Robert S. Mueller III. At or around the same time, the hackers also targeted 76 email addresses used by the Clinton campaign, investigators said. The remarkable timing of the Russian attempt on Clinton’s servers is just one of the new details revealed in the indictment of 12 Russian military intelligence officers, who Mueller alleges hacked the email accounts and computers of Democratic officials and organizations in an audacious effort to influence the U.S. election. Although the broad outlines of the hacking and influence campaign have been widely reported, the indictment describes for the first time the identities, techniques and tactics of the operation to disrupt American democracy. It includes details on how the Russians, using an encrypted file with instructions, delivered their trove of hacked emails to WikiLeaks, the online anti-secrecy organization led by Julian Assange that became the main platform for the Russians to display their trove of hacked emails. The indictment also reflects an aggressive but somewhat inartful operation in which hackers used the same computer servers to launder money by using the online currency bitcoin as they did to lure their victims and to register sites they used for hacking. The hackers worked for the spy agency called the Main Intelligence Directorate of the General Staff, or GRU, the indictment said. They also allegedly targeted a state election board, identified by U.S. officials as Illinois. The Russians stole information about 500,000 voters, including names, addresses, partial Social Security numbers, dates of birth and driver’s license numbers, according to the indictment. “This is maybe the last major missing piece of Mueller’s mosaic of charges on Russian election interference,” said David Kris, who headed the Justice Department’s national security division during the Obama administration and now leads consulting firm Culper Partners. Russia’s Foreign Ministry rejected the indictment’s allegations as lacking evidence and described the indictment as a clear effort to derail Monday’s Helsinki summit, where President Trump is to meet Russian President Vladimir Putin. The new indictments follow earlier charges that Russian operators of social media accounts spread propaganda and false news stories during the 2016 campaign. Absent from Friday’s indictment are any allegations of conspiracy between Russian operatives and Americans, including members of the Trump campaign. “The single most remarkable thing is that the special counsel names and shames 12 GRU officers, goes into detail of its operation and does this at a moment when we are days away from the Helsinki summit,” said Thomas Rid, a strategic studies professor at Johns Hopkins University who was one of the first researchers in 2016 to identify Guccifer 2.0, an online identity created as part of the GRU operation. Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein said Friday that the indictment’s timing was dictated purely by the determination of prosecutors that the information was sufficient to present to a grand jury. While Russian hacking, especially for espionage purposes, is decades old, using digital tools to steal data and then release it to embarrass and stoke divisions — weaponizing information — was the innovation, one that U.S. spy agencies did not see coming until too late. Another Russian spy agency, the SVR, allegedly hacked the network of the Democratic National Committee in 2015. But it was the military units whose alleged interference Mueller singled out, and the SVR is not mentioned in the indictment. Two GRU teams in particular, Units 26165 and 74455, both located in Moscow, carried out most of the campaign, beginning in early 2016, according to the indictment. One of Unit 26165’s officers, Senior Lt. Aleksey Lukashev, used various online fake personas, including “Den Katenberg” and “Yuliana Martynova,” to craft “spearphishing” emails to trick Clinton campaign members, including Chairman John Podesta, into clicking on links that enabled the hackers to obtain the victims’ login and password credentials, the indictment said. Another unit mate, Capt. Nikolay Kozachek, allegedly crafted the X-Agent malware used to hack the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and DNC networks in April 2016. Both were among those indicted. Unit 74455, also known as the Main Center for Special Technology, engineered the release of the stolen documents through a website it created called DCLeaks and the online persona Guccifer 2.0, according to the indictment. The campaign began as early as March 2016, when Lukashev crafted and sent a spearphish email to Podesta that was designed to look like a security notification from Google, the indictment stated. The spoof email instructed the user to change his password by clicking on a link. Podesta’s assistant, following the instructions of a security technician, dutifully complied, according to people familiar with the incident. Emails hacked from Podesta’s account would be released on WikiLeaks in a steady steam later that year, ensuring that material embarrassing to Clinton’s campaign would continue on a daily basis to deflect from her message in the weeks leading up to the election. The GRU allegedly broke into the networks of the DCCC in April 2016, by spearphishing an employee. The hackers installed keystroke loggers, which let them see what the employees were typing, and took images of employees’ computer screens, according to the indictment. The DCCC served as the hackers’ gateway to the DNC. Armed with the credentials of a DCCC contractor authorized to gain access to the DNC network, the GRU infiltrated the national committee, eventually gaining access to 33 computers, according to the indictment. Once inside the DCCC and DNC computers, the hackers searched for keywords related to the 2016 election, prosecutors allege. In mid-April 2016, they searched one DCCC computer for terms including “hillary,” “cruz” and “trump,” the indictment states. The hackers also copied particular DCCC folders, including one labeled “Benghazi Investigations.” And they “targeted” computers that contained information about opposition research and “field operation plans” for the 2016 election. The hackers used computer network infrastructure that they leased inside the United States, including in Arizona and Illinois, to move files from the targeted computers. On June 22, the indictment stated, WikiLeaks sent a private message to Guccifer 2.0 asking to have access to the material, saying “it will have a much higher impact” on its site. The GRU made repeated attempts to transfer the stolen DNC emails to WikiLeaks beginning in late June 2016. On July 14, the Russians got an email to WikiLeaks with an attachment titled “wk dnc link1.txt.gpg.” The attachment contained an encrypted file with instructions on accessing an online archive of hacked DNC documents, the indictment said. On July 18, WikiLeaks confirmed it had “the 1Gb or so archive” and would release the material “this week,” according to the indictment. On July 22, three days before the Democratic National Convention opened, WikiLeaks put up the DNC email archive of more than 20,000 emails and other documents hacked by the GRU, the indictment said. Anton Troianovski in Berlin contributed to this report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,367 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 10 hours ago, SaturdayGT said: 1. Should be way ways more relevant than irrelevant. Fine. But the method of voting doesn't change the inherent nature of politicians whether they are good or bad. The issue is whether or not mail in voting leads to more fraud. It doesn't. 2. Germany, China., democracies going back to rome....I think its human nature to undermine democracies, and us humans as politicians have had a long history of pulling the wool over the eyes of masses of people! I think history suggests we be very skeptical of those in leadership positions. And the Republicans are currently trying in this country. They are deliberately trying to minimize turnout because they know they are in the minority. 3. I can see you have a good argument,.. its just not making me feel better about mail in voting. Well if "good arguments" aren't enough to get you to reconsider your position, we are both wasting our time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 7,793 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 11 hours ago, homersapien said: And why do you "not agree with it", considering we are in a pandemic? Because places like Broward County can not get it right with the old tried and true procedures. Just see it becoming a real quagmire. Not agreeing does not mean not understanding that "mail in" is perhaps our best sensible option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,367 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said: Because places like Broward County can not get it right with the old tried and true procedures. Just see it becoming a real quagmire. Not agreeing does not mean not understanding that "mail in" is perhaps our best sensible option. Well, if that's the case, doesn't that add to the argument for mail in voting? The only "quagmire" is that it will take longer to get the results. But that seems a small price to pay vs. making people congregate in masses during a pandemic. And I am not sure what it says about you, that you disagree with our "best sensible option"? This is all about Trump trying to suppress turn out. You and I both know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,472 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 18 minutes ago, aubiefifty said: you are not very smart are you? it was in fact hacked. listen to some real news............. washingtonpost.com How the Russians hacked the DNC and passed its emails to WikiLeaks Ellen Nakashima 8-10 minutes On a late July day in 2016, Donald Trump, the GOP nominee for president, stood at a lectern in Florida, next to an American flag, and urged a U.S. adversary to become involved in the election campaign and find tens of thousands of emails wiped from the server of his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton. “Russia, if you’re listening,” he said at a news conference at one of his resorts, “I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing.” That same day, July 27, several Russian government hackers launched an attack against the email accounts of staffers in Clinton’s personal office, according to a sweeping indictment Friday by special counsel Robert S. Mueller III. At or around the same time, the hackers also targeted 76 email addresses used by the Clinton campaign, investigators said. The remarkable timing of the Russian attempt on Clinton’s servers is just one of the new details revealed in the indictment of 12 Russian military intelligence officers, who Mueller alleges hacked the email accounts and computers of Democratic officials and organizations in an audacious effort to influence the U.S. election. Although the broad outlines of the hacking and influence campaign have been widely reported, the indictment describes for the first time the identities, techniques and tactics of the operation to disrupt American democracy. It includes details on how the Russians, using an encrypted file with instructions, delivered their trove of hacked emails to WikiLeaks, the online anti-secrecy organization led by Julian Assange that became the main platform for the Russians to display their trove of hacked emails. The indictment also reflects an aggressive but somewhat inartful operation in which hackers used the same computer servers to launder money by using the online currency bitcoin as they did to lure their victims and to register sites they used for hacking. The hackers worked for the spy agency called the Main Intelligence Directorate of the General Staff, or GRU, the indictment said. They also allegedly targeted a state election board, identified by U.S. officials as Illinois. The Russians stole information about 500,000 voters, including names, addresses, partial Social Security numbers, dates of birth and driver’s license numbers, according to the indictment. “This is maybe the last major missing piece of Mueller’s mosaic of charges on Russian election interference,” said David Kris, who headed the Justice Department’s national security division during the Obama administration and now leads consulting firm Culper Partners. Russia’s Foreign Ministry rejected the indictment’s allegations as lacking evidence and described the indictment as a clear effort to derail Monday’s Helsinki summit, where President Trump is to meet Russian President Vladimir Putin. The new indictments follow earlier charges that Russian operators of social media accounts spread propaganda and false news stories during the 2016 campaign. Absent from Friday’s indictment are any allegations of conspiracy between Russian operatives and Americans, including members of the Trump campaign. “The single most remarkable thing is that the special counsel names and shames 12 GRU officers, goes into detail of its operation and does this at a moment when we are days away from the Helsinki summit,” said Thomas Rid, a strategic studies professor at Johns Hopkins University who was one of the first researchers in 2016 to identify Guccifer 2.0, an online identity created as part of the GRU operation. Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein said Friday that the indictment’s timing was dictated purely by the determination of prosecutors that the information was sufficient to present to a grand jury. While Russian hacking, especially for espionage purposes, is decades old, using digital tools to steal data and then release it to embarrass and stoke divisions — weaponizing information — was the innovation, one that U.S. spy agencies did not see coming until too late. Another Russian spy agency, the SVR, allegedly hacked the network of the Democratic National Committee in 2015. But it was the military units whose alleged interference Mueller singled out, and the SVR is not mentioned in the indictment. Two GRU teams in particular, Units 26165 and 74455, both located in Moscow, carried out most of the campaign, beginning in early 2016, according to the indictment. One of Unit 26165’s officers, Senior Lt. Aleksey Lukashev, used various online fake personas, including “Den Katenberg” and “Yuliana Martynova,” to craft “spearphishing” emails to trick Clinton campaign members, including Chairman John Podesta, into clicking on links that enabled the hackers to obtain the victims’ login and password credentials, the indictment said. Another unit mate, Capt. Nikolay Kozachek, allegedly crafted the X-Agent malware used to hack the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and DNC networks in April 2016. Both were among those indicted. Unit 74455, also known as the Main Center for Special Technology, engineered the release of the stolen documents through a website it created called DCLeaks and the online persona Guccifer 2.0, according to the indictment. The campaign began as early as March 2016, when Lukashev crafted and sent a spearphish email to Podesta that was designed to look like a security notification from Google, the indictment stated. The spoof email instructed the user to change his password by clicking on a link. Podesta’s assistant, following the instructions of a security technician, dutifully complied, according to people familiar with the incident. Emails hacked from Podesta’s account would be released on WikiLeaks in a steady steam later that year, ensuring that material embarrassing to Clinton’s campaign would continue on a daily basis to deflect from her message in the weeks leading up to the election. The GRU allegedly broke into the networks of the DCCC in April 2016, by spearphishing an employee. The hackers installed keystroke loggers, which let them see what the employees were typing, and took images of employees’ computer screens, according to the indictment. The DCCC served as the hackers’ gateway to the DNC. Armed with the credentials of a DCCC contractor authorized to gain access to the DNC network, the GRU infiltrated the national committee, eventually gaining access to 33 computers, according to the indictment. Once inside the DCCC and DNC computers, the hackers searched for keywords related to the 2016 election, prosecutors allege. In mid-April 2016, they searched one DCCC computer for terms including “hillary,” “cruz” and “trump,” the indictment states. The hackers also copied particular DCCC folders, including one labeled “Benghazi Investigations.” And they “targeted” computers that contained information about opposition research and “field operation plans” for the 2016 election. The hackers used computer network infrastructure that they leased inside the United States, including in Arizona and Illinois, to move files from the targeted computers. On June 22, the indictment stated, WikiLeaks sent a private message to Guccifer 2.0 asking to have access to the material, saying “it will have a much higher impact” on its site. The GRU made repeated attempts to transfer the stolen DNC emails to WikiLeaks beginning in late June 2016. On July 14, the Russians got an email to WikiLeaks with an attachment titled “wk dnc link1.txt.gpg.” The attachment contained an encrypted file with instructions on accessing an online archive of hacked DNC documents, the indictment said. On July 18, WikiLeaks confirmed it had “the 1Gb or so archive” and would release the material “this week,” according to the indictment. On July 22, three days before the Democratic National Convention opened, WikiLeaks put up the DNC email archive of more than 20,000 emails and other documents hacked by the GRU, the indictment said. Anton Troianovski in Berlin contributed to this report. Regardless of all of that, Hillary didn't lose because of the Russians. She lost because she is a terrible person and was a terrible candidate, and she ran a lousy campaign with a really stupid strategy that neglected battleground states she had untapped advantages in (WI, PA, MI) and instead focused on flipping others she didn't actually need (like AZ). She let overconfidence in seeing how rotten Trump was cloud her judgment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aubiefifty 16,766 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 5 minutes ago, TitanTiger said: Regardless of all of that, Hillary didn't lose because of the Russians. She lost because she is a terrible person and was a terrible candidate, and she ran a lousy campaign with a really stupid strategy that neglected battleground states she had untapped advantages in (WI, PA, MI) and instead focused on flipping others she didn't actually need (like AZ). She let overconfidence in seeing how rotten Trump was cloud her judgment. oh i agree. i voted bernie last time as i did not care for her. my point was cr said something that was not true. that is the only reason i posted this. but looking back i do believe we would have been better off with her than trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 7,793 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, homersapien said: And I am not sure what it says about you, that you disagree with our "best sensible option"? It says I do not like the idea of "mail in" but understand given our circumstances. Nothing more and nothing less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialCircle 570 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, aubiefifty said: you are not very smart are you? it was in fact hacked. listen to some real news............. washingtonpost.com How the Russians hacked the DNC and passed its emails to WikiLeaks Ellen Nakashima 8-10 minutes On a late July day in 2016, Donald Trump, the GOP nominee for president, stood at a lectern in Florida, next to an American flag, and urged a U.S. adversary to become involved in the election campaign and find tens of thousands of emails wiped from the server of his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton. “Russia, if you’re listening,” he said at a news conference at one of his resorts, “I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing.” That same day, July 27, several Russian government hackers launched an attack against the email accounts of staffers in Clinton’s personal office, according to a sweeping indictment Friday by special counsel Robert S. Mueller III. At or around the same time, the hackers also targeted 76 email addresses used by the Clinton campaign, investigators said. The remarkable timing of the Russian attempt on Clinton’s servers is just one of the new details revealed in the indictment of 12 Russian military intelligence officers, who Mueller alleges hacked the email accounts and computers of Democratic officials and organizations in an audacious effort to influence the U.S. election. Although the broad outlines of the hacking and influence campaign have been widely reported, the indictment describes for the first time the identities, techniques and tactics of the operation to disrupt American democracy. It includes details on how the Russians, using an encrypted file with instructions, delivered their trove of hacked emails to WikiLeaks, the online anti-secrecy organization led by Julian Assange that became the main platform for the Russians to display their trove of hacked emails. The indictment also reflects an aggressive but somewhat inartful operation in which hackers used the same computer servers to launder money by using the online currency bitcoin as they did to lure their victims and to register sites they used for hacking. The hackers worked for the spy agency called the Main Intelligence Directorate of the General Staff, or GRU, the indictment said. They also allegedly targeted a state election board, identified by U.S. officials as Illinois. The Russians stole information about 500,000 voters, including names, addresses, partial Social Security numbers, dates of birth and driver’s license numbers, according to the indictment. “This is maybe the last major missing piece of Mueller’s mosaic of charges on Russian election interference,” said David Kris, who headed the Justice Department’s national security division during the Obama administration and now leads consulting firm Culper Partners. Russia’s Foreign Ministry rejected the indictment’s allegations as lacking evidence and described the indictment as a clear effort to derail Monday’s Helsinki summit, where President Trump is to meet Russian President Vladimir Putin. The new indictments follow earlier charges that Russian operators of social media accounts spread propaganda and false news stories during the 2016 campaign. Absent from Friday’s indictment are any allegations of conspiracy between Russian operatives and Americans, including members of the Trump campaign. “The single most remarkable thing is that the special counsel names and shames 12 GRU officers, goes into detail of its operation and does this at a moment when we are days away from the Helsinki summit,” said Thomas Rid, a strategic studies professor at Johns Hopkins University who was one of the first researchers in 2016 to identify Guccifer 2.0, an online identity created as part of the GRU operation. Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein said Friday that the indictment’s timing was dictated purely by the determination of prosecutors that the information was sufficient to present to a grand jury. While Russian hacking, especially for espionage purposes, is decades old, using digital tools to steal data and then release it to embarrass and stoke divisions — weaponizing information — was the innovation, one that U.S. spy agencies did not see coming until too late. Another Russian spy agency, the SVR, allegedly hacked the network of the Democratic National Committee in 2015. But it was the military units whose alleged interference Mueller singled out, and the SVR is not mentioned in the indictment. Two GRU teams in particular, Units 26165 and 74455, both located in Moscow, carried out most of the campaign, beginning in early 2016, according to the indictment. One of Unit 26165’s officers, Senior Lt. Aleksey Lukashev, used various online fake personas, including “Den Katenberg” and “Yuliana Martynova,” to craft “spearphishing” emails to trick Clinton campaign members, including Chairman John Podesta, into clicking on links that enabled the hackers to obtain the victims’ login and password credentials, the indictment said. Another unit mate, Capt. Nikolay Kozachek, allegedly crafted the X-Agent malware used to hack the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and DNC networks in April 2016. Both were among those indicted. Unit 74455, also known as the Main Center for Special Technology, engineered the release of the stolen documents through a website it created called DCLeaks and the online persona Guccifer 2.0, according to the indictment. The campaign began as early as March 2016, when Lukashev crafted and sent a spearphish email to Podesta that was designed to look like a security notification from Google, the indictment stated. The spoof email instructed the user to change his password by clicking on a link. Podesta’s assistant, following the instructions of a security technician, dutifully complied, according to people familiar with the incident. Emails hacked from Podesta’s account would be released on WikiLeaks in a steady steam later that year, ensuring that material embarrassing to Clinton’s campaign would continue on a daily basis to deflect from her message in the weeks leading up to the election. The GRU allegedly broke into the networks of the DCCC in April 2016, by spearphishing an employee. The hackers installed keystroke loggers, which let them see what the employees were typing, and took images of employees’ computer screens, according to the indictment. The DCCC served as the hackers’ gateway to the DNC. Armed with the credentials of a DCCC contractor authorized to gain access to the DNC network, the GRU infiltrated the national committee, eventually gaining access to 33 computers, according to the indictment. Once inside the DCCC and DNC computers, the hackers searched for keywords related to the 2016 election, prosecutors allege. In mid-April 2016, they searched one DCCC computer for terms including “hillary,” “cruz” and “trump,” the indictment states. The hackers also copied particular DCCC folders, including one labeled “Benghazi Investigations.” And they “targeted” computers that contained information about opposition research and “field operation plans” for the 2016 election. The hackers used computer network infrastructure that they leased inside the United States, including in Arizona and Illinois, to move files from the targeted computers. On June 22, the indictment stated, WikiLeaks sent a private message to Guccifer 2.0 asking to have access to the material, saying “it will have a much higher impact” on its site. The GRU made repeated attempts to transfer the stolen DNC emails to WikiLeaks beginning in late June 2016. On July 14, the Russians got an email to WikiLeaks with an attachment titled “wk dnc link1.txt.gpg.” The attachment contained an encrypted file with instructions on accessing an online archive of hacked DNC documents, the indictment said. On July 18, WikiLeaks confirmed it had “the 1Gb or so archive” and would release the material “this week,” according to the indictment. On July 22, three days before the Democratic National Convention opened, WikiLeaks put up the DNC email archive of more than 20,000 emails and other documents hacked by the GRU, the indictment said. Anton Troianovski in Berlin contributed to this report. You have yet to post one single shred of evidence that Russians hacked the DNC network......none. The reason there is no evidence is that the DNC refused to allow the FBI to look at it. What is believed and alleged by some or many may or may not be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialCircle 570 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, homersapien said: But mail in factually has already lead to significant problems. Here is one of many examples. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/us/politics/wisconsin-election-absentee-coronavirus.amp.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj3jordan 2,051 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, aubiefifty said: you are not very smart are you? it was in fact hacked. listen to some real news............. washingtonpost.com How the Russians hacked the DNC and passed its emails to WikiLeaks Ellen Nakashima 8-10 minutes On a late July day in 2016, Donald Trump, the GOP nominee for president, stood at a lectern in Florida, next to an American flag, and urged a U.S. adversary to become involved in the election campaign and find tens of thousands of emails wiped from the server of his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton. “Russia, if you’re listening,” he said at a news conference at one of his resorts, “I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing.” That same day, July 27, several Russian government hackers launched an attack against the email accounts of staffers in Clinton’s personal office, according to a sweeping indictment Friday by special counsel Robert S. Mueller III. At or around the same time, the hackers also targeted 76 email addresses used by the Clinton campaign, investigators said. The remarkable timing of the Russian attempt on Clinton’s servers is just one of the new details revealed in the indictment of 12 Russian military intelligence officers, who Mueller alleges hacked the email accounts and computers of Democratic officials and organizations in an audacious effort to influence the U.S. election. Although the broad outlines of the hacking and influence campaign have been widely reported, the indictment describes for the first time the identities, techniques and tactics of the operation to disrupt American democracy. It includes details on how the Russians, using an encrypted file with instructions, delivered their trove of hacked emails to WikiLeaks, the online anti-secrecy organization led by Julian Assange that became the main platform for the Russians to display their trove of hacked emails. The indictment also reflects an aggressive but somewhat inartful operation in which hackers used the same computer servers to launder money by using the online currency bitcoin as they did to lure their victims and to register sites they used for hacking. The hackers worked for the spy agency called the Main Intelligence Directorate of the General Staff, or GRU, the indictment said. They also allegedly targeted a state election board, identified by U.S. officials as Illinois. The Russians stole information about 500,000 voters, including names, addresses, partial Social Security numbers, dates of birth and driver’s license numbers, according to the indictment. “This is maybe the last major missing piece of Mueller’s mosaic of charges on Russian election interference,” said David Kris, who headed the Justice Department’s national security division during the Obama administration and now leads consulting firm Culper Partners. Russia’s Foreign Ministry rejected the indictment’s allegations as lacking evidence and described the indictment as a clear effort to derail Monday’s Helsinki summit, where President Trump is to meet Russian President Vladimir Putin. The new indictments follow earlier charges that Russian operators of social media accounts spread propaganda and false news stories during the 2016 campaign. Absent from Friday’s indictment are any allegations of conspiracy between Russian operatives and Americans, including members of the Trump campaign. “The single most remarkable thing is that the special counsel names and shames 12 GRU officers, goes into detail of its operation and does this at a moment when we are days away from the Helsinki summit,” said Thomas Rid, a strategic studies professor at Johns Hopkins University who was one of the first researchers in 2016 to identify Guccifer 2.0, an online identity created as part of the GRU operation. Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein said Friday that the indictment’s timing was dictated purely by the determination of prosecutors that the information was sufficient to present to a grand jury. While Russian hacking, especially for espionage purposes, is decades old, using digital tools to steal data and then release it to embarrass and stoke divisions — weaponizing information — was the innovation, one that U.S. spy agencies did not see coming until too late. Another Russian spy agency, the SVR, allegedly hacked the network of the Democratic National Committee in 2015. But it was the military units whose alleged interference Mueller singled out, and the SVR is not mentioned in the indictment. Two GRU teams in particular, Units 26165 and 74455, both located in Moscow, carried out most of the campaign, beginning in early 2016, according to the indictment. One of Unit 26165’s officers, Senior Lt. Aleksey Lukashev, used various online fake personas, including “Den Katenberg” and “Yuliana Martynova,” to craft “spearphishing” emails to trick Clinton campaign members, including Chairman John Podesta, into clicking on links that enabled the hackers to obtain the victims’ login and password credentials, the indictment said. Another unit mate, Capt. Nikolay Kozachek, allegedly crafted the X-Agent malware used to hack the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and DNC networks in April 2016. Both were among those indicted. Unit 74455, also known as the Main Center for Special Technology, engineered the release of the stolen documents through a website it created called DCLeaks and the online persona Guccifer 2.0, according to the indictment. The campaign began as early as March 2016, when Lukashev crafted and sent a spearphish email to Podesta that was designed to look like a security notification from Google, the indictment stated. The spoof email instructed the user to change his password by clicking on a link. Podesta’s assistant, following the instructions of a security technician, dutifully complied, according to people familiar with the incident. Emails hacked from Podesta’s account would be released on WikiLeaks in a steady steam later that year, ensuring that material embarrassing to Clinton’s campaign would continue on a daily basis to deflect from her message in the weeks leading up to the election. The GRU allegedly broke into the networks of the DCCC in April 2016, by spearphishing an employee. The hackers installed keystroke loggers, which let them see what the employees were typing, and took images of employees’ computer screens, according to the indictment. The DCCC served as the hackers’ gateway to the DNC. Armed with the credentials of a DCCC contractor authorized to gain access to the DNC network, the GRU infiltrated the national committee, eventually gaining access to 33 computers, according to the indictment. Once inside the DCCC and DNC computers, the hackers searched for keywords related to the 2016 election, prosecutors allege. In mid-April 2016, they searched one DCCC computer for terms including “hillary,” “cruz” and “trump,” the indictment states. The hackers also copied particular DCCC folders, including one labeled “Benghazi Investigations.” And they “targeted” computers that contained information about opposition research and “field operation plans” for the 2016 election. The hackers used computer network infrastructure that they leased inside the United States, including in Arizona and Illinois, to move files from the targeted computers. On June 22, the indictment stated, WikiLeaks sent a private message to Guccifer 2.0 asking to have access to the material, saying “it will have a much higher impact” on its site. The GRU made repeated attempts to transfer the stolen DNC emails to WikiLeaks beginning in late June 2016. On July 14, the Russians got an email to WikiLeaks with an attachment titled “wk dnc link1.txt.gpg.” The attachment contained an encrypted file with instructions on accessing an online archive of hacked DNC documents, the indictment said. On July 18, WikiLeaks confirmed it had “the 1Gb or so archive” and would release the material “this week,” according to the indictment. On July 22, three days before the Democratic National Convention opened, WikiLeaks put up the DNC email archive of more than 20,000 emails and other documents hacked by the GRU, the indictment said. Anton Troianovski in Berlin contributed to this report. Sorry fitty I fell asleep reading that. What about the download speed issue? The download speed suggested it was an inside job because it was too fast to have occurred from an outside connection. Was this addressed in the previous tome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McLoofus 35,182 Posted July 31, 2020 Author Share Posted July 31, 2020 14 minutes ago, SocialCircle said: But mail in factually has already lead to significant problems. Here is one of many examples. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/us/politics/wisconsin-election-absentee-coronavirus.amp.html You've really got to try harder if you want to convince people of your viewpoint instead of just making yourself look like a clown. Quote Cracks in Wisconsin’s vote-by-mail operation are now emerging after the state’s scramble to expand that effort on the fly for voters who feared going to the polls in Tuesday’s elections. The takeaways — that the election network and the Postal Service were pushed to the brink of their capabilities, and that mistakes were clearly made — are instructive for other states if they choose to broaden vote-by-mail methods without sufficient time, money and planning. Remember, it was the Wisconsin legislature that- against the advice of everyone, just like the dumbass redneck governor of your virus-wracked state- insisted on pushing forward with the primaries instead of postponing. This is exactly why trump is throttling USPS's capabilities right now. Jesus. For somebody who claims to pay attention to what he does and not what he says, suffice it to say this isn't a good look for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialCircle 570 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 5 hours ago, McLoofus said: You've really got to try harder if you want to convince people of your viewpoint instead of just making yourself look like a clown. Remember, it was the Wisconsin legislature that- against the advice of everyone, just like the dumbass redneck governor of your virus-wracked state- insisted on pushing forward with the primaries instead of postponing. This is exactly why trump is throttling USPS's capabilities right now. Jesus. For somebody who claims to pay attention to what he does and not what he says, suffice it to say this isn't a good look for you. Thanks for making my point that mail in has had significant issues. Our postal service has been an issue for many years now and it continues. I can assure you it is not just a WI issue. I can personally attest it has long been an issue in GA and in IL. I like my look just fine. However, a mirror might do you well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToraGirl 5,498 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 21 hours ago, TitanTiger said: I don't know. But why does it matter? The postal service has handled massive jumps in mailing every year during Christmas season - sending dozens to hundreds of Christmas cards out from households that maybe mail a handful of things the rest of the year, not to mention a huge uptick in packages. What evidence is there that they couldn't handle an uptick in mail in ballots? This isn't to dispute anything you've shared. But I promise I was floored to find mail BULGING OUT of all 4 curbside mailboxes at Winton Blount, 5 pm today...with curbside not until 7:30, line of cars behind me. I had 20 letters to mail and it took some muscle power to make them stay. Like all else, one more Covid19 workaround to decipher...and the stakes for either side are high...with all..even ICHY...surely in agreement that you don't want YOURS to be the one that flies away in the wind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToraGirl 5,498 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 21 hours ago, SaturdayGT said: I'm sorry if I sound like a conspiracy theorist or, stupid or whatever....I honestly do not feel mail in voting is safe from the corruption of politics. ..I'm just not going to be convinced. You don't have to be. Fear, wisdom...no matter the motive, your point is valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad_ATX 13,654 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, ToraGirl said: This isn't to dispute anything you've shared. But I promise I was floored to find mail BULGING OUT of all 4 curbside mailboxes at Winton Blount, 5 pm today...with curbside not until 7:30, line of cars behind me. I had 20 letters to mail and it took some muscle power to make them stay. Like all else, one more Covid19 workaround to decipher...and the stakes for either side are high...with all..even ICHY...surely in agreement that you don't want YOURS to be the one that flies away in the wind... So why not do it how a place like Washington acts? People are sent ballots well in advance. They can either mail them in, or, if they are worried about their vote getting lost in the mail, drop them in designated locations. The drop location is monitored constantly by poll station volunteers. The drop stations look like this and Washington has not had a problem with voter fraud using this method. On election night, there are even drive thru locations to speed it up for people so that everyone's vote can be submitted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,367 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 We are heading for a cluster **** in November. The irony is the purpose of this cluster **** is to choose our leaders who's duty is to prevent such a thing in our elections. Trump is handling this exactly the way he handled the pandemic: It's all about me, **** the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 11,367 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 Even Trump agrees: https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/31/trump-greatest-election-disaster-2020-389712 Trump predicts this year will bring the 'greatest election disaster in history' The president also reversed himself and said he wished the Nov. 3 election would be moved up. One of the POTUS's sacred responsibilities to ensure a peaceful transition of power. So if he see's a problem, what is he doing to prevent it??? We have 3 months to work with! What a disaster for the country this a**hole has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj3jordan 2,051 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 On 7/30/2020 at 11:25 AM, TitanTiger said: Want to wager a six pack of your beer of choice on it? I'm not a gambling man generally speaking, but I'll put a friendly $20 on the line that Biden wins in November. It'll probably tighten up some from where it is now, but Trump isn't winning. Given that Trump is 74 and Biden is 77, I'll put a stipulation in that the bet is off if either candidate dies. Does brain dead count?😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,419 Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 19 hours ago, aubiefifty said: you do realize the russians tried to hack hillarys puters and give her emails to the gop right? this is the truth.they hacked the dnc with more success. here ya go although i know i am wasting my time........... theatlantic.com The Coincidence at the Heart of the Russia Hacking Scandal David A. Graham 7-9 minutes A new indictment charges that Russians tried to hack Hillary Clinton’s emails on July 27, 2016—the same day that Donald Trump publicly asked them to do so. July 13, 2018 5 more free articles this month more free articles Sign in Donald Trump holds a press conference on July 27, 2016.Carlo Allegri / Reuters The broad outlines of Friday’s indictment by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, charging 12 Russians with conspiracy, identity theft, and money laundering in connection with hacking during the 2016 presidential election, are not surprising. The hacking of the Democratic National Committee has been public knowledge since July 2016, and even then, the authorities publicly stated that the perpetrators were Russian government officials. Other details, such as the apparent involvement of WikiLeaks and Trump adviser Roger Stone, were also known. Some of the details, however, are striking. On July 27, 2016, at a Trump press conference in Florida, the candidate referred to 33,000 emails that an aide to Hillary Clinton had deleted from the former secretary of state’s personal email server. The DNC had recently announced the Russian intrusion, and Trump speculated that if Russia broke into the DNC, it would have accessed Clinton’s emails, too. “By the way, if they hacked, they probably have her 33,000 emails,” Trump said. “I hope they do. They probably have her 33,000 emails that she lost and deleted. Because you’d see some beauties there.” That was perhaps irresponsible speculation, but it wasn’t crazy. There were widespread questions about Clinton’s information security, and whether she might have compromised government secrets. But a few minutes later Trump said something much stranger. “I will tell you this: Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing,” he said. “I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.” The president was encouraging a foreign adversary to illegally hack into messages by a former secretary of state that might contain sensitive information, then release them publicly. Trump had good reason to believe that Russia was listening. The previous month, his son, Donald Jr.; son-in-law, Jared Kushner; and campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, had a meeting at Trump Tower with Russians who they believed were offering damaging information about Clinton. (The meeting wasn’t revealed to the public until 2017, and both the Russians and the Trump campaign officials say no dirt was exchanged.) Prior to the meeting, Trump Jr. had received an email stating that the meeting was “ part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.” Mueller’s indictment offers new evidence that Russia was listening—and acting on Trump’s request. The indictment charges 12 officers of the GRU, Russia’s military-intelligence agency, with hacking intended to interfere with the election. According to the document: The Conspirators spearphished individuals affiliated with the Clinton Campaign throughout the summer of 2016. For example, on or about July 27, 2016, the Conspirators 7 attempted after hours to spearphish for the first time email accounts at a domain hosted by a third-party provider and used by Clinton's personal office. At or around the same time, they also targeted seventy-six email addresses at the domain for the Clinton Campaign. In other words, a Russian attempt to penetrate Clinton’s server and her campaign came around the same time that Trump was publicly pleading with Russia to do just that. (Mueller alleges that there had been attempts to hack Clinton’s campaign since at least March 2016.) Trump’s hacking request was so egregious that it earned immediate pushback from other Republicans. Speaker Paul Ryan’s spokesman issued a statement saying, “Russia is a global menace led by a devious thug. Putin should stay out of this election.” Even Mike Pence, Trump’s own vice-presidential nominee, contradicted his running mate. “If it is Russia [that hacked the DNC] and they are interfering in our elections, I can assure you both parties and the United States government will ensure there are serious consequences,” he said. The indictment notes other examples of Russia releasing documents at times engineered to benefit the Trump campaign, though it doesn’t offer any evidence that Trump aides directed, or were aware of, those releases before they happened. The indictment notes that WikiLeaks released a tranche of emails allegedly stolen by Russia on July 22, 2016—just three days before the DNC, a convenient stroke of timing for Trump. Then, on October 7, 2016, WikiLeaks released another batch of hacked emails within hours of the revelation of the Access Hollywood tape, in which Trump is overheard boasting about sexually assaulting women. In a statement responding to the indictment on Friday, the White House did not condemn Russian interference in the election, instead striking a purely defensive note regarding the president’s 2016 victory. “Today’s charges include no allegations of knowing involvement by anyone on the campaign and no allegations that the alleged hacking affected the election result,” a spokeswoman said. “This is consistent with what we have been saying all along.” Trump is scheduled to meet one-on-one with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday in Helsinki, Finland. At the time of Trump’s comments in July 2016, it was easy to write them off as the latest sideshow from his circus of a campaign. Though he was at that moment enjoying a brief post-Republican National Convention bounce in the polls, Trump was widely expected to lose the election, so his comments, while dangerous, were of limited relevance. That was incorrect, of course: Trump defeated Clinton. And since then, the public has learned a great deal about both Russian interference in the election and ties between the Trump campaign and Russia. Mueller indicted a coterie of Russians on charges of interfering in the election via online trolling. The public learned of the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, despite multiple attempts by Trump Jr. to mislead about it. Former National-Security Adviser Michael Flynn pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with the Russian ambassador. Former Trump campaign foreign-policy adviser George Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with Russians during the election. Another foreign-policy aide, Carter Page, offered confusing and sometimes contradictory evidence about his travels to Russia and elsewhere. Mueller has produced evidence showing Manafort’s deep pre-campaign ties to the Kremlin. Kushner reportedly attempted to establish a back-channel to communicate with Russia. And so on. As I have argued, the question of whether these ties existed ought to be closed. There is extensive evidence to support that they did. Friday’s indictment adds an astonishing new wrinkle. Trump campaign officials may or may not have been colluding with a Russian influence operation behind closed doors, but Trump himself was making no attempt to hide his own desires, with cameras and reporters watching. The Russians heeded his call. We want to hear what you think about this article. Submit a letter to the editor or write to letters@theatlantic.com. David A. Graham is a staff writer at The Atlantic. July 13, 2018 is literally several lifetimes ago. There has been so much found out since then. Most of it directly contradictory to the article's points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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