Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 2, 2004 Share Posted September 2, 2004 You have posted several times that Mr. Kerry has apologized for slandering Vietnam Vets. Can you provide a link for that? Thank you If that is true, why are Kerry's top aides saying that Kerry has nothing to apologize for? I cannot find anything indicating that Kerry has apologized or proof that his aides are saying he does not need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted September 2, 2004 Share Posted September 2, 2004 Actually, I think this is what I said: Has Kerry gotten on national TV during primetime and begged forgiveness in between fits of uncontrolled sobbing? No. He has explained his feelings from that period many times and apologized, not for doing what he did but for some of the things he said. LINK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger12 46 Posted September 2, 2004 Share Posted September 2, 2004 I'm sorry, but I did not see any apology in there Al. He stated he regretted some of his word choices, but the man never apologized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 Al, I must agree with ranger, there are no apologies in that transcript. Is there some other evidence that he has apologized? I am not trying to catch you in anything. I am just trying to come to a reasoned and truthful conclusion about it. I did hear on the news this afternoon that some of Kerry's top aides were saying that he had not apologized and that he not only should not but he would not. When I heard that my first thought was, but Al said he had apologized. That is why I asked this question. SEN. KERRY: Where did all that dark hair go, Tim? That's a big question for me. You know, I thought a lot, for a long time, about that period of time, the things we said, and I think the word is a bad word. I think it's an inappropriate word. I mean, if you wanted to ask me have you ever made mistakes in your life, sure. I think some of the language that I used was a language that reflected an anger. It was honest, but it was in anger, it was a little bit excessive. MR. RUSSERT: You used the word "war criminals." SEN. KERRY: Well, let me just finish. Let me must finish. It was, I think, a reflection of the kind of times we found ourselves in and I don't like it when I hear it today. I don't like it, but I want you to notice that at the end, I wasn't talking about the soldiers and the soldiers' blame, and my great regret is, I hope no soldier--I mean, I think some soldiers were angry at me for that, and I understand that and I regret that, because I love them. But the words were honest but on the other hand, they were a little bit over the top. And I think that there were breaches of the Geneva Conventions. There were policies in place that were not acceptable according to the laws of warfare, and everybody knows that. I mean, books have chronicled that, so I'm not going to walk away from that. But I wish I had found a way to say it in a less abrasive way. MR. RUSSERT: But, Senator, when you testified before the Senate, you talked about some of the hearings you had observed at the winter soldiers meeting and you said that people had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and on and on. A lot of those stories have been discredited, and in hindsight was your testimony... SEN. KERRY: Actually, a lot of them have been documented. MR. RUSSERT: So you stand by that? SEN. KERRY: A lot of those stories have been documented. Have some been discredited? Sure, they have, Tim. The problem is that's not where the focus should have been. And, you know, when you're angry about something and you're young, you know, you're perfectly capable of not--I mean, if I had the kind of experience and time behind me that I have today, I'd have framed some of that differently. Needless to say, I'm proud that I stood up. I don't want anybody to think twice about it. I'm proud that I took the position that I took to oppose it. I think we saved lives, and I'm proud that I stood up at a time when it was important to stand up, but I'm not going to quibble, you know, 35 years later that I might not have phrased things more artfully at times. MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public. SEN. KERRY: They are. People can come and see them at headquarters and take a look at them. I'm not going to-- but I'll tell you this. It does appear he will not release all of his records. But he will let some see them if they come to his headquarters. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4772030/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 I took his words as those of a contrite person. I could be wrong. But, as I said before on the other thread: He has explained his feelings from that period many times and apologized, not for doing what he did but for some of the things he said. Did he actually say the words "I'm sorry?" No. Maybe I read more into it when I watched it on "Meet The Press." If I did, it's not the first time I've ever made a mistake and I'm sure it won't be the last and I'm a big enough man to admit it. I may have been wrong on this one, Tigermike, and I thank you for pointing that out because I might've mistakenly said it again in conversation with someone who was thinking about voting for him. That would be a poor reflection on Kerry, and me, if I were spreading lies or half-truths like that. But, just out of curiosity, let's pretend that you've just been hired to write this one speech for him, this apology speech. What would you have him say? MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public.SEN. KERRY: They are. People can come and see them at headquarters and take a look at them. I'm not going to-- but I'll tell you this. It does appear he will not release all of his records. But he will let some see them if they come to his headquarters. You realize, or maybe you don't, that "I'm not going to--" is an aborted sentence, don't you? He's not saying he's not going to let them look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 You realize, or maybe you don't, that "I'm not going to--" is an aborted sentence, don't you? He's not saying he's not going to let them look. You are correct Al he is not saying they cannot look at what ever records he has chosen to have available at his headquarters. But it sure sounds as if he is saying, I'm not going to sign a full release of all military records that are not actually "in" my service record. Am I wrong in thinking that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 You realize, or maybe you don't, that "I'm not going to--" is an aborted sentence, don't you? He's not saying he's not going to let them look. You are correct Al he is not saying they cannot look at what ever records he has chosen to have available at his headquarters. But it sure sounds as if he is saying, I'm not going to sign a full release of all military records that are not actually "in" my service record. Am I wrong in thinking that? I think you are. He was starting to say something and then stopped. Maybe he was going to say "I'm not going to quibble over this" or "I'm not going to put my personal medical files on the internet." Look at the entire dialogue: MR. RUSSERT: The Boston Globe reports that your commanding officer, Lieutenant Commander Grant Hibberd has suggested that you perhaps didn't earn your first Purple Heart and question whether you should have left Vietnam after six months. In order to deal with those kinds of issues, when I asked President Bush about his service in the Texas Guard, he agreed to release all his military records, health records, everything. Would you agree to release all your military records?SEN. KERRY: I have. I've shown them--they're available to you to come and look at. I think that's a very unfair characterization by that person. I mean, politics is politics. The medical records show that I had shrapnel removed from my arm. We were in combat. We were in a very, very--probably one of the most frightening--if you ask anybody who was with me, the two guys who were with me, was probably the most frightening night that they had that they were in Vietnam and we're... MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public. SEN. KERRY: They are. People can come and see them at headquarters and take a look at them. I'm not going to--but I'll tell you this. I'm proud of my service. I'm proud of what we did. I know what happened. And the Navy 35 years ago made a decision and it's the Navy's decision and I think it was the right decision. Russert asked him twice about releasing ALL of his records and twice he was told they were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public..They are.........I'm not going to--but I'll tell you this. .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 He was starting to say something and then stopped. Evidently, you believe it must've been something sinister and I believe that it wasn't. The transcript supports the likelihood that there was nothing sinister about it since he was asked twice about making his records public and twice he said they were. I think you're grasping at straws on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 No Al, I don't think it was something sinister. I just think he was asked a question and answered it as honestly as he is ever likely to. There is the possibility he was thinking something else and was not going in that direction. You say you don't believe he was answering that way, but there is the possibility that he was, right? There is the possibility that he was really answering honestly? MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public.....I'm not going to--but I'll tell you this. .......... The transcript supports the likelihood that he was answering the question he was asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 No Al, I don't think it was something sinister. I just think he was asked a question and answered it as honestly as he is ever likely to. There is the possibility he was thinking something else and was not going in that direction. You say you don't believe he was answering that way, but there is the possibility that he was, right? There is the possibility that he was really answering honestly? MR. RUSSERT: But you'll make all your records public.....I'm not going to--but I'll tell you this. .......... The transcript supports the likelihood that he was answering the question he was asked. With creative editing you can make it say whatever you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermike 3,053 Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 You're so right Al, I don't know why I didn't see it sooner. From that one interview, I now realize that John Kerry has never flip flopped on any issue. He has never had two completely divergent opinions on nearly every imaginable subject. He has never voted against funding the CIA, FBI, DOD or any other agency whose sole purpose it is to protect the United States. He has never slandered US servicemen. But he has now apologized for doing so. Good Lord, John Kerry is Catholic, maybe he will be proclaimed Pope when Pope John Paul II dies. And I surely don't want Pope John Paul II to die any time soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,440 Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 I took his words as those of a contrite person. I could be wrong. But, as I said before on the other thread: Man, I and I get called a guy that mis-characterizes stuff! Contrite?.?.?.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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