Weegle777 78 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 I understand that a few here will not like this thread, but here goes... If I heard this correctly, and feel free to correct this if this factually incorrect, Auburn doesn't pull schollies, or "process" players to make room for players that might be better, as saban does in his program. I know that we will have the normal natural process of players leaving for some reason every year, but if they don't, those players remain on scholarship even if they underperform. Thereby taking a scholarship that could go to a better player. Saban, though vilified as a harsh and unfeeling bast*** by many, signs the maximum amount of recruits every year and processes the underperforming players out. Now: My question is, since Auburn essentially "guarantees" that a kid won't lose his ride unless he earns the three strikes that we have all heard about, could this have an adverse effect on accountability and the immediacy of giving 120% every day? And, if our players thought that if they underperformed that they would be replaced, and lose their ride, would there be a difference in performance? I'll hang up and listen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionheartkc 6,150 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombigbeetiger 223 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 I think it COULD be a factor, but I don't really know....I do know that there are some that need to be sent packing....except for Lawson, do you realize that our best player on defense is a true freshman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butthead 525 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 ...and, potentially, our two best players on offense are a RSF, SW, and true F, KJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. I see what you are saying, but could it be unintentional? What I mean is, could it be that there is a certain "comfort" level that these guys get without realizing it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger 8,869 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Why did our best players start off as 2nd and 3rd and in Barber's case 4th stringer to begin the season? That is alarming imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger 8,869 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. I see what you are saying, but could it be unintentional? What I mean is, could it be that there is a certain "comfort" level that these guys get without realizing it? Yes. Some just want to hang out and play video games and use their status on campus to chase girls. They are kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionheartkc 6,150 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Why did our best players start off as 2nd and 3rd and in Barber's case 4th stringer to begin the season? That is alarming imo Tells me that we have a serious deficiency when it comes to simulating actual game situations. Everyone who watched practice, coaches, alumni, talking heads, the lot of them saw a bunch of rock stars out there... then you turn on the lights and the shine faded away. I can only speculate as to how something like this can happen, but I'm sure Gus is now painfully aware that it did and is looking for a solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombigbeetiger 223 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Why did our best players start off as 2nd and 3rd and in Barber's case 4th stringer to begin the season? That is alarming imo yeah....that worries me......to be brutally honest, I did not want malzahn as head coach....then 2013 and I warmed up to him and thought that he might be the man...right now, I don't have a clue as to how I actually feel about him, but I do know that he sure ain't doing anything to make me keep that warm feeling....I am afraid that we will probably be looking for a coach after next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. I see what you are saying, but could it be unintentional? What I mean is, could it be that there is a certain "comfort" level that these guys get without realizing it? Yes. Some just want to hang out and play video games and use their status on campus to chase girls. They are kids. JMO but without pulling a scholly, the coaches can make life miserable for malingerers.....so I doubt that the guaranteed scholarship has much affect on effort. There's is a year round job and just watch them in the weight room and elsewhere ....and consider the peer pressure for guys who might not make the effort...on the field or in the classroom. Meahwhile, I trust the comment about the guys laying around, playing video games and chasing girls is just a joke....or perhaps just Tiger thinking back on his college days. As for me, i don't see any downside for giving the guys a bit of security. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuburnSpider 2 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 I seem to remember every season malzahn has been here it has taken him deep into the season to realize what he has. That has always baffled me. Seems to me a quality coach making the kind of bucks he is should be able to evaluate what he has and be ready by the start of the season to turn them loose. Even in 10 it took him until the LSU game to realize what Cam brought to the table. And that is ridiculous. 13 pretty much the same with the best RB in the SEC. Even Now he still doesn't realize just what Barber brings to the table. We should be riding him like a horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Share Posted October 27, 2015 The reason I ask is, because I wonder if this type of philosophy is detrimental to real world expectations. Saban's method is cutthroat, but it does reward real world work ethic. What do you guys think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 The reason I ask is, because I wonder if this type of philosophy is detrimental to real world expectations. Saban's method is cutthroat, but it does reward real world work ethic. What do you guys think? If you've checked the discussion on our defensive woes, you will see that our attrition rate is pretty bad ...for whatever reason. JMO but there is no reason to think that NS is any tougher than AU ....and of course we often hear the counter argument that he lets his players get away with all kind of stuff....so who knows.? Whatever it is, AU 's attrition rate has been pretty bad the past few years leaving us short-handed at key spots and causing us to be scouting for JUCOs to fill the openings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,386 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. I see what you are saying, but could it be unintentional? What I mean is, could it be that there is a certain "comfort" level that these guys get without realizing it? Yes. Some just want to hang out and play video games and use their status on campus to chase girls. They are kids. JMO but without pulling a scholly, the coaches can make life miserable for malingerers.....so I doubt that the guaranteed scholarship has much affect on effort. There's is a year round job and just watch them in the weight room and elsewhere ....and consider the peer pressure for guys who might not make the effort...on the field or in the classroom. Meahwhile, I trust the comment about the guys laying around, playing video games and chasing girls is just a joke....or perhaps just Tiger thinking back on his college days. As for me, i don't see any downside for giving the guys a bit of security. ^ This. But it did made me think of those Seinfeld episodes where George would take a job where they couldn't fire him and was willing to take whatever they dished out in trying to get rid of him. Its an interesting topic Weegs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 We need to process players ,and I hope we do once we get real depth. I want players competing in practice for the starting spot because they know the backups are just as good. And I want the players that think they are above the team to be processed off the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoundationEagle 637 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Well actually, we "advise" guys to transfer due to playing time issues which we see every year. The main difference seems to be that Saban shows them the door while we tend to help them look for somewhere else to land before leaving. I MUCH prefer our method to theirs. Just because some guys don't pan out doesn't mean you should treat them like yesterday's garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creed 1,858 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 I understand that a few here will not like this thread, but here goes... If I heard this correctly, and feel free to correct this if this factually incorrect, Auburn doesn't pull schollies, or "process" players to make room for players that might be better, as saban does in his program. I know that we will have the normal natural process of players leaving for some reason every year, but if they don't, those players remain on scholarship even if they underperform. Thereby taking a scholarship that could go to a better player. Saban, though vilified as a harsh and unfeeling bast*** by many, signs the maximum amount of recruits every year and processes the underperforming players out. Now: My question is, since Auburn essentially "guarantees" that a kid won't lose his ride unless he earns the three strikes that we have all heard about, could this have an adverse effect on accountability and the immediacy of giving 120% every day? And, if our players thought that if they underperformed that they would be replaced, and lose their ride, would there be a difference in performance? I'll hang up and listen... I'm not sure the NCAA's Academic Progress Rate (APR) and Athletic Scholarship limitation will allow a university to just process at will anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,386 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 I'm torn about it. Presumably, any kid who merits a scholarship offer in the first place has enough ability to at least practice and play on the scout team even if he never starts - which considering the work - is worth the scholarship IMO. So the question really becomes the space they are taking up, which could be given to a better player. How significant is this over the long haul? It would be interesting to see an analysis of Bama's system vs. ours to try to quantify the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixie1860 27 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Bored much? What a senseless, over discussed, and unnecessary thread. No offense...of course, but this horse has been dead for a minute. Plus, it was already beaten post mortem 6-7 times since. I expected better quite frankly, and all of you should be ashamed. Take a few laps... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionheartkc 6,150 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 JMO but there is no reason to think that NS is any tougher than AU ....and of course we often hear the counter argument that he lets his players get away with all kind of stuff....so who knows.? the difference between AU and ua is that Auburn lets players be less than perfect on the field, but is more stringent about off the field discipline than most schools. bama is zero tolerance on the field, but will cover their butt for any stupidity that they want to get into off the field. As an elite player, which would you prefer? As an alumni, which would you rather be your legacy? Thus why it's an uphill battle for Auburn to be a top program, but why I wouldn't want to be part of any other school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,386 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Bored much? What a senseless, over discussed, and unnecessary thread. No offense...of course, but this horse has been dead for a minute. Plus, it was already beaten post mortem 6-7 times since. I expected better quite frankly, and all of you should be ashamed. Take a few laps... Hey, I don't remember discussing it before. Course, I don't remember yesterday either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShocksMyBrain 9,863 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Bored much? What a senseless, over discussed, and unnecessary thread. No offense...of course, but this horse has been dead for a minute. Plus, it was already beaten post mortem 6-7 times since. I expected better quite frankly, and all of you should be ashamed. Take a few laps... What an unnecessary post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McLoofus 35,182 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Bored much? What a senseless, over discussed, and unnecessary thread. No offense...of course, but this horse has been dead for a minute. Plus, it was already beaten post mortem 6-7 times since. I expected better quite frankly, and all of you should be ashamed. Take a few laps... What an unnecessary post. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUIH1 1,515 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Well actually, we "advise" guys to transfer due to playing time issues which we see every year. The main difference seems to be that Saban shows them the door while we tend to help them look for somewhere else to land before leaving. I MUCH prefer our method to theirs. Just because some guys don't pan out doesn't mean you should treat them like yesterday's garbage. Agree totally. We do process in our own way as you stated and I also agree that I like our method better than Saban's. Now the question is, are we processing in our own way often or quickly enough? wde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger 8,869 Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Honestly, I can't think of any reason a player intentionally wouldn't give 100% if they actually want to go to the NFL, no matter what the situation. I've never heard a football player say, "I'm just here for the free education". College level football players want to play football. You could argue, and most likely be correct, that our policy keeps us from having the overall depth of talent other teams do, but I don't think it effects effort. I also don't think what you see on the field each week is a lack of effort. Lack of ability in some cases... probably. Lack of refined execution... most definitely. Lack of ability to process fast enough... that too. Lack of ability to keep it up for 10 straight minutes on the clock... yup. But lack of effort? Other than Duke phoning it in, I haven't seen it this year. I see what you are saying, but could it be unintentional? What I mean is, could it be that there is a certain "comfort" level that these guys get without realizing it? Yes. Some just want to hang out and play video games and use their status on campus to chase girls. They are kids. JMO but without pulling a scholly, the coaches can make life miserable for malingerers.....so I doubt that the guaranteed scholarship has much affect on effort. There's is a year round job and just watch them in the weight room and elsewhere ....and consider the peer pressure for guys who might not make the effort...on the field or in the classroom. Meahwhile, I trust the comment about the guys laying around, playing video games and chasing girls is just a joke....or perhaps just Tiger thinking back on his college days. As for me, i don't see any downside for giving the guys a bit of security. It was only a half joke. Although I never had the fortune of playing D1 sports I know plenty who have and I can tell you the other half of the joke is that it's unfortunately true. I'm not at all saying all players are like this because that is not nearly the case but there are some who are content being on a major team and the status that comes along with it. What I'm referring to is maybe best described by example. Tre Mason was often seen at the Gold's Gym at AU working out in 2012 as reported on here. He was going the extra mile to get himself ready for the NFL (who knows why he wasn't tired enough after the workout plan the staff gave him....ahem Chizik). On the other end of the spectrum we hear stories of players missing/skipping workouts. I remember it was posted on here a few years ago the LSU strength coach posted a sign on his office window saying "NFL Scouts, please do not inquire about the following players because they miss voluntary workouts: ___,___,____" or something to that effect (exact quote might be way off as it's been a while since I've seen it and can't seem to find it now on google -- I remember it though because Kwon Alexander was listed there and people were posting about how we were lucky that he chose LSU over AU haha) Some kids are just complacent because of all the hype they get from just reaching the level they are at when it seems like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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