Barnacle 9,064 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 1 hour ago, bigbird said: Give past greats the same coaching, strength programs, summer camps, private instructors, et. al. From pop Warner on and I bet be they would compete just as well as the "modern" athletes. I bet you're right. Here's a question (not specific to you Bird) - does your evaluation of players change based on whether the guy played pre or post integration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 15 minutes ago, Barnacle said: I bet you're right. Here's a question (not specific to you Bird) - does your evaluation of players change based on whether the guy played pre or post integration? Not sure how far you want to go back but professional sports were integrated more than 60 years ago.....and college sports outside the south about the same length of time. Could be that integration gave outstanding black athletes a better opportunity to become well known but not sure how you would change an evaluation. And for years the best black athletes from southern high schools became stars in the Big10 and Pac 12. The big loser in sports was probably the SEC. JMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnacle 9,064 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, AU64 said: Not sure how far you want to go back but professional sports were integrated more than 60 years ago.....and college sports outside the south about the same length of time. Could be that integration gave outstanding black athletes a better opportunity to become well known but not sure how you would change an evaluation. And for years the best black athletes from southern high schools became stars in the Big10 and Pac 12. The big loser in sports was probably the SEC. JMO Just take the SEC, for example. I think its reasonable to assume that there were players, even standout players on pre-integration teams that may have not been starters at their positions after integration. I agree with Bird's post that all other things being equal, if you were to take the best players 60 years ago and provided them with the same resources, nutrition, coaching, etc. that athletes receive today, that they would probably compete with today's athletes. But if we are talking about the SEC 60 years ago, then it's hard to say who were the "best" players, considering none of the teams were integrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cole256 17,084 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 3 hours ago, Gene Loblaw said: I’d take a healthy Cadillac Williams over Bo Jackson. Bo was basically a slightly bigger Corey Grant This is what he/she brings to the board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,051 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 On 5/28/2019 at 10:28 AM, augolf1716 said: Can't believe anyone thinks Nick is better then Randy Walls aka speedy So you're dissing Wade Watley? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAG 33,997 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 Did someone just compare Bo Jackson to Corey Grant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnacle 9,064 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 10 minutes ago, DAG said: Did someone just compare Bo Jackson to Corey Grant? They are basically the same person, didn't you know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McLoofus 35,182 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 7 minutes ago, DAG said: Did someone just compare Bo Jackson to Corey Grant? Dude is clowning but what sucks is that he/she is still gonna make people inadvertently dismiss Corey Grant, who is an absolute freak of nature. (He's just not supernatural like Bo.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AU64 10,122 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 4 hours ago, Barnacle said: Just take the SEC, for example. I think its reasonable to assume that there were players, even standout players on pre-integration teams that may have not been starters at their positions after integration. I agree with Bird's post that all other things being equal, if you were to take the best players 60 years ago and provided them with the same resources, nutrition, coaching, etc. that athletes receive today, that they would probably compete with today's athletes. But if we are talking about the SEC 60 years ago, then it's hard to say who were the "best" players, considering none of the teams were integrated. Guess you have to file that question the category of things you will never know. It as not just college that changed, it was High School football too....and who knows how that affected things.....combined schools, black and white kids no longer able to play when competition got tougher, and maybe quality of coaching for kids got better at the HS level...considering that 60 years ago black schools, facilities and probably coaches were often substandard. It's all changed......and maybe you can get one of those authors who writes alternative history novels to spin you up a yarn or two on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnacle 9,064 Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 9 minutes ago, AU64 said: Guess you have to file that question the category of things you will never know. It as not just college that changed, it was High School football too....and who knows how that affected things.....combined schools, black and white kids no longer able to play when competition got tougher, and maybe quality of coaching for kids got better at the HS level...considering that 60 years ago black schools, facilities and probably coaches were often substandard. It's all changed......and maybe you can get one of those authors who writes alternative history novels to spin you up a yarn or two on the subject. This helps illustrate what I was getting to, which was there are a myriad of factors which make it really difficult to compare players from different generations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted June 3, 2019 Share Posted June 3, 2019 On 5/29/2019 at 8:00 AM, bigbird said: Give past greats the same coaching, strength programs, summer camps, private instructors, et. al. From pop Warner on and I bet be they would compete just as well as the "modern" athletes. This is true and these resources that athletes receive today all have helped with the evolution of the bodies through the eras. Quite simply the coaches and players just have more information and resources. Athletes are faster, stronger and bigger today thanks to year around position specific and detail oriented workout plans, and I believe the coaches better understand the limits of what they want, and the effectiveness of their regimens. The good ole junction boys days workouts of water deprivation and constant calisthenics aren’t even in step with today’s military’s basic training regimens and they still want ‘em lean and mean. Just looking at our 1958 OL..:. Apparently Ken Rice was an all world offensive tackle for Auburn and he was 6’2 and around 240. He obviously wouldn’t make it as a tackle today. Seems he played both ways though so his fitness levels and body weight verses energy exertion had to be more efficient given his double duties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slammer1 409 Posted June 3, 2019 Share Posted June 3, 2019 9 hours ago, aujeff11 said: This is true and these resources that athletes receive today all have helped with the evolution of the bodies through the eras. Quite simply the coaches and players just have more information and resources. Athletes are faster, stronger and bigger today thanks to year around position specific and detail oriented workout plans, and I believe the coaches better understand the limits of what they want, and the effectiveness of their regimens. The good ole junction boys days workouts of water deprivation and constant calisthenics aren’t even in step with today’s military’s basic training regimens and they still want ‘em lean and mean. Just looking at our 1958 OL..:. Apparently Ken Rice was an all world offensive tackle for Auburn and he was 6’2 and around 240. He obviously wouldn’t make it as a tackle today. Seems he played both ways though so his fitness levels and body weight verses energy exertion had to be more efficient given his double duties. Ken Rice would have been just fine. He also was our heavyweight wrestler on our wrestling team back when AU had a wrestling team. He lives in my neck of the woods and I get to see him on occasions, mainly at alumni meetings. Ken lost his wife not too long ago as I did also. Just another thing we had in common. Great guy and a great athlete. WDE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cole256 17,084 Posted June 3, 2019 Share Posted June 3, 2019 4 hours ago, Slammer1 said: Ken Rice would have been just fine. He also was our heavyweight wrestler on our wrestling team back when AU had a wrestling team. He lives in my neck of the woods and I get to see him on occasions, mainly at alumni meetings. Ken lost his wife not too long ago as I did also. Just another thing we had in common. Great guy and a great athlete. WDE No he wouldn't be just fine as a tackle at 240 he can be the bestest guy in the world but that doesn't mean anything as far as playing tackle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Loblaw 636 Posted June 3, 2019 Share Posted June 3, 2019 29 minutes ago, cole256 said: No he wouldn't be just fine as a tackle at 240 he can be the bestest guy in the world but that doesn't mean anything as far as playing tackle Might wanna just stick to basketball little fella. You’re just a wee teency bit out of your element on the big boy football forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aujeff11 6,243 Posted June 3, 2019 Share Posted June 3, 2019 1 hour ago, Gene Loblaw said: Might wanna just stick to basketball little fella. You’re just a wee teency bit out of your element on the big boy football forum Cole did a number on you lil bro. 1 hour ago, cole256 said: No he wouldn't be just fine as a tackle at 240 he can be the bestest guy in the world but that doesn't mean anything as far as playing tackle Exactly. He could maybe be an all American center, maybe guard, but even then that’s still small for your average guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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