Cleveland officer Michael Brelo found not guilty in fatal shooting of two people

[AUUSN 823]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

This statement reflects your level of intelligence.

[AUDub 11,148]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

[alexava 6,973]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

[AUDub 11,148]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

No. It does not.

[Weegle777 78]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

This statement reflects your level of intelligence.

Coming from you, that means very little.

[AUDub 11,148]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

This statement reflects your level of intelligence.

Coming from you, that means very little.

Fight me IRL.

[AUUSN 823]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

This statement reflects your level of intelligence.

Coming from you, that means very little.

Fight me IRL.

[JoeBags7277 734]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

The chances are unbelievably high that they will come home at night. Commercial fishermen, pilots, truck drivers, and garbagemen all have a higher on the job fatality rate than police officers, and that's without taking into account the fact that heart attacks and car accidents take far more police lives than murders- yet none of those professions attempt to claim some sort of ironclad defense against cricisims due to the danger of their jobs. It has never been safer to be a police officer, and its about time that mentality was tossed into the nearest dustbin. It is costing too many lives by making too many cops apply a lethal mentality to a non-lethal scenario.

[cooltigger21 0]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

The chances are unbelievably high that they will come home at night. Commercial fishermen, pilots, truck drivers, and garbagemen all have a higher on the job fatality rate than police officers, and that's without taking into account the fact that heart attacks and car accidents take far more police lives than murders- yet none of those professions attempt to claim some sort of ironclad defense against cricisims due to the danger of their jobs. It has never been safer to be a police officer, and its about time that mentality was tossed into the nearest dustbin. It is costing too many lives by making too many cops apply a lethal mentality to a non-lethal scenario.

There is a danger in carrying this too far. The fact that the attacks doubled in one year is troubling to say the least. Regardless of how low the rate was, when it jumps that much in one year is cause for concern. This case is bad but we're lumping all cops in with these. Between the media and this administration, one would think that what happened here is rampant and normal everyday happenstance.

[alexava 6,973]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

No. It does not.

it does if i am on the jury. actions have consequences. i forgot who said it first but the phrase "don't start nothing, won't be nothing" comes into play.

[AUDub 11,148]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

No. It does not.

it does if i am on the jury. actions have consequences.

Good to know you're willing to kill a defeated opponent. Reflects really well on you.

[alexava 6,973]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

No. It does not.

it does if i am on the jury. actions have consequences.

Good to know you're willing to kill a defeated opponent. Reflects really well on you.

not willing, i am not willing to kill anyone but some people can't just turn off the switch. that is why i ask who turned it on. and i edited my previous post. when you start a fight bad things can happen. the guy who didnt start it don't deserve those bad things.

[homersapien 11,373]

So, as far as we know, this guy is going to resume his job as a cop?

That's just not right.

Speaking from my own experience, he's not quite out of the woods yet, not as far as employment goes. Its likely that the exectuors of the estates will file a civil suit. Settlement terms or plaintiff demands could very well include termination of Mr. Brelo.

If a cop jumps on the hood of a car and empties his gun at the unarmed occupants he should get fired at the very least.

[homersapien 11,373]

I've defended cops up and down and sideways and will continue to do so 99% of the time. This was just too much even for me. Under the law, the judge was probably correct in finding him not guilty of voluntary manslaughter but there was no excuse for his reaction and behavior. Same goes for everyone involved.

Well, it's just my opinion, but I suspect they are bringing a little too much of a military mind-set to the job.

And you don't have to be ex-military to do that.

You could be right. I don't know what the deal is with some of these people.

A very knowledgeable friend of mine asserts that a great deal of what we're seeing is the result of veterans from the War on Terror coming home and entering law enforcement, and of course police work is a logical enough career choice for an ex military guy. Somehow, its just never drilled into their heads that their new domestic roles are fundamentally different from the old. As Madison said, the means of defense against foreign danger have been always the instruments of tyranny at home.

Well it may be partially true but we've always had ex military go into police work. I think partially we're not doing enough to screen out the yahoos and others that don't fully understand what being a police officer means. More thorough psychological testing should be a part of the application and screening process. This guy did talk about his Marine training kicking in talking about why he got up on the hood of the car so there is an element of that in there.

I know cops that have gone into the military and soldiers that have gone into law enforcement. Been happening forever, so this is not a new phenomenon. I do think more screening/psychological testing would be of benefit.

Never been a Marine, but can't imagine jumping on a hood firing 15 shots as part of that training. I could be wrong and would certainly like for one of current soldiers to elaborate if possible.

The way I took it was the training to "kill the enemy took" over. The car just happened to be there.

[homersapien 11,373]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

Your belly button is showing again.

[homersapien 11,373]

So you are prepared to intelligently discuss the effects a 22 mile chase at speeds of 120 mph has on the body or psyche?

I am. Just because they were jacked up doesn't excuse the application of excessive deadly force or the lack of consequences in criminal court. I don't accept the premise that their mental state excuses the crime. And as CT said, they're trained for just such a situation.

For example, if you get into a fight and end up accidentally killing your opposite by say, stomping on their throats after you've knocked them cold in a fit of adrenaline, should the crime be excused?

depends on who initiated it.

No. It does not.

it does if i am on the jury. actions have consequences. i forgot who said it first but the phrase "don't start nothing, won't be nothing" comes into play.

You are obviously not jury worthy.

[homersapien 11,373]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

I'll bet you wouldn't have trouble passing judgment had your 16-year old son been the one running from the cops.

[autigeremt 6,628]

"Russell and Williams were killed Nov. 29, 2012, after they led 62 police vehicles on a chase across Cleveland."

"Comply or die"

it is possible. You never know when a backfire might incite gun fire from the 62 units you are eluding.

"Keep your car in working order or die."

Sounds like something the EPA might be doing in the future. lol

[autigeremt 6,628]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

I'll bet you wouldn't have trouble passing judgment had your 16-year old son been the one running from the cops.

Perspective is something that cannot be transcribed. It has to be lived.

[homersapien 11,373]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

Dead on. And that's what kills me about these people. They want to sit in their comfy wittle chairs and pass judgment on guys who don't know if they will come home to their families. These people are the ones who would probably cower in the corner and hide behind their wives if danger came calling. It's easy to pass judgment when you are typing on a computer going on only the stories you read on the internet.

I'll bet you wouldn't have trouble passing judgment had your 16-year old son been the one running from the cops.

Perspective is something that cannot be transcribed. It has to be lived.

Apparently it's not something that is easily imagined.

[AUFAN78 3,897]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are)

After a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph, would you jump on the hood of your son or daughter's car and fire 15 rounds into the vehicle?

First, I wasn't aware the deceased were his son and/or daughter? Secondly, my point was if you've not experienced this scenario how can you arrive at confident conclusion with regards to your actions? You simply can't and any statement indicating otherwise would be deemed ignorant.

When you think of the people you swore to protect as animals, you'll treat them as such.

I don't get that mindset. Who thinks of citizens as animals? I suppose there are those that do, but I struggle with the concept.

[AUDub 11,148]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are)

After a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph, would you jump on the hood of your son or daughter's car and fire 15 rounds into the vehicle?

First, I wasn't aware the deceased were his son and/or daughter? Secondly, my point was if you've not experienced this scenario how can you arrive at confident conclusion with regards to your actions? You simply can't and any statement indicating otherwise would be deemed ignorant.

When you think of the people you swore to protect as animals, you'll treat them as such.

I don't get that mindset. Who thinks of citizens as animals? I suppose there are those that do, but I struggle with the concept.

Plenty of people, including positions of power like officers of the law.

"One of you is going to have to hang for this" and then, turning to Brandley, added, "Since you’re the n****r, you're elected.'

[cooltigger21 0]

Personally I wish that all cops were like Mick Belker from Hill Street Blues, one of my all time favorite characters.

[AUFAN78 3,897]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are)

After a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph, would you jump on the hood of your son or daughter's car and fire 15 rounds into the vehicle?

First, I wasn't aware the deceased were his son and/or daughter? Secondly, my point was if you've not experienced this scenario how can you arrive at confident conclusion with regards to your actions? You simply can't and any statement indicating otherwise would be deemed ignorant.

When you think of the people you swore to protect as animals, you'll treat them as such.

I don't get that mindset. Who thinks of citizens as animals? I suppose there are those that do, but I struggle with the concept.

Plenty of people, including positions of power like officers of the law.

"One of you is going to have to hang for this" and then, turning to Brandley, added, "Since you’re the n****r, you're elected.'

I think, hope you are wrong. I also think you've imbibed.

[AUUSN 823]

How many of you guys that are vilifying these cops, are actually cops?

Is this supposed to mean anything? Shut down our argument?

He's angling for the Courtier's Reply.

You'll get used to this sort of thing if you argue with Weegs long enough.

Courtier's Reply ;D/> . Good one Ben. Or is it?

I would add that none of us likely know how we'd react after a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph. We can laugh or scoff at the notion that we'd not react in a like manor to Brelo, but that would be an ignorant statement or thought unless we've had that real life experience. So, in some respects, Weegs statement rings true. Hate that for you so quick to judge types. (you know who you are) ;)/>

After a 22 mile chase at speeds in excess of 120 mph, would you jump on the hood of your son or daughter's car and fire 15 rounds into the vehicle?

First, I wasn't aware the deceased were his son and/or daughter? Secondly, my point was if you've not experienced this scenario how can you arrive at confident conclusion with regards to your actions? You simply can't and any statement indicating otherwise would be deemed ignorant.

When you think of the people you swore to protect as animals, you'll treat them as such.

I don't get that mindset. Who thinks of citizens as animals? I suppose there are those that do, but I struggle with the concept.

When you think of the people you have sworn to protect as a member of your family, you'll treat them as such. That includes NOT jumping on the hood and emptying your service weapon into the vehicle. You wouldn't put them in a van handcuffed and unrestrained. You wouldn't shoot them in the back. You wouldn't choke them to death.

What you would do is act like this cop: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/watch-ohio-officer-refuses-shoot-charging-murder-suspect-article-1.2190739