There is something fundamentally off about this administration

[AURaptor 1,128]

Can anyone explain to me why withholding the name of the group the shooter pledged allegiance to will, in any way , cause harm to the victim's families, or how it will cause anyone to relive the horror or tragedy ?

I'll hang up and listen.

[japantiger 4,052]

The first step in solving a problem is an accurate understanding of that problem. Refusing to admit facts, redacting parts of statements and so forth doesn't help solve any problem, they make it harder to solve by hiding factors involved with it.

This reminds me of Susan Rice being sent out to lie to the press the morning after the Benghazi attacks. They already knew the American-made video had nothing to do with it but Rice was given her cheat sheets and sent out to run with the lie. This administration first denies anything that doesn't fit into their pipe dreams, then when crushed with facts goes to some vague Plan B.

It's obvious...the actual event that took place does not comport with Obama's world view; therefore, the facts must be changed. This is what happened in Benghazi....the administration doesn't trust the American people to come to the same conclusion they have come to...therefore, tell them a story you think will lead them to the same place the admin is. This is beyond Orwellian....it's actually frightening that we have people in our government that have so little respect for us they would attempt to do something like this....like releasing this info would cause the bad guys to want to kill us more...or would cause people to draw the wrong conclusions about what actually happened or is happening.

[homersapien 11,513]

"Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

Here is your " plainly stated" quote.

It is quite plain and there is no comparison to WW2 and the asymmetric warfare we're experiencing now. First, NO Japanese Americans were shooting up their wok places or gay bars in the name of religion or for any other reason for that matter but, carry on believing what you will. Its plain to me he will not criticize or condemn a cult of supremacist killers.

You are making Alexva's point: Just look at what we did to Japanese Americans without our suffering armed terrorist attacks from them!

When this country acts out of fear, we often regret and feel ashamed over it later.

No I'm not making his point. The Japanese Americans were unnecessarily incarcerated. They didn't do anything to justify it. The Islamists, on the other hand, are supremacist murderers and looking the other way because we mistreated Japanese Americans makes no sense whatsoever. Its, like I said, a false comparison.

No it's not a false comparison at all. Just look at what Trump has been saying. And you agree with him.

I haven't seen or listened to anything Trump has said. He's not my muse but it is a false comparison relative to the topic of this thread.

BS. Don't lie and say you don't know that Trump has been advocating general restrictions on Muslim immigrants and monitoring american Muslims. You couldn't avoid that if you wanted to.

Its not a lie pajama boy. I'm fed up with the presidential politics between 2 pukes. Its amazing a country as great as America cant find anybody to run for president than the 2 scumbags who won their respective party's nomination. As far as putting a pause on Muslim immigration - no, I don't have a problem with that, especially given the fact that the terror groups have publicly stated they're going to be sending terrorists in these migrations.

Sorry, but if you are claiming you don't know what Trump has been advocating, you wouldn't be on this forum. You also wouldn't watch TV, listen to the radio, read papers and magazines or ever go on the internet.

You are lying.

[homersapien 11,513]

There comes a point of diminishing returns when playing nice and trying not to hurt feelings by calling the killers who they are.

Says the guy who refuses to deny all Muslims are guilty... :-\/>

And that's even without Obama egging you on.

Non sequitur

Wrong.

It wasn't a conclusion, which is a requirement for a non sequitur. It was an observation concerning your bias.

You shouldn't just pick up something I have used (correctly) without understanding what it means.

[homersapien 11,513]

Well, just for the record, it looks like the redaction thing was initiated by the FBI. I suppose that qualifies as the "administration".

http://www.politico....anscript-224556

The FBI reversed itself and publicly issued a complete transcript of a 911 call from the Orlando nightclub shooter Monday afternoon after coming under withering criticism from House Speaker Paul Ryan and other Republicans for deleting references to the Islamic State group as well as the group's leader, Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi.

A version of the text of the 50-second call between an Orlando 911 dispatcher and shooter Omar Mateen disclosed Monday morning, included his claim of responsibility for the shooting, but was edited to remove Mateen's mention of ISIL and of Al-Baghdadi.

The FBI said the redactions were intended to limit any publicity benefit for ISIL, but House Speaker Paul Ryan sharply rejected that rationale and called on President Barack Obama to reverse the decision.

"Selectively editing this transcript is preposterous. We know the shooter was a radical Islamist extremist inspired by ISIS. We also know he intentionally targeted the LGBT community," Ryan said. "The administration should release the full, unredacted transcript so the public is clear-eyed about who did this, and why.”

Hours later, the FBI did just that, saying that the deletions had "caused an unnecessary distraction.".....

[japantiger 4,052]

Well, just for the record, it looks like the redaction thing was initiated by the FBI. I suppose that qualifies as the "administration".

http://www.politico....anscript-224556

The FBI reversed itself and publicly issued a complete transcript of a 911 call from the Orlando nightclub shooter Monday afternoon after coming under withering criticism from House Speaker Paul Ryan and other Republicans for deleting references to the Islamic State group as well as the group's leader, Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi.

A version of the text of the 50-second call between an Orlando 911 dispatcher and shooter Omar Mateen disclosed Monday morning, included his claim of responsibility for the shooting, but was edited to remove Mateen's mention of ISIL and of Al-Baghdadi.

The FBI said the redactions were intended to limit any publicity benefit for ISIL, but House Speaker Paul Ryan sharply rejected that rationale and called on President Barack Obama to reverse the decision.

"Selectively editing this transcript is preposterous. We know the shooter was a radical Islamist extremist inspired by ISIS. We also know he intentionally targeted the LGBT community," Ryan said. "The administration should release the full, unredacted transcript so the public is clear-eyed about who did this, and why.”

Hours later, the FBI did just that, saying that the deletions had "caused an unnecessary distraction.".....

You suppose that qualifies as the administration? Really? The reason it is called the "administration" is because the president is supposed to "administer" the agency operations....seriously, you guys kill me some times. Comey works Lynch who works for Obama...they made the joint decision to do this nonsense. They should get the s*** kicked out of them for doing something this preposterous.

[AURaptor 1,128]

Every Muslim who recognizes sharia law will say the same thing, that the gay lifestyle is a sin, and death is the sentence.

If there is one sure way to win jihad brownie points with those who claim to speak for true Islam, then killing a bunch of gays is a surefire way to martyr oneself.

So the reason gays were targeted is not because of some hate crime nonsense, but because of a twisted view of Islamic religion.

[alexava 6,973]

Well, just for the record, it looks like the redaction thing was initiated by the FBI. I suppose that qualifies as the "administration".

http://www.politico....anscript-224556

The FBI reversed itself and publicly issued a complete transcript of a 911 call from the Orlando nightclub shooter Monday afternoon after coming under withering criticism from House Speaker Paul Ryan and other Republicans for deleting references to the Islamic State group as well as the group's leader, Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi.

A version of the text of the 50-second call between an Orlando 911 dispatcher and shooter Omar Mateen disclosed Monday morning, included his claim of responsibility for the shooting, but was edited to remove Mateen's mention of ISIL and of Al-Baghdadi.

The FBI said the redactions were intended to limit any publicity benefit for ISIL, but House Speaker Paul Ryan sharply rejected that rationale and called on President Barack Obama to reverse the decision.

"Selectively editing this transcript is preposterous. We know the shooter was a radical Islamist extremist inspired by ISIS. We also know he intentionally targeted the LGBT community," Ryan said. "The administration should release the full, unredacted transcript so the public is clear-eyed about who did this, and why.”

Hours later, the FBI did just that, saying that the deletions had "caused an unnecessary distraction.".....

now this should end ISIS as we know it!

[TitanTiger 20,542]

I don't care to argue with you about this, especially since your mind is made up. I see the rationale of the administration. What would releasing an unredacted version accomplish in realistic terms?

The truth doesn't need results to validate it. It's the censorship that needs to explain itself.

The picture of this guy is complex. Long standing anger and generalized threats of violence that were finally attached to a supposed cause. The story is there to anyone paying attention.

I agree. But editing out his Islamic extremism doesn't help give us a truer picture of him.

[augolf1716 21,434]

Good discussion.......play it all imo if not it just make you wonder.

[AURaptor 1,128]

Why was this AMERICAN born Muslim speaking in Arabic to the 911 dispatch ?

Anyone care to wager a guess ?

[TexasTiger 13,136]

Why was this AMERICAN born Muslim speaking in Arabic to the 911 dispatch ?

Anyone care to wager a guess ?

To work you up?

[AURaptor 1,128]

Why was this AMERICAN born Muslim speaking in Arabic to the 911 dispatch ?

Anyone care to wager a guess ?

To work you up?

Yes, continue to joke and ignore reality.

A - He spoke Arabic because this was a religious act. Period. Why ? Because Arabic is the tongue in which the Qur'an is written and taught. It's how Islam is truly understood. Arabic IS the language of Islam.

So, for all this talk of how the shooter was born in Queens NY, is nonsensical deflection. He considered Afghanistan HIS country, as the religion of Islam was why HE felt he needed to do this heinous attack.

[AUFAN78 3,943]

"Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

Here is your " plainly stated" quote.

It is quite plain and there is no comparison to WW2 and the asymmetric warfare we're experiencing now. First, NO Japanese Americans were shooting up their wok places or gay bars in the name of religion or for any other reason for that matter but, carry on believing what you will. Its plain to me he will not criticize or condemn a cult of supremacist killers.

You are making Alexva's point: Just look at what we did to Japanese Americans without our suffering armed terrorist attacks from them!

When this country acts out of fear, we often regret and feel ashamed over it later.

So they are redacting the transcript out of fear and will regret and feel ashamed later. Got it. Brilliant.

[homersapien 11,513]

"Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

Here is your " plainly stated" quote.

It is quite plain and there is no comparison to WW2 and the asymmetric warfare we're experiencing now. First, NO Japanese Americans were shooting up their wok places or gay bars in the name of religion or for any other reason for that matter but, carry on believing what you will. Its plain to me he will not criticize or condemn a cult of supremacist killers.

You are making Alexva's point: Just look at what we did to Japanese Americans without our suffering armed terrorist attacks from them!

When this country acts out of fear, we often regret and feel ashamed over it later.

So they are redacting the transcript out of fear and will regret and feel ashamed later. Got it. Brilliant.

Really stupid post. I thought you were better than that.

[TexasTiger 13,136]

Why was this AMERICAN born Muslim speaking in Arabic to the 911 dispatch ?

Anyone care to wager a guess ?

To work you up?

Yes, continue to joke and ignore reality.

A - He spoke Arabic because this was a religious act. Period. Why ? Because Arabic is the tongue in which the Qur'an is written and taught. It's how Islam is truly understood. Arabic IS the language of Islam.

So, for all this talk of how the shooter was born in Queens NY, is nonsensical deflection. He considered Afghanistan HIS country, as the religion of Islam was why HE felt he needed to do this heinous attack.

And you haven't really followed his or can't engage in complex thought.

[AU-HANDLEY-TIGER 205]

I think they should release them unedited. I mean this douche pleged allegiance to the extremist group dujour. Al Nusra front, Hezbolla and ISIS were the many vastly different groups he was trying to hitch his wagon too.

The internet recruiting of "lone wolves" such as this one will become our new norm , unless you stop the source.

[AURaptor 1,128]

Why was this AMERICAN born Muslim speaking in Arabic to the 911 dispatch ?

Anyone care to wager a guess ?

To work you up?

Yes, continue to joke and ignore reality.

A - He spoke Arabic because this was a religious act. Period. Why ? Because Arabic is the tongue in which the Qur'an is written and taught. It's how Islam is truly understood. Arabic IS the language of Islam.

So, for all this talk of how the shooter was born in Queens NY, is nonsensical deflection. He considered Afghanistan HIS country, as the religion of Islam was why HE felt he needed to do this heinous attack.

And you haven't really followed his or can't engage in complex thought.

" to work you up " isn't anywhere near complex thought

[icanthearyou 4,464]

Can you really assign a religion or, ideology to someone who is mentally ill? Was Lee Harvey Oswald really a communist? Was he someone mentally/emotionally disturbed who was looking for anything/anyone that would feed his inflated sense of self importance?

Are we wasting time examining this particular person from a religious or political perspective? Would a simple psychological examination be more telling?

Based on what we know, is this guy a religious zealot or, a violent nut?

[TitanTiger 20,542]

Can you really assign a religion or, ideology to someone who is mentally ill? Was Lee Harvey Oswald really a communist? Was he someone mentally/emotionally disturbed who was looking for anything/anyone that would feed his inflated sense of self importance?

Are we wasting time examining this particular person from a religious or political perspective? Would a simple psychological examination be more telling?

Based on what we know, is this guy a religious zealot or, a violent nut?

Or both?

[icanthearyou 4,464]

Can you really assign a religion or, ideology to someone who is mentally ill? Was Lee Harvey Oswald really a communist? Was he someone mentally/emotionally disturbed who was looking for anything/anyone that would feed his inflated sense of self importance?

Are we wasting time examining this particular person from a religious or political perspective? Would a simple psychological examination be more telling?

Based on what we know, is this guy a religious zealot or, a violent nut?

Or both?

Too convenient. Simple link or, actual cause? What's really driving this guy to kill? Deeply held religious beliefs or, psychosis?

[TitanTiger 20,542]

Can you really assign a religion or, ideology to someone who is mentally ill? Was Lee Harvey Oswald really a communist? Was he someone mentally/emotionally disturbed who was looking for anything/anyone that would feed his inflated sense of self importance?

Are we wasting time examining this particular person from a religious or political perspective? Would a simple psychological examination be more telling?

Based on what we know, is this guy a religious zealot or, a violent nut?

Or both?

Too convenient. Simple link or, actual cause? What's really driving this guy to kill? Deeply held religious beliefs or, psychosis?

It's not too convenient. Your false dichotomy is too simplistic. It's completely reasonable to believe that he was both motivated by a warped set of religious beliefs and that he's a nut. They are not mutually exclusive motives.

And that doesn't even get into a viable third motive: self-hatred due to his own same-sex attractions.

[SaturdayGT 719]

What makes this Orlando shooter any different from the rest of ISIS as far as being some violent nut or religious zealot? What happened in orlando is pretty light compared to others have done who are involved with ISIS.

[AURaptor 1,128]

If Mateen was " mentally ill " then every believer of every religion is sick.

[Bunkey 0]

Sandy Hook killer was Christian, Raptor. Oh what will you do when Hilliary is President? Maybe move to a bunker in a trailer park? Oh wait...LMAO