"Donald Trump is not well"

[homersapien 11,379]

57 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Maybe some fingers should be pointed toward Scarborough. Some act if he is completely innocent inall this. I wish Trump would knock off the tangent tweets too and stick to tweeting about issues. But iI think I would react too if some idiot made untrue claims about me and my family

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/30/trump-kushner-never-blackmailed-scarborough-source-says.html

George Orwell said "the more a society drifts from the truth the more it will hate those who speak it," That very true in today's polarized society where it's sometime hard to tell who is telling the truth.

Yeah right. 

It's not like Scarborough kidnapped Trump and made him his monkey.  

This is on Trump.  Obviously you are happy with a president with a huge inferiority complex plus a penchant for irrational action.

[TitanTiger 20,483]

3 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

Maybe some fingers should be pointed toward Scarborough. Some act if he is completely innocent inall this. I wish Trump would knock off the tangent tweets too and stick to tweeting about issues. But iI think I would react too if some idiot made untrue claims about me and my family

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/30/trump-kushner-never-blackmailed-scarborough-source-says.html

 

And Scarborough says that's a lie and he has the texts to prove it:

Quote

Scarborough responded quickly to Trump's tweet with one of his own, writing, "Yet another lie. I have texts from your top aides and phone records. Also, those records show I haven't spoken with you in many months."

http://money.cnn.com/2017/06/30/media/national-enquirer-donald-trump-joe-scarborough/index.html

In a battle between Trump and anyone on who's telling the truth, Trump is the last guy to bet on, unless you like losing money.  Zero credibility.  

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

 

And Scarborough says that's a lie and he has the texts to prove it:

In a battle between Trump and anyone on who's telling the truth, Trump is the last guy to bet on, unless you like losing money.  Zero credibility.  

Trump and Kushner deny it. If Scarborough has proof let him produce it. Otherwise it's his word against Trump. Based on day after day of bashing Trump it's clear he hates Trump. So I will go with Trump until proven guilty. Isn't that what you often tell me.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/30/trump-kushner-never-blackmailed-scarborough-source-says.html

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

31 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

 

And Scarborough says that's a lie and he has the texts to prove it:

In a battle between Trump and anyone on who's telling the truth, Trump is the last guy to bet on, unless you like losing money.  Zero credibility.  

Let's see those texts and phone call logs. Scarborough should have those ready to go since he's going to go public with this accusation. I may not bet on Trump telling the truth but I'm sure as hell not going to go along with whatever partisan hacks who hosts news shows and present themselves as "independent journalists" say on any given issue.

I mean if you're going to hold Trump to a standard, I hope you also hold the so called "journalists" in the news media to that standard as well. This is why there's so much distrust of the media, because they're not just presenting themselves as opinion shows, they present themselves as news shows and as "independent journalists or analysts". 

When you watch CNN for instance, a guy like Brian Stelter is presented as an "independent journalist". Yet that couldn't be further from the truth. That's like Trump presenting himself as a hardcore conservative. It's just not accurate and reflective of reality. 

There's very few "independent journalists" on the air currently. Whether it be ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, FOX, CNN, or MSNBC. You can watch any network news program and if you took a poll on the public's judgment on which side the host of a news show is on politically, I'm pretty sure the public's judgment's would be fairly accurate. That's a problem. I know Sean Hannity is a partisan hack and not a journalist. Sean Hannity doesn't present himself as an "independent journalist", he presents himself as an unapologetic conservative opinion host. Sean Hannity's not trying to deceive people into thinking he's an independent voice. You're even seeing the kind of opinionated personality's on ESPN commenting on social stories that intertwine with sports. I don't think people watch ESPN to get the opinions of hosts and personality's like Stephen A. Smith on things like Colin Kaepernick kneeling or whether a sports team will go to the White House in honor of winning a championship  ESPN has basically become an extension of the news media in how they rub shoulders with athletes and pick sides on a topic even if it doesn't reflect the views of the audience that watches. 

You see Trump supporters and other right leaning people "normalize" Trump because many have seen the media for years "normalize" partisan double standards towards individuals who don't align with their network's narratives they push. You don't see the media hold Democrats to the same standards they do Republicans. There weren't very many in the media(non FOX) that were riled up when a Democratic Louisiana Congressman made a crude comment about Kelleyanne Conway. When Nancy Pelosi was interviewed and asked about the crude comments, Pelosi didn't push back against the comments and condemn the Louisiana congressman. She instead deflected towards Trump's comments on the Access Hollywood tape. Pelosi's answer illustrates how Democrats don't get pressed or held accountable for their comments the way Trump or any other Republican does. Trump's comments and tweets get addressed ad nauseam on news shows. It's wall-to-wall converage and panels are brought on to discuss any Trump comment. It's not like the media ignores what Trump says the way they do Democrats comments and tweets. Yet anti-Trump people get irritated when Trump supporters and other Republicans won't push back harder against Trump.

When anti-Trump people start also calling out folks like Nancy Pelosi and the "independent journalists" who let them slide, then maybe I'll be more outraged about Trump's comments or tweets. If we were playing on a level playing field, you'd see more people on the right condemning Trump. There's no moral high ground in the political pissing contest between Trump and the media, yet anti-Trump folks think there is. Even if Trump quit tweeting or making these comments, most of those same people complaining about Trump still wouldn't call out the bs when a Democrat gets a pass from the news media. They "normalize" their side because they think their side is morally superior, they don't need to call anything out because what their side says is the "truth".

[TitanTiger 20,483]

4 minutes ago, Auburnfan91 said:

Let's see those texts and phone call logs. Scarborough should have those ready to go since he's going to go public with this accusation. I may not bet on Trump telling the truth but I'm sure as hell not going to go along with whatever partisan hacks who hosts news shows and present themselves as "independent journalists" say on any given issue.

I mean if you're going to hold Trump to a standard, I hope you also hold the so called "journalists" in the news media to that standard as well. This is why there's so much distrust of the media, because they're not just presenting themselves as opinion shows, they present themselves as news shows and as "independent journalists or analysts". 

As homer pointed out, "the media" is not some monolith where you get to say that because ___________ did something biased or unfair therefore I get to discount anything another journalist says because it's against my party or my guy.

Double-standard my ass.  Trump is a known, habitual liar.  I don't give two sh**s whether you think the Democrats get the same treatment, this isn't about them, it's about him.  Even if they are the most evil, two-faced lying sacks of s*** on Earth, it does nothing to improve his credibility.  Hillary could be lying all day long, 24/7/365 and it changes nothing about the fact that Trump lies constantly and acts like a petulant child and a bully when criticized or challenged.

I'd love to see the texts and call logs too, but my bet is this will quietly go away because Trump knows better than to poke the bear on this.

[TitanTiger 20,483]

25 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Trump and Kushner deny it. If Scarborough has proof let him produce it. Otherwise it's his word against Trump. Based on day after day of bashing Trump it's clear he hates Trump. So I will go with Trump until proven guilty. Isn't that what you often tell me.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/30/trump-kushner-never-blackmailed-scarborough-source-says.html

His entire body of work as a politician should tell you that Trump's word against anyone this side of Beelzebub is a losing prospect.

But you go ahead and be a sucker.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

30 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

His entire body of work as a politician should tell you that Trump's word against anyone this side of Beelzebub is a losing prospect.

But you go ahead and be a sucker.

Well tell me a politician who hasn't told a bunch of lies. How about Obama, Hillary, Bush, Bill Clinton, Nixon, etc. Truth is the media and the left is still so angry that their darling Hillary lost that they will continue to spew their hate for Trump and divide the country. And you are the sucker for not seeing it for what it is. Even though we don't often agree surely you are intelligent enough to see that.

[TitanTiger 20,483]

3 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Well tell me a politician who hasn't told a bunch of lies. How about Obama, Hillary, Bush, Bill Clinton, Nixon, etc. Truth is the media and the left is still so angry that their darling Hillary lost that they will continue to spew their hate for Trump and divide the country. And you are the sucker for not seeing it for what it is. Even though we don't often agree surely you are intelligent enough to see that.

Stop deflecting.  This is about Trump, not Obama, Hillary, Nixon or anyone else.  Nothing about their character changes the fact that Trump is a liar and that you are an absolute sucker to believe anything he says over almost anyone else on the planet.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

4 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Stop deflecting.  This is about Trump, not Obama, Hillary, Nixon or anyone else.  Nothing about their character changes the fact that Trump is a liar and that you are an absolute sucker to believe anything he says over almost anyone else on the planet.

Your standard MO.... saying I'm deflecting when presenting facts. You even resort to calling someone who expresses a different position a sucker. Doesn't say much for your own character. As amod I would think you could rise above that. Bottomline, I'm not wasting anymore tile with this. Not  a productive use of my time.

 

 

[ShocksMyBrain 9,366]

3 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Stop deflecting.  This is about Trump, not Obama, Hillary, Nixon or anyone else.  Nothing about their character changes the fact that Trump is a liar and that you are an absolute sucker to believe anything he says over almost anyone else on the planet.

Trump's not a politician though, I thought. That's why they voted for him, he has no filter and "tells it like it is" and that's what will #maga. I love seeing lifelong conservatives saying, "he should get off twitter and do something". Yeah, no s***. 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 minute ago, ShocksMyBrain said:

Trump's not a politician though, I thought. That's why they voted for him, he has no filter and "tells it like it is" and that's what will #maga. I love seeing lifelong conservatives saying, "he should get off twitter and do something". Yeah, no s***. 

At least he is keeping, or trying to keep, his promises and is being transparent whether you or anyone else like him.

[TitanTiger 20,483]

2 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Your standard MO.... saying I'm deflecting when presenting facts. You even resort to calling someone who expresses a different position a sucker. Doesn't say much for your own character. As amod I would think you could rise above that.

But that's just the thing, you aren't presenting facts.  At least not any pertinent ones.  We are talking about Trump.  Period.  It doesn't matter if all those other people are liars.  It doesn't make him more trustworthy even if they're all filthy liars.  THAT is why it is deflection - you are trying to point fingers and make it about something other than what it is.

And I'm sorry if the truth hurts.  Trump's a liar.  Like, one of the biggest most obvious liars I've ever seen.  He lies about stupid stuff that it makes no sense to lie about.  Everyone knows this.  So if you can see how he's acted the last 24 months and still believe him over someone else, you're a sucker.  If "exceedingly gullible" sounds nicer to you, fine.  

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

But that's just the thing, you aren't presenting facts.  At least not any pertinent ones.  We are talking about Trump.  Period.  It doesn't matter if all those other people are liars.  It doesn't make him more trustworthy even if they're all filthy liars.  THAT is why it is deflection - you are trying to point fingers and make it about something other than what it is.

And I'm sorry if the truth hurts.  Trump's a liar.  Like, one of the biggest most obvious liars I've ever seen.  He lies about stupid stuff that it makes no sense to lie about.  Everyone knows this.  So if you can see how he's acted the last 24 months and still believe him over someone else, you're a sucker.  If "exceedingly gullible" sounds nicer to you, fine.  

Of course they aren't pertinent facts to you, None ever are if they make a point you don't like. Standard procudure for you.

 

[ShocksMyBrain 9,366]

5 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

At least he is keeping, or trying to keep, his promises and is being transparent whether you or anyone else like him.

If you say so. 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Just now, ShocksMyBrain said:

If you say so. 

Do you disagree? If so elaborate.

[TitanTiger 20,483]

3 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Of course they aren't pertinent facts to you, None ever are if they make a point you don't like. Standard procudure for you.

 

They aren't pertinent because they aren't.  Even if I liked the point, it's not one I'd use because it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand.

If a man cheats on his wife, pointing to all the other men who cheat isn't going to mean jack***t to his wife or anyone else.  So what if the whole world cheats?  This isn't about them, it's about him and his behavior. Their cheating doesn't make him less of a slime ball.

Trump lies.  It. Does. Not. Matter. Who. Else. Lies.  Stop believing him.  Stop giving him the benefit of the doubt.  Stop being a sucker. 

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

As homer pointed out, "the media" is not some monolith where you get to say that because ___________ did something biased or unfair therefore I get to discount anything another journalist says because it's against my party or my guy.

Double-standard my ass.  Trump is a known, habitual liar.  I don't give two sh**s whether you think the Democrats get the same treatment, this isn't about them, it's about him.  Even if they are the most evil, two-faced lying sacks of s*** on Earth, it does nothing to improve his credibility.  Hillary could be lying all day long, 24/7/365 and it changes nothing about the fact that Trump lies constantly and acts like a petulant child and a bully when criticized or challenged.

I'd love to see the texts and call logs too, but my bet is this will quietly go away because Trump knows better than to poke the bear on this.

And I don't give a rats ass about Trump's credibility or tweets. I don't think even you believe people voted for Trump because they thought he was honest or someone who was charming and pleasant. You're not going to turn a dog into a cat no matter much you want the dog to change. It's just not gonna happen. Go get a cat if you want a cat. 

We just had a rock star presidency the last 8 years. Obama didn't mind criticizing anyone from Joe the plumber to Cambridge police to Donald Trump to FOX news. Obama wasn't "above it all" either yet the left and those in the media cheered him on all the way when he spouted off about a person or organization he didn't like or disagreed with. That was awesome. Obama's behavior was met with unanimous approval. If anything, he was only criticized because he wasn't more vocal about things like people being shot by police or going after Republicans on issues. Obama's sh*t didn't stink.  

Just because Trump says mean stuff and behaves childishly doesn't mean he's evil or a monster. The media are helping feed into it and "normalize" it when they lash out and get personal by calling Trump a liar and not just disagreeing with policies but they go on rants about how horrible a person he is because of it. If someone called Obama a liar and questioned his behavior or even his policies, they were shouted down and sometimes accused of racism. Calling Trump an orange cheeto, mocking his hair, mocking how he talks, going after Melania for not criticizing her husband, there's nothing off limits when it comes to criticizing Trump. 

Trump campaigned on attacking the media and opponents. Nobody should be surprised that he didn't really change when he became president. That was part of Trump's appeal that a lot of people were drawn to. He doesn't play by the rules and double standards the way so many political hacks in the news media want to enforce. That doesn't mean I agree with his comments. I just don't pretend to hold the president to an unwritten standard of how a president should act. Because the media don't hold every president to the same standards. You're reaching if you think Trump should be upholding the standards of the office. A large segment of the country didn't vote for that. The media only now want to complain about being presidential because the last 8 years they couldn't be bothered to actually be aggressive and call out un-presidential behavior. In some cases they didn't just stay silent and not call it out, they actually approved of it and jokingly celebrated Obama's "toughness".

Trump didn't happen in a vacuum. Trump wouldn't have won in 2008 or 2012 because Obama was just so likable and had a personality that charmed people. He presented himself as "above the fray" and that he wouldn't play games. The media weren't just impartial bystanders during the Obama presidency. They covered or outright blacked out negative stories or things that happened under Obama. They absolved Obama from blame on a lot of things. Hilary got tougher coverage than Obama but was still excused and explained away about her private server and given passes for defending Bill's affairs. The media are foaming at the mouth right now wanting Melania Trump to criticize her husband's "bullying" behavior.

Now we have a reality tv presidency where everything is filled with drama and controversy. People and the media are so hung up about Trump's words and not his actions. They think he's awful because of his mouth and tweets. A lot of his policies actually appeal to more than just conservatives but the people who support Trump don't matter to anti-Trump folks. They're awful people for supporting Trump.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 minute ago, Auburnfan91 said:

And I don't give a rats ass about Trump's credibility or tweets. I don't think even you believe people voted for Trump because they thought he was honest or someone who was charming and pleasant. You're not going to turn a dog into a cat no matter much you want the dog to change. It's just not gonna happen. Go get a cat if you want a cat. 

We just had a rock star presidency the last 8 years. Obama didn't mind criticizing anyone from Joe the plumber to Cambridge police to Donald Trump to FOX news. Obama wasn't "above it all" either yet the left and those in the media cheered him on all the way when he spouted off about a person or organization he didn't like or disagreed with. That was awesome. Obama's behavior was met with unanimous approval. If anything, he was only criticized because he wasn't more vocal about things like people being shot by police or going after Republicans on social.issues Obama's sh*t didn't stink.  

Just because Trump says mean stuff and behaves childishly doesn't mean he's evil or a monster. The media are helping feed into it and "normalize" it when they lash out and get personal by calling Trump a liar and not just disagreeing with policies but they go on rants about how horrible a person he is because of it. If someone called Obama a liar and questioned his behavior or even his policies, they were shouted down and sometimes accused of racism. Calling Trump an orange cheeto, mocking his hair, mocking how he talks, going after Melania for not criticizing her husband, there's nothing off limits when it comes to criticizing Trump. 

Trump campaigned on attacking the media and opponents. Nobody should be surprised that he didn't really change when he became president. That was part of Trump's appeal that a lot of people were drawn to. He doesn't play by the rules and double standards the way so many political hacks in the news media want to enforce. That doesn't mean I agree with his comments. I just don't pretend to hold the president to an unwritten standard of how a president should act. Because the media don't hold every president to the same standards. You're reaching if you think Trump should be upholding the standards of the office. A large segment of the country didn't vote for that. The media only now want to complain about being presidential because the last 8 years they couldn't be bothered to actually be aggressive and call out un-presidential behavior. In some cases they didn't just stay silent and not call it out, they actually approve of it and jokingly celebrated Obama's "toughness".

Trump didn't happen in a vacuum. Trump wouldn't have won in 2008 or 2012 because Obama was just so likable and had a personality that charmed people. He presented himself as "above the fray" and that he wouldn't play games. The media weren't just impartial bystanders during the Obama presidency. They covered or outright blacked out negative stories or things that happened under Obama. They absolved Obama from blame on a lot of things. Hilary got tougher coverage than Obama but was still excused and explained away about her private server and given passes for defending Bill's affairs. The media are foaming at the mouth right now wanting Melania Trump to criticize her husband's "bullying" behavior.

Now we have a reality tv presidency where everything is filled with drama and controversy. People and the media are so hung up about Trump's words and not his actions. They think he's awful because of his mouth and tweets. A lot of his policies actually appeal to more than just conservatives but the people who support Trump don't matter to anti-Trump folks. They're awful people too. 

^^^^^ Thank you for a well stated civil post.

[alexava 6,973]

10 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

At least he is keeping, or trying to keep, his promises and is being transparent whether you or anyone else like him.

Still waiting on those tax returns....

[Grumps 3,704]

Here is my explanation of Trump's behavior:

I think that Trump somewhat liked his life prior to being POTUS. I think that he decided that he was not going to completely give up his life as "The Donald." I think that he has made a conscious decision to separate his personal life from his POTUS life. So, when he can, he acts like the same impulsive child he was prior to being POTUS. I think it is silly to think that he is mentally incapacitated just because he makes mean tweets.

His tweeting behavior is completely unpresidential, and I don't like it, but I can understand his desire to maintain his personal identity while serving as POTUS.

[homersapien 11,379]

12 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

Trump and Kushner deny it. If Scarborough has proof let him produce it. Otherwise it's his word against Trump. Based on day after day of bashing Trump it's clear he hates Trump. So I will go with Trump until proven guilty. Isn't that what you often tell me.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/30/trump-kushner-never-blackmailed-scarborough-source-says.html

Ummmm.   His word against Trump's.

Gee that's a tough one.  

[homersapien 11,379]

12 hours ago, Auburnfan91 said:

There's very few "independent journalists" on the air currently. Whether it be ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, FOX, CNN, or MSNBC.

You put PBS in the same category as FOX?!

Sorry, but you lost me there.

[homersapien 11,379]

11 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

Your standard MO.... saying I'm deflecting when presenting facts. You even resort to calling someone who expresses a different position a sucker. Doesn't say much for your own character. As amod I would think you could rise above that. Bottomline, I'm not wasting anymore tile with this. Not  a productive use of my time.

Presenting irrelevant information is deflecting PT.

And your position is we should believe Trump about anything, apparently because other people have lied.  

It's both illogical and irrational.

[homersapien 11,379]

24 minutes ago, Grumps said:

Here is my explanation of Trump's behavior:

I think that Trump somewhat liked his life prior to being POTUS. I think that he decided that he was not going to completely give up his life as "The Donald." I think that he has made a conscious decision to separate his personal life from his POTUS life. So, when he can, he acts like the same impulsive child he was prior to being POTUS. I think it is silly to think that he is mentally incapacitated just because he makes mean tweets.

His tweeting behavior is completely unpresidential, and I don't like it, but I can understand his desire to maintain his personal identity while serving as POTUS.

Wrong.  

His behavior clearly indicates he has incapacitating psychological issues. Maybe not incapacitating for a wealthy New York bully, but certainly for the POTUS.

[homersapien 11,379]

11 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

At least he is keeping, or trying to keep, his promises and is being transparent whether you or anyone else like him.

To provide a healthcare plan that covers everyone at an affordable price?