"WR and TEs aren't creating separation" (or are they?)

[cole256 17,066]

39 minutes ago, bigbird said:

To me, unless it was a double move by DRob, it looks as if they are in cv2. The corner is starting to squat in the short zone and the safety has split the deep routes.  The post looks covered because the safety has already made his break. He knew which way to break to by reading Nix. Notice how far along Nix is in his throwing motion. If Nix had chosen to throw it to DRob, the safety's hips would've been flipped toward the sideline.

While it looks like Bo took the wrong guy in these stills, the post is the better pass because Kobe had cleared out the backside safety and the MoF was wide open with the receiver running away from the defender. If Nix throws it to the back judge, it should be a walk-in TD. The corner has to be a much more accurate pass due to it being on the short side, the limited space in the EZ, and needing to get it over the safety. 

 

Thank you!

[cole256 17,066]

Also let's be real that's the throw that's not your strength, but also this is sort of the start of being a real QB.....just some stuff we're going to learn on the way.

Made posts long ago, this wasn't a coach come and say hey don't do this and now everything is fine, it's going to be a process. The most important thing is becoming efficient and accurate. It will take reps.

[W.E.D 11,070]

1 minute ago, cole256 said:

Also let's be real that's the throw that's not your strength, but also this is sort of the start of being a real QB.....just some stuff we're going to learn on the way.

tbqh neither of the patterns are really a strength of his.

1 minute ago, cole256 said:

Made posts long ago, this wasn't a coach come and say hey don't do this and now everything is fine, it's going to be a process. The most important thing is becoming efficient and accurate. It will take reps.

Agree.  It was never going to be an immediate flip of a switch.

[cole256 17,066]

2 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

tbqh neither of the patterns are really a strength of his.

Agree.  It was never going to be an immediate flip of a switch.

I think intermediate stuff is ok. Or at least higher completion percentage. I'm certainly not a D1 coach but it just seems like everybody benefits letting Bo roll out or moving the pocket. It helps o line, Bo, maybe wr, and it puts pressure on the D. But maybe they were thinking that's what they would expect. Idk.

I'm rolling out personally.

[cole256 17,066]

2 hours ago, WDE_OxPx_2010 said:

@cole256the ball was catchable if Hudson isn't junked up at the line. I blame Hudson for that. He wasn't expecting the ball.

 

I see what you are thinking, and to be honest that may be the case, I'm just saying from my perspective I don't see it that way. 

I played corner when I played and I feel there is a timing connection involved and it's very important, but there's a QB decision part as well. A play isn't all get to a spot. The QB has to aim accordingly as well. If this wasn't so then it would be very easy to guard the redzone. You wouldn't have to worry about anything but impeding and getting to a spot. What makes throwing ball short so hard to guard is you are thinking they are trying to get to a spot but they throw to another spot because you are covering so well. It's really an adjustment to coverage without adjusting the play.

 

That's my opinion. It's no greater than yours though

[cole256 17,066]

49 minutes ago, EastAl_Tiger said:

He doesn't even have to throw it to the EZ. DRob has his man beat from about the 20 yd line. just lead him a little and he catches it at the goal line.  instead, he threw it to neither receiver.

That's a good point too. If I recall it wasn't goal but 4th and 2 

[W.E.D 11,070]

19 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I think intermediate stuff is ok. Or at least higher completion percentage. I'm certainly not a D1 coach but it just seems like everybody benefits letting Bo roll out or moving the pocket. It helps o line, Bo, maybe wr, and it puts pressure on the D. But maybe they were thinking that's what they would expect. Idk.

I'm rolling out personally.

I agree on he is better 0-20 yards, but that post route would have been a deeper ball, right?  20+ yards in the air?  That was at least my thought process behind the comment.

Edited September 22, 2021 by W.E.D

[cole256 17,066]

10 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

I agree on he is better 0-20 yards, but that post route would have been a deeper ball, right?  20+ yards in the air?

Yeah it would be deeper. I think I've seen him hit a couple though. It seems he has the most trouble in fades or streaks or whatever moniker is attached to them. I'm just making a guess but maybe the post having some horizontal direction in it maybe helps. Also a post requires a little more zip and opposed to a fade needing a bunch of touch.

I'll be honest, that's all speculation from me. I'm just going off of what I do see and that's the vertical routes seem to be difficult for him. Also now that I'm  typing the good throws he made to kobe and Jackson (that he dropped) those balls were balls with zip. Even the last play of the game he threw it with zip trying to get somewhere as opposed to lobbing a hail Mary. Did you notice that?

Edited September 22, 2021 by cole256

[W.E.D 11,070]

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I'll be honest, that's all speculation from me

At least you admit you don't know what you're talking about 😀 j/k

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

the post having some horizontal direction in it maybe helps. Also a post requires a little more zip and opposed to a fade needing a bunch of touch.

I think that's a good point.

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Also now that I'm right m typing the good throws he made to kobe and Jackson (that he dropped) those balls were balls with zip. Even the last play of the game he threw it with zip trying to get somewhere as opposed to lobbing a hail Mary. Did you notice that?

Yeah, agree.  And maybe in the 1st game the wide open TD to JJ (I think) was a crossing route and the TD to Kobe too was a harder thrown ball.  Anything that gets up in the air seems to get away from Bo.  There is a touch pass to Shed down the side line where he's got his man beat an Bo has to go up/over a DB to drop it in....needs touch.  He kind short arms in and it comes up short.

Edited September 22, 2021 by W.E.D
spelling

[cole256 17,066]

8 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

At least you admit you don't know what you're talking about 😀 j/k

When it comes to what it takes to throw the ball I don't. Anything besides your feet need to be set and you need a strong base and balance. And that's from playing corner really learning on when to jump a throw. 

You never really talk to a QB and ask him how he does what he does. You just know he's a QB lol. 

Now defending a route I can talk that all day. 

[steeleagle 2,945]

3 hours ago, WDE_OxPx_2010 said:

@cole256the ball was catchable if Hudson isn't junked up at the line. I blame Hudson for that. He wasn't expecting the ball.

 

Sorry. Don't agree. I think Hudson knew where he needed to be, the DB locked him up, and Hudson realized he wasn't going to get to the corner turned, and lost his balance falling down.

I can understand when you look at it that it almost looks like Hudson was trying to block the DB, but his prior moves with the juke left, tells me he was trying to make the DB go to his left so he then would have a lane to the corner. That DB simply knew how to defend that route.

The pass was not a bad pass. If he shortens it to keep it inside the lines, he gives the DB a chance to INT it.

My Steelers memorable pass to win the SB was not the same play but if you notice the pass by Ben was never going to be inbounds. He was putting it where his WR would HAVE to go up and get it.

That's what I thought where Bo was putting it. The fact that there was no WR in that area does make it look like it was too far/too high. But if a WR is there he has a chance to catch. 

Edited September 22, 2021 by steeleagle

[DAG 33,982]

13 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

Sorry. Don't agree. I think Hudson knew where he needed to be, the DB locked him up, and Hudson realized he wasn't going to get to the corner turned, and lost his balance falling down.

I can understand when you look at it that it almost looks like Hudson was trying to block the DB, but his prior moves with the juke left, tells me he was trying to make the DB go to his left so he then would have a lane to the corner. That DB simply knew how to defend that route.

The pass was not a bad pass. If he shortens it to keep it inside the lines, he gives the DB a chance to INT it.

My Steelers memorable pass to win the SB was not the same play but if you notice the pass by Ben was never going to be inbounds. He was putting it where his WR would HAVE to go up and get it.

That's what I thought where Bo was putting it. The fact that there was no WR in that area does make it look like it was too far/too high. But if a WR is there he has a chance to catch. 

Now I get it. A Steelers fan. Gah 

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

@bigbirdyou want to delete my posts, but you didn't reign it the other party when he arrived?

[bigbird 60,525]

@ValleyTiger I asked for it to stop. It hasn't.  If you have issues with my moderation, feel free to PM me.  

[cole256 17,066]

Can anybody do a still of that throw and where the ball was at?

A closer view?

Edited September 22, 2021 by cole256

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

2 minutes ago, bigbird said:

@ValleyTiger I asked for it to stop. It hasn't.  If you have issues with my moderation, feel free to PM me.  

Yeah and I mentioned their passive aggressive pot shots continuing, but you let them live. Don't be selective in your cleaning.

[bigbird 60,525]

Just now, ValleyTiger said:

Yeah and I mentioned their passive aggressive pot shots continuing, but you let them live. Don't be selective in your cleaning.

I'd double check before saying that, but that's just me.

[cole256 17,066]

31 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

Sorry. Don't agree. I think Hudson knew where he needed to be, the DB locked him up, and Hudson realized he wasn't going to get to the corner turned, and lost his balance falling down.

I can understand when you look at it that it almost looks like Hudson was trying to block the DB, but his prior moves with the juke left, tells me he was trying to make the DB go to his left so he then would have a lane to the corner. That DB simply knew how to defend that route.

The pass was not a bad pass. If he shortens it to keep it inside the lines, he gives the DB a chance to INT it.

My Steelers memorable pass to win the SB was not the same play but if you notice the pass by Ben was never going to be inbounds. He was putting it where his WR would HAVE to go up and get it.

That's what I thought where Bo was putting it. The fact that there was no WR in that area does make it look like it was too far/too high. But if a WR is there he has a chance to catch. 

That's a major stretch

[DAG 33,982]

1 minute ago, cole256 said:

That's a major stretch

Right. That was a perfect throw by Ben to where only Santana Holmes could get it. That fade route would be 50/50 at best.

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

2 minutes ago, bigbird said:

I'd double check before saying that, but that's just me.

I did. More of his crap at bottom of page 4 after you jumped in. 

You continue to clean up after him or reign back his generalizations of good people on this board as being ignorant and I'll let it go.

[cole256 17,066]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

Right. That was a perfect throw by Ben to where only Santana Holmes could get it. That fade route would be 50/50 at best.

I don't even think the throws should be compared tbh

[W.E.D 11,070]

28 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Can anybody do a still of that throw and where the ball was at?

A closer view?

The fade and where it landed?  I think I did that in another thread.  I think these are the screen shots.  Tried to pause it when it crossed the sideline and when it hit the ground.

 

[bigbird 60,525]

10 minutes ago, ValleyTiger said:

I did. More of his crap at bottom of page 4 after you jumped in. 

You continue to clean up after him or reign back his generalizations of good people on this board as being ignorant and I'll let it go.

Since you continue to want this to play out publicly, I will let it.

 

You had one response after my initial redirection.

2 hours ago, ValleyTiger said:

He's wrong plenty. It's just that the people knowledgeable enough to call him on his BS mostly aren't around much anymore, have him on ignore, or won't waste their time on such a lost cause.

The other had one post after my initial redirection.

1 hour ago, cole256 said:

😂 this guy! 🤡

You then posted 3 more times, each being purposefully antagonistic and inflammatory trying to illicit a response. By the time I hid those and before I could find what set you off, you decided to publicly call me out.  I then asked you to PM me if you had issues.  Instead, you chose to continue. Just stop.

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

1 minute ago, bigbird said:

Since you continue to want this to play out publicly, I will let it.

 

You had one response after my initial redirection.

The other had one post after my initial redirection.

You then posted 3 more times, each being purposefully antagonistic and inflammatory trying to illicit a response. By the time I hid those and before I could find what set you off, you decided to publicly call me out.  I then asked you to PM me if you had issues.  Instead, you chose to continue. Just stop.

I did send you a PM, but maybe you haven't seen it yet.

Last I'll say. I said in my response to you that if the passive aggressive from the other side continues that I'd clap back. 

[cole256 17,066]

2 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

The fade and where it landed?  I think I did that in another thread.  I think these are the screen shots.  Tried to pause it when it crossed the sideline and when it hit the ground.

 

I saw those, but from that angle you can't really make an argument either way imo. I know you're just helping so don't take that as me crapping on you or anything. I was just wondering were there some different angles maybe.