Are any of you hunters?

[Tigermike 3,039]

John Kerry Wants to Ban Guns in America

Tuesday, August 10, 2004

John Kerry’s 20-year U.S. Senate voting record opposing Second Amendment rights brands him as the most anti-gun presidential nominee in U.S. history!

HERE’S PROOF

FACT: Kerry has voted nine times in favor of banning semi-automatic firearms. 1

FACT: Kerry has voted to ban most center-fire rifle ammunition, including the most common rounds used by hunters and target shooters.2

FACT: Kerry has voted to close off hundreds of thousands of acres of the California Mojave Desert to hunting.3

FACT: Kerry has voted to hold the highly regulated American firearms industry legally responsible for the illegal acts of violent criminals.4

FACT: Kerry was one of only 15 Senators to oppose the Firearms Owners’ Protection Act, which ended alarming abuses being committed under the 1968 Gun Control Act.5

FACT: Kerry was one of only 29 Senators to vote to prohibit gun manufacturers from discharging debts created by the reckless lawsuits filed by municipalities.6

FACT: Kerry has voted to allow BATF to conduct unlimited, warrant-less inspections of FFL holders.7

FACT: Kerry has voted to criminalize legal sales between private individuals at gun shows.8

FACT: Kerry has voted against increasing mandatory minimum and maximum penalties for the illegal transfer or use of a firearm. And yet he has also voted to impose penalties of a year in prison and a $10,000 fine on an adult if a juvenile steals a firearm from him, and then merely displays it in a public place.9

FACT: Kerry has voted to force many small firearms dealers out of business, which would have impacted both the availability and price of guns, particularly in rural areas.10

FACT: Kerry has voted 11 times to force law-abiding citizens to wait to exercise their Second Amendment rights. He voted to keep the federal waiting period after the National Instant Check System was in place.11

FACT: Kerry voted twice to eliminate the Civilian Marksmanship Program.12

FACT: Kerry wants to silence gun owners’ voice. When NRA sought the same exemption from campaign finance rules that news organizations have, Kerry called that effort “hijacking America’s airwaves.”13

FACT: Kerry commended the Million Mom March for their march on Washington that included calls for gun owner licensing, gun registration and other restrictions on law-abiding gun owners.14

FACT: Kerry twice supported legislation that would have mandated the inclusion of trigger locks with any handgun sale, forcing individual gun buyers to purchase products they did not necessarily want or need.15

FACT: If elected president, Kerry will pack the U.S. Supreme Court with Dianne Feinstein/Chuck Schumer/Ted Kennedy-selected anti-gun activists who believe you have no right to own any firearm.

FACT: Senator John Kerry has a 100% voting record with the Brady Campaign (formerly Handgun Control Inc.), a national gun-ban group. DEFEND FIREARMS. DEFEAT KERRY.

VOTE NOVEMBER 2.

For more information on John Kerry, please visit www.nrapvf.org.

1. Vote No. 24, March 2, 2004; Vote No. 295, Aug. 25, 1994; Vote No. 294, Aug. 25, 1994; Vote No. 293, Aug. 25, 1994; Vote No. 375, Nov. 17, 1993; Vote No. 365, Nov. 9, 1993; Vote No. 133, June 28, 1990; Vote No. 103, May 23, 1990; Vote No. 102, May 23, 1990.

2. Vote No. 28, March 2, 2004.

3. Vote No. 87, April 12, 1994.

4. Vote No. 24, March 2, 2004; Vote No. 25, March 2, 2004 ("poison pill" amendments).

5. Vote No. 142, July 9, 1985.

6. Vote No. 4, Feb. 2, 2000.

7. Vote No. 140, July 9, 1985.

8. Vote No. 134, May 20, 1999; Vote No. 25, March 2, 2004.

9. Vote No. 118, May 14, 1999; Vote No. 224, July 22, 1998.

10. Vote No. 227, July 30, 1993.

11. Vote No. 141, July 9, 1985; Vote No. 115, June 28, 1991; Vote No. 113, June 28, 1991; Vote No. 278, Nov. 27, 1991; Vote No. 53, Mar. 19, 1992; Vote No. 262, Oct. 2, 1992; Vote No. 385, Nov. 19, 1993; Vote No. 386, Nov. 19, 1993; Vote No. 387, Nov. 19, 1993; Vote No. 390, Nov. 19, 1993; Vote No. 394, Nov. 20, 1993.

12. Vote No. 325 Oct. 12, 1993; Vote No. 178, June 27, 1996.

13. Vote No. 64, April 2, 2001.

14. Vote No. 104, May 17, 2000. 15. Vote No. 215, July 21, 1998; Vote No. 216, July 21, 1998.

15. Vote No. 215, July 21, 1998, Vote 216, July 21, 1998.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Find this item at: http://www.nrapvf.org/Kerry/default.aspx

[LegalEagle 22]

More smear and fear. I'm a hunter. I have sense enough to know that Kerry in the White House will not mean that any of my guns will be taken away or that I won't be able to hunt.

I will reinterate that it is sad that we have to choose between Bush and Kerry. Most of the folks on this board would make better Presidents. But I love my country too much to vote for Bush.

This won't scare me off.

[Tiger Al 0]

More smear and fear. I'm a hunter. I have sense enough to know that Kerry in the White House will not mean that any of my guns will be taken away or that I won't be able to hunt.

I will reinterate that it is sad that we have to choose between Bush and Kerry. Most of the folks on this board would make better Presidents. But I love my country too much to vote for Bush.

This won't scare me off.

C'mon, LE!!! You're selling out as a hunter! You know you have the right to hunt deer with a fully automatic AK-47 if you want. You're letting them take away your rights by supporting Kerry!!!

[Tigermike 3,039]

C'mon, Al you know as well as anyone it's not a matter of hunting with a fully automatic AK-47. You know very well that Kerry has been in lock step with the anti gun lobby for years. You also know that Kerry has voted along the lines posted above. You also know how predictable you are by the above statement.

LegalEagle

More smear and fear. I'm a hunter. I have sense enough to know that Kerry in the White House will not mean that any of my guns will be taken away or that I won't be able to hunt.

Most of the folks on this board would make better Presidents. But I love my country too much to vote for Bush.

This won't scare me off.

How is it smear and fear when facts are presented? Factual and truthful information is always good to have. But when Mr. Kerry is and has been portraying himself as a hunter in photo-opts to get the "gun vote", then his true self needs to be and should be presented. Rather than the lie he and the Democrats want you to see.

There was never any idea that your mind might be changed, your mind was and has been made up for some time.

[CShine 0]

[Tigermike 3,039]

So Kerry hunting, in an attempt to get the gun vote is somehow indicative of how he votes? Would indicate that he and the anti gun lobby do not desire to expand the ban guns?

[Tiger Al 0]

So Kerry hunting, in an attempt to get the gun vote is somehow indicative of how he votes? Would indicate that he and the anti gun lobby do not desire to expand the ban guns?

What guns do they want to ban? Is the type he's holding indicative of the ones they want to keep out of your hands?

[Weagle98 119]

Actually Yes, In this picture

http://www.drudgereport.com/dncg.htm

[Tiger Al 0]

Actually Yes, In this picture

http://www.drudgereport.com/dncg.htm

"Pistol grips?" I think you'd really have to be wanting your imagination stretched to apply it to shotguns.

[Tigermike 3,039]

Actually Yes, In this picture

http://www.drudgereport.com/dncg.htm

"Pistol grips?" I think you'd really have to be wanting your imagination stretched to apply it to shotguns.

But the dems did didn't they.

[CShine 0]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does not have a pistol grip.

This is a pistol grip

[Tiger Al 0]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying.

Well, there's a big surprise. :roll:

[Tigermike 3,039]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does not have a pistol grip.

This is a pistol grip

Oh by the way, CShine is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does have a pistol grip. The dems might like to confuse by saying there is only one type of pistol grip.

But what does the manufacturer have to say?

SPECIFICATIONS:

(with full pistol grip)

http://www.berettaweb.com/semi%20auto%20shotgun/A300.htm

[Tiger Al 0]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does not have a pistol grip.

This is a pistol grip

Oh by the way, CShine is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does have a pistol grip. The dems might like to confuse by saying there is only one type of pistol grip.

But what does the manufacturer have to say?

SPECIFICATIONS:

(with full pistol grip)

http://www.berettaweb.com/semi%20auto%20shotgun/A300.htm

Do you honestly believe this is what they were talking about? Do you really?

[CCTAU 3,333]

sKerry's election to the presidency would have a major impact on gun ownership in the US. He is a weak minded fool who has already proven that he sides against the american people when it comes to their protection. The presidency has a lot of impact on gun control and confiscation. He is the one responsible for nominating SC justices. And weak mindied sKerry would difinitely appoint whoever his anti-gun buddies want for him to nominate. Fully automatic weapons have nothing to do with hunting, they have to do with the second amendment. But all of these anti-gun groups do not care about the fully automatic weapos (these are already scritnized thouroughly) They want semi-auto shotguns, rifles, AND ALL HANDGUNS.

sKerry is in league with these guys and will be defeated by a large number of gun owners and hunters.

LE, if you want to give up your second amendment rights, go ahead. But to believe it can't happen???????

Look at the UK.

Look at Australia.

So what you ar really saying is that the rest of the gun owners in america are fighting for your rights, but you aren't fighting for theirs?

I told you this on the other board, John sKerry is the most anti-gun presidential cnadidate in the history of the U.S.

[Tigermike 3,039]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does not have a pistol grip.

This is a pistol grip

Oh by the way, CShine is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does have a pistol grip. The dems might like to confuse by saying there is only one type of pistol grip.

But what does the manufacturer have to say?

SPECIFICATIONS:

(with full pistol grip)

http://www.berettaweb.com/semi%20auto%20shotgun/A300.htm

Do you honestly believe this is what they were talking about? Do you really?

Do you honestly believe the grip is all they were wanting to ban? Do you really?

[CShine 0]

Mike,

You obviously don't know a pistol grip when you see one. If you think the gun you linked has a pistol grip then there is literally no such thing as a long gun that does NOT have one.

[CCTAU 3,333]

Mike,

You obviously don't know a pistol grip when you see one. If you think the gun you linked has a pistol grip then there is literally no such thing as a long gun that does NOT have one.

Semantics. Get an inch, take a mile. sKerry and HCI are buddies and Sarah Brady has stated time and again that she wants ALL guns out of private citizen's hands. So if he votes with her, he is against all gun owners.

[Tiger Al 0]

Oh by the way, Drudge is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does not have a pistol grip.

This is a pistol grip

Oh by the way, CShine is lying. The shotgun Kerry is holding does have a pistol grip. The dems might like to confuse by saying there is only one type of pistol grip.

But what does the manufacturer have to say?

SPECIFICATIONS:

(with full pistol grip)

http://www.berettaweb.com/semi%20auto%20shotgun/A300.htm

Do you honestly believe this is what they were talking about? Do you really?

Do you honestly believe the grip is all they were wanting to ban? Do you really?

The article claimed that Kerry wanted to ban all guns with "pistol grips." The article further claimed that the shotgun in the picture would fall into that category. Is that the kind of firearm that you really believe would be included?

[stoic-one 1,548]

It may not have been banned for having a pistol grip, but it dang sure would have been banned for being a semi-automatic shotgun.....

[CShine 0]

Here are more pics of guns with true pistol grips. They aren't even remotely similar to what Kerry is holding.

http://www.protectiondepot.com/pistol_shotgun.asp

http://world.guns.ru/shotgun/sh23-e.htm

[Tigermike 3,039]

Kerry Reshapes Agenda for Gun-Control Lobby

By Robert B. Bluey

CNSNews.com Staff Writer

August 20, 2004

(CNSNews.com) - Sen. John Kerry's desire to be viewed as a gun-toting Democrat has left the gun-control lobby noticeably silent during the 2004 presidential campaign, relegated to the sidelines on an issue that played a significant role in the election four years ago.

One of the nation's leading gun-control organizations, the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, has focused almost exclusively on the soon-to-expire "assault weapons" ban, making little mention of the election itself. But in 2000, the group spent $5 million, most of it targeted at George W. Bush.

Kerry, meanwhile, has orchestrated campaign stops in an effort to appeal to gun owners. With a gun in hand, he staged events at Wisconsin's Gunslick Trap Club in July and on the Iowa plains in October.

Kerry's strategy was outlined last fall by the gun-control group Americans for Gun Safety, along with the Democratic Leadership Council and pollster Mark Penn, who advised Democrats to tone down their harsh rhetoric.

"Democratic candidates for president are taking the gun issue to the political center, rejecting the most far-reaching gun restrictions supported by former candidates Al Gore and Bill Bradley," a February press release from Americans for Gun Safety boasts.

But since Democrats have wrapped up their primary - clashing at times over former Vermont governor Howard Dean's top rating from the National Rifle Association - the gun issue has disappeared from the forefront of the campaign.

"I'm not sure why Kerry isn't focusing more on the gun violence prevention issue," said Chad Ramsey, a regional director for the Brady Campaign. "I think it's fine that he's showing he's a hunter. There are a lot of hunters who agree that assault weapons should be banned."

Although Kerry's use of gun imagery in the campaign doesn't bother the Brady Campaign, pro-gun groups like the National Rifle Association have made much of Kerry's photo opportunities. The NRA's television ads aim to focus attention on Kerry's voting record instead.

"John Kerry's record speaks volumes about his views against the Second Amendment," said Kelly Hobbs, an NRA spokeswoman. "A John Kerry administration would be tantamount to a death sentence for Second Amendment rights."

The Brady Campaign's Ramsey didn't dispute Kerry's voting record. After all, Kerry has consistently received a 100 percent rating from the group. Kerry also took time out of his campaign in March to fly to Washington to vote in favor of extending the gun ban.

"I don't think Kerry is trying to be someone he's not. That's part of his persona; he goes hunting. He is an excellent shot. That's part of who he is, and there's no sense hiding that," Ramsey said. "I think he also has not hidden the fact that he believes in gun violence prevention and has voted that way every time he's had a chance to."

But after Al Gore touted his support for strict gun control during his 2000 presidential bid, Democrats have recognized the drawbacks of doing so. Gore lost Arkansas, his home state of Tennessee and West Virginia, which could have turned the election his way.

"Gore was advocating federal licensing, and that's a pretty radical thing," said Matt Bennett, an adviser to Americans for Gun Safety. "Kerry certainly doesn't support that. And Kerry's gone out of his way on the campaign trail, both during the primaries and recently, to do events where he's shooting to make clear to people he's a hunter, a sports shooter and a gun owner."

Other gun-control supporters dismiss the notion that Gore's tough rhetoric cost him the election. New York Rep. Carolyn McCarthy's spokesman, Rob Recklaus, said the impact of groups like the NRA has been exaggerated.

"There's a misconception that somehow, the pro-gun vote cost Gore the election in 2000," Recklaus said. "The NRA keeps on saying the original 1994 assault weapons ban and the Brady Bill were the reasons the Democrats lost the election. It's completely revisionist. There were a lot of things going on in 1994 that cost the Democrats the House, and I don't think guns were one of them."

Not so, according to Erich Pratt, spokesman for Gun Owners of America. Even former President Bill Clinton estimated that the 1994 gun ban cost 20 Democrats their jobs, giving Republicans control of Congress.

"The firearms issue is one of the strongest single issues that plays in a voter's mind," Pratt said. "What an NRA or a GOA has to say about a candidate is going to make a huge difference. This is an issue that will pull people, no matter what their political affiliation."

Pratt suggested that Kerry's effort to appear gun-friendly might be why gun-control groups have taken a lesser role in his campaign.

"You almost wonder if the Kerry campaign has asked the Brady [Campaign] to put a zip on it and keep quiet," Pratt said. "I think it would be suicide for them to go into the suburban and rural areas. But New York City, places like that, their issue may sell to voters. But once you get outside of there, you really don't find widespread support for their issues."

Ramsey of the Brady Campaign dismissed those suggestions or that there was infighting among gun-control groups about how to handle Kerry.

"We're still the preeminent gun violence prevention organization out there. When it comes to that, the politicians come to us and ask policy advice," Ramsey said. "There's no battle for who has the ear of who's running for president."

LINK

[Tiger Al 0]

It may not have been banned for having a pistol grip, but it dang sure would have been banned for being a semi-automatic shotgun.....

Sorry, it wouldn't.

The term ''semiautomatic assault weapon'' means -

(A)

any of the firearms, or copies or duplicates of the firearms in any caliber, known as -

(i)

Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);

(ii)

Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;

(iii)

Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);

(iv)

Colt AR-15;

(v)

Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;

(vi)

SWD M-10, M-11, M-11/9, and M-12;

(vii)

Steyr AUG;

(viii)

INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22; and

(ix)

revolving cylinder shotguns, such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12;

(

a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of -

(i)

a folding or telescoping stock;

(ii)

a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(iii)

a bayonet mount;

(iv)

a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and

(v)

a grenade launcher;

©

a semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of -

(i)

an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;

(ii)

a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;

(iii)

a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;

(iv)

a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and

(v)

a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm; and

(D)

a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of -

(i)

a folding or telescoping stock;

(ii)

a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(iii)

a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and

(iv)

an ability to accept a detachable magazine.

LINK

[LegalEagle 22]

sKerry's election to the presidency would have a major impact on gun ownership in the US. He is a weak minded fool who has already proven that he sides against the american people when it comes to their protection. The presidency has a lot of impact on gun control and confiscation. He is the one responsible for nominating SC justices. And weak mindied sKerry would difinitely appoint whoever his anti-gun buddies want for him to nominate. Fully automatic weapons have nothing to do with hunting, they have to do with the second amendment. But all of these anti-gun groups do not care about the fully automatic weapos (these are already scritnized thouroughly) They want semi-auto shotguns, rifles, AND ALL HANDGUNS.

sKerry is in league with these guys and will be defeated by a large number of gun owners and hunters.

LE, if you want to give up your second amendment rights, go ahead. But to believe it can't happen???????

Look at the UK.

Look at Australia.

So what you ar really saying is that the rest of the gun owners in america are fighting for your rights, but you aren't fighting for theirs?

I told you this on the other board, John sKerry is the most anti-gun presidential cnadidate in the history of the U.S.

And like I said before, if the Republicans had a decent candidate, I'd vote for him or her. What good is having a gun going to be when the nuclear bombs start explodin'?

[stoic-one 1,548]

Al, that is the current code, not the proposed changes...