Is our athletic department "too religious"?

[TheBlueVue 177]

I have a question for the OP if he's still hanging around.

What evidence is present at this time that suggests that the CURRENT coaching staff is pressing God and religion on the CURRENT football players?

The original article posted was way back in the Tubs/Franklin days. We've had two new coaches + a steady turnover on the roster and at the OC position since then.

This is an agenda driven thread by those who simply do not like any acknowledgement of religious faith at anytime, ever, period!

Not true. That is a simplistic statement with a tinge of paranoid xenophobia.

And as far as I know, the current staff have done nothing that might spark a thread such as this.

But I agree with the people - including the Oregon fans - who felt Chizik's comments after the NC game were inappropriate.

I couldn't care less what Oregon fans think and Chizik is no longer the coach at Auburn. Take your displeasure up with him. Paranoid xenophobia you say? That statement is definitely in keeping with the rest of your efforts here.

[keesler 5,924]

I have a question for the OP if he's still hanging around.

What evidence is present at this time that suggests that the CURRENT coaching staff is pressing God and religion on the CURRENT football players?

The original article posted was way back in the Tubs/Franklin days. We've had two new coaches + a steady turnover on the roster and at the OC position since then.

This is an agenda driven thread by those who simply do not like any acknowledgement of religious faith at anytime, ever, period!

Not true. That is a simplistic statement with a tinge of paranoid xenophobia.

And as far as I know, the current staff have done nothing that might spark a thread such as this.

But I agree with the people - including the Oregon fans - who felt Chizik's comments after the NC game were inappropriate.

If it doesn't pertain to the here and now, then it's time to move on IMO.

Our coaches have their hands full, they are doing their best to change the culture that hovered over that locker-room last season and they have a huge task ahead of 'em. It's easier to physically change a players body than it is to change the stuff between the ears. Many of our guys played with very little intensity and emotion last year, they flat out laid down and gave up in some of our biggest games in '11 & '12. These coaches have to work on our players attitudes and mental toughness, then the physical toughness will follow.

[AUpreacherman22 3,885]

Very few people want Christians to keep their faith to themselves when they are building hospitals and orphanages and starting organizations like the Red Cross, Salvation Army, Compassion International, Samaritan's Purse, etc. It's when people picket, protest, and boycott everything from Starbucks to Disney "in the name of Jesus" that people do (and should IMHO) wish they would keep their faith to themselves.

[TheBlueVue 177]

Very few people want Christians to keep their faith to themselves when they are building hospitals and orphanages and starting organizations like the Red Cross, Salvation Army, Compassion International, Samaritan's Purse, etc. It's when people picket, protest, and boycott everything from Starbucks to Disney "in the name of Jesus" that people do (and should IMHO) wish they would keep their faith to themselves.

you left out coaching football. Quite a contingency of those making their feelings about that known in this thread.

[walker77 0]

This would be so much easier of an OP to address for most if we were dealing with whether the coach should be allowed to influence the players to eat a tropical blizzard, rather than a banana split. But you bring Christ into the equation and serious, count the cost, decisions have to be made. He said Himself that He was bringing division... knowing many would reject Him...

And I believe what He brings, even to athletic competition, beats the alternatives... and this will be expresed not only in the players, but coaches as well...

[TheBlueVue 177]

The problem with this debate is there are some who are simply too "smart" to fall for the power of believing and the difference it can make in life. They would prefer to win an argument hiding behind the robes of the SCOTUS. To them, just about ANY sort of public acknowledgement of religious faith is simply unacceptable. Funny that I have no problem with those who do not believe or who are agnostic but they sure as hell have a problem with those who do believe. Funny how it works out that way! I don't think this staff has done one thing that would precipitate a 30 page debate but here we are. Oh well...it is what it is!

[Weegle777 78]

And now it's a land-grant state college. Back then, it was a private liberal-arts school. At the time they were still teaching blood-letting as proper medical treatment and women weren't allowed in.

Things change, and frankly, things get better.

I guess you opinion of better and mine must differ. I certainly don't think that the world has become a better place in the years since the U.S. Supreme Court's decision to ban prayer in schools. We now have to regularly deal with school shootings. I can't understand why someone that disagrees with a prayer can't respectfully remain silent for a few minutes even if they chose not to pray.

The SCOTUS didn't ban prayer in schools. Anyone who wants to pray is school is perfectly free to do so. What it banned is organized prayer initiated by those in a position of authority. I have already explained why this is inappropriate, although from your last sentence it is apparent you don't agree with my reasoning.

I suspect even you would get a little uncomfortable if children had to sit through just any prayer (Islam, voo-doo, witchcraft). After all, your kids could remain "respectfully silent" instead of getting down and kneeling toward mecca with the rest of their peers.

If you read my posts carefully, then you know how I feel about forced prayer. On the other hand, I find utterly rediculous that any group of people with common beliefs can't hold an organized prayer amongst themselves in a public school.

Ever hear of "see you at the flagpole"?

So why can't the prayer be led by a Christan teacher?

Why is there no longer a prayer prior to Auburn football games?

Because of a gross misinterpretation of the establishment clause, and the ignorance of people believing that the separation of church and state is in the constitution.

Obviously, the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

Still doesn't negate the true meaning of the establishment clause and what it was meant to represent by the writers.

Obviously the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

[Weegle777 78]

I have a question for the OP if he's still hanging around.

What evidence is present at this time that suggests that the CURRENT coaching staff is pressing God and religion on the CURRENT football players?

The original article posted was way back in the Tubs/Franklin days. We've had two new coaches + a steady turnover on the roster and at the OC position since then.

This is an agenda driven thread by those who simply do not like any acknowledgement of religious faith at anytime, ever, period!

Not true. That is a simplistic statement with a tinge of paranoid xenophobia.

And as far as I know, the current staff have done nothing that might spark a thread such as this.

But I agree with the people - including the Oregon fans - who felt Chizik's comments after the NC game were inappropriate.

I couldn't care less what Oregon fans think and Chizik is no longer the coach at Auburn. Take your displeasure up with him. Paranoid xenophobia you say? That statement is definitely in keeping with the rest of your efforts here.

Glad I'm not the only one that sees through this guy.

[TheBlueVue 177]

And now it's a land-grant state college. Back then, it was a private liberal-arts school. At the time they were still teaching blood-letting as proper medical treatment and women weren't allowed in.

Things change, and frankly, things get better.

I guess you opinion of better and mine must differ. I certainly don't think that the world has become a better place in the years since the U.S. Supreme Court's decision to ban prayer in schools. We now have to regularly deal with school shootings. I can't understand why someone that disagrees with a prayer can't respectfully remain silent for a few minutes even if they chose not to pray.

The SCOTUS didn't ban prayer in schools. Anyone who wants to pray is school is perfectly free to do so. What it banned is organized prayer initiated by those in a position of authority. I have already explained why this is inappropriate, although from your last sentence it is apparent you don't agree with my reasoning.

I suspect even you would get a little uncomfortable if children had to sit through just any prayer (Islam, voo-doo, witchcraft). After all, your kids could remain "respectfully silent" instead of getting down and kneeling toward mecca with the rest of their peers.

If you read my posts carefully, then you know how I feel about forced prayer. On the other hand, I find utterly rediculous that any group of people with common beliefs can't hold an organized prayer amongst themselves in a public school.

Ever hear of "see you at the flagpole"?

So why can't the prayer be led by a Christan teacher?

Why is there no longer a prayer prior to Auburn football games?

Because of a gross misinterpretation of the establishment clause, and the ignorance of people believing that the separation of church and state is in the constitution.

Obviously, the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

Still doesn't negate the true meaning of the establishment clause and what it was meant to represent by the writers.

Obviously the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

But it is..

[AUpreacherman22 3,885]

Fwiw, I have been able to preach the gospel and lead prayer at local public schools. It is legal as long as it is a voluntary student lead organization and a student invites me to come and participate.

[Tiger 8,825]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

[TheBlueVue 177]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

[AU64 10,122]

Gee.....I've been out of town a week and was certain that when I got back, the folks posting here would have decided this question one way or the other.....but here it is...people still commenting and adding pages to the thread. Maybe it's time to take a vote and them move on.

[Mikey 16,598]

Hey, Tiger-I like the avatar! That must be a '60's Aubie, he's a stoner fer sure.

[jared52 4,354]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

There were people saying some comments were offensive and other asking those people to direct them to the offensive comments. What would be helpful to those asking which comments were offensive to know that some people take offense at the mear idea that someone doesn't believe the same way they do. It's basic human nature to want to be accepted and validated and when someone threatens those things, we get offended. It's the same when someone who is homosexual hears someone who believe homosexuality to be a sin say so. It's someone not validating their belief system. So if someone says, "Your God doesn't exist," it becomes offensive to the hearer.

[TheBlueVue 177]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

There were people saying some comments were offensive and other asking those people to direct them to the offensive comments. What would be helpful to those asking which comments were offensive to know that some people take offense at the mear idea that someone doesn't believe the same way they do. It's basic human nature to want to be accepted and validated and when someone threatens those things, we get offended. It's the same when someone who is homosexual hears someone who believe homosexuality to be a sin say so. It's someone not validating their belief system. So if someone says, "Your God doesn't exist," it becomes offensive to the hearer.

Is everyone in the world actively seeking to be offended? I mean it sure seems to me that everyone is offended by something. I'm not offended by anything. I'm not so quick to point out things as sins, however, I reserve the right to think some things are down right perverse.

[telling tiger 156]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

There were people saying some comments were offensive and other asking those people to direct them to the offensive comments. What would be helpful to those asking which comments were offensive to know that some people take offense at the mear idea that someone doesn't believe the same way they do. It's basic human nature to want to be accepted and validated and when someone threatens those things, we get offended. It's the same when someone who is homosexual hears someone who believe homosexuality to be a sin say so. It's someone not validating their belief system. So if someone says, "Your God doesn't exist," it becomes offensive to the hearer.

Far too rational for this thread, good work.

[jared52 4,354]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

There were people saying some comments were offensive and other asking those people to direct them to the offensive comments. What would be helpful to those asking which comments were offensive to know that some people take offense at the mear idea that someone doesn't believe the same way they do. It's basic human nature to want to be accepted and validated and when someone threatens those things, we get offended. It's the same when someone who is homosexual hears someone who believe homosexuality to be a sin say so. It's someone not validating their belief system. So if someone says, "Your God doesn't exist," it becomes offensive to the hearer.

Is everyone in the world actively seeking to be offended? I mean it sure seems to me that everyone is offended by something. I'm not offended by anything. I'm not so quick to point out things as sins, however, I reserve the right to think some things are down right perverse.

I guess it depends on how tightly you hold on to the things of this world that determine whether you (meaning any one, not just you Vue) get offended.

[TheBlueVue 177]

There's nothing wrong with this thread, if you are offended then DON'T READ IT ANYMORE....

Has anyone indicated that they're offended? I haven't read the entire thread but I don't recall having seen that post.

There were people saying some comments were offensive and other asking those people to direct them to the offensive comments. What would be helpful to those asking which comments were offensive to know that some people take offense at the mear idea that someone doesn't believe the same way they do. It's basic human nature to want to be accepted and validated and when someone threatens those things, we get offended. It's the same when someone who is homosexual hears someone who believe homosexuality to be a sin say so. It's someone not validating their belief system. So if someone says, "Your God doesn't exist," it becomes offensive to the hearer.

Is everyone in the world actively seeking to be offended? I mean it sure seems to me that everyone is offended by something. I'm not offended by anything. I'm not so quick to point out things as sins, however, I reserve the right to think some things are down right perverse.

I guess it depends on how tightly you hold on to the things of this world that determine whether you (meaning any one, not just you Vue) get offended.

You're probably right. IMO the political correctness movement has spawned a culture of whiners looking for the slightest little thing to get up in arms over. I have no position to defend and I'm certainly not selling anything here but I don't need validation nor acceptance.

[homersapien 11,373]

The problem with this debate is there are some who are simply too "smart" to fall for the power of believing and the difference it can make in life. They would prefer to win an argument hiding behind the robes of the SCOTUS. To them, just about ANY sort of public acknowledgement of religious faith is simply unacceptable. Funny that I have no problem with those who do not believe or who are agnostic but they sure as hell have a problem with those who do believe. Funny how it works out that way! I don't think this staff has done one thing that would precipitate a 30 page debate but here we are. Oh well...it is what it is!

Yeah, those people are a real pain all right. It's almost as if they refuse to accept this is a Christian country.

[homersapien 11,373]

And now it's a land-grant state college. Back then, it was a private liberal-arts school. At the time they were still teaching blood-letting as proper medical treatment and women weren't allowed in.

Things change, and frankly, things get better.

I guess you opinion of better and mine must differ. I certainly don't think that the world has become a better place in the years since the U.S. Supreme Court's decision to ban prayer in schools. We now have to regularly deal with school shootings. I can't understand why someone that disagrees with a prayer can't respectfully remain silent for a few minutes even if they chose not to pray.

The SCOTUS didn't ban prayer in schools. Anyone who wants to pray is school is perfectly free to do so. What it banned is organized prayer initiated by those in a position of authority. I have already explained why this is inappropriate, although from your last sentence it is apparent you don't agree with my reasoning.

I suspect even you would get a little uncomfortable if children had to sit through just any prayer (Islam, voo-doo, witchcraft). After all, your kids could remain "respectfully silent" instead of getting down and kneeling toward mecca with the rest of their peers.

If you read my posts carefully, then you know how I feel about forced prayer. On the other hand, I find utterly rediculous that any group of people with common beliefs can't hold an organized prayer amongst themselves in a public school.

Ever hear of "see you at the flagpole"?

So why can't the prayer be led by a Christan teacher?

Why is there no longer a prayer prior to Auburn football games?

Because of a gross misinterpretation of the establishment clause, and the ignorance of people believing that the separation of church and state is in the constitution.

Obviously, the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

Still doesn't negate the true meaning of the establishment clause and what it was meant to represent by the writers.

Obviously the SCOTUS - and a good many citizens - disagree.

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

Exactly.

[ToomersRevenge 284]

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

What an ironic example to use there.

[homersapien 11,373]

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

What an ironic example to use there.

Really.

He can't help but be amusing.

[Weegle777 78]

I can say that the earth is the center of the universe but that doesn't make it correct.

What an ironic example to use there.

Really. ;)/>

He can't help but be amusing.

What can I say, I do try!

[minister of music 0]

Against my better judgment, I'm entering the fray...

I am a better man than homersapien.

Of all the things I've read on this thread (haven't read it all though), this statement might be the most offensive thing I've seen. As a fellow believer, I implore you with Philippians 2 to consider these words very carefully. One of the biggest things Jesus taught against was those who thought themselves better than others. Most of Christianity's problems stem from Christains believing themselves to be better than others. If anything, close communion with Jesus reveals to us just how disgusting we are, not how much better we are than other sinners.

I sent this reply to Jared52 explaining my post............Don't take my statement out of context.The better man was to back off and stop the division and confusion we were causing by continuing the conversation. Had nothing to do where we stood with God. As you see i have refrained, he is continuing his devil advocacating,dividing and causing hurt in a thread that does not need to be continued on the football forum...Respectfully

Pastor Ricky Aldridge.