Tank Angle Route

[AUght2win 6,883]

Not to make you guys sicker, but I think Tank scores on the angle route out of the backfield. Bo never looked his way. 

[W.E.D 11,070]

5 minutes ago, AUght2win said:

Bo never looked his way. 

That was b/c it was predetermined before the snap.  Either by Bo or Harsin/Bobo, we don't know which.  I can't be convinced otherwise that this was a 1 read play from the start.  I posted a few screen shots in the other thread talking about the fade.  As soon as he gets the ball he's already throwing it to the EZ, Tank wasn't even close to the LOS by the time it's released.  It was 1.44s from snap to release.

A fake or look off fade back to Tank would have been a pretty incredible play.

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

17 minutes ago, AUght2win said:

Not to make you guys sicker, but I think Tank scores on the angle route out of the backfield. Bo never looked his way. 

That's a better angle than from the endzone showing how Tank was the only option not blanketed. He scores there with a decent throw.

The fade is just too low percentage there for my liking. 

The read on that side of the field says to throw the fade bc the LBs are there in coverage and the slant wasn't gonna hit. Still, not even a good design with no natural rub bc of the formation. 

LBs stayed back so the progression should have been quickly flipped to wide side of the field. For whatever reason predetermined or bad presnap read, it didn't happen. Bo had the time tho.

[WFE12 9,191]

So that's why he was pissed

[im4aual 488]

Almost looks like we're just trying to draw an interference penalty to get four tries from the one.  

[TigerPAC 985]

i am no OC, but would it not have been better for Kobe to delay then run behind Jackson, almost like a rub-pick?

it does seem that trying to get PI was the objective because no way ball was going to be caught, but surely no coach would try that instead of trying to score with your best player.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

Eh, this is a poor way to break down screen grabs.  At the time Bo is releasing the ball, Tank isn't even past the LOS yet.  When you see Tank open over the middle, the ball is already in the air and defenders are going towards it.

Hard to tell how PSU plays it if Bo still has the ball at that point.  In fact, in the 2nd screen shot you can clearly see the LB sitting there right over the middle where Tank would have been.

Edited September 20, 2021 by Brad_ATX

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

2 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Eh, this is a poor way to break down screen grabs.  At the time Bo is releasing the ball, Tank isn't even passed the LOS yet.  When you see Tank open over the middle, the ball is already in the air and defenders are going towards it.

Hard to tell how PSU plays it if Bo still has the ball at that point.

Good point. 

[Randman5000 4,235]

He would have had to make a play.. a spin probably gets in... But no body has beaten their man in these shots. .. maybe TE if it's a laser..

It looks like we are running a rub route but the ball looks like fade.. a fade is not a high percentage pass unless there is no doubt they can get to the spot... Which in my opinion works for the wide side of the field. the dump to tank is a better option, I like tank to at least make the play. 

 

Edited September 20, 2021 by Randman5000

[AUght2win 6,883]

5 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Eh, this is a poor way to break down screen grabs.  At the time Bo is releasing the ball, Tank isn't even past the LOS yet.  When you see Tank open over the middle, the ball is already in the air and defenders are going towards it.

Hard to tell how PSU plays it if Bo still has the ball at that point.  In fact, in the 2nd screen shot you can clearly see the LB sitting there right over the middle where Tank would have been.

True but it looks like zone. If Bo doesn't telegraph it I think Tank shakes the LB for an easy score. Imagine being that LB in the middle of the field, flat footed, assigned with not letting Tank get a window from 2 yards out. 

[W.E.D 11,070]

2 minutes ago, AUght2win said:

True but it looks like zone. If Bo doesn't telegraph it I think Tank shakes the LB for an easy score. Imagine being that LB in the middle of the field, flat footed, assigned with not letting Tank get a window from 2 yards out. 

It wouldn't have been flat footed b/c he'd have time to react towards Tank as the ball is throw.  There would be a solid collision at or near the goal line, IMO.  I'd take may chance with Tank vs a fade with no rub/pick.

There might have been 5 options on that play b/c 5 players went out into a passing formation, but I'm not sure how your run a short side of the field fade w/out it being a quick throw.  You either just don't go there or intentionally look of the defense then quickly come back to 4.  I'm not sure Bo has that in him right now.

[e808 3,028]

Idk how their defense is set Tank would have had to run over two maybe 3 guys but I would have taken those odds. Honestly just looking at the play they had the perfect defense for the play call other than Tank .

Edited September 20, 2021 by e808

[Auhud08 596]

Honestly the biggest problem with this play is that noone is in the back of the endzone. Every db is within a yard of the goalline. Things get tight down there. You got to spread them out and misdirect as much as possible. Wouldve loved to have seen a backside TE option with a swing pass to tank as an option. Run everyone else across the open side to the short side. Let bo scramble a little and see if we can find a gap

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

The right play call in the situation is either a zone read run or a roll out pass similar to the Jon Gruden's famed Spider 2 Y Banana to give better options.  Play design below.

 

[keesler 5,931]

38 minutes ago, TigerPAC said:

i am no OC, but would it not have been better for Kobe to delay then run behind Jackson, almost like a rub-pick?

it does seem that trying to get PI was the objective because no way ball was going to be caught, but surely no coach would try that instead of trying to score with your best player.

[au302 2,669]

Harsin has gone out of his way to talk about how it was a good call and that there were options on the play. He did it again today. Seems to me like he is trying to say that Bo made the wrong read, whether pre-snap or what not, without straight up saying it so that he doesn't throw his QB under the rug and create another PR crisis. 

[TigerPAC 985]

problem, to me, is there were no good/great options....and when you MUST score a td, need something better than what we ran.  tank is/was the best "option" but as stated above, all of our receivers in patterns are essentially in the same distance and not moving much.  i would've taken drop off to tank any day, but then he has to beat 2 defenders waiting on him.  oh well, it's over.  gotta go focus on worldbeaters GA st

[keesler 5,931]

5 minutes ago, au302 said:

Harsin has gone out of his way to talk about how it was a good call and that there were options on the play. He did it again today. Seems to me like he is trying to say that Bo made the wrong read, whether pre-snap or what not, without straight up saying it so that he doesn't throw his QB under the rug and create another PR crisis. 

I just heard him on a sports talk interview, he basically put the onus on Bo.  By simply stating there were other options on that play that leaves only 1 captain in charge to make that critical call and that was Bo.  

NOW, against a top 10 team, on the road, with the game on the line, in front of a loud & rowdy crowd that's jacked up to deafening levels cheering their defense....is it wise to give your QB multiple options/decisions he must make in a critical goal line situation like that? 

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

58 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

It wouldn't have been flat footed b/c he'd have time to react towards Tank as the ball is throw.  There would be a solid collision at or near the goal line, IMO.  I'd take may chance with Tank vs a fade with no rub/pick.

There might have been 5 options on that play b/c 5 players went out into a passing formation, but I'm not sure how your run a short side of the field fade w/out it being a quick throw.  You either just don't go there or intentionally look of the defense then quickly come back to 4.  I'm not sure Bo has that in him right now.

It's a split field concept. Read is one side or the other.

38 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

The right play call in the situation is either a zone read run or a roll out pass similar to the Jon Gruden's famed Spider 2 Y Banana to give better options.  Play design below.

 

Absolutely or something more along the lines of the rub Clemson used against Bama.

Edited September 20, 2021 by ValleyTiger

[W.E.D 11,070]

4 minutes ago, keesler said:

I just heard him on a sports talk interview, he basically put the onus on Bo.  By simply stating there were other options on that play that leaves only 1 captain in charge to make that critical call and that was Bo.  

NOW, against a top 10 team, on the road, with the game on the line, in front of a loud & rowdy crowd that's jacked up to deafening levels cheering their defense....is it wise to give your QB multiple options/decisions he must make in a critical goal line situation like that? 

I'd give my QB the ability to make that decision if he's done it before.  I'm glad he trusts his QB, but idk if I would in that situation.

[au302 2,669]

4 minutes ago, keesler said:

I just heard him on a sports talk interview, he basically put the onus on Bo.  By simply stating there were other options on that play that leaves only 1 captain in charge to make that critical call and that was Bo.  

NOW, against a top 10 team, on the road, with the game on the line, in front of a loud & rowdy crowd that's jacked up to deafening levels cheering their defense....is it wise to give your QB multiple options/decisions he must make in a critical goal line situation like that? 

Can't state it any better than you just did. I don't think it's a bad play design, but it was a bad call in that moment. They shouldn't have called that when we have the best RB in the country as well as a QB who is pretty terrible at reading defenses. Can't put the game on him correctly reading the defense there imo

[W.E.D 11,070]

1 minute ago, ValleyTiger said:

Absolutely or something more along the lines of the rub Clemson used against Bama.

Set up damn near perfectly outside the ball being on the far hash.

[keesler 5,931]

Just now, au302 said:

Can't state it any better than you just did. I don't think it's a bad play design, but it was a bad call in that moment. They shouldn't have called that when we have the best RB in the country as well as a QB who is pretty terrible at reading defenses. Can't put the game on him correctly reading the defense there imo

I put very little blame on Bo in that particular situation. Take the pressure off your QB (who's a little iffy reading D's) when the game is on the line and put it on your stud RB. 

[Tiger Refuge 6,675]

8 minutes ago, keesler said:

I just heard him on a sports talk interview, he basically put the onus on Bo.  By simply stating there were other options on that play that leaves only 1 captain in charge to make that critical call and that was Bo.  

NOW, against a top 10 team, on the road, with the game on the line, in front of a loud & rowdy crowd that's jacked up to deafening levels cheering their defense....is it wise to give your QB multiple options/decisions he must make in a critical goal line situation like that? 

In a non-conference game against a stout opponent in the road? Yes. Find out how he reacts now. Find out if he has grown.

[e808 3,028]

I am not the coach but can only go what my eyes see or what we know. The first option was the fade which failed. The second was tank which I like our chances. The other 3 havent materialized yet and would have required the line to block longer. Oh well it’s over. Hopefully it’s learning experience for all involved