Harsin Drama Megathread

[Guest MustardSeed]

7 hours ago, Taco said:

Man it’s awesome we have a thing called the NIL now huh?

Isn’t it downright ironic that pretty much everyone agrees that this is what gets recruits to sign this year but still blames Harsin for the signing day when it’s become extremely clear the ones with the money weren’t going to buy him any players….  How do you fire a guy for not recruiting well because you refuse to do your part thus causing him not to recruit well….  Seems an extremely intentional self fulfilling prophecy and even more reason to believe the PTB are intentionally screwing him over.  There’s too many signs to think otherwise at this point

Edited February 8, 2022 by MustardSeed

[NWALA Tiger 3,535]

This has got to be resolved by Thursday, one way or another.  No way AU trots Harsin out at the SEC coaches meeting without this being resolved... Oh wait, it's AU administration we talking bout, nevermind 

[Cardin Drake 1,886]

29 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Isn’t it downright ironic that pretty much everyone agrees that this is what gets recruits to sign this year but still blames Harsin for the signing day when it’s become extremely clear the ones with the money weren’t going to buy him any players….  How do you fire a guy for not recruiting well because you refuse to do your part thus causing him not to recruit well….  Seems an extremely intentional self fulfilling prophecy and even more reason to believe the PTB are intentionally screwing him over.  There’s too many signs to think otherwise at this point

This is true, but it's up to the coach to get on the same page as the boosters. In the NIL era, it's a fundamental part of job. It pretty much always has been, but now those guys have even more power.  A coach these days has to at least pretend convincingly that their input is welcome.  And if this whole thing was really triggered by Mason's exit interview, the PTB just recognized reality first. At this point I believe the affair rumor.  It's the least damaging way out, so I hope it's true.  But Harsin was never the right guy. Doing part of your job well just doesn't cut it for the money we are paying him. 

[boddagetta09 28]

I can’t be the only one who finds it more than coincidental that Burgess is on the board at GSW, a higher up at AU, was moved to the athletics program three years ago to oversee what AG is doing. On top of that, Jimmy Rane is the richest man in Alabama, the largest donor to AU, and serves on the BoT. Oh, and let’s not forget that our sitting governor, Kay Ivey, appointed Jimmy Rane to run her reelection campaign. 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck……..it might be a coup. 

[jluvah 673]

Ladies and gentlemen, your next head coach at Auburn University…..,……… Kevin Steele

[aucom96 1,638]

1 hour ago, MustardSeed said:

Isn’t it downright ironic that pretty much everyone agrees that this is what gets recruits to sign this year but still blames Harsin for the signing day when it’s become extremely clear the ones with the money weren’t going to buy him any players….  How do you fire a guy for not recruiting well because you refuse to do your part thus causing him not to recruit well….  Seems an extremely intentional self fulfilling prophecy and even more reason to believe the PTB are intentionally screwing him over.  There’s too many signs to think otherwise at this point

Building relationships is part of being a successful head coach at the highest level. Harsin can come in here, blow everyone off and try and run his program like a military camp, but he won't make many friends that way. Now, those friends matter. 

[AcUmen 242]

7 hours ago, AU-24 said:

If you have concrete evidence that he did not have an affair, if there’s a good reason why 18 scholarship players left for the portal, if you know why he can’t get good quality players from the portal to include a portal quarterback rated at least 1-10, why he can’t do better in recruiting, to include missing on everyone on signing day and losing a scholarship wide receiver the same day, why he hired and fired six different coaches in 13 months, why players have gone to social media in disgust and support of him, if you know why he lost five games in a row, first time since 1950, why he gave up the biggest lead in Auburn history, and why he had the talent to beat ranked teams this season, he had the talent and depth to take Alabama into four overtimes, but he didn’t have the talent in depth to do better than 6-7.

1) It is not our job to prove a negative, which is impossible.  It is the accusers job to prove their claims. 

2) Alabama also lost 18 players to the portal. OMG Nick Saban has lost control!

3) I don't know much about the portal dynamics or how he's doing in "recruiting" it.  This might be a fair criticism.

4) Harsin was 18th in recruiting this season.  It's not great, but it's nowhere near awful either. 

5) Harsin did not fire 6 coaches.  Corn was fired during the season.  Bobo was fired after the season (rightly so).  Eason left for his ALMA MATER at Clemson.  Austin Davis left for personal reasons (and made this clear in his statement).  Mason is the only one who left on his own because he was unhappy.  That's only ONE coach who seemed to butt heads with Harsin and decided to leave because of it. Everyone else was fired for being bad or left for personal reasons/better opportunities.

6) Players have went on social media because they're mad they didn't start/play/whatever.  I have seen NOTHING from any of their complaints that makes me say "Yikes, Harsin needs to go."  Even those bashing him also admit "he's a good coach but needs better people skills." Tony Fair went on social media and said "Harsin is performing chemo on the team, he is getting rid of the cancer."

7) Yes, he lost 5 in a row.  MSU was bad.  SC was bad. Alabama was so close, but still a loss.  But you know what? Bobo could not score in the 2nd half of games at ALL.  It was a problem most of the season and he deserved to be fired for it.

It is Harsin's first year in a rebuild.  He went 6-7.  Tubs sucked his first year.  Dye wasn't great his first year.  Chizik was mediocre his first year.  6-7 is not grounds to be fired after your FIRST year.  Sorry, it's not.  If we begin firing .500 coaches after their first year, AU will be a dumpster fire for a LONG time.  NO ONE decent (and I mean no one) will want to coach at AU.

And if we had social media (and an open transfer portal) in 1981, I guarantee you that there would have been ALL KINDS of players bashing Dye. A big part of the problem is this social media, 24/7 gossip age we live in now.  Without it, there wouldn't even be an "investigation" right now.

[Guest MustardSeed]

2 minutes ago, aucom96 said:

Building relationships is part of being a successful head coach at the highest level. Harsin can come in here, blow everyone off and try and run his program like a military camp, but he won't make many friends that way. Now, those friends matter. 

Those “friends” by almost all accounts have been heavily against him since day 1.  So who’s fault is that really?  What this says is we don’t care how bad they want you out from day 1, you better kiss their butts or else. 
Yeah, I take Harsin’s side on this one too. It’s practically impossible to be objective about that from what’s been reported and say he should have been friends with them. It was their doing. 

[Guest MustardSeed]

25 minutes ago, boddagetta09 said:

I can’t be the only one who finds it more than coincidental that Burgess is on the board at GSW, a higher up at AU, was moved to the athletics program three years ago to oversee what AG is doing. On top of that, Jimmy Rane is the richest man in Alabama, the largest donor to AU, and serves on the BoT. Oh, and let’s not forget that our sitting governor, Kay Ivey, appointed Jimmy Rane to run her reelection campaign. 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck……..it might be a coup. 

There aren’t enough bingos or spot ons in the world for this post. Ironically the boards run by PM and the likes never go down these routes as possible causes. They always lay blame elsewhere. Surely this deeply ingrained incestuous hierarchy wouldn’t reach to the “reporters” too 🙄

Nah, it’s not possible that they control the narrative. Heck, someone yesterday even admitted that letting the real cat out of the bag would implode the whole university. I say let it out. This is a house built on sand and it’s bound to only get worse if it isn’t corrected soon. 
Now that doesn’t absolve Harsin if he’s committed a fireable offense, but it sure peels back the curtain to the reality of what we’ve been supporting IMO

[abw0004 10,134]

9 hours ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Nope! Hence me saying maybe people shouldn’t be jumping on Twitter and threatening to riot if Harsin is fired. They’re going to look really stupid if Harsin actually did something to seriously hurt the program and his players.

Judging by how many showed up to his rally at Toomer's Corner, I would say about three people would riot.

[AuCivilEng1 11,045]

Just now, abw0004 said:

Judging by how many showed up to his rally at Toomer's Corner, I would say about three people would riot.

Yea I don’t think people actually will riot. My point is that to shout to the heavens on Twitter that Auburn is slimy and doing something terrible to Coach Harsin is dangerous. 

[DAG 34,034]

So shouldn't we be hearing something today? Isn't tomorrow the SEC coaches meeting?

[aucom96 1,638]

8 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Those “friends” by almost all accounts have been heavily against him since day 1.  So who’s fault is that really?  What this says is we don’t care how bad they want you out from day 1, you better kiss their butts or else. 
Yeah, I take Harsin’s side on this one too. It’s practically impossible to be objective about that from what’s been reported and say he should have been friends with them. It was their doing. 

Harsin knew what he was walking into. It's really not that much different than Saban. You had a stagnant coach pushed out the door, a clown-show coaching search and then Saban walked in. Granted, Saban had much more of a name but he made that program his own and he did it by turning around a top 5 class his first year and on-the-field results quickly followed. Now the guy is bulletproof in Tuscaloosa. Harsin took a not completely untalented team, helmed a season that went on a downward trajectory and a 5 game skid to end, turned in a very underwhelming recruiting class and then a significant portion of his coaching staff walked out the door on him. He's reportedly difficult to work with, he has not sold the program to the fanbase at all and his response to criticism is basically a middle finger. 

I'm not saying the PTB are right here. If they are actively working against him, I hope it comes to light and they are dealt with accordingly, but this isn't an NIL thing. Harsin hasn't helped his own case at all. 

[abw0004 10,134]

Just now, AuCivilEng1 said:

Yea I don’t think people actually will riot. My point is that to shout to the heavens on Twitter that Auburn is slimy and doing something terrible to Coach Harsin is dangerous. 

I agree, I was just making a joke.  I feel like people are hanging on just as tight to Harsin as they did Malzahn.  I don't really understand that since Harsin hasn't really been here that long and hasn't really done any PR to show he loves Auburn to make Auburn fans fall in love with him.  Almost half of the team has transferred out since he took over (36 total), and one of the most respected defensive minds took a pay cut just to get away from him.

Yet you have people like Mane Eazy holding on for dear life saying Harsin will be head coach at Auburn forever.

[AUsome_Tiger11 19]

14 minutes ago, AcUmen said:

1) It is not our job to prove a negative, which is impossible.  It is the accusers job to prove their claims. 

2) Alabama also lost 18 players to the portal. OMG Nick Saban has lost control!

3) I don't know much about the portal dynamics or how he's doing in "recruiting" it.  This might be a fair criticism.

4) Harsin was 18th in recruiting this season.  It's not great, but it's nowhere near awful either. 

5) Harsin did not fire 6 coaches.  Corn was fired during the season.  Bobo was fired after the season (rightly so).  Eason left for his ALMA MATER at Clemson.  Austin Davis left for personal reasons (and made this clear in his statement).  Mason is the only one who left on his own because he was unhappy.  That's only ONE coach who seemed to butt heads with Harsin and decided to leave because of it. Everyone else was fired for being bad or left for personal reasons/better opportunities.

6) Players have went on social media because they're mad they didn't start/play/whatever.  I have seen NOTHING from any of their complaints that makes me say "Yikes, Harsin needs to go."  Even those bashing him also admit "he's a good coach but needs better people skills." Tony Fair went on social media and said "Harsin is performing chemo on the team, he is getting rid of the cancer."

7) Yes, he lost 5 in a row.  MSU was bad.  SC was bad. Alabama was so close, but still a loss.  But you know what? Bobo could not score in the 2nd half of games at ALL.  It was a problem most of the season and he deserved to be fired for it.

It is Harsin's first year in a rebuild.  He went 6-7.  Tubs sucked his first year.  Dye wasn't great his first year.  Chizik was mediocre his first year.  6-7 is not grounds to be fired after your FIRST year.  Sorry, it's not.  If we begin firing .500 coaches after their first year, AU will be a dumpster fire for a LONG time.  NO ONE decent (and I mean no one) will want to coach at AU.

And if we had social media (and an open transfer portal) in 1981, I guarantee you that there would have been ALL KINDS of players bashing Dye. A big part of the problem is this social media, 24/7 gossip age we live in now.  Without it, there wouldn't even be an "investigation" right now.

I agree with every part of this post and I stand by Harsin in that, pending he did nothing wrong and the investigation comes up with nothing. All of this, in my opinion hinges on the investigation. If the university feels the need to look into something then I will wait until that has been concluded to voice full vocal support one way or the other.

[abw0004 10,134]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

So shouldn't we be hearing something today? Isn't tomorrow the SEC coaches meeting?

I sure hope so.  At this rate we may hit 200 pages before we have an answer.  Although, I am glad the university is taking this seriously and taking their time sorting out fact from fiction.  With how serious some of these personal allegations are we don't want to rush to a decision.

[DAG 34,034]

Just now, abw0004 said:

I sure hope so.  At this rate we may hit 200 pages before we have an answer.  Although, I am glad the university is taking this seriously and taking their time sorting out fact from fiction.  With how serious some of these personal allegations are we don't want to rush to a decision.

Well, make up your minds. At first it was a decision was imminent, now it is let's not rush into a decision.

[AuCivilEng1 11,045]

1 minute ago, abw0004 said:

I agree, I was just making a joke.  I feel like people are hanging on just as tight to Harsin as they did Malzahn.  I don't really understand that since Harsin hasn't really been here that long and hasn't really done any PR to show he loves Auburn to make Auburn fans fall in love with him.  Almost half of the team has transferred out since he took over (36 total), and one of the most respected defensive minds took a pay cut just to get away from him.

Yet you have people like Mane Eazy holding on for dear life saying Harsin will be head coach at Auburn forever.

Yea I just don’t see what the guy has done to deserve such love. I really don’t care if he’s out there kissing babies. But he’s done some real damage to the program in the last 14 months. People keep throwing around, “we need a culture change”. Why? What was so bad about our culture. We had a couple of players who had attitudes, but for the most part, Auburn hung right there with some of the best teams in the nation. What we needed was someone who could run an offense, develop QB’s, and recruit offensive linemen. You fix those 3 things and you fix Auburn football. Now the next guy has to do even more work.

[AUx 3,016]

11 minutes ago, AcUmen said:

1) It is not our job to prove a negative, which is impossible.  It is the accusers job to prove their claims. 

2) Alabama also lost 18 players to the portal. OMG Nick Saban has lost control!

3) I don't know much about the portal dynamics or how he's doing in "recruiting" it.  This might be a fair criticism.

4) Harsin was 18th in recruiting this season.  It's not great, but it's nowhere near awful either. 

5) Harsin did not fire 6 coaches.  Corn was fired during the season.  Bobo was fired after the season (rightly so).  Eason left for his ALMA MATER at Clemson.  Austin Davis left for personal reasons (and made this clear in his statement).  Mason is the only one who left on his own because he was unhappy.  That's only ONE coach who seemed to butt heads with Harsin and decided to leave because of it. Everyone else was fired for being bad or left for personal reasons/better opportunities.

6) Players have went on social media because they're mad they didn't start/play/whatever.  I have seen NOTHING from any of their complaints that makes me say "Yikes, Harsin needs to go."  Even those bashing him also admit "he's a good coach but needs better people skills." Tony Fair went on social media and said "Harsin is performing chemo on the team, he is getting rid of the cancer."

7) Yes, he lost 5 in a row.  MSU was bad.  SC was bad. Alabama was so close, but still a loss.  But you know what? Bobo could not score in the 2nd half of games at ALL.  It was a problem most of the season and he deserved to be fired for it.

It is Harsin's first year in a rebuild.  He went 6-7.  Tubs sucked his first year.  Dye wasn't great his first year.  Chizik was mediocre his first year.  6-7 is not grounds to be fired after your FIRST year.  Sorry, it's not.  If we begin firing .500 coaches after their first year, AU will be a dumpster fire for a LONG time.  NO ONE decent (and I mean no one) will want to coach at AU.

And if we had social media (and an open transfer portal) in 1981, I guarantee you that there would have been ALL KINDS of players bashing Dye. A big part of the problem is this social media, 24/7 gossip age we live in now.  Without it, there wouldn't even be an "investigation" right now.

Pretty much agree on the facts. The truth is in between the masses extrapolated conclusions and not binary. Both sides needed to work as a team from day 1, they have their flaws, they wouldn’t, and it got to a toxic/hostile point. This concluded from facts available (of which there are few). It’s gone too far to go back. But nobody wins going forward. Where was it required to be ALL anti  Harsin or anti administration? 

[wcware 1,365]

10 minutes ago, DAG said:

So shouldn't we be hearing something today? Isn't tomorrow the SEC coaches meeting?

🦗 

[abw0004 10,134]

17 minutes ago, AcUmen said:

1) It is not our job to prove a negative, which is impossible.  It is the accusers job to prove their claims.  True.

2) Alabama also lost 18 players to the portal. OMG Nick Saban has lost control!  Auburn has actually lost 36 since Harsin took over.  That is 12 more than when Shane Beamer took over at South Carolina and more than Tennessee as well.

4) Harsin was 18th in recruiting this season.  It's not great, but it's nowhere near awful either.  That was mostly defensive players, which is a problem.  And the guy heading up the recruiting for our defense took a pay cut to get away from Harsin.

6) Players have went on social media because they're mad they didn't start/play/whatever.  I have seen NOTHING from any of their complaints that makes me say "Yikes, Harsin needs to go."  Even those bashing him also admit "he's a good coach but needs better people skills." Tony Fair went on social media and said "Harsin is performing chemo on the team, he is getting rid of the cancer."  I think it is louder of the people that left than the few that are speaking up.  As stated above, almost half of the team has left.

7) Yes, he lost 5 in a row.  MSU was bad.  SC was bad. Alabama was so close, but still a loss.  But you know what? Bobo could not score in the 2nd half of games at ALL.  It was a problem most of the season and he deserved to be fired for it.  Agreed, but Bobo should never have been hired in the first place.  That is the issue.

It is Harsin's first year in a rebuild.  He went 6-7.  Tubs sucked his first year.  Dye wasn't great his first year.  Chizik was mediocre his first year.  6-7 is not grounds to be fired after your FIRST year.  Sorry, it's not.  If we begin firing .500 coaches after their first year, AU will be a dumpster fire for a LONG time.  NO ONE decent (and I mean no one) will want to coach at AU.  The problem is Harsin's ego.  He doesn't think we need to recruit top talent.  He thinks he can just outcoach everyone.  Dye understood the value of recruiting and coaching at a top level.  Harsin is also apparently against NIL's, which will really hurt us.

 

[Guest MustardSeed]

5 minutes ago, aucom96 said:

Harsin knew what he was walking into. It's really not that much different than Saban. You had a stagnant coach pushed out the door, a clown-show coaching search and then Saban walked in. Granted, Saban had much more of a name but he made that program his own and he did it by turning around a top 5 class his first year and on-the-field results quickly followed. Now the guy is bulletproof in Tuscaloosa. Harsin took a not completely untalented team, helmed a season that went on a downward trajectory and a 5 game skid to end, turned in a very underwhelming recruiting class and then a significant portion of his coaching staff walked out the door on him. He's reportedly difficult to work with, he has not sold the program to the fanbase at all and his response to criticism is basically a middle finger. 

I'm not saying the PTB are right here. If they are actively working against him, I hope it comes to light and they are dealt with accordingly, but this isn't an NIL thing. Harsin hasn't helped his own case at all. 

You miss the gigantic key ingredient here though. Bama boosters wanted Saban so he had a much longer leash to begin with. Ours didn’t want Harsin.  We can talk about how the PTB shouldn’t have that much power or how if that’s gonna continue then they should just pick their own coach, but that’s not really Harsin’s fault.  Napier was close enough to know the garbage situation here and said no. Harsin wasn’t.  On the plus side for him, they’re likely about to pay him a buttload of money to regain their power. 

[DAG 34,034]

1 minute ago, abw0004 said:

He doesn't think we need to recruit top talent.

You are full of it now. That is one of the dumbest things I've heard in some time. I am all for bringing Hugh Freeze but this is why I just don't get along with you. You say things like it is fact but in reality makes no sense. If that were the case he wouldn't have went after the Caleb Williams of the world.

[aucom96 1,638]

1 minute ago, MustardSeed said:

You miss the gigantic key ingredient here though. Bama boosters wanted Saban so he had a much longer leash to begin with. Ours didn’t want Harsin.  We can talk about how the PTB shouldn’t have that much power or how if that’s gonna continue then they should just pick their own coach, but that’s not really Harsin’s fault.  Napier was close enough to know the garbage situation here and said no. Harsin wasn’t.  On the plus side for him, they’re likely about to pay him a buttload of money to regain their power. 

I don't miss it and this isn't a unique issue to Auburn. Big money athletic programs have boosters like we do. Bama struggled with the same things; underwhelming hires that split the booster base and had variable support like Curry, Fran and Shula. Florida ran McElwain off in two seasons, both of which they won their division. They ran Mullen off in three. Orgeron won a national title and he was gone two seasons later. Tennessee has gone through a number of coaches. 

We took a big gamble with Harsin. He was basically a no name coach in a smaller conference with no SEC background. We had just gone through a multi-year messy booster fight to finally get rid of Malzahn. Bama went out and got a name who gave their fighting boosters pause and reason to unite. We went out and got a coach from Boise State who doesn't like to recruit and has a chip on his shoulder. The results were pretty predictable given a losing season. I'm not saying all of what's going on is right...I don't really know what is going on. But this is the cost of big money sports. If Pearl keeps basketball at a high level, we'll eventually deal with it there as well. 

[BHDAU1 240]

I'm just curious, after over 100 pages of discussion can anyone give us a list of accusations against Harsin that are backed up by one single supportable and undeniable fact? Or is this list of accusations more like a list of grievances and complaints about how SOME players do not like the way he coaches or treats them.... and oh lets say others don't think he should have lost some of the games Auburn lost like the Iron bowl?

I mean really this is all it boils down to, and are the people that want him out willing to pony up the serious money that it will take to fire him?  Because unless there is some big surprise major F-up that Harsin participated in nothing I have heard even comes close to firing "for cause".  

This dog and pony show has gone on long enough and the people in charge of running the school and the Athletics Department and public relations need to grow a pair and put a stop to all this total garbage in every way they can.  I mean really folks, lets say Harsin did in fact have an affair with a student AND routinely chained his players to a hot bench as punishment for days at a time while whipping them with a leather belt the Public Relations management on this whole debacle has been laughable at the very best, and criminally negligent at best.