Scary Financial Outlook

[Son of A Tiger 561]

The national debt only gets bigger and Bidenomics likely makes it worse. It's scary no matter is to blame. There seems to be no solution in sight with our current politicians.

Treasury just dropped a financial bomb, but Bidenomics means the worst is yet to come | Fox Business

 

[GoAU 1,600]

Yeah, unfortunately most people have no concept of future consequences, and only live in the present.  By the time the masses actually wake up, it’ll be too late.  Consequences that can’t be “fixed” will be upon us.  

[creed 1,637]

Write you representative and let them know the national debt is your main concern.

[Son of A Tiger 561]

23 minutes ago, creed said:

Write you representative and let them know the national debt is your main concern.

I've done that many times but one rep can only do so much. It's going to take our whole crew in DC from the POTUS down working together to make it happen and you know what the chances of that are. It may already be too late.

[AU9377 4,935]

On 10/29/2023 at 8:47 PM, Son of A Tiger said:

The national debt only gets bigger and Bidenomics likely makes it worse. It's scary no matter is to blame. There seems to be no solution in sight with our current politicians.

Treasury just dropped a financial bomb, but Bidenomics means the worst is yet to come | Fox Business

 

The problem isn't new.  U.S. politicians have effectively decided to make the problem and our budget woes into a "too big to fail" problem.  Biden's economic policies are no more or less to blame than any other President.  Until we do what Bill Clinton did and balance the damn budget, the hole will only get deeper.  There is money available to do the things that government should do, including health care, but we have to actually stop allowing lobbyists and special interests to direct who gets rich from the taxpayers.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

Inequality and privatizion are much bigger issues.

 

[GoAU 1,600]

5 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

Inequality and privatizion are much bigger issues.

 

How do you define “inequality”?

I’m not sure how you can say they’re “much bigger issues”, as the debt issue threaten the very existence of our nation.   Inequality and privatization can’t exist if there isn’t a functioning nation (or at least a functioning currency / economy) to begin with. 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

19 hours ago, GoAU said:

How do you define “inequality”?

I’m not sure how you can say they’re “much bigger issues”, as the debt issue threaten the very existence of our nation.   Inequality and privatization can’t exist if there isn’t a functioning nation (or at least a functioning currency / economy) to begin with. 

No, that is just your opinion.  We are the most powerful (economically, financially, militarily) nation in history.  We have the world reserve currency.

What do you believe our "credit limit" should be based upon?

What percentage of our potential economic capacity is being utilized?  Economic/productive capacity is a less emotional, more practical measure of ability to handle debt.

Your second sentence is just dumb.  Inequality shrinks the tax base.  It fuels financialization over productivity, exploitation over fair value exchange.  Privitazation has "shrunk" the size of government by some metrics while,,, producing this extraordinary debt.  Financialization is fueling inequality, privitazation and,,, debt.

[GoAU 1,600]

2 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

No, that is just your opinion.  We are the most powerful (economically, financially, militarily) nation in history.  We have the world reserve currency.

What do you believe our "credit limit" should be based upon?

What percentage of our potential economic capacity is being utilized?  Economic/productive capacity is a less emotional, more practical measure of ability to handle debt.

Your second sentence is just dumb.  Inequality shrinks the tax base.  It fuels financialization over productivity, exploitation over fair value exchange.  Privitazation has "shrunk" the size of government by some metrics while,,, producing this extraordinary debt.  Financialization is fueling inequality, privitazation and,,, debt.

You are correct that it is my opinion, that allowing our national debt to spiral out of control can threaten the existence of our nation.  I will also stand by that opinion.

The biggest concern I have about our "credit limit" is the fact that the unprecedented growth of our national debt, combined with high interest rates will raise the interest payments on our national debt from $475 Billion in 2022 to $1.4 Trillion by 2032.   We cannot continue to just growth our debt and assume that it will just go away.   The size of this hole is immense and needs to be addressed immediately.   A truly balanced budget should be a requirement instead of these continuing spending resolutions.

I can't even begin to unpack your hypothetical comments about inequity until you define it.   What exactly do you define inequity as, and how do you propose to eliminate it?

[icanthearyou 4,463]

4 hours ago, GoAU said:

You are correct that it is my opinion, that allowing our national debt to spiral out of control can threaten the existence of our nation.  I will also stand by that opinion.

The biggest concern I have about our "credit limit" is the fact that the unprecedented growth of our national debt, combined with high interest rates will raise the interest payments on our national debt from $475 Billion in 2022 to $1.4 Trillion by 2032.   We cannot continue to just growth our debt and assume that it will just go away.   The size of this hole is immense and needs to be addressed immediately.   A truly balanced budget should be a requirement instead of these continuing spending resolutions.

I can't even begin to unpack your hypothetical comments about inequity until you define it.   What exactly do you define inequity as, and how do you propose to eliminate it?

If the debt is the existential problem,,, what do you want to do?  Raise taxes?  Cut military spending?  Steal from Americans by virtue of Social Security cuts? 

If we remain a financial based rather than production based economy,,, debt must increase.  The only options are the ones above.  

We must broaden our economy, our tax base.  This means promoting greater equality.  I am sure you can figure out the meaning of equality.

[GoAU 1,600]

17 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

If the debt is the existential problem,,, what do you want to do?  Raise taxes?  Cut military spending?  Steal from Americans by virtue of Social Security cuts? 

If we remain a financial based rather than production based economy,,, debt must increase.  The only options are the ones above.  

We must broaden our economy, our tax base.  This means promoting greater equality.  I am sure you can figure out the meaning of equality.

Are you saying you don’t think debt is a problem?  I don’t think raising taxes is necessarily the answer, but modification of taxes is always an option.  For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes.  Where are the people who cry “Fair Share” on that?  I am not advocating for crushing taxes at all, but some semblance of chipping in helps.  You mention “Stealing from Americans” on SS, but taxes in general are just government stealing.  There are a ton of garbage expenditures our government makes in non critical areas (research R. Paul’s list for starters) - start there.  Cut all of that.   Then investigate all of the money we send other nations.  Eliminate any that are to countries that aren’t our strongest ally’s or don’t benefit us directly.  There is no need for us to pay for everything all the time.  A great example is the current situation in Israel - why are we sending money to both sides of the same war?

The US needs to remain a production based economy.  I am a huge supporter of manufacturing in the US, but I’d be concerned you would find factory jobs as “exploiting” people unless they make completely unrealistic wages?  

As for “equality” there are a ton of different  ways that can be interpreted.  You tout that all the time, and I’m truly curious as to what you mean.   Equality of opportunity or equality of outcomes?   True communism?  Do you want to hamper those that work hard and take chances to make them equal to those that are lazy?   Or should I just guess what you mean?  

[autigeremt 6,635]

8 hours ago, GoAU said:

Are you saying you don’t think debt is a problem?  I don’t think raising taxes is necessarily the answer, but modification of taxes is always an option.  For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes.  Where are the people who cry “Fair Share” on that?  I am not advocating for crushing taxes at all, but some semblance of chipping in helps.  You mention “Stealing from Americans” on SS, but taxes in general are just government stealing.  There are a ton of garbage expenditures our government makes in non critical areas (research R. Paul’s list for starters) - start there.  Cut all of that.   Then investigate all of the money we send other nations.  Eliminate any that are to countries that aren’t our strongest ally’s or don’t benefit us directly.  There is no need for us to pay for everything all the time.  A great example is the current situation in Israel - why are we sending money to both sides of the same war?

The US needs to remain a production based economy.  I am a huge supporter of manufacturing in the US, but I’d be concerned you would find factory jobs as “exploiting” people unless they make completely unrealistic wages?  

As for “equality” there are a ton of different  ways that can be interpreted.  You tout that all the time, and I’m truly curious as to what you mean.   Equality of opportunity or equality of outcomes?   True communism?  Do you want to hamper those that work hard and take chances to make them equal to those that are lazy?   Or should I just guess what you mean?  

Just guess. It’s the closest thing to what’s being put in front of you. It’s opinions v/s opinions with some facts sprinkled in. 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

21 hours ago, GoAU said:

Are you saying you don’t think debt is a problem?  I don’t think raising taxes is necessarily the answer, but modification of taxes is always an option.  For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes.  Where are the people who cry “Fair Share” on that?  I am not advocating for crushing taxes at all, but some semblance of chipping in helps.  You mention “Stealing from Americans” on SS, but taxes in general are just government stealing.  There are a ton of garbage expenditures our government makes in non critical areas (research R. Paul’s list for starters) - start there.  Cut all of that.   Then investigate all of the money we send other nations.  Eliminate any that are to countries that aren’t our strongest ally’s or don’t benefit us directly.  There is no need for us to pay for everything all the time.  A great example is the current situation in Israel - why are we sending money to both sides of the same war?

The US needs to remain a production based economy.  I am a huge supporter of manufacturing in the US, but I’d be concerned you would find factory jobs as “exploiting” people unless they make completely unrealistic wages?  

As for “equality” there are a ton of different  ways that can be interpreted.  You tout that all the time, and I’m truly curious as to what you mean.   Equality of opportunity or equality of outcomes?   True communism?  Do you want to hamper those that work hard and take chances to make them equal to those that are lazy?   Or should I just guess what you mean?  

The utter stupidity of these three sentences should be obvious and,,, should tell you why you are wrong.

 

[GoAU 1,600]

4 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

The utter stupidity of these three sentences should be obvious and,,, should tell you why you are wrong.

 

If you think expecting everyone to pay some amount of taxes is completely unreasonable, you're the stupid one.  I'm not advocating the same percentage for everyone, but having a huge portion of the population taking more than they are contributing makes ZERO sense.  But, it fits your communist / socialist manifesto just fine, right?  Scream about "equality (which you have still failed to define), but expect the "rick" to pay all the bills.

[DKW 86 7,425]

One day in the future, the US Govt is going to simply write-off so much in debt it will make your head spin...

It is going to happen, and will become our business model...

Edited November 5, 2023 by DKW 86

[icanthearyou 4,463]

13 hours ago, GoAU said:

If you think expecting everyone to pay some amount of taxes is completely unreasonable, you're the stupid one.  I'm not advocating the same percentage for everyone, but having a huge portion of the population taking more than they are contributing makes ZERO sense.  But, it fits your communist / socialist manifesto just fine, right?  Scream about "equality (which you have still failed to define), but expect the "rick" to pay all the bills.

Hard to believe you are this stupid.  Or,,,are you simply this unaware and inhumane?

[GoAU 1,600]

5 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

Hard to believe you are this stupid.  Or,,,are you simply this unaware and inhumane?

I feel exactly the same about you.  This issue isn’t whether or not either of us is inhumane, it’s how to best address the problem.  
 

I feel that enslaving people through government handouts, squashing drive and innovation by holding those people back, and giving more and more power to the government is inhumane.  
 

Look, your ideas of financial “equality” for all sound great on the surface, but aren’t even remotely practical.  The bottom line is there are people out there that work harder, take chances, and frankly are smarter and more intuitive than others.   Holding them back so that others without the same drive or work ethic is inhumane.  
 

The best we can hope to do is get as close as we can to providing equal opportunity for people to do well for themselves, but they need to put in the work to do it for themselves.   

[icanthearyou 4,463]

5 minutes ago, GoAU said:

I feel exactly the same about you.  This issue isn’t whether or not either of us is inhumane, it’s how to best address the problem.  
 

I feel that enslaving people through government handouts, squashing drive and innovation by holding those people back, and giving more and more power to the government is inhumane.  
 

Look, your ideas of financial “equality” for all sound great on the surface, but aren’t even remotely practical.  The bottom line is there are people out there that work harder, take chances, and frankly are smarter and more intuitive than others.   Holding them back so that others without the same drive or work ethic is inhumane.  
 

The best we can hope to do is get as close as we can to providing equal opportunity for people to do well for themselves, but they need to put in the work to do it for themselves.   

No.  You have made your position quite clear.  You do not feel you should pay taxes.  You feel as though the wealthy are paying enough.  You wish to tax those with the least,,, more.

You are obviously an idiot or, inhumane.

You refuse to acknolwledge the taxes that the less fortunate do pay and,,, the regressive nature of those taxes.

You refuse to acknowledge how wages at the bottom have stagnated since the 1970s, despite economic growth and, growth in productivity.

You refuse to acknowledge new highs (and accelerating) inequality.

You refuse to acknowledge the increased share of GDP going to the financial sector.  Or, even attempt to understand how the transition from a production,  to financial economy affects those without assets.

You are too typical of those who have no intellect or, humanity.  You blame the poor and powerless.

You are truly one of the lousiest humans here.  You truly are horrible.

We do not tax people. We tax income and transactions (except financial ones?)  If a relative few are going to take the vast share,,, they have to be taxed.

[creed 1,637]

On 11/3/2023 at 5:29 PM, GoAU said:

Are you saying you don’t think debt is a problem?  I don’t think raising taxes is necessarily the answer, but modification of taxes is always an option.  For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes.  Where are the people who cry “Fair Share” on that?  I am not advocating for crushing taxes at all, but some semblance of chipping in helps.  You mention “Stealing from Americans” on SS, but taxes in general are just government stealing.  There are a ton of garbage expenditures our government makes in non critical areas (research R. Paul’s list for starters) - start there.  Cut all of that.   Then investigate all of the money we send other nations.  Eliminate any that are to countries that aren’t our strongest ally’s or don’t benefit us directly.  There is no need for us to pay for everything all the time.  A great example is the current situation in Israel - why are we sending money to both sides of the same war?

The US needs to remain a production based economy.  I am a huge supporter of manufacturing in the US, but I’d be concerned you would find factory jobs as “exploiting” people unless they make completely unrealistic wages?  

As for “equality” there are a ton of different  ways that can be interpreted.  You tout that all the time, and I’m truly curious as to what you mean.   Equality of opportunity or equality of outcomes?   True communism?  Do you want to hamper those that work hard and take chances to make them equal to those that are lazy?   Or should I just guess what you mean?  

"For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes." 

This is news to me because everthing is taxed. Gas, groceries (in most states), going to the movies, buying beer, etc. etc.

[AU9377 4,935]

I can't help but feel that many people in this country believe that our economy should never experience a downturn, a correction, or any type of recession.  That isn't how economies work.  People aren't entitled to always make more money year to year.  I know teachers that make $65k to $80k a year that constantly whine about how little money they make.  I know an occupational therapist that teaches people how to bathe and comb their hair that makes $70k a year. I don't begrudge anyone making good money.  I just can't help but wonder how we became so spoiled that we actually believe that high salaries don't impact the cost of goods and services? 

 

[GoAU 1,600]

On 11/5/2023 at 3:13 PM, creed said:

"For example, over half of our nation (18+) pay ZERO taxes." 

This is news to me because everthing is taxed. Gas, groceries (in most states), going to the movies, buying beer, etc. etc.

Allow me to clarify, being we were talking about income taxes, my statement was relating to income taxes. Follow the point now?

[GoAU 1,600]

On 11/5/2023 at 1:29 PM, icanthearyou said:

No.  You have made your position quite clear.  You do not feel you should pay taxes.  You feel as though the wealthy are paying enough.  You wish to tax those with the least,,, more.

You are obviously an idiot or, inhumane.

You refuse to acknolwledge the taxes that the less fortunate do pay and,,, the regressive nature of those taxes.

You refuse to acknowledge how wages at the bottom have stagnated since the 1970s, despite economic growth and, growth in productivity.

You refuse to acknowledge new highs (and accelerating) inequality.

You refuse to acknowledge the increased share of GDP going to the financial sector.  Or, even attempt to understand how the transition from a production,  to financial economy affects those without assets.

You are too typical of those who have no intellect or, humanity.  You blame the poor and powerless.

You are truly one of the lousiest humans here.  You truly are horrible.

We do not tax people. We tax income and transactions (except financial ones?)  If a relative few are going to take the vast share,,, they have to be taxed.

This is a diatribe of ignorance.  It’s a run on stream of false assumptions, blatant ignorance and pure lies.  You have no idea what you’re talking about, but that’s never stopped you before, and it certainly isn’t likely to in the future.  
 

Maybe I can interest you in some fundamental reading lessons and you can try again?

[icanthearyou 4,463]

30 minutes ago, GoAU said:

This is a diatribe of ignorance.  It’s a run on stream of false assumptions, blatant ignorance and pure lies.  You have no idea what you’re talking about, but that’s never stopped you before, and it certainly isn’t likely to in the future.  
 

Maybe I can interest you in some fundamental reading lessons and you can try again?

Perhaps you aren't very good at stating your opinion?  However, I think you did a fine job.

[autigeremt 6,635]

On 11/8/2023 at 12:25 PM, GoAU said:

This is a diatribe of ignorance.  It’s a run on stream of false assumptions, blatant ignorance and pure lies.  You have no idea what you’re talking about, but that’s never stopped you before, and it certainly isn’t likely to in the future.  
 

Maybe I can interest you in some fundamental reading lessons and you can try again?

Waste of time my brother.