Ranger12 46 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 As you walk up the steps to the Capital Buildings in Washington DC, which houses the Supreme Court, you can see near the top of the building a row of the world's law givers and each one is facing an individual in the middle, who in turn is facing forward with a full frontal view-it's Moses and the Ten Commandments! As you enter the Supreme Courtroom, each of the two huge oak doors has the Ten Commandments endraved on the lowe portion of each door. As you sit inside the courtroom, you will observe above where the Supreme Court judges sit, as display of the Ten Commandments! There are Bible verses etched in stone on many of the Federal Buildings and Monuments throughout Washington DC. James Madison, the fourth president, known as "The Father of our Constitution", made the following statement. "We have staked the whole of all our political institutions upon the capacity of mankind for self-government, upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God". Patrick Henry, that great patriot and Founding Father of our country said, "It cannont be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians, not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ." Every session of Congress begins with a prayer by a paid preacher whose salary is paid by taxpayers of the country since 1777. Fifty-two of the fifty-five founders of the Constitution were members of established orthodox churches in the colonies. Thomas Jefferson worried the Courts would overstep their authority and instead if interpreting the law, would begin making law. How then, have gotten to the point that everything we have done for over 200 years in this country is now suddenly wrong and unconstitutional? -Rev. Hal Daigre 1st Independent Methodist Church Decatur, AL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CShine 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 OK, all those things exist. Is there some point here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger12 46 Posted December 10, 2003 Author Share Posted December 10, 2003 OK, all those things exist. Is there some point here? If you can't get the point, then I guess there is no use in even trying to explain because your comprehension skills need a little work. You must have not read the last part or had a hard time understanding it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CShine 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Yeah, I understood the last part. It's so incredibly overgeneralized that it could talk about almost anything. Actually, that's exactly what it does. Are you seriously trying to start a discussion about "everything we have done for over 200 years in this country"? Like I said, is there some point here, or are we just going to talk about "everything"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,519 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 For the slow of mind, I think what he's trying to point out is that the way the courts are interpreting the establishment clause today is WAY out of step with what the writers of our Constitution intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CShine 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 For the slow of mind, I think what he's trying to point out is that the way the courts are interpreting the establishment clause today is WAY out of step with what the writers of our Constitution intended. Yeah, that all sounds great. Only problem is that there's no document in existed that tells us "what the writers of our Constitution intended." When we discover one, maybe you'll have a point. Until then, "what the writers of our Constitution intended" is and always has been nothing but guesswork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger12 46 Posted December 10, 2003 Author Share Posted December 10, 2003 Yeah, I understood the last part. It's so incredibly overgeneralized that it could talk about almost anything. Actually, that's exactly what it does. Are you seriously trying to start a discussion about "everything we have done for over 200 years in this country"? Like I said, is there some point here, or are we just going to talk about "everything"? I thought it seemed pretty obviouse, especially the last part. I got it the first time I heard and so did alot of others that heard it with me. But, I will break it down for you. Christianity and God is being eradicated from government for the "separation of church and state, etc" and the Ten Commandments is declared unconstitutional to be on the Alabama State Courthouse, but yet all of that goes totally against what our founding fathers intended. All those Biblical references and scriptures in DC were put there with the consent of the founding fathers. Why do we now say that the ones that created this country were wrong in doing that? That is basically what is happening now. TT, thank you for explaining it in simplier terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanTiger 20,519 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Yeah, it's real guesswork. Virtually every known quote and discussion from the time surrounding the framing of our Constitution contradicts the current interpretation, but you're right. It's a real mind-bender. Tough one to figure out. :roll: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 ranger, all of those statues on the edifice of the supreme court building, namely Moses as that is the one that interests you, are part of a broad work. Roy Moore attempted to single out Christianity and to promote it in the Alabama judicial building. Why is this so hard to understand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,448 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 For the slow of mind, I think what he's trying to point out is that the way the courts are interpreting the establishment clause today is WAY out of step with what the writers of our Constitution intended. Yeah, that all sounds great. Only problem is that there's no document in existed that tells us "what the writers of our Constitution intended." When we discover one, maybe you'll have a point. Until then, "what the writers of our Constitution intended" is and always has been nothing but guesswork. That would be called "The Federalist Papers" written in part by Alexander Hamilton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,448 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 ranger, all of those statues on the edifice of the supreme court building, namely Moses as that is the one that interests you, are part of a broad work. Roy Moore attempted to single out Christianity and to promote it in the Alabama judicial building. Why is this so hard to understand? Excuse me Sir, but the last I heard the Ten Commandments were part of a display area that included the Hammurabic Code, The Magna Carta, The Declaration of Independence, The Constitution, Justian's Code, etc. It was just part of the broader picture too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger12 46 Posted December 10, 2003 Author Share Posted December 10, 2003 ranger, all of those statues on the edifice of the supreme court building, namely Moses as that is the one that interests you, are part of a broad work. Roy Moore attempted to single out Christianity and to promote it in the Alabama judicial building. Why is this so hard to understand? Where go you get that he was trying to single out Christianity? The Ten Commandments are also followed by the Jews. Where did you hear Roy Moore ever say that? I remember him referencing it to our laws and our Founding Fathers belief in those laws given by God. If Roy Moore was doing what you said, then what were the founding fathers doing by putting biblical references on all the buildings and monuments? Why are all those "lawmakers" looking at Moses? So I guess our founding fathers and Roy Moore have something in common then don't they? They recognized the Ten Commandments and God's laws as the ulitmate laws that this country should abide by. It seems that all these quotes referencing God, the Ten Commandments, and even Christ, seem to never get mentioned in the mainstream media or the textbooks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CShine 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 For the slow of mind, I think what he's trying to point out is that the way the courts are interpreting the establishment clause today is WAY out of step with what the writers of our Constitution intended. Yeah, that all sounds great. Only problem is that there's no document in existed that tells us "what the writers of our Constitution intended." When we discover one, maybe you'll have a point. Until then, "what the writers of our Constitution intended" is and always has been nothing but guesswork. That would be called "The Federalist Papers" written in part by Alexander Hamilton. Not true. The Federalist Papers represent the personal opinions of Hamilton, James Madison, and John Jay only. They were written as a sales pitch published in pamphlet form in an attempt to convince the state of New York to ratify the Constitution. They have been rightly recognized as a very insightful body of writings by a few very insightful men, and as such, the Federalist Papers are seen as a very important work of political theory. They do NOT represent the views of the founding fathers as a whole, nor has anyone ever suggested that they do. They are the personal opinions of Hamilton, Madison, and Jay only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Al 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Alright, ranger or anyone else, why is it so important to you that the government promote religious ideologies? Why should this be a function of the government? Why would you want the government to be entangled in the religion of this country, even if you agree with the religion it's entangled with? David, I stood as close to the monument as I was to you at Buffalo's and it is apparent that the primary focus of the monument is the ten commandments, not any of the other much smaller entities on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny AU-92 0 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Yeah, that all sounds great. Only problem is that there's no document in existed that tells us "what the writers of our Constitution intended." When we discover one, maybe you'll have a point. Until then, "what the writers of our Constitution intended" is and always has been nothing but guesswork. Nope, not one document... "The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: 'It connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity." President Adams, July 4, 1821 "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ!" - Patrick Henry God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we remove from them the conviction that those liberties are a gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just and his justice cannot sleep forever. - Thomas Jefferson "Let us with caution indulge the supposition, that morality can be maintained without religion."--George Washington, ca. 1789, Maxims of Washington, ed. John F. Schroeder (Mt. Vernon: Mt. Vernon Ladies Association, 1942), p. 106. "Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports . . . And let us indulge with caution the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion . . . Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail to the exclusion of religious principle." From President George Washington's Farewell Address More for the Perusing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CShine 0 Posted December 11, 2003 Share Posted December 11, 2003 Yeah, that all sounds great. Only problem is that there's no document in existed that tells us "what the writers of our Constitution intended." When we discover one, maybe you'll have a point. Until then, "what the writers of our Constitution intended" is and always has been nothing but guesswork. Nope, not one document... "The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: 'It connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity." President Adams, July 4, 1821 "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ!" - Patrick Henry God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we remove from them the conviction that those liberties are a gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just and his justice cannot sleep forever. - Thomas Jefferson "Let us with caution indulge the supposition, that morality can be maintained without religion."--George Washington, ca. 1789, Maxims of Washington, ed. John F. Schroeder (Mt. Vernon: Mt. Vernon Ladies Association, 1942), p. 106. "Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports . . . And let us indulge with caution the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion . . . Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail to the exclusion of religious principle." From President George Washington's Farewell Address More for the Perusing I can't help but notice that NOT ONE of your quotations mentions the Constitution in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.