Tigers arrested

[Mikey 16,578]

They all pled guilty

They already faced the judge? Link?

That was on the TV news. They pled at a preliminary hearing.

[quietfan 233]

They all pled guilty

They already faced the judge? Link?

That was on the TV news. They pled at a preliminary hearing.

Hope they can all accept their punishment like men, and eventually rebuild their lives.

Hopefully they've learned that much from CGC's influence.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

What did they plead guilty to? If Moseley stayed in the car as reported, wouldn't he be just an accessory?

[cptau 169]

After they were arrested and booked by the police, they typically go to court within 3 days for an arraignment which involves the DA reading the charges to them and asking how they plea. After they plea, the judge can grant bail depending on the nature of the charges, etc. In this case bail was set and Mosely made bail late Friday afternoon. For the 4 players this all happened within 17 hours of the alleged robbery.

I really do not think they plead guilty. Even a court appointed public defender would tell them to plead not guilty. If they refuse to plea the judge can default to not guilty as the plea. A decent attorney would attempt to reduce the charges or obtain a plea bargain even if it is an open and shut case.

Also keep in mind we do not know how many people were in that house that night. A least 3 people in the building were the alleged robbers. if there are 3 or less other persons, it may be difficult for them to prove a robbery took place and that a weapon was used. Their word and against the 3 defendants word. I expect there will be a plea bargain attempt to get one of the 4 defendants to testify against the others. The ones without the weapon would be most like to testify against the weapon holder and or ring leader. They all need decent attorneys at this point.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

A few more details.

http://www.wsfa.com/Global/story.asp?S=14235072

[SouthLink02 8]

I wonder how all this will play out IF:

--McNeil was little desperate for money as he indicated on Facebook

--somebody owed him some money he decided to collect

--he knew he would encounter several people as he tried to collect so he took along some "help"

--the gun was a toy

--he got some money and left not expecting any follow up

--the "robbed" person(s) decided to make up something and call police in revenge

I'm not in any way saying this is what happened. Just saying what if.

You going to write a book about all those 'ifs'?

One thing for sure, I wouldn't come down on these guys as decisivly as some here have without further facts.

Absolutely. But if they didn't play for AU, THEY ARE GUILTY! THUGS! THROW THEM IN JAIL!

[TitanTiger 20,472]

WTVM-TV 9 in Columbus, Ga. reports that court documents show Antonio M. Goodwin, 20, Kowaski Q. Kitchens, 19, Michael A. McNeil, 22, and Harrison D. Mosley, 19, each admitted to five counts of Robbery 1st Degree, one count Burglary 1st Degree and one count of Theft of Property 3rd Degree.

http://www.wsfa.com/Global/story.asp?S=14235072

And the law now is that the driver of the getaway car gets charged with the same crime as everyone else. He may as well have walked in with the gun and taken all the stuff himself.

[Bama My Heart 5]

I wonder how all this will play out IF:

--McNeil was little desperate for money as he indicated on Facebook

--somebody owed him some money he decided to collect

--he knew he would encounter several people as he tried to collect so he took along some "help"

--the gun was a toy

--he got some money and left not expecting any follow up

--the "robbed" person(s) decided to make up something and call police in revenge

I'm not in any way saying this is what happened. Just saying what if.

You going to write a book about all those 'ifs'?

One thing for sure, I wouldn't come down on these guys as decisivly as some here have without further facts.

Absolutely. But if they didn't play for AU, THEY ARE GUILTY! THUGS! THROW THEM IN JAIL!

Just curious. Has the press ever stated who lived in the house? Were they students that the players knew? It just seems strange that they picked a house that several adults lived in and just happened to know that there would be stuff that they wanted. If they didn't know who lived there, they could really have been risking their lives, because a lot of adults have guns in their homes for this sort of thing, especially this day and time. It's a scary thing all around, for the people that lived there, and these guys had to be absolutely crazy at the time to do this.

[Mikey 16,578]

I wonder how all this will play out IF:

--McNeil was little desperate for money as he indicated on Facebook

--somebody owed him some money he decided to collect

--he knew he would encounter several people as he tried to collect so he took along some "help"

--the gun was a toy

--he got some money and left not expecting any follow up

--the "robbed" person(s) decided to make up something and call police in revenge

I'm not in any way saying this is what happened. Just saying what if.

You going to write a book about all those 'ifs'?

One thing for sure, I wouldn't come down on these guys as decisivly as some here have without further facts.

Absolutely. But if they didn't play for AU, THEY ARE GUILTY! THUGS! THROW THEM IN JAIL!

Just curious. Has the press ever stated who lived in the house? Were they students that the players knew? It just seems strange that they picked a house that several adults lived in and just happened to know that there would be stuff that they wanted. If they didn't know who lived there, they could really have been risking their lives, because a lot of adults have guns in their homes for this sort of thing, especially this day and time. It's a scary thing all around, for the people that lived there, and these guys had to be absolutely crazy at the time to do this.

It's obvious that there is a history to go with this story. They didn't just sit around bored and decide "hey, lets go rob somebody". The details of of the background story have not yet been released, but rest assured the "victims" and one or more of the the perps knew each other very well in advance of this incident.

I don't think the players expected the residents of that house to call the police, if they had they'd have done something other than drive straight back towards campus on Wire Road.

[WarEagle84 0]

A few more details.

http://www.wsfa.com/Global/story.asp?S=14235072

"Admitted to" is not the same thing as "plead guilty". They may have confessed to investigators and/or admitted to AU coaches, but that is not the same as a plea for trial. Unless you're pretty naive, you never plead guilty unless you get a plea bargain and know what the sentence is going to be. A straight up guilty plea at their arraignment would possibly subject them to the maximum sentence -- I think I read 20 years -- potentially served consecutively for each count. It would be almost as dumb as the original crime to trust the legal system to be fair.

[mcgufcm 4,096]

No one in the history of plea bargaining has ever known what the sentence was going to be. You have plea negotiations with the prosecution. They recommend a sentence to the judge. The judge accepts the plea. Then the judge, and only the judge, has the power to sentence the defendant. He can follow the prosecution's recommendation or not. Usually, the defendant has an opportunity to withdraw his plea if the judgment is materially different from the recommendation, but the defendant never, ever knows what the sentence will be prior to sentencing.

I'm interested in the details in this case because I would expect a guilty plea to be paired with a withdrawal or reduction of certain charges. As it stands, there are mandatory minimums involved. If some of the charges were reduced or withdrawn, those minimums would be taken off the table which would give the judge a lot more leeway in sentencing. Given that most (all?) of these guys are first offenders, I do wish the mandatory minimums were out of the picture. Most judges have a good sense of equity. They are willing and able to be lenient or strict when the situation calls.

[lovemyAU 0]

http://www2.oanow.com/blogs/aublog/2011/mar/11/44/police-4-au-players-arrested-connection-robbery-ar-1568390/

From Oanow.com

Says they appeared in front of a Judge friday evening...also Mike McNeil bonded out today

Hope they throw the book at em..what a case of stupid!!

[Bama My Heart 5]

I wonder how all this will play out IF:

--McNeil was little desperate for money as he indicated on Facebook

--somebody owed him some money he decided to collect

--he knew he would encounter several people as he tried to collect so he took along some "help"

--the gun was a toy

--he got some money and left not expecting any follow up

--the "robbed" person(s) decided to make up something and call police in revenge

I'm not in any way saying this is what happened. Just saying what if.

You going to write a book about all those 'ifs'?

One thing for sure, I wouldn't come down on these guys as decisivly as some here have without further facts.

Absolutely. But if they didn't play for AU, THEY ARE GUILTY! THUGS! THROW THEM IN JAIL!

Just curious. Has the press ever stated who lived in the house? Were they students that the players knew? It just seems strange that they picked a house that several adults lived in and just happened to know that there would be stuff that they wanted. If they didn't know who lived there, they could really have been risking their lives, because a lot of adults have guns in their homes for this sort of thing, especially this day and time. It's a scary thing all around, for the people that lived there, and these guys had to be absolutely crazy at the time to do this.

It's obvious that there is a history to go with this story. They didn't just sit around bored and decide "hey, lets go rob somebody". The details of of the background story have not yet been released, but rest assured the "victims" and one or more of the the perps knew each other very well in advance of this incident.

I don't think the players expected the residents of that house to call the police, if they had they'd have done something other than drive straight back towards campus on Wire Road.

A guy called into Finebaum this afternoon and said that he was friends with the guys in the trailer. He said there was a party a couple of weeks ago, and the players were there and they saw the safe and must have figured it had something valuable in it, and of course the electronics. He was trying to be helpful but PF was so rude to him, he probably wishes that he had not called. He was trying to tell him that there were no drugs at that party, and Finebaum just kept hammering him. I hadn't heard that somebody is trying to make this out to be a drug related incident, and if they're not PF sure is.

[jw 4 au 526]

No one in the history of plea bargaining has ever known what the sentence was going to be. You have plea negotiations with the prosecution. They recommend a sentence to the judge. The judge accepts the plea. Then the judge, and only the judge, has the power to sentence the defendant. He can follow the prosecution's recommendation or not. Usually, the defendant has an opportunity to withdraw his plea if the judgment is materially different from the recommendation, but the defendant never, ever knows what the sentence will be prior to sentencing.

I'm interested in the details in this case because I would expect a guilty plea to be paired with a withdrawal or reduction of certain charges. As it stands, there are mandatory minimums involved. If some of the charges were reduced or withdrawn, those minimums would be taken off the table which would give the judge a lot more leeway in sentencing. Given that most (all?) of these guys are first offenders, I do wish the mandatory minimums were out of the picture. Most judges have a good sense of equity. They are willing and able to be lenient or strict when the situation calls.

There could be precedence for a possible mistaken confession. I quote the State of Alabama v. Bill Gambini (My Cousin Vinny).

Sheriff: When did you shoot him?

Bill: What?

Sheriff Farley: At what point did you shoot the clerk?

Bill: I shot the clerk?

Sheriff: Yes, when did you shoot him?

Bill: I shot the clerk?

Officer: Dean, we need you out here!

Sheriff: I’m right in the middle of a damn confession here!

(Sheriff and Deputy leave room. Bill realizes…)

Bill: WHOA!!! Wait a minute!!

[AU alum 2]

I wonder how all this will play out IF:

--McNeil was little desperate for money as he indicated on Facebook

--somebody owed him some money he decided to collect

--he knew he would encounter several people as he tried to collect so he took along some "help"

--the gun was a toy

--he got some money and left not expecting any follow up

--the "robbed" person(s) decided to make up something and call police in revenge

I'm not in any way saying this is what happened. Just saying what if.

You going to write a book about all those 'ifs'?

One thing for sure, I wouldn't come down on these guys as decisivly as some here have without further facts.

Absolutely. But if they didn't play for AU, THEY ARE GUILTY! THUGS! THROW THEM IN JAIL!

Slink, you are wrong. No matter who they played for, and yes, that includes Auburn, and they stormed in a house with guns and used the guns in a robbery, they deserved to be tossed off the team. Now, if any further facts show that I was wrong , I will apologize and eat crow. I doubt that I will have to.

[cptau 169]

They may have stated they understand the charges against them. That may be what this TV station is trying to report?

"WTVM-TV 9 in Columbus, Ga. reports that court documents show Antonio M. Goodwin, 20, Kowaski Q. Kitchens, 19, Michael A. McNeil, 22, and Harrison D. Mosley, 19, each admitted to five counts of Robbery 1st Degree, one count Burglary 1st Degree and one count of Theft of Property 3rd Degree."

These are court rules that are being followed in this:

_______________________________________________________________

Alabama Rules of Criminal Procedure

http://judicial.alabama.gov/library/rules_crim_procedure.cfm

Rule 4.1. Arrest without a warrant

http://judicial.alabama.gov/library/rules/cr4_1.pdf

Rule 4.3. Procedure upon arrest.

http://judicial.alabama.gov/library/rules/cr4_3.pdf

Rule 4.4. Initial appearance.

http://judicial.alabama.gov/library/rules/cr4_4.pdf

Rule 14.2. Proceedings at arraignment; pleas.

http://judicial.alabama.gov/library/rules/cr14_2.pdf

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

These guys were apparently just plain dumb, almost as dumb as posters from other schools coming here to butt into family discussions. I have never gone on another school's board and made a post about some problem that school was having. I guess that's just more proof they are obsessed with Auburn.

[cptau 169]

They admitted they did it. That's why they were dismissed from the team too

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2011/03/four_former_auburn_football_pl.html

[WarEagle84 0]

No one in the history of plea bargaining has ever known what the sentence was going to be. You have plea negotiations with the prosecution. They recommend a sentence to the judge. The judge accepts the plea. Then the judge, and only the judge, has the power to sentence the defendant. He can follow the prosecution's recommendation or not. Usually, the defendant has an opportunity to withdraw his plea if the judgment is materially different from the recommendation, but the defendant never, ever knows what the sentence will be prior to sentencing

If the judge refuses to accept the plea, there is no plea bargain. If he does, the sentence is the one agreed to in the plea bargain. You may be technically correct, but as a practical matter, when you agree to a plea bargain, you know what the sentence will be (assuming the judge buys off on it).

I am not a lawyer, and I have never been party to a criminal proceeding, but I have watched a lot of Law and Order. Still, if LegalEagle or someone with more direct knowledge of the law wants to tell me I'm wrong, I won't argue.

[LegalEagle 22]

No one in the history of plea bargaining has ever known what the sentence was going to be. You have plea negotiations with the prosecution. They recommend a sentence to the judge. The judge accepts the plea. Then the judge, and only the judge, has the power to sentence the defendant. He can follow the prosecution's recommendation or not. Usually, the defendant has an opportunity to withdraw his plea if the judgment is materially different from the recommendation, but the defendant never, ever knows what the sentence will be prior to sentencing

If the judge refuses to accept the plea, there is no plea bargain. If he does, the sentence is the one agreed to in the plea bargain. You may be technically correct, but as a practical matter, when you agree to a plea bargain, you know what the sentence will be (assuming the judge buys off on it).

I am not a lawyer, and I have never been party to a criminal proceeding, but I have watched a lot of Law and Order. Still, if LegalEagle or someone with more direct knowledge of the law wants to tell me I'm wrong, I won't argue.

Read closely. You are both saying the same thing. Mcgufcm is presenting a technical (hyper-technical I would say) analysis and WE84 is providing a practical analysis. The result of each is the same.

[mcgufcm 4,096]

I'm an attorney, and I worked in the Fulton County Public Defender's office for a brief period of time. Can I get some love?

[BigSammyK 171]

I'm an attorney, and I worked in the Fulton County Public Defender's office for a brief period of time. Can I get some love?

Not in Fulton County you can't!

[LegalEagle 22]

I'm an attorney, and I worked in the Fulton County Public Defender's office for a brief period of time. Can I get some love?

Strictly platonic!

[mcgufcm 4,096]

Yaaaaaaay!

[Mikey 16,578]

I'm an attorney, and I worked in the Fulton County Public Defender's office for a brief period of time. Can I get some love?

A lawyer expects love? What planet are you on? I do know a bunch of lawyer jokes if you'd like to hear 'em. The best one's about.... nevermind.