For those under the impression that we are overflowing with talent

[easnoddy 0]

The right guys? That may apply to offense and 4-3 vs 3-4 DL, but skill positions are skill positions. They can catch/run/cover or they can't.

[kingofhill1 2]

That's just who is playing. Now do a rundown of who is standing on the sidelines. The ones the coaches refuse to play.

P.S.

Moo state is loaded with 2* and 3*. So what does that mean?

Why? I did a ruin down of contributors. Should I also include all of the four and five star talent that uat has transferred of to North Alabama?

Give us a QB that can spot and hit an open receiver, and we win against MSU.

Also, please note that I said we're in a position where all of our top talent must work out immediately. Having Frost and Westerman not there mentally yet isn't super unusual, but it certainly hurts us. How different would this team be if KF, Frost, Westerman, Florence and Theresie were playing at their full potential (with RT at DB) right now? If M. McNeil were still here? The only likely weakness would the LB corps, and we're signing a pair of studs (hopefully) this year at LB,

If Mike McNeil were still here then I'd know something funny was going on. His last year would have been last year.

As far as the linebackers go, I've posted this before but no one commented on it. I'll throw it out again.

The 2010 class was supposed to be a strong linebacker class. The following were all considered "studs" and most were, at some point in the recruiting process, given the "beast" label. What happened to them?

Holland: starter

Curry: kicked off the team

White: no longer plays due to injury

Owens: moved to defensive end.

Now Owens is still playing and doing well. Holland is still playing as a starter. But think about it, this class was supposed to be loaded with outstanding linebackers. Only one of them is still playing that position and two of them are no longer playing at Auburn.

I am not a firm believer in "stars." We got all lathered up about the star rating of our classes beginning in 2010. So far a lot of those stars have not lived up to expectations. I will definately cut Frazier a whole lot of slack. However, just my uneducated opinion, we should expect to see a lot of improvement by the end of the season. As has been well observed, Texas A & M is playing a redshirt freshman qb and he isn't doing bad at all. I believe our guy has what it takes. He just isn't there yet. Turning on him isn't going to help one blessed thing.

[selias 2,398]

Look at the talent on the roster, not just the ones playing. Why isn't the talent on campus now being coached up? It's not that we're losing, it's the way we're losing. We just got embarrassed by a perrenial SEC bottom feeder. We got blown out by all our rivals last year. We've had a lousy defense for 3 years, heading into the 4th. This team under Chizik isn't improving, if anything, it's regressing. Poorly coached, poorly prepared, and thoroughly uncompetitive.

[auskull 239]

I agree with all of the above. We have signed but not necessarily retained top 15 classes ( In my opinion this has become a real issue). Players don't seem coached up and we just don't have that "take it to em attitude" that we have become accustomed to with past eras. Nobody fears playing us now and we have become less of a challenge for other teams. You can bet that La Mo is coming to town thinking that they can beat us. We are a mess.

[TheBlueVue 177]

I didn't read through this entire thread but I must say trying to point to lack of stars as justifying our pathetic play is just that...pathetic. So, does MSU have more stars than Auburn does? LOL.....stars rates a players potential in HS. I seem to remember quite a few 2 stars that weren't bad...Sen"Derrick Marks, Zac Clayton, Nick Fairley, Mike Blanc, DonTarrious Thomas...the list is endless. Star ratings are for fans to get excited about for those who run the srvices to capitalize on. Coaching is a lot more important than stars. Now before people start to jump on me about the correlation bewteen recruiting class rankings and NC, I understand the necessity of having talented players. All Im saying is, I believe Auburn has more than enough of that to be playing at a MUCH HIGHER level than they currently are...period!

[aucanucktiger 1,809]

The right guys? That may apply to offense and 4-3 vs 3-4 DL, but skill positions are skill positions. They can catch/run/cover or they can't.

Well some RBs can catch and some WRs can block down field much better than others coming out of h.s., yes? Those skills are critical in the Loeffler O making 3* guys w/ those skills more like "the right guys" than 4* guys w/out. IMHO.

[mcdover 0]

Look at the talent on the roster, not just the ones playing. Why isn't the talent on campus now being coached up? It's not that we're losing, it's the way we're losing. We just got embarrassed by a perrenial SEC bottom feeder. We got blown out by all our rivals last year. We've had a lousy defense for 3 years, heading into the 4th. This team under Chizik isn't improving, if anything, it's regressing. Poorly coached, poorly prepared, and thoroughly uncompetitive.

It's all Roof's fault.

[selias 2,398]

Look at the talent on the roster, not just the ones playing. Why isn't the talent on campus now being coached up? It's not that we're losing, it's the way we're losing. We just got embarrassed by a perrenial SEC bottom feeder. We got blown out by all our rivals last year. We've had a lousy defense for 3 years, heading into the 4th. This team under Chizik isn't improving, if anything, it's regressing. Poorly coached, poorly prepared, and thoroughly uncompetitive.

It's all Roof's fault.

Did I miss the sarcasm? How is it Roof's fault?

[AUinfusion 390]

It's talent across the board that people refer to, not just one or two positions. 3 highly ranked classes in a row no matter how ya slice it.

Yes, and that's why I took the time to point out that they're wrong. We don't have talent across the board. How can we have so little star power in the back 7 on D, yet have "talent across the board"??? How can we have exactly one serviceable QB but have "talent across the board" on O? Why don't you take some time, do some research, and find out how many recruits are currently contributing from those highly ranked classes?

Currently contributing? Why don't you re-read my post. Not sure why you think I need to do research on finding out how many recruits are currently contributing, as I made no such mention of the sort either way. What I clearly did say was simply that we've had 3 highly ranked classes in a row, period, and that is the overall talent level people are referring to when questioning why players aren't playing up to their expected capacity, i.e. questioning the coaching once players arrive. Just for fun though, I did a cursory review of the past 3 classes and found that we have signed 77 players overall, with the breakdown as follows:

5*- 4

4*- 39

3*- 31

2*- 3

You are refusing to see the forest for the trees, b/c that makes it easier for you to hold to the incorrect assumption that we have the same talent as LSU/UGA/uat. If we sign the top 5 QBs and the top 5 RBs in 2013, we will have a top 5 ranked class overall, and will have done very little towards making AU a better football team. Of those four fives stars you mentioned, two are gone, one is just coming back from leukemia, and one has not made it onto the field yet, ostensibly b/c he isn't ready mentally, so their are ZERO five star players on the field of us right now. ZERO. Now look at the top rated four star players that aren't contributing:

Erick Mack: Bystander at a shooting, may not come back to football

Roszell Gayden: Couldn't cut the mustard

Antonio Goodwin: Criminal, in jail.

J. Bonomolo: Just never became a great player

* L. Owens: Starting to conbtribute a now after a failed tryout at LB last year

J. Richardson: Never got over the hump with his grades. Sad b/c he was a good player

Erique Florence: Injuries keeping him off the field

C. Westerman: Supposedly not ready mentally, which seems crazy to me

R. Therezie: was playing with the ones, got hurt, now wants to switch from his recruited DB position to RB

J. Rose: thrown off the team

?? has Jaylon Denson played for us other than special teams?

== From here forward is last years class, so you wouldn't expect that many to be participating ==

S. Callahan: Isn't in the two deep

? C. Mckinzy: on the two deep, but I don't see any participation stats for him

J. Holsey; not on the two deep

Jovon Robinson: Gone, possibly for good, due to Memphis area shenanigans

* Kozan: On the two deep, but I don't think he has played. Word is he is pushing, though

T. Nero: hasn't played, listed at third string

?? Has Patrick Miller been in the game? He is supposedly pushing for time ??

J. Mitchel: hasn't played

So that's nearly half of the four stars, and all of the five stars who are not in the rotation right now. Why is this hard to understand? Class rankings DO NOT DETERMINE if you are filling needs, and they don't take into account future injuries, bad decisions, or bad luck. The reason you need to do research is because you keep saying "we had three top ten recruiting classes in a row, so we have the talent", which is NOT true. We have lost a LOT of that talent, and the bulk of the 2012 class hasn't made it onto the field yet (which is not unusual). We have a defensive backfield made up almost entirely of two and three star players, and we really don't have a backup to KF right now. Don't look at stupid composite class rankings to determine where we should be, look at the actual players that are STILL AT AU, and that are in a position to contribute.

[AUinfusion 390]

I didn't read through this entire thread but I must say trying to point to lack of stars as justifying our pathetic play is just that...pathetic. So, does MSU have more stars than Auburn does? LOL.....stars rates a players potential in HS. I seem to remember quite a few 2 stars that weren't bad...Sen"Derrick Marks, Zac Clayton, Nick Fairley, Mike Blanc, DonTarrious Thomas...the list is endless. Star ratings are for fans to get excited about for those who run the srvices to capitalize on. Coaching is a lot more important than stars. Now before people start to jump on me about the correlation bewteen recruiting class rankings and NC, I understand the necessity of having talented players. All Im saying is, I believe Auburn has more than enough of that to be playing at a MUCH HIGHER level than they currently are...period!

Well, if you had bothered to read the OP at least, you would have seen that I said just that, that sometimes the best players start out as three stars. You would have also noticed the title, which is directed at those who seem to think that we ARE playing with four and five star players across the field. We're not.

At no point have I said that the coaches were doing a great job, or that the team was doing the best it can do. I don't think either of those statements is any way true. I'm just tired of people pretending that we have four and five star talent all over the field.

[AUinfusion 390]

Good analysis. One point is that after a year in college, the talent level of most 3* players is coached up to the level of a 4* coming out of HS, at a minimum. So I guess the next question about your OP analysis is obvious. Why ? Why do we not have top talent on the field ? It is either recruiting or coaching is it not ?

We are getting some very highly ranked classes, 3 top 10 classes in a row, so it cant be that. It could be selection of which 4 and 5*s we take, that is possible. That would be part of the selection and analysis process in recruiting. So if we use your assumption, that we do not have top talent on the field, would that not leave coaching up the talent ?

A lot of it is attrition and bad luck. Cam & Dyer were five stars. Both are gone. We've lost a bucket full of four star OL over that last couple of years, and Shon was fighting for his health, which took a five star out of the rotation. We really haven't recruited that well at LB, and at DB we have a four star hurt, a four star playing RB now, and a four star that left the team.

Having a top ten class doesn't mean that your are filling needs or shoring up weaknesses. We could sign all of the top ten RBs and have a number one class, but it wouldn't help us fill needs that much, and it wouldn't protect us from bad luck, injuries, etc.

I don't necessarily agree with your passages I underlined above but that is not important. If you believe that then why is that the case ? What is the ultimate cause of this ? Who is responsible for it ? You have listed things both in your OP and this post that you believe to be the current situation (the effect) but I am not sure you have taken the final step and given us the why (the ultimate cause).

I don't really have an ultimate cause to give. I was just pointing out that we *don't* have a lot of high profile recruits on the field for us right now. I broke down in another response on this thread where some of those players have gone. We've had some bad apples that either left or got arrested, we've had some bad injury luck that has pushed some players out, and honestly, I can't imagine why Westerman and Frost haven't been given a shot yet.

As for having a top ten class not meaning your filling your needs, think of it this way: If, in 2013, we signed the top 8 OTs, the top 8 WRs, and the top 8 DEs, we would have the number one class in the nation most likely. We would also not have a backup QB behind KF, we would still have a defensive backfield made up of mostly two and three star players, and we would likely only have on highly regarded LB on the team. Filling needs is about signing and retaining the guys that fill in weak spots on your team. If we had been doing that, you would be able to point out all of the four star talent at DB and LB right now. You would be talking about KF's highly recruited backup getting a shot. We would be wondering if Jovon Robinson would be pushing Dyer for playing time this year. Sadly, even at a position where we have recruited VERY well, bad luck has hurt us. I can't count the number of highly regarded OL that we have lost over the last few years.

[auburn4ever 1,266]

We're not overflowing.

[jkvogt21 0]

plenty of talent on the field, not enough talent wearing headsets and carring clip boards.... enough said.

[metafour 4,969]

I'm not sure where you're trying to go with this thread. Are you defending the coaches or are you not? The people who are bringing up recruiting rankings are doing so because they are not happy with the fact that our "highly recruited" players have for the most part shown little to no improvement. This is a coaching blunder no matter how you look at it.

[keesler 5,934]

I didn't read through this entire thread but I must say trying to point to lack of stars as justifying our pathetic play is just that...pathetic. So, does MSU have more stars than Auburn does? LOL.....stars rates a players potential in HS. I seem to remember quite a few 2 stars that weren't bad...Sen"Derrick Marks, Zac Clayton, Nick Fairley, Mike Blanc, DonTarrious Thomas...the list is endless. Star ratings are for fans to get excited about for those who run the srvices to capitalize on. Coaching is a lot more important than stars. Now before people start to jump on me about the correlation bewteen recruiting class rankings and NC, I understand the necessity of having talented players. All Im saying is, I believe Auburn has more than enough of that to be playing at a MUCH HIGHER level than they currently are...period!

AU has what it takes to be competitive this year - we have talent/depth/facilities/a home schedule on the good rotation - What's missing?

[keesler 5,934]

Good analysis. One point is that after a year in college, the talent level of most 3* players is coached up to the level of a 4* coming out of HS, at a minimum. So I guess the next question about your OP analysis is obvious. Why ? Why do we not have top talent on the field ? It is either recruiting or coaching is it not ?

We are getting some very highly ranked classes, 3 top 10 classes in a row, so it cant be that. It could be selection of which 4 and 5*s we take, that is possible. That would be part of the selection and analysis process in recruiting. So if we use your assumption, that we do not have top talent on the field, would that not leave coaching up the talent ?

A lot of it is attrition and bad luck. Cam & Dyer were five stars. Both are gone. We've lost a bucket full of four star OL over that last couple of years, and Shon was fighting for his health, which took a five star out of the rotation. We really haven't recruited that well at LB, and at DB we have a four star hurt, a four star playing RB now, and a four star that left the team.

Having a top ten class doesn't mean that your are filling needs or shoring up weaknesses. We could sign all of the top ten RBs and have a number one class, but it wouldn't help us fill needs that much, and it wouldn't protect us from bad luck, injuries, etc.

I don't necessarily agree with your passages I underlined above but that is not important. If you believe that then why is that the case ? What is the ultimate cause of this ? Who is responsible for it ? You have listed things both in your OP and this post that you believe to be the current situation (the effect) but I am not sure you have taken the final step and given us the why (the ultimate cause).

I don't really have an ultimate cause to give. I was just pointing out that we *don't* have a lot of high profile recruits on the field for us right now. I broke down in another response on this thread where some of those players have gone. We've had some bad apples that either left or got arrested, we've had some bad injury luck that has pushed some players out, and honestly, I can't imagine why Westerman and Frost haven't been given a shot yet.

As for having a top ten class not meaning your filling your needs, think of it this way: If, in 2013, we signed the top 8 OTs, the top 8 WRs, and the top 8 DEs, we would have the number one class in the nation most likely. We would also not have a backup QB behind KF, we would still have a defensive backfield made up of mostly two and three star players, and we would likely only have on highly regarded LB on the team. Filling needs is about signing and retaining the guys that fill in weak spots on your team. If we had been doing that, you would be able to point out all of the four star talent at DB and LB right now. You would be talking about KF's highly recruited backup getting a shot. We would be wondering if Jovon Robinson would be pushing Dyer for playing time this year. Sadly, even at a position where we have recruited VERY well, bad luck has hurt us. I can't count the number of highly regarded OL that we have lost over the last few years.

Well obviously there is a problem somewhere. Retaining the talent you bring in is part of a coach's job, developing the players you have regardless of the "star" ranking the kid had coming out of highschool is part of a coach's job, hiring a staff of position coaches that can recruit as well as develope the players is part of a coach's job, implimenting an offensive and defensive scheme for the program so that the team has an identity is part of a coach's job. It's a big job, that's why they get paid the big bucks.

[selias 2,398]

plenty of talent on the field, not enough talent wearing headsets and carring clip boards.... enough said.

I concur.

[norcuron 35]

We have plenty of player potential talent.

Its the talent of the coaches im worried about.

[WarTim 3,457]

I guess it's just "not in the stars" for AU.

[AUIH1 1,515]

Whether we have talent or not for whatever reasons you have given (all of which reflect poorly on our coaches BTW), we have enough talent to be competitive with a bottom feeder like Miss State which again reflects poorly on our coaches.

wde

[lca408 367]

I'm not sure where you're trying to go with this thread. Are you defending the coaches or are you not? The people who are bringing up recruiting rankings are doing so because they are not happy with the fact that our "highly recruited" players have for the most part shown little to no improvement. This is a coaching blunder no matter how you look at it.

Agreed Meta. Hard to see what the purpose of his pointing this out is other than to ridicule people for saying we have talent.

As far as the point he keeps repeating about overall class rankings?

Well, here goes. Yes, certain players at certain positions have inflated the rankings in the past 3 classes. Dyer, Newton, Reed, and Coleman in particular inflated the 2010 class' ranking to get it in the top 5, but that doesn't mean that the rest of the class wasn't loaded with talent, particularly at LB, WR, and DL. Whitaker, Carter, Lemonier, and Sanders were all 4 star DL in that class, players that are all Juniors now. Holland and Owens were 4 star LBs and while Curry was an average 3 star, Jawara White was a highly recruited LB that could never quite make it to 4 star status, even though his offer list was through the roof. Jonathan Mincy was much the same way though I agree that neither Chris Davis or Ryan White were thought of that highly. At WR, Kitchens, Goodwin, and Reed were top notch talent, though certainly Kitchens and Goodwin are gone for good. Still though, Coleman remains on the roster as a back up LT, Owens has been moved to his natural position (which he excels at based on his stats, even though he's still a backup), Holland remains a starter at MLB though we don't know for how long, and the entire D-Line group is still there, minus Bonomolo who never contributed, playing alot.

In 2011, Auburn went a bit more towards defense and its this class that is still in relatively good shape right now. Granted, a few have departed like Thomas O'Reilly and Jonathan Rose but the majority of guys are still there. Kris Frost was a 5 star LB, Uzomah, Bray, Denson, Coates, and Fulse were all 4 star WRs and TEs, Frazier was a 4/5 star depending on who you talk to, Whitehead, Therezie, and Florence were all 4 stars, the OL class was extremely strong and 3 of those guys - Westerman, Dissmukes, and Robinson - were all 4 stars and still contributing if not starting. At DL, Wright and Blackson were 4 star DTs to compliment Whitaker and Carter and both are still here contributing.

Last year, we have 3 casualties - Williams and Hutcherson not qualifying in time and Robisnon gone - but everyone else is on campus. Plenty of talent to choose from on the OL and both McKinzy and Mitchell are 4 stars at LB. Nero is a 4 star DT, Holsey is a 4 star CB, and Louis is a 4 star WR.

At the moment, Auburn isn't really hurting for depth at alot of positions, except perhaps RB or maybe QB based on playing ability. In 3 straight classes, the OL has been shored up with both talent and numbers, the DL is deep with talent and experience, the LB corps is deep with talent but not alot of experience, and the WRs and TEs have PLENTY of talent and numbers to not worry about.

The LBs and secondary are the two areas where the argument is strong on the face of it. No, neither Bates or Evans was highly recruited out of high school, but you can't really say much about Auburn's choice of 3 star LBs Anthony Swain, Justin Garrett, and Chris Landrum. All 3 were first choice guys for Chizik and the coaches during the building of the class, with their commitments coming early in the process and Auburn happy to accept. From my POV, their recruiting ranking had little to do with their worth, considering that they were snagged up early by the coaches, so they were obviously the talent that they wanted. Then there's the secondary, where Auburn has seemed content to bring on board alot of 3 star players who can switch between corner and safety. Several of these guys were first choice picks as well including Jonathan Jones and TJ Davis in 2012, not to mention that Mincy and his long offer list despite a 3 star ranking was also a prize pickup for Chizik in 2010. Demetruce McNeal didn't have the offers that Mincy did, but was one of the first commitments after Big Cat weekend for Chizik, showing that he was a priority as well. From what I can see, the only players that don't measure up in this category are Ryan Smith, Chris Davis, and Ryan White - 3 guys who were added relatively late in the process due to other dominoes falling differently.

From what I can see, Chizik was content to work with lower rated players in the secondary that still "passed the eye test" for DBs to build up depth. Perhaps that happened at LB as well in 2011 and to a lesser extent 2010. Chizik still got the guys he wanted in 2011 in the secondary with Florence, Rose, Whitehead, and Therezie, the only exception being Marcus Roberson who was actually kicked out of the class a day after he committed for still talking with Florida.

You can make the argument that Bates and Evans are low-rated recruits and that's one of the reasons we're underperforming, but when you realize that the lineup behind them is filled with either highly rated players or first choice guys that Chizik and co. recruited, it doesn't hold up all that well. You can make the argument that Bates and Evans are starting because they have to, which may be true, but then you have to explain why the higher rated players haven't shown their talent in practice to displace the other guys yet. Maybe they're not as talented as we thought, or maybe they haven't developed because the coaches haven't developed them yet. Holland supposedly had plenty of talent to play in the SEC and so far, he's been average at best at MLB. In the secondary, players like Davis, Mincy, Whitehead and McNeal have been playing and contributing because of their production on the practice field, and when taken in consideration with how each of them came to Auburn, few can be considered true "back-up plans" at their positions because they were either highly rated or first-choice picks.

The D-Line is the most evident position on the field for this comparison. There isn't a position that currently has more talent and experience in depth that the entire DL. The DEs have a solid 2-deep with Lemonier, Sanders, and Owens as 4 star players, and Ford a 3 star that's playing like a 4 star. At DT, Whitaker, Carter, Wright, and Blackson are the 4 in rotation in the 2-deep, and all 4 were 4 stars. Not to mention that all of the players that I've mentioned have at least 1 full year of experience. While the DEs are performing relatively well, the DTs have been just as disappointing as last year. Why hasn't there been a progression from last year to this year, with fundamentals like proper tackling being at least paramount?

I think the answer is obvious. We recruit the same players that the other guys do. Granted, we don't always get everyone we want, and yes, Alabama and LSU do have more talent across the board than we do, but that doesn't mean that Auburn is not talented. If you really look at it, Auburn has filled it's needs quite well over the past 3 years. Yes, there are alot of players that have taken a hike but by and large, the majority of our highly recruited players are still here, and contributing at many of the most key positions. Should Auburn have run the table in 2012? No, but I think we all expected some marked improvement from the youth and inexperience from last year. Unfortunately, we have a team that is 0-2, and a team that gave up in the second half against MSU. That's coaching, plain and simple. There is plenty of talent to work with on this team. The coaches have yet to exploit it properly, the exception being (Again, JMO) Grimes at OL and Boulware on ST. At least on an individual basis, players should have improved fundamentals and skills from the previous year. That hasn't really happened to anyone yet.

I see what you're saying, but I'm sorry, I don't buy it.

Ryan

[IronMan70 3,277]

Good analysis. One point is that after a year in college, the talent level of most 3* players is coached up to the level of a 4* coming out of HS, at a minimum. So I guess the next question about your OP analysis is obvious. Why ? Why do we not have top talent on the field ? It is either recruiting or coaching is it not ?

We are getting some very highly ranked classes, 3 top 10 classes in a row, so it cant be that. It could be selection of which 4 and 5*s we take, that is possible. That would be part of the selection and analysis process in recruiting. So if we use your assumption, that we do not have top talent on the field, would that not leave coaching up the talent ?

A lot of it is attrition and bad luck. Cam & Dyer were five stars. Both are gone. We've lost a bucket full of four star OL over that last couple of years, and Shon was fighting for his health, which took a five star out of the rotation. We really haven't recruited that well at LB, and at DB we have a four star hurt, a four star playing RB now, and a four star that left the team.

Having a top ten class doesn't mean that your are filling needs or shoring up weaknesses. We could sign all of the top ten RBs and have a number one class, but it wouldn't help us fill needs that much, and it wouldn't protect us from bad luck, injuries, etc.

I don't necessarily agree with your passages I underlined above but that is not important. If you believe that then why is that the case ? What is the ultimate cause of this ? Who is responsible for it ? You have listed things both in your OP and this post that you believe to be the current situation (the effect) but I am not sure you have taken the final step and given us the why (the ultimate cause).

I don't really have an ultimate cause to give. I was just pointing out that we *don't* have a lot of high profile recruits on the field for us right now. I broke down in another response on this thread where some of those players have gone. We've had some bad apples that either left or got arrested, we've had some bad injury luck that has pushed some players out, and honestly, I can't imagine why Westerman and Frost haven't been given a shot yet.

As for having a top ten class not meaning your filling your needs, think of it this way: If, in 2013, we signed the top 8 OTs, the top 8 WRs, and the top 8 DEs, we would have the number one class in the nation most likely. We would also not have a backup QB behind KF, we would still have a defensive backfield made up of mostly two and three star players, and we would likely only have on highly regarded LB on the team. Filling needs is about signing and retaining the guys that fill in weak spots on your team. If we had been doing that, you would be able to point out all of the four star talent at DB and LB right now. You would be talking about KF's highly recruited backup getting a shot. We would be wondering if Jovon Robinson would be pushing Dyer for playing time this year. Sadly, even at a position where we have recruited VERY well, bad luck has hurt us. I can't count the number of highly regarded OL that we have lost over the last few years.

Well obviously there is a problem somewhere. Retaining the talent you bring in is part of a coach's job, developing the players you have regardless of the "star" ranking the kid had coming out of highschool is part of a coach's job, hiring a staff of position coaches that can recruit as well as develope the players is part of a coach's job, implimenting an offensive and defensive scheme for the program so that the team has an identity is part of a coach's job. It's a big job, that's why they get paid the big bucks.

This guy gets it.

[NoALtiger 3,873]

I'm not sure where you're trying to go with this thread. Are you defending the coaches or are you not? The people who are bringing up recruiting rankings are doing so because they are not happy with the fact that our "highly recruited" players have for the most part shown little to no improvement. This is a coaching blunder no matter how you look at it.

Exactly. This guy ranting on and on is giving me a headache. I cant figure out what he's trying to prove that everyone doesnt already know. Our current players aren't producing? Yeah pal, i've seen the games and I get that. Ha!!

[alexava 6,974]

The right guys? That may apply to offense and 4-3 vs 3-4 DL, but skill positions are skill positions. They can catch/run/cover or they can't.

No. He meant grades and character, "auburn men".

[AUinfusion 390]

I'm not sure where you're trying to go with this thread. Are you defending the coaches or are you not? The people who are bringing up recruiting rankings are doing so because they are not happy with the fact that our "highly recruited" players have for the most part shown little to no improvement. This is a coaching blunder no matter how you look at it.

Exactly. This guy ranting on and on is giving me a headache. I cant figure out what he's trying to prove that everyone doesnt already know. Our current players aren't producing? Yeah pal, i've seen the games and I get that. Ha!!

I can't figure out why it's hard to read a title in a post around here. I clearly stated that my original post was in response to the numerous people claiming that b/c we've had 3 top ten classes in a row, we're playing with the same level of (as ranked by the "star givers") talent as some of the other top SEC schools. We're not. I'm neither defending nor attacking the coaches. I'm pointing out an actual fact. Sorry if those make your head hurt.