2015 4* LB Darrell Williams commits to AU!

[AU64 10,122]

I don't get this ...recruiting all-SEC LBs...who knows which players will be All-SEC when the guys are 18 years old and still in high school playing against smaller and slower opponents in most games.

And, I don't understand the claim that we don't get SEC caliber LBs. If I recall, about every recruit involved a pretty serous recruiting battle with other major schools and if there is any validity in the recruiting services we have recruited among the best kids in Div 1. Seems it is more an issue of what happens after they arrive ...and the players getting some stability in our coaching staff....and the instruction they are getting.

So if DW does not get an offer from bama...and decides to come to AU does that mean he must not be an SEC caliber LB?

[WarEagleIn2010 38]

All SEC linebacker is their first choice. Any other is, at best, settling for second best. If Auburn cannot pull in All SEC linebacker, it is a failure. That's how I see it.

Still funny.

[AU80cruiser 1,102]

All SEC linebacker is their first choice. Any other is, at best, settling for second best. If Auburn cannot pull in All SEC linebacker, it is a failure. That's how I see it.

Still funny.

Haha yelp

[The Freak 2,528]

I'll wear it out eventually, lol.

[bg5 536]

I think this horse has been beaten to death, made into dog food, eaten and pooped back out. Everyone gets we need better LB's. Back to any news on DW.

[NoALtiger 3,867]

I think this horse has been beaten to death, made into dog food, eaten and pooped back out. Everyone gets we need better LB's. Back to any news on DW.

+1

[Mikey 16,631]

It begins again is in reference to you analytical skills and not the defense. You display a clear bias in your assessments and analyses. You clearly have set a moving target for success hidden by your vague claim of what other LB's around the SEC do without taking into account the other proficiencies and deficiencies of the entire defensive system. Now you are headed down the path of calling another group of Lb's overrated because they don't fit your moving target. Tre Williams and Deshaun Davis were your saviors last year but now Tre is overrated by the other services because he didn't crack the line up by your set date. I hate to see what you will say if they don't start over Frost and Cass next year.

Mikey what do you do for a living? On day one of that job were you the best at your job? I would bet you were not. You may have had a knowledge to get you "recruited" but you had to learn the way that business works and develop within the ranks of that business. Our defense as a whole as been sub par and I agree with that. Our linebackers this year have been a brighter spot. Two teams ran the ball well on our defense which was UGA and UA. Everyone else had some success against us passing.

Net Rushing Yds per game:

Ark 153 yds

K-State 40 yds

LSU 138 yds

MSU 223 yds

SC 119 yds

Miss 146 yds

A&M 176 yds

UGA 289 yds

UA 227 yds

That ranked 46th out of 125 D1 teams. Up from 97th the year before. That probably would have been better if we could pressure the QB without blitzing said linebackers but that's one of those convenient things you don't mention.

Since our LB's are so bad what are their gap assignments, keys and responsibilities on the Inside zone, the counter, the wham, the power, the toss sweep etc. How did they fail in their assignments on each? Why were the Lbs consistently graded out higher by professional scouts and not by "MISS" (Mikey's Imaginary Scouting Service). The point is, your evaluation effort is horrid and lazy at best. The defense needs to improve but the linebackers have shown significant improvement year over year and you fail to even give them the slightest credit and it is really pathetic.

I hear what you are saying but, to be fair, I think Mikey has been consistent with the standard he thinks is important for the linebacker position. His standard has been that we should be consistently recruiting All-SEC type linebackers to compete with the other SEC West powers that are doing just that. That happens to be true. It also happens to be a high standard but we should be doing just that. By using that standard we fell short this year and that is something that has become a common theme for us at LB for awhile.

A look at the 2014 All-SEC teams thus far bears that out. The LBs making the All SEC teams came from Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Miss St, Missouri, and Tennessee, but none from Auburn.

2014 Coaches All SEC Linebackers

1st team linebackers: McKinney- Mississippi State, Spaight- Arkansas, DePriest- Alabama

2nd team linebackers: Herrera- Georgia, Wilson- Georgia, Morrison- Florida

2014 AP All SEC Linebackers

1st team: Spaight-Arkansas, Ragland-Alabama, Herrera-Georgia

2nd team: Alexander-LSU, Brothers-Missouri, Morrison-Florida, Wilson-Georgia

honorable mention: DePriest-Alabama, Floyd-Georgia, Johnson-Tennessee

A lot of this has to do imo with the development received by AU LBs the last 5 years. We do have talent on the team that is capable of achieving that goal next year. Looking to 2015 I think Frost, Cass and hopefully Tre Williams will make a solid run at becoming All SEC type linebackers. We need to keep them coming at a high level too.

How does a school recruit "All-SEC type" linebackers whom have never played in the SEC? What is an All SEC type linebacker??? Do you not see a problem with this theory? You recruit the players for your system and develop them to succeed in your system and when they succeed they become All-SEC.

This is what has not happened consistently at Auburn for linebackers but lets look at something:

Ted Roof DC- area of focus LB (average recruiter)

Brian Van Gorder DC - area of focus LB (average recruiter)

Ellis Johnson DC - area of focus LB (doesn't really recruit)

Maybe our linebackers needs a dedicated coach who is not multitasking with the whole defense and can devote his time to the linebackers and enjoys recruiting linebackers.

I agree with the point on coaching which is why I mentioned development in my post. I even went back and expanded on that point (see previous post) a few minutes before your post but for whatever reason your quote didn't pick it up. A mystery, lol.

We haven't had the development from the position coaches at the LB position AND we haven't had the continuous recruitment of enough high talent players there, which is the lifeblood of any position. That of course is how you do end up with All-SEC linebackers. It has been sad to watch the proud AU tradition at the linebacker position become neglected the way it has been the last few years. My own point of reference goes back to watching Mike "Captain Crunch" Kolen, so that might tell you something about the proper standard I find necessary.

Mikey, please read this and tell me who put those word in your mouth because it was not me. (It's the bold part) So apparently the people defended your point of view don't have accuracy in their statement. It's extremely convenient to let it slide when someone agrees with your view but when someone disagrees they're out of their mind. At least make it a fair debate and use integrity.

No-one here is dumb enough to think all-SEC linebackers can be recruited without them transferring from other teams, which is unheard of. It's an impossibility and your cognitive abilities are sadly lacking if you think anybody said that. What's been said over and over is that we need to recruit players with the potential to become all-SEC. ("all-SEC potential", "all-SEC type" or "all-SEC material" are interchangeable here) Find a different nit to pick. You talking about all-SEC linebackers that have never played in the SEC is silly and yes, you are the only one talking about that.

[IronMan70 3,277]

I don't have a beef with Mikey. I have a beef with how he verbalizes his criticisms of AU players. Secondly I was speaking to Mikey when you intervened with the point that Mikey was correct in his assessment that we need to recruit All-SEC linebackers. I asked you repeated how do we do that which you have failed to even address. ................................

..........................................................................

I didn't ? This is what I said....

"We haven't had the development from the position coaches at the LB position AND we haven't had the continuous recruitment of enough high talent players there, which is the lifeblood of any position. That of course is how you do end up with All-SEC linebackers. It has been sad to watch the proud AU tradition at the linebacker position become neglected the way it has been the last few years. My own point of reference goes back to watching Mike "Captain Crunch" Kolen, so that might tell you something about the proper standard I find necessary."

......and to explain it even further, the phrase " do end up with" means.... after an elite recruit got on the team, received the proper coaching and development, over an extended period of time, which at a minimum will usually take 2 years, for even the best recruit.

[Dixie1860 27]

I don't get this ...recruiting all-SEC LBs...who knows which players will be All-SEC when the guys are 18 years old and still in high school playing against smaller and slower opponents in most games.

And, I don't understand the claim that we don't get SEC caliber LBs. If I recall, about every recruit involved a pretty serous recruiting battle with other major schools and if there is any validity in the recruiting services we have recruited among the best kids in Div 1. Seems it is more an issue of what happens after they arrive ...and the players getting some stability in our coaching staff....and the instruction they are getting.

So if DW does not get an offer from bama...and decides to come to AU does that mean he must not be an SEC caliber LB?

It has nothing to do with the LB's we have gotten, not being good, or who else recruited them.

MLB+OLB is the QB+RB equivalent positions on defense. It takes quantity at a position like LB just as it does quality. We have not signed ENOUGH LB talent to keep the talent level competitive in the SEC.

Not sure how this is even debatable.

[1TexasTiger 55]

It begins again is in reference to you analytical skills and not the defense. You display a clear bias in your assessments and analyses. You clearly have set a moving target for success hidden by your vague claim of what other LB's around the SEC do without taking into account the other proficiencies and deficiencies of the entire defensive system. Now you are headed down the path of calling another group of Lb's overrated because they don't fit your moving target. Tre Williams and Deshaun Davis were your saviors last year but now Tre is overrated by the other services because he didn't crack the line up by your set date. I hate to see what you will say if they don't start over Frost and Cass next year.

Mikey what do you do for a living? On day one of that job were you the best at your job? I would bet you were not. You may have had a knowledge to get you "recruited" but you had to learn the way that business works and develop within the ranks of that business. Our defense as a whole as been sub par and I agree with that. Our linebackers this year have been a brighter spot. Two teams ran the ball well on our defense which was UGA and UA. Everyone else had some success against us passing.

Net Rushing Yds per game:

Ark 153 yds

K-State 40 yds

LSU 138 yds

MSU 223 yds

SC 119 yds

Miss 146 yds

A&M 176 yds

UGA 289 yds

UA 227 yds

That ranked 46th out of 125 D1 teams. Up from 97th the year before. That probably would have been better if we could pressure the QB without blitzing said linebackers but that's one of those convenient things you don't mention.

Since our LB's are so bad what are their gap assignments, keys and responsibilities on the Inside zone, the counter, the wham, the power, the toss sweep etc. How did they fail in their assignments on each? Why were the Lbs consistently graded out higher by professional scouts and not by "MISS" (Mikey's Imaginary Scouting Service). The point is, your evaluation effort is horrid and lazy at best. The defense needs to improve but the linebackers have shown significant improvement year over year and you fail to even give them the slightest credit and it is really pathetic.

I hear what you are saying but, to be fair, I think Mikey has been consistent with the standard he thinks is important for the linebacker position. His standard has been that we should be consistently recruiting All-SEC type linebackers to compete with the other SEC West powers that are doing just that. That happens to be true. It also happens to be a high standard but we should be doing just that. By using that standard we fell short this year and that is something that has become a common theme for us at LB for awhile.

A look at the 2014 All-SEC teams thus far bears that out. The LBs making the All SEC teams came from Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Miss St, Missouri, and Tennessee, but none from Auburn.

2014 Coaches All SEC Linebackers

1st team linebackers: McKinney- Mississippi State, Spaight- Arkansas, DePriest- Alabama

2nd team linebackers: Herrera- Georgia, Wilson- Georgia, Morrison- Florida

2014 AP All SEC Linebackers

1st team: Spaight-Arkansas, Ragland-Alabama, Herrera-Georgia

2nd team: Alexander-LSU, Brothers-Missouri, Morrison-Florida, Wilson-Georgia

honorable mention: DePriest-Alabama, Floyd-Georgia, Johnson-Tennessee

A lot of this has to do imo with the development received by AU LBs the last 5 years. We do have talent on the team that is capable of achieving that goal next year. Looking to 2015 I think Frost, Cass and hopefully Tre Williams will make a solid run at becoming All SEC type linebackers. We need to keep them coming at a high level too.

How does a school recruit "All-SEC type" linebackers whom have never played in the SEC? What is an All SEC type linebacker??? Do you not see a problem with this theory? You recruit the players for your system and develop them to succeed in your system and when they succeed they become All-SEC.

This is what has not happened consistently at Auburn for linebackers but lets look at something:

Ted Roof DC- area of focus LB (average recruiter)

Brian Van Gorder DC - area of focus LB (average recruiter)

Ellis Johnson DC - area of focus LB (doesn't really recruit)

Maybe our linebackers needs a dedicated coach who is not multitasking with the whole defense and can devote his time to the linebackers and enjoys recruiting linebackers.

I agree with the point on coaching which is why I mentioned development in my post. I even went back and expanded on that point (see previous post) a few minutes before your post but for whatever reason your quote didn't pick it up. A mystery, lol.

We haven't had the development from the position coaches at the LB position AND we haven't had the continuous recruitment of enough high talent players there, which is the lifeblood of any position. That of course is how you do end up with All-SEC linebackers. It has been sad to watch the proud AU tradition at the linebacker position become neglected the way it has been the last few years. My own point of reference goes back to watching Mike "Captain Crunch" Kolen, so that might tell you something about the proper standard I find necessary.

Mikey, please read this and tell me who put those word in your mouth because it was not me. (It's the bold part) So apparently the people defended your point of view don't have accuracy in their statement. It's extremely convenient to let it slide when someone agrees with your view but when someone disagrees they're out of their mind. At least make it a fair debate and use integrity.

No-one here is dumb enough to think all-SEC linebackers can be recruited without them transferring from other teams, which is unheard of. It's an impossibility and your cognitive abilities are sadly lacking if you think anybody said that. What's been said over and over is that we need to recruit players with the potential to become all-SEC. ("all-SEC potential", "all-SEC type" or "all-SEC material" are interchangeable here) Find a different nit to pick. You talking about all-SEC linebackers that have never played in the SEC is silly and yes, you are the only one talking about that.

I hear what you are saying but to be fair, I think Mikey has been consistent with the standard he thinks is important at the linebacker position. His standard has been that we should be consistently recruiting All-SEC type linebackers to compete with the other SEC West powers that are already doing that. That is a high standard and it happens to be true, we should be doing just that.

Apparently someone is dumb enough to believe that. Why didn't you address that I did not say this Mikey? It's plain and clear but my cognitive skills are lacking?

IronMan since this is what you claimed Mikey said and I asked specifically, how do we recruit All-SEC linebackers, please explain the comment you attributed to Mikey.

Every LB we recruited had offers to other SEC schools. The problem is when they got to AU. If you fix what you have, you eventually get more interest from more Lbs. Look at the WR area as a perfect example. We hardly ever had looks from top WRs but now we do because Craig coached the guys up on the roster.

[AUbritt 611]

Tex, are you really still on about this? And the crux of your argument -- and what's prompted you to call IronMan "dumb" -- is that you think IM said that Milkey said we need to recruit All-SEC linebackers?

In the text you quoted above, IM clearly states "All-SEC type linebackers," (emphasis added). That's consistent with the idea that they are not already All-SEC. Moreover, IM suggests that we need to recruit these types consistently, which jives with Mikey's claim that we need to recruit more All-SEC type linebackers.

No one is making the claim that you think is dumb. And if they did, I'm sure they would agree with you and say they misspoke.

Now, I thought this was the DW thread, not the 'all things linebackers' thread. I'm hoping DW sticks with us. How about y'all?

[1TexasTiger 55]

I'm trying to understand how you recruit an ALL SEC type anything. Those type of players are developed. That has been my argument the whole time. Point blank I get tired of coming on here and seeing our players called trash, or sorry, or not SEC worthy.

Why would DW or any linebacker recruit want to come here the way we talk about our own?

[AUbritt 611]

I'm trying to understand how you recruit an ALL SEC type anything. Those type of players are developed. That has been my argument the whole time. Point blank I get tired of coming on here and seeing our players called trash, or sorry, or not SEC worthy.

Why would DW or any linebacker recruit want to come here the way we talk about our own?

I agree with not bashing our current players. I think Mikey has been pretty consistent in talking about the LBs as a group, as well as in suggesting that the only way we can get All-SEC LBers on the field is to recruit more who have that potential at the LB position (all-SEC types) so that some of them will develop into actuall All-SEC LBers.

I guess you could take that as a slap at our current players. I would characterize it as Mikey not being satisfied with the current level of play of our LB corps. I could be wrong, but I don't think Mikey has been one to single out individuals and bash them. He has been consistently vocal about his position that we need to do a better job recruiting MORE potentially All-SEC players at the LB position.

[1TexasTiger 55]

There were some things said that rubbed a few people the wrong way including me. I don't think Mikey's intentions are wrong at all and we differ with how to solve the problems, but my only thing is if anyone is going to be that critical you have to understand the whole defensive picture. It's hard to place all the blame on one unit. A DT can make a middle linebacker look very bad just like a WR can make a QB look very bad.

[IronMan70 3,277]

No-one here is dumb enough to think all-SEC linebackers can be recruited without them transferring from other teams, which is unheard of. It's an impossibility and your cognitive abilities are sadly lacking if you think anybody said that. What's been said over and over is that we need to recruit players with the potential to become all-SEC. ("all-SEC potential", "all-SEC type" or "all-SEC material" are interchangeable here) Find a different nit to pick. You talking about all-SEC linebackers that have never played in the SEC is silly and yes, you are the only one talking about that.

I hear what you are saying but to be fair, I think Mikey has been consistent with the standard he thinks is important at the linebacker position. His standard has been that we should be consistently recruiting All-SEC type linebackers to compete with the other SEC West powers that are already doing that. That is a high standard and it happens to be true, we should be doing just that.

Apparently someone is dumb enough to believe that. Why didn't you address that I did not say this Mikey? It's plain and clear but my cognitive skills are lacking?

IronMan since this is what you claimed Mikey said and I asked specifically, how do we recruit All-SEC linebackers, please explain the comment you attributed to Mikey.

Every LB we recruited had offers to other SEC schools. The problem is when they got to AU. If you fix what you have, you eventually get more interest from more Lbs. Look at the WR area as a perfect example. We hardly ever had looks from top WRs but now we do because Craig coached the guys up on the roster.

There is nothing to explain to you. There is no "claim" and there is no reason for Mikey to deny it. Mikey said it, has been saying it for over 2 years, has explained it to you more than once, I have explained it to you more than once, Mikey and I are giving you the same explanation of his position. In addition, 4 other posters have also explained this to you. Does that mean that the 5 of us agree with Mikey on everything about this issue ? No, but the one thing Mikey has been, is consistent on his position about it.

The truth is that you are intentionally being obtuse and not "understanding" these explanations, from 5 different people now. All of this because you don't want to acknowledge you were mistaken in your characterization of Mikey's consistent position on all this. Instead you'd rather choose to create some phantom issue where none exists. I get it.

Just a fyi, name calling is not effective and gets you no where.

[AuburnNTexas 7,154]

Just so nobody thinks all people living in Texas are obtuse. I agree with Mikey most of the time that we need to recruit more high quality linebackers as because of the difficulty of the position even kids that we think will be great don't always work out so having more gets you a better chance of having one to develop into an ALL SEC type linebacker. Then there are two more pieces to the equation one like so many have said coaches that coach a player up to his potential so that they can become All SEC type linebackers and the second piece is the player with the physical and mental tools has the attitude to learn from the coach and the desire to get better and become the type of player we all want to see as an Auburn linebacker.

The only place I have disagreed with Mikey on is I honestly think Frost and Mckinzey are getting close to being what we want and have a good chance of being there next year. I do think having to constantly learn a new system every year or two has really hindered Auburn Linebackers development. I really hope we get a new DC who will either stay for a while or bring in an assistant who will become our DC so we can have continuity.

Now getting back to original thread it is important we keep Darrel Williams and he becomes a great SS or Linebacker as he has the potential to be what we are looking for with the right coaching

[augolf1716 21,216]

Yes lets get back to talking about Mr. Williams

[NoALtiger 3,867]

Just looking for some DW news, must have stumbled in to the Beyond Thunderdome thread. My apologies.

[Tigerfinz 1,362]

Master Blaster runs Bartertown...

[IronMan70 3,277]

Just so nobody thinks all people living in Texas are obtuse. I agree with Mikey most of the time that we need to recruit more high quality linebackers as because of the difficulty of the position even kids that we think will be great don't always work out so having more gets you a better chance of having one to develop into an ALL SEC type linebacker. Then there are two more pieces to the equation one like so many have said coaches that coach a player up to his potential so that they can become All SEC type linebackers and the second piece is the player with the physical and mental tools has the attitude to learn from the coach and the desire to get better and become the type of player we all want to see as an Auburn linebacker.

The only place I have disagreed with Mikey on is I honestly think Frost and Mckinzey are getting close to being what we want and have a good chance of being there next year. I do think having to constantly learn a new system every year or two has really hindered Auburn Linebackers development. I really hope we get a new DC who will either stay for a while or bring in an assistant who will become our DC so we can have continuity.

Now getting back to original thread it is important we keep Darrel Williams and he becomes a great SS or Linebacker as he has the potential to be what we are looking for with the right coaching

I agree, it is very important we keep Darrel Williams. I also agree with you about Frost and McKinzey. I think they are too (getting close) and really believe that Coach Boom can get those two over the top. Hopefully over time he can also develop Darrel and Tre Williams to be able to play at a consistently high level. Personally, I think he is going to be able to do just that.

[Mikey 16,631]

If we can keep D. Williams and McBryde and add one more solid LB, this class could be the first step towards crawling out of the depth pits we've been in at LB. Also, keeping the same system for a few years will help at every defensive position.

[chucmin 2]

Did I just read a glimpse of optimism from our LB corp from Mikey? :-)

[JoeinPF 94]

I normally like to keep the threads about individuals on point and not stray into discussions about positions. From the beginning I believed D. Williams was a huge get for our program. Now as I read about the upcoming Ala/Miss All Star Game, I'm even more impressed/pleased to have him along with McBryde.

For those preaching doom and gloom about our LB's, I would remind you we not only have McKinzey and Frost coming back with a lots of starts, we also have T. Williams, Davis, and Toney waiting in the wings plus Mitchell who is developing well. No, our LB program is not where we would like it to be, but it's in better shape than some would admit. The addition of another quality player this year would be icing on the cake.

[looney 794]

I would remind you we not only have McKinzey and Frost coming back

When will we know for sure on this? I'd heard some banter about good draft grades for both...

Sorry if I'm derailing the Williams thread.

[Mikey 16,631]

I normally like to keep the threads about individuals on point and not stray into discussions about positions. From the beginning I believed D. Williams was a huge get for our program. Now as I read about the upcoming Ala/Miss All Star Game, I'm even more impressed/pleased to have him along with McBryde.

For those preaching doom and gloom about our LB's, I would remind you we not only have McKinzey and Frost coming back with a lots of starts, we also have T. Williams, Davis, and Toney waiting in the wings plus Mitchell who is developing well. No, our LB program is not where we would like it to be, but it's in better shape than some would admit. The addition of another quality player this year would be icing on the cake.

Toney was moved from LB to H-Back in mid-season, apparently because LB simply wasn't his college position. Davis has not played a snap of football in two years due to injury and how that turns out is anybody's guess. If Mitchell is developing well, why did he play less this year than last? Next year we will have four seniors, Swain, McKinzy, Frost and Garrett, not a one of whom has ever been named to an all-SEC team. Never mind their level of accomplishment, who will provide even warm body replacements in 2016?

There is reason for optimism with Tre Williams and if we can add one more LB to this years' class of signees. That's optimism for the long term . Short term, we have a problem.