2 NYPD cops shot and killed

[cole256 17,084]

So...can we all at LEAST agree that race was NOT a factor? If not, explain.......

What if I said these cops wasn't killed because they were cops.....how would you explain against it?

the killer admitted it on social media.

Right. So let's say he didn't say it on social media would that make it less true what was in his heart? I guess what I'm saying is you can't definitely say race has nothing to do with it.It seems like people go out of their way on this board to say racism doesn't exist. That nothing is racism and if you mention race you're a race biter, and I think that's not right. Especially if you haven't ever have to experience it in a degrading manner.

Okay if he didn't say it on social media, he did tell a bystander something to the affect of watch this. Your point about shooting the cops is way off.

Actually my point isn't off at all. These days you can do whatever and people will justify it and will call somebody a race baiter before acknowledging something may have been wrong. You guys really don't know if that guy did that because of race or not because of course he's not going to tell you. His actions showed different though.....

[AURaptor 1,126]

You certain the cop was mocking Garners death ? Really ?

[WarTim 3,457]

Still waiting for an answer...

[aujeff11 6,243]

I only find fault in the cop that choked out the kid. The others, fake guns and all, I have no problem with their actions.

[cole256 17,084]

You certain the cop was mocking Garners death ? Really ?

Yes really. What would you say the reason of smiling waving at the camera of a woman taping crying that a man just died? You all are asking me questions but aren't answering any of mine.

[cole256 17,084]

Still waiting for an answer...

Gave you mine waiting on yours. I go back and look at all your posts and you don't explain any. You either make fun or insult the positions you don't agree with and place a smiley face or you demand answers.....that's taking a role I don't think you have in this forum of opinions

[cole256 17,084]

I only find fault in the cop that choked out the kid. The others, fake guns and all, I have no problem with their actions.

I agree. I think once the choke hold was placed it was best to try to diffuse the situation....Maybe if the choke hold was released once he was initially on the ground instead of when his body was limp he may have lived

[AURaptor 1,126]

You certain the cop was mocking Garners death ? Really ?

Yes really. What would you say the reason of smiling waving at the camera of a woman taping crying that a man just died? You all are asking me questions but aren't answering any of mine.

I've not seen the full vid, but does he know for certain that Garner is dead ? Might he be smiling because he thinks she's being hysterical & over reacting ?

[cole256 17,084]

Wow really? Whether he knows he's dead or not he knows he's injured. And how many times have you smiled at an scared hysterical woman? And that still doesn't explain the wave.....And he's a policeman...You know protect and serve her?? Look at some of the things and excuses you guys are making, but it's unacceptable for a black guy getting arrested to use the excuse his decisions may not have been the best because he was nervous or scared about being surrounded and being told to get on the ground about a disturbance that he helped break up?

And how are some of you even speaking so freely on the incident and it wasn't worth your time to even watch the video?

And you think it's silly for me to be afraid right now if an officer was to tell me to lie on the ground and put my arms behind my back? At first the fear was nobody will see what's happening. Now it's whether they do or not you may very well be pleading or making an excuse to why I am dead. That's not scary it's terrifying.

[AURaptor 1,126]

How many times has a cop had a civilian yell & scream at them to stop when they were just doing their job? Prolly more than most folks realize.

You still didn't really answer the question - are you SURE the cop was aware Garner was dead / in real distress ? Cause I'm not sure & I do think it matters.

What would you do where a cop would have you face down , arms behind your head ? I've had a few scrapes, and at no time did I end up in that predicament.

[cole256 17,084]

I would do it and be scared out of my mind. And I would be positive that NOTHING would be done to the officer though, and I do understand that if you comply with the officer your chances of living increases but I don't believe in abuse of power and authority. And the civilian wasn't yelling or screaming everybody was watching in awe saying omg they killed him....

But once again I ask you what difference of a man unconscious hurt and him being dead makes you decide to wave at the camera or not? I've asked this question like 5 times.

I can't say if the guy knew he was dead or not. I did say he knew he wasn't hardly bleeding and he needed medical assistance though.

[TheBlueVue 177]

I would do it and be scared out of my mind. And I would be positive that NOTHING would be done to the officer though, and I do understand that if you comply with the officer your chances of living increases but I don't believe in abuse of power and authority. And the civilian wasn't yelling or screaming everybody was watching in awe saying omg they killed him....

But once again I ask you what difference of a man unconscious hurt and him being dead makes you decide to wave at the camera or not? I've asked this question like 5 times.

I can't say if the guy knew he was dead or not. I did say he knew he wasn't hardly bleeding and he needed medical assistance though.

The Garner incident and his subsequent death was awful. On that I think everyone can agree. At a time like that is it important to look at what caused the incident to happen? Look, Im not making ANY excuses for the mistakes that were made and I definitely believe, based on the video, he was subjected to excessive force. Here's what is being ignored. That dude had been arrested 38 times previously for selling loose cigarettes. I can hear the groans now but those officers were directed to that location because merchants had complained about his activities. Im of the opinion, if during Michael Bloomberg's leadership, NYC had NOT approved such prohibitively high taxes on cigarettes there would be no black market for selling singles. Moreover, familiarity breeds contempt and in that specific incident the contempt ran both ways after 38 previous incidents for the SAME violation. Was it wrong? Of course it was but, pricing a package of cigarettes around $10 a package because of insane tax policy is likely what precipitated the incident. I also do not believe the officer killed the guy because Garner should not have resisted arrest - he knew he was breaking the law. We are forever thrust into these debates about police brutality which would have been totally avoided if the victim had not intractably resisted arrest. These victims are not the saints of society but are being made into martyrs for ALL the wrong reasons.

[AURaptor 1,126]

What I'd do in that position is unanswerable I'd have to be a cop & served in that part of town to fully get his mindset.

And I'd like to think I'd never be in a predicament where a cop gas me face down & arms cuffed chins me. You didn't answer that one either.

[WarTim 3,457]

I would do it and be scared out of my mind. And I would be positive that NOTHING would be done to the officer though, and I do understand that if you comply with the officer your chances of living increases but I don't believe in abuse of power and authority. And the civilian wasn't yelling or screaming everybody was watching in awe saying omg they killed him....

But once again I ask you what difference of a man unconscious hurt and him being dead makes you decide to wave at the camera or not? I've asked this question like 5 times.

I can't say if the guy knew he was dead or not. I did say he knew he wasn't hardly bleeding and he needed medical assistance though.

The Garner incident and his subsequent death was awful. On that I think everyone can agree. At a time like that is it important to look at what caused the incident to happen? Look, Im not making ANY excuses for the mistakes that were made and I definitely believe, based on the video, he was subjected to excessive force. Here's what is being ignored. That dude had been arrested 38 times previously for selling loose cigarettes. I can hear the groans now but those officers were directed to that location because merchants had complained about his activities. Im of the opinion, if during Michael Bloomberg's leadership, NYC had NOT approved such prohibitively high taxes on cigarettes there would be no black market for selling singles. Moreover, familiarity breeds contempt and in that specific incident the contempt ran both ways after 38 previous incidents for the SAME violation. Was it wrong? Of course it was but, pricing a package of cigarettes around $10 a package because of insane tax policy is likely what precipitated the incident. I also do not believe the officer killed the guy because Garner should not have resisted arrest - he knew he was breaking the law. We are forever thrust into these debates about police brutality which would have been totally avoided if the victim had not intractably resisted arrest. These victims are not the saints of society but are being made into martyrs for ALL the wrong reasons.

Best, most logical post I have read in quite some time. Thanks

[cole256 17,084]

I did answer it, I'd say I'd do as I told and I'd be scared to death. I would literally pray over my soul as I know there's a possibility these men may kill me.

I'd like to think I'd never be in that predicament either but I found myself hand cuffed and in the back of a police car while the policeman searched my car, for pulling me over for my tag light (brand new car) before and I never imagined I'd ever be cuffed or in a back of a car being that I don't break any laws (besides speeding, and seat belt) so unfortunately I can't say it's nothing I have to worry about.

[cole256 17,084]

I would do it and be scared out of my mind. And I would be positive that NOTHING would be done to the officer though, and I do understand that if you comply with the officer your chances of living increases but I don't believe in abuse of power and authority. And the civilian wasn't yelling or screaming everybody was watching in awe saying omg they killed him....

But once again I ask you what difference of a man unconscious hurt and him being dead makes you decide to wave at the camera or not? I've asked this question like 5 times.

I can't say if the guy knew he was dead or not. I did say he knew he wasn't hardly bleeding and he needed medical assistance though.

The Garner incident and his subsequent death was awful. On that I think everyone can agree. At a time like that is it important to look at what caused the incident to happen? Look, Im not making ANY excuses for the mistakes that were made and I definitely believe, based on the video, he was subjected to excessive force. Here's what is being ignored. That dude had been arrested 38 times previously for selling loose cigarettes. I can hear the groans now but those officers were directed to that location because merchants had complained about his activities. Im of the opinion, if during Michael Bloomberg's leadership, NYC had NOT approved such prohibitively high taxes on cigarettes there would be no black market for selling singles. Moreover, familiarity breeds contempt and in that specific incident the contempt ran both ways after 38 previous incidents for the SAME violation. Was it wrong? Of course it was but, pricing a package of cigarettes around $10 a package because of insane tax policy is likely what precipitated the incident. I also do not believe the officer killed the guy because Garner should not have resisted arrest - he knew he was breaking the law. We are forever thrust into these debates about police brutality which would have been totally avoided if the victim had not intractably resisted arrest. These victims are not the saints of society but are being made into martyrs for ALL the wrong reasons.

But the officers who killed them are saints? And once again the policeman initially came over because of an disturbance of two men fighting NOT because of selling cigarettes. Which IMO if a man does sell a cigarette it doesn't mean he's not a good guy or a saint. Kids in college that underage drink and drive do much worse and they are future doctors, lawyers, businessmen, philanthropist, etc

And though he may have broke the law before, may was going to break the law later that day he wasn't breaking the law at that time.

[AURaptor 1,126]

I did answer it, I'd say I'd do as I told and I'd be scared to death. I would literally pray over my soul as I know there's a possibility these men may kill me. [/Quote]

No, I asked WHY would you even be in that situation! That's not what cops do for routine traffic violations.

I'd like to think I'd never be in that predicament either but I found myself hand cuffed and in the back of a police car while the policeman searched my car, for pulling me over for my tag light (brand new car) before and I never imagined I'd ever be cuffed or in a back of a car being that I don't break any laws (besides speeding, and seat belt) so unfortunately I can't say it's nothing I have to worry about.

.

I had a new truck & got pulled over cause my tag didn't match ( long story ) but I had all manner of documentation and didn't get hassled . My seat belt was on, I did the yes sir/ no sir bit & gave no attitude. He was well in his rights to ticket me, but I held my tongue when he made some wise crack about me still owing taxes... I just let it slide & agreed politely. He may have been fishing for a reason to be a D, but I had to be somewhere so I didn't bother with it.

[cole256 17,084]

I'm glad it worked out for you. I did everything you said you did but I was hand cuffed and placed in the back of a police car once again scared of what might happened.

[AURaptor 1,126]

I'm glad it worked out for you. I did everything you said you did but I was hand cuffed and placed in the back of a police car once again scared of what might happened.

IDK if there was probable cause for him to ck your car if all you had was a tail lite out ( new car ? ) I get cuffed & placed in the squad car for the cop's protection,

Maybe he was padding his hours to get some OT? No idea there.

[TexasTiger 13,006]

I'm glad it worked out for you. I did everything you said you did but I was hand cuffed and placed in the back of a police car once again scared of what might happened.

IDK if there was probable cause for him to ck your car if all you had was a tail lite out ( new car ? ) I get cuffed & placed in the squad car for the cop's protection,

Maybe he was padding his hours to get some OT? No idea there.

Can you entertain any other reasons?

[AURaptor 1,126]

Oh, new car ,young black guy?

[cole256 17,084]

Not tail light, tag light.

[cole256 17,084]

And he openly told me there is quite a bit drug trafficking that goes on that road. Now what I had to do with drugs? Absolutely nothing. He also told me to tell him if I had any drugs in the car because he had a dog and it would find it. He said if I tell him he can work with me but if the dog finds it there would be nothing he can do....(This can't be true, can it?) Of course once I was in the car there was no dog in there. This happened in Cullman or right outside of it between Cullman and Moulton, I was on the way home from Auburn. coincidentally my mom told me not to go through there she don't feel comfortable be traveling through there alone. I didn't listen. Learned quick then just because you're in college and away from home listen to your mom

[Strychnine 1,803]

And he openly told me there is quite a bit drug trafficking that goes on that road. Now what I had to do with drugs? Absolutely nothing. He also told me to tell him if I had any drugs in the car because he had a dog and it would find it. He said if I tell him he can work with me but if the dog finds it there would be nothing he can do....(This can't be true, can it?) Of course once I was in the car there was no dog in there. This happened in Cullman or right outside of it between Cullman and Moulton, I was on the way home from Auburn. coincidentally my mom told me not to go through there she don't feel comfortable be traveling through there alone. I didn't listen. Learned quick then just because you're in college and away from home listen to your mom

No, that is not true. "If you tell me, then I can work with you..." is simply fishing for a confession. At no point is he bound to "work with you" relative to reducing or dropping a charge, and the dog does nothing to change that. The dog is a contentious tool to establish probable cause to search your car. Of course, the requirement of probable cause and/or search warrant goes out the window if you give them permission to search. Did you give that permission?

If you had drugs in the car, and had told the officer exactly where he could find them, you would have been charged with possession, regardless of what he said. There are two important things to keep in mind when you are talking to police officers: 1. They are not your friend. 2. They are not required to be truthful with you.

[AURaptor 1,126]

Tag, tail... which ever. i still don't see that as probable cause , unless there was a road block, and they were stopping other cars as well.