Obama Administration ran guns from Benghazi to Syria

[AuburnNTexas 7,148]

I find it odd that a scandal laden, incompetent, moment has heroes. I suppose I will never understand the extremities of rhetoric.

Guys who would come and fight to save the lives of fellow Americans are hero's. American's died at Benghazi more would have died without these men willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for their fellow Americans.This is irregardless of what happened politically that was out of their control.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

Please forgive me for not buying into the proper narrative. Perhaps I lack the requisite sense of patriotism. Maybe I am just too skeptical because the investigations which could not support the narrative have now shifted to classified emails.

I suppose I should get with the program, pick a side. Somehow, I just cannot seem to shake the idea that both sides have played politics with this one and, that neither side is genuine.

[AuburnNTexas 7,148]

Please forgive me for not buying into the proper narrative. Perhaps I lack the requisite sense of patriotism. Maybe I am just too skeptical because the investigations which could not support the narrative have now shifted to classified emails.

I suppose I should get with the program, pick a side. Somehow, I just cannot seem to shake the idea that both sides have played politics with this one and, that neither side is genuine.

I am not talking about the politics of Hillary and the Benghazi committee. The heroes I am talking about are the men who were in Benghazi at the time of the attack and went to the aid of the consular office and tried to protect other American's some of these men died others survived. If you can't see what they did as an act of heroism I feel sorry for you.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

I suppose you are correct. However, I see these heroes determined to support one of those political narratives.

Perhaps I have become too skeptical. Sorry.

[homersapien 11,373]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like he thinks of McCain?

[AURaptor 1,125]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Who captured them ?

Two security contractors who fought to defend the diplomatic compound attacked by terrorists in Libya fired shots Tuesday at one of Sen. Marco Rubio’s supposed strengths — foreign policy and national security experience.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Show me where McCain called them losers.

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

I suppose you are correct. However, I see these heroes determined to support one of those political narratives.

Perhaps I have become too skeptical. Sorry.

Maybe they are not supporting H because she lied to the family of the dead and said it was because of a video?

[AURaptor 1,125]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Show me where McCain called them losers.

I'm guessing he means to say that TRUMP would consider them losers, as he called McCain a loser for being caught by the NVA.

Only this is nonsensical, as these guys ( acting as private contractors, not US military ) didn't get caught by anyone, and instead put their lives on the line to save others.

And it should go w/ out saying that McCain deserves all manner of honor and respect w/ regards to his capture and enduring torture. I'd like to see Trump try to handle 30 minutes of what McCain took for years. ( But that's another topic. )

[Mims44 1,869]

Not to make light of their endeavors in the least. But I could point out many current and former soldiers who acted honorably under fire, yet voted or supported for personal reasons.

Myself included, I voted for Bush on his second term, as did almost everyone I knew at the time... for no reason other than Bush had raised our pay a significant amount, and it was all but guaranteed that he would raise it even more if given another 4 years in office.

[quietfan 233]

Putting one's life at risk for others is heroic and to be honored.

And everyone is entitled to his or her opinion.

But being a hero does not necessarily mean one's opinion is necessarily more rational, more informed, freer from bias, or of more intrinsic value than someone else's.

I respect these guys as heroes, but I'm not going to cast my vote based on their political opinions.

[AuburnNTexas 7,148]

Putting one's life at risk for others is heroic and to be honored.

And everyone is entitled to his or her opinion.

But being a hero does not necessarily mean one's opinion is necessarily more rational, more informed, freer from bias, or of more intrinsic value than someone else's.

I respect these guys as heroes, but I'm not going to cast my vote based on their political opinions.

Very valid point. My only problem earlier was some people not believing these men were heroes.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

I think you made an incorrect assumption.

[homersapien 11,373]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like he called McCain?

Show me where McCain called them losers.

Fixed it for you.

Had you really not heard what Trump called McCain or are you just being an a-hole?

[ShocksMyBrain 9,366]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like he charged McCain? :dunno:/>

Show me where McCain called them losers.

Fixed it for you.

Had you really not heard what Trump called McCain or are you just being an a-hole?

I think he simply misread the original statement.

[homersapien 11,373]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like he charged McCain? :dunno:/>

Show me where McCain called them losers.

Fixed it for you.

Had you really not heard what Trump called McCain or are you just being an a-hole?

I think he simply misread the original statement.

Well, I admit I used ambiguous syntax, but I still don't see how anyone who keeps up would seriously interpret it that way.

[ShocksMyBrain 9,366]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like he charged McCain? :dunno:/>

Show me where McCain called them losers.

Fixed it for you.

Had you really not heard what Trump called McCain or are you just being an a-hole?

I think he simply misread the original statement.

Well, I admit I used ambiguous syntax, but I still don't see how anyone who keeps up would seriously interpret it that way.

I'll admit that I don't follow current events as closely as I should, but I knew what you were talking about.

[AuburnNTexas 7,148]

I think you made an incorrect assumption.

Quite possible. It has happened before and will probably happen again. If I mis-read what you meant I am sorry. All I was trying to say is these men who went to the consular office to protect it are heroes. The fact that they support or don't support Trump was irrelevant to me. Also for those who are trying to say they were losers.Whether they partially succeeded, completely succeeded or failed in total nobody who puts their life on the line like they did is a loser. Their mission may or may not have been a failure but calling them losers is unacceptable. In this case they did help some people to escape so at the least the mission was partially successful.

The defenders of the Alamo lost the battle but hey were not losers, McCain was captured but he was not a loser.

[homersapien 11,373]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Who captured them ?

Two security contractors who fought to defend the diplomatic compound attacked by terrorists in Libya fired shots Tuesday at one of Sen. Marco Rubio’s supposed strengths — foreign policy and national security experience.

Because (using Trump's logic) they were "defeated" - they didn't succeed in protecting the embassy.

But it's notable that you seem to give credence to Trump's idea that prisoners are "losers".

[homersapien 11,373]

I think you made an incorrect assumption.

Quite possible. It has happened before and will probably happen again. If I mis-read what you meant I am sorry. All I was trying to say is these men who went to the consular office to protect it are heroes. The fact that they support or don't support Trump was irrelevant to me. Also for those who are trying to say they were losers.Whether they partially succeeded, completely succeeded or failed in total nobody who puts their life on the line like they did is a loser. Their mission may or may not have been a failure but calling them losers is unacceptable. In this case they did help some people to escape so at the least the mission was partially successful.

The defenders of the Alamo lost the battle but hey were not losers, McCain was captured but he was not a loser.

You missed the point. No one is making that substantive argument, well except for Raptor who implied it.

I am talking about Trump and his perspective, which says McCain is a loser. If McCain - as a captured POW is a "loser", why wouldn't any serviceman who failed to accomplish the mission be a "loser" also?

It's an absurd argument of course, but based on his McCain comments, it is one that Trump could logically make.

[AURaptor 1,125]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Who captured them ?

Two security contractors who fought to defend the diplomatic compound attacked by terrorists in Libya fired shots Tuesday at one of Sen. Marco Rubio’s supposed strengths — foreign policy and national security experience.

Because (using Trump's logic) they were "defeated" - they didn't succeed in protecting the embassy.

But it's notable that you seem to give credence to Trump's idea that prisoners are "losers".

You're ( per usual ) completely wrong on both counts. They ARE heroes , in that they protected the lives of over 30 Americans, despite Hillary's ( and / or Obama's ) politically motivated decision to stand down forces which could have saved the lives of 4 other Americans, including our US ambassador.

And as I clearly stated , by no means was McCain a 'loser'.

[homersapien 11,373]

Wouldn't Trump consider these guys "losers", just like McCain?

Who captured them ?

Two security contractors who fought to defend the diplomatic compound attacked by terrorists in Libya fired shots Tuesday at one of Sen. Marco Rubio’s supposed strengths — foreign policy and national security experience.

Because (using Trump's logic) they were "defeated" - they didn't succeed in protecting the embassy.

But it's notable that you seem to give credence to Trump's idea that prisoners are "losers".

You're ( per usual ) completely wrong on both counts. They ARE heroes , in that they protected the lives of over 30 Americans, despite Hillary's ( and / or Obama's ) politically motivated decision to stand down forces which could have saved the lives of 4 other Americans, including our US ambassador.

And as I clearly stated , by no means was McCain a 'loser'.

No, you argued they weren't captured, implying that was a legitimate condition for being losers.

And you are simply lying about an order to stand down forces that would have made a difference.

[AURaptor 1,125]

No, you argued they weren't captured, implying that was a legitimate condition for being losers.

wrong. I was just using Trump's logic. HE said it, not I.

And you are simply lying about an order to stand down forces that would have made a difference.

How am I lying ? Explain THAT one.

[homersapien 11,373]

No, you argued they weren't captured, implying that was a legitimate condition for being losers.

wrong. I was just using Trump's logic. HE said it, not I.

And you are simply lying about an order to stand down forces that would have made a difference.

How am I lying ? Explain THAT one.

Of course that's his logic. My argument is that using his logic, being captured = failing your mission.

You are lying because it's not true.

[AURaptor 1,125]

No, you argued they weren't captured, implying that was a legitimate condition for being losers.

wrong. I was just using Trump's logic. HE said it, not I.

And you are simply lying about an order to stand down forces that would have made a difference.

How am I lying ? Explain THAT one.

Of course that's his logic. My argument is that using his logic, being captured = failing your mission.

You are lying because it's not true.

Failing the mission isn't what Trump said. He SPECIFICALLY said getting caught was what made McCain a loser. He could have completed his mission, and THEN got caught, but even so, that has no bearing on the Benghazi heroes.

They didn't get captured. They faced overwhelming odds and saved more than we even know ( Obama won't let them talk - wonder why ? ) with out getting any back up , what so ever.

I don't know it's not true that Hillary / Obama made the call to stand down. I contend there was such a call, and it DID happen.

No lie here.

* ETA - Things others say which you don't believe or which may possibly be wrong =/= " lying ".