Job Cuts More Than Double In October

[CShine 0]

Job cuts announced by U.S. companies more than doubled in October from the previous month, providing more evidence that the nation's economy is in a period of jobless expansion, according to a report from an outplacement firm.

Chicago-based Challenger, Gray & Christmas Inc. said Tuesday that in October companies announced plans to eliminate 171,874 positions, compared with 76,506 jobs in September. It was the highest monthly level since October 2002, when 176,010 job cuts were announced.

The surge in October ended a streak of five months when job reductions fell below 100,000 per month. The lowest figure during that time was in June, with 59,715 jobs cut.

Hardest-hit was the automotive industry, which announced plans to eliminate 28,363 jobs in October. That was followed by the retail sector, which plans to cut 21,169 positions, and the telecommunications industry, which said it would slash 21,030 jobs.

"While perhaps shocking to some, the October spike follows a trend of heavy year-end downsizing that has occurred since we began tracking job cuts in 1993," said CEO John A. Challenger. "In 2001 and 2002, October was the largest job-cut month in the fourth quarter."

He added that companies' increasing productivity has made it easier for them to further delay hiring plans. The migration of jobs offshore as well as increasing consolidation also have stunted job growth

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...i_ge/job_cuts_1

[Tiger Al 0]

Crap...not again. Is this unemployment problem EVER going to get good again? I'm wondering if I have the only job left in the country!!!

[CarolinaTiger 0]

oh no!

more bad news! and it's all bush's fault!

we need a new president!

a new party in charge!!!!

ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TitanTiger 20,510]

Hmm...I just saw Ron Insana on the Today Show this morning and he said the job figures would be in on Friday of this week and that most economists are expecting them to have gone up. I guess we'll see.

[Weagle98 119]

Job growth is a lagging indicator. It sometimes takes up to a year for unemployment number to increase along with growth out of a recession. Patience Tiger Al. The economy in ALL aspects is improving or will improve relatively shortly.

[CShine 0]

Job growth is a lagging indicator.  It sometimes takes up to a year for unemployment number to increase along with growth out of a recession.  Patience Tiger Al.  The economy in ALL aspects is improving or will improve relatively shortly.

We have had growth in every single quarter for two straight years. Just how long do we have to wait for this lagging indicator? You say "up to a year." Well, we are WAY PAST that point, and we're STILL seeing increased layoffs.

[Tiger Al 0]

But, CShine, I thought all those tax cuts were going to create jobs??? Wasn't that going to be an updated, funky version of 'trickle down?'

You MUST be mistaken about job losses. Surely people can't STILL be losing jobs, are they?

[Tiger Al 0]

[MDM4AU 336]

SOURCE?

[CarolinaTiger 0]

what about an explanation of what it's supposed to mean?

typically a graph like that would insinuate a cause-and-effect relationship between what's being plotted.

is that what you are insinuating, Al?

[Weagle98 119]

That is amazing that a president has that much immediate control over unemployment. Look, Clinton enjoed a false bubble of technology job growth in his presidency. That bubble burst in about 2000 and then the lagging indicator "unemployment" took about 2 years to also rise.

We have had growth in every single quarter for two straight years. Just how long do we have to wait for this lagging indicator? You say "up to a year." Well, we are WAY PAST that point, and we're STILL seeing increased layoffs.

Wow CShine you just stated that we had growth for about every quarter that President Bush has been in office. I bet you couldn't get one of the 9 dem candidates to say that.

What has helped spark the economy was the Bush Tax Cut. Following tax cutes by JFK and Reagan it takes about 3 years for unemployment to lower after the tax cut. You can't snap your fingers and then WAM! new jobs.

The tax cuts have given more money to people, these people have spent their money, the inventory levels in the warehouses for the products that they are buying are decreasing, the companies are starting to need to produce more, and finally they will need to hire more employees to meet that production. This takes time.

[Weagle98 119]

Bump.

In light of new information I wanted to bump this up.

Jobless claims.

http://www.aunation.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=1622

[Donutboy 0]

oh no!

more bad news! and it's all bush's fault!

we need a new president!

a new party in charge!!!!

ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, there were over 12 million jobs created during the Clinton administration compared to 3.6 million jobs lost so far during the Bush administration.

[TitanTiger 20,510]

Convenient how you magically attribute each situation to the person in office. What exactly did Clinton do to get the economy officially out of a recession a full 21 months before he took office? And which of the numerous dot-com startups that fueled the stock market boom of the late 90s did he own?

While we're at it, what exactly did G.W. Bush have to do with those dot-coms being overvalued and start to drop in value like a lead balloon in early 2000? How many of Bush's economic policies had taken effect by March 2001 (less than 3 months after he took office) that sent the country into a recession? And exactly how would any other president done better on the economy in the wake of 9-11-2001, taking a hit like that when things were already shaky?

Just curious.

[Tiger Al 0]

Titan, I can't give an accounting for every single job created under Clinton, but if you remember, one of his primary ways for creating jobs and boosting the economy was to upgrade our infrastructure.

At least four or five times during his administration, my mom and I drove from Montgomery to Wichita to see my grandmother. Every one of those times there was always work being done to widen interstates, improve secondary roads and repair or replace bridges.

This cost money, but by the government spending the money in this way, jobs were created and people were putting money into the economy on a weekly basis as a result. Monies were returned to the government in the form of taxes.

The Bush tax cuts cost money, too. The major difference is that the bulk of the refunds went to the extremely rich who weren't likely to spend much of it. They would more likely invest it, which might be contributing to the recent good news on Wall Street, but few jobs have been created. Which, if you remember, was the primary reason Bush gave for the tax refunds, to help create jobs.

[MDM4AU 336]

Tiger AL,

When was the last time you came through Birmingham or North of B'ham toward Cullman. Bridges are still being built. Roads are still being widened. I-459 is about to make a complete loop. Corridor X never stopped being worked. I know. I drive 65 everyday to Cullman and Vinemont, or Blount County, as well as HWY 78 to Jasper or Haleyville or Winfield or Hamilton. Or Hwy 75 to Oneonta. Roads, schools, bridges, shopping centers, etc., all being built and/worked on. I can hardley get out of Helena some mornings because of all the work and building going on. It is slowly coming back, if it were truly ever gone around here.

I don't know exactly what it costs to live in Elmore County, but I bet it cost me more (taxes) to live in Shelby and work in Jefferson. I don't need anymore taxes taken from me.

[DKW 86 7,440]

Well, I dont know all of you folks but it just seems strange that GDP grew at an 15 year high the last quarter. Fifteen years,, for the mathematically impaired that means 1988, as in better than any year under Clinton. GDP is a an early indicator of Investment in White Goods and Hardware. Just what the tax cut was supposed to do.

In the last 3 months, Honda, BMW, Nissan, GE, Mercedes, Hyundai, have all bought heavily into job creation in this country/state. But you know, those new plants and job hiring take a while to happen.

So who is losing jobs? Chrysler, GM, Ford, and some old UNIONIZED rust belt companies that have large parts of their work force working under work rules that 40-50 years out of date. No wonder that old companies like those mentioned above can come into America and out compete, out perform and yes even ultimately outpay and benefit workers that work under badly outdated union rules.

Case: My Dad was UAW. One plant in his union listed as a cause for striking that the company would not buy porn magazines for the men's rooms at one plant. Yes Ladies and Gentlemen, the workers there literally wanted to **** *** while at work on company time.

[Tiger Al 0]

Tiger AL,

When was the last time you came through Birmingham or North of B'ham toward Cullman. Bridges are still being built. Roads are still being widened. I-459 is about to make a complete loop. Corridor X never stopped being worked. I know. I drive 65 everyday to Cullman and Vinemont, or Blount County, as well as HWY 78 to Jasper or Haleyville or Winfield or Hamilton. Or Hwy 75 to Oneonta. Roads, schools, bridges, shopping centers, etc., all being built and/worked on. I can hardley get out of Helena some mornings because of all the work and building going on. It is slowly coming back, if it were truly ever gone around here.

I don't know exactly what it costs to live in Elmore County, but I bet it cost me more (taxes) to live in Shelby and work in Jefferson. I don't need anymore taxes taken from me.

Exactly what I'm talking about. These road projects were started then and take time to complete. They don't expire when we have an administration change.

I would suspect that if your taxes in Shelby County are higher than mine it's because you probably more for your schools, don't you? Your property tax is probably higher than mine. If your state and federal tax is higher than mine it's because you make more money than I do.

[MDM4AU 336]

I realize what you are saying but many of the road and bridge projects are not old projects still being worked. The 459 loop was just started last year. There is all types of new construction going on everywhere up here as well as rural AL where my territory is. That's why I asked if you had been up this way in a while.

My taxes are higher (counties / cities) than many places. I don't need anymore taxes at this time. For working in Bamaham I pay a Jeffco tax and a Birmingham tax along with all the other.

[Tiger Al 0]

Well, I dont know all of you folks but it just seems strange that GDP grew at an 15 year high the last quarter. Fifteen years,, for the mathematically impaired that means 1988, as in better than any year under Clinton. GDP is a an early indicator of Investment in White Goods and Hardware. Just what the tax cut was supposed to do.

In the last 3 months, Honda, BMW, Nissan, GE, Mercedes, Hyundai, have all bought heavily into job creation in this country/state. But you know, those new plants and job hiring take a while to happen.

So who is losing jobs? Chrysler, GM, Ford, and some old UNIONIZED rust belt companies that have large parts of their work force working under work rules that 40-50 years out of date. No wonder that old companies like those mentioned above can come into America and out compete, out perform and yes even ultimately outpay and benefit workers that work under badly outdated union rules.

Case: My Dad was UAW. One plant in his union listed as a cause for striking that the company would not buy porn magazines for the men's rooms at one plant. Yes Ladies and Gentlemen, the workers there literally wanted to **** *** while at work on company time.

That's great news...as long as you remember that one of the components of the GDP is government expenditures. I'll bet the last two quarters the government has been spending a lot of extra money on a war. The Commerce Department's Bureau of Economic Analysis had this to say:

 

The acceleration in real GDP growth in the second quarter primarily reflected an upturn in federal defense spending, an acceleration in PCE, and an upturn in nonresidential fixed investment that were partly offset by an upturn in imports.  Real federal government consumption expenditures and gross investment increased 25.5 percent

in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 0.7 percent in the first.  National defense increased

45.8 percent, in contrast to a decrease of 3.3 percent.  Nondefense decreased 5.4 percent, in contrast to

an increase of 8.4 percent.  Real state and local government consumption expenditures and gross

investment decreased 0.2 percent, in contrast to an increase of 0.2 percent.

So, I guess as long as we can remain in a perpetual state of war the economy REALLY IS doing pretty good!!!

[TitanTiger 20,510]

That's great news...as long as you remember that one of the components of the GDP is government expenditures. I'll bet the last two quarters the government has been spending a lot of extra money on a war.  The Commerce Department's Bureau of Economic Analysis had this to say:

The acceleration in real GDP growth in the second quarter primarily reflected an upturn in federal defense spending, an acceleration in PCE, and an upturn in nonresidential fixed investment that were partly offset by an upturn in imports.  Real federal government consumption expenditures and gross investment increased 25.5 percent in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 0.7 percent in the first.  National defense increased

45.8 percent, in contrast to a decrease of 3.3 percent.  Nondefense decreased 5.4 percent, in contrast to an increase of 8.4 percent.  Real state and local government consumption expenditures and gross investment decreased 0.2 percent, in contrast to an increase of 0.2 percent.

So, I guess as long as we can remain in a perpetual state of war the economy REALLY IS doing pretty good!!!

Well, that would be fine if that's the numbers DKW was referring to were for the second quarter, however in the third quarter that wasn't the case:

WASHINGTON  — The economy grew at a scorching 7.2 percent annual rate in the third quarter in the strongest pace in nearly two decades. Consumers spent with abandon and businesses ramped up investment, compelling new evidence of an economic resurgence...

While consumers have been the main force keeping the economy going, there are more signs that businesses are starting to do their part.   

Especially encouraging was the 15.4 percent growth rate in spending by businesses on equipment and software in the third quarter. That marked the largest increase since the first quarter of 2000 and was up from a 8.3 percent growth rate in the second quarter...

   

Federal government spending, which grew at a 1.4 percent rate, was only a minor contributor to GDP in the third quarter. Spending on national defense was flat. But in the second quarter, military spending on the Iraq war — which grew at a whopping 45.8 percent rate — helped to catapult economic growth.   

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,101680,00.html

And another source says...

...The burst of GDP growth was led by a 6.6 percent jump in consumer spending, the fastest pace since the third quarter of 1997. Consumer spending grew at a 3.8 percent pace in the second quarter. 

Child tax credit checks and lower rates of income tax withholding helped fuel the third-quarter spending surge, enabling the Bush administration -- which pushed for tax cuts earlier this year -- to take a victory lap Thursday morning...

Government spending, which contributed mightily to second quarter growth, slowed down as defense spending, which surged 45.8 percent in the second quarter, driven by spending on the war in Iraq, was flat. 

http://money.cnn.com/2003/10/30/news/econo...dex.htm?cnn=yes