Don't Fire Gus Malzahn

[around4ever 4,139]

3 minutes ago, Tiger said:

How about a "let's see if a high school coach with no adjustments to his system can work in the SEC" experiment? 

Nah, that might work one out of every ten years.  

Now, I used to coach youth football and had a good feel for offensive and defensive game plans.  I am not opposed to making adjustments either.  I'll take the job for a cool $1M per year plus bonuses.  

[TitanTiger 20,499]

3 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Now Kerryon leaves and we're throwing RS freshmen who played QB in HS into the fray as our only viable option.

As an addendum, do not take this in anyway as being critical of Boobee Whitlow.  I think he's going to be a very good RB in this league and he works his ass off out there.  Hell, if he was running behind the line Tre Mason had, or that even KJ had last year he'd be doing very well.  But he's still learning the position.  Ideally a kid like him would be sitting behind a top-tier tailback who's a junior or senior and learning the ropes, getting mop up duty and so on.  He would not be relied upon to make something happen behind a piss-poor OL.

[IronMan70 3,277]

The ridiculous thing in this is Gus would get $32.5 million if fired, his staff about $4-$5 million in a buyout, then we would pay another $5-$7 million for a new HC and staff the first year. That's $44 million give or take. A new 'football only' facility is somewhere between $40-$50 million and we still don't have one. 

[The Freak 2,528]

7 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Yep.  Came in like a comet going 12-2 his first year.  Since then...

8-5
7-6
8-5
10-4
6-6 (likely)

And that 10-4 was an SEC championship and CFP appearance botched by his complete lack of roster management and recruiting at one of the most important positions in his offense - tailback.  Lose one good RB and the offense goes completely in the tank because there's nothing behind him.  And don't give me Pettway - that's a band-aid solution out of necessity.  He's a fullback with above average running ability.  Now Kerryon leaves and we're throwing RS freshmen who played QB in HS into the fray as our only viable option.

At what point does it sink into the "keep Gus" crowd that the mediocre and underperforming seasons are the norm for Gus and the successes are the anomalies?

6-6 is more of a "maybe" at this point.  I think it's actually the best we can do.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

1 minute ago, The Freak said:

6-6 is more of a "maybe" at this point.  I think it's actually the best we can do.

It hinges on Ole Miss.  Win this weekend and I think we probably finish with losses to aTm, UGA and Bama and win over Liberty to finish 6-6.  Lose this weekend and we're looking at 5-7.  I cannot fathom losing to Liberty or I'd say 4-8.

[WarEagle1983 2,185]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

Yep.  Came in like a comet going 12-2 his first year.  Since then...

8-5
7-6
8-5
10-4
6-6 (likely)

And that 10-4 was botched by his complete lack of roster management and recruiting at one of the most important positions in his offense - tailback.  Lose one good RB and the offense goes completely in the tank because there's nothing behind him.  And don't give me Pettway - that's a band-aid solution out of necessity.  He's a fullback with above average running ability.  Now Kerryon leaves and we're throwing RS freshmen who played QB in HS into the fray as our only viable option.

At what point does it sink into the "keep Gus" crowd that the mediocre and underperforming seasons are the norm for Gus and the successes are the anomalies?

The hard part for me about Gus is knowing the fact that he has it in him to be a top coach. We've seen flashes of it. That's the most frustrating part. He checks off a lot of the markers on the list in what you'd want in a CFB HC to run a program except the ones that ultimately matter the most when it comes to Xs and Os. He has to be forced to make changes. If he ever "gets IT"....he could be great. Maybe that's one of the reasons some still hold on to hope for him. But it's year 6 and we have an unstable football program and it's the same issues over and over. I think we've been very patient.  

[The Freak 2,528]

2 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

It hinges on Ole Miss.  Win this weekend and I think we probably finish with losses to aTm, UGA and Bama and win over Liberty to finish 6-6.  Lose this weekend and we're looking at 5-7.  I cannot fathom losing to Liberty or I'd say 4-8.

Agreed.

[TigerFanAU 586]

Fire Gus today. He doesn't know what he's doing anymore. I think this guy has finally had a mental meltdown and doesn't know where to turn.

[keesler 5,924]

6 minutes ago, IronMan70 said:

The ridiculous thing in this is Gus would get $32.5 million if fired, his staff about $4-$5 million in a buyout, then we would pay another $5-$7 million for a new HC and staff the first year. That's $44 million give or take. A new 'football only' facility is somewhere between $40-$50 million and we still don't have one. 

But but but......we have to remember money is no issue!  

We can suck the hind teet on facility upgrades, we can even string along spurts of spending and piece-mill the projects along the way with JHS looking like an erector set - but those $$ men are cash heavy and even though they may be 10 months removed from inking a contract, they'll have no problem pushing their stacks All-In!

 

 

[gr82be 14,440]

1 hour ago, SKIPPER_01 said:

Everything else has been already. Hear me on this...

Gus is stuck in this contract just like we are. 

Obviously. He is adapting slower than we want. Probably due to his ego that his offensive system is great and he is smarter than everyone.

During '15 & '16, we forced him to change OC and let go of playcalling. He has not genuinely done that. He is the most stubborn coach I've seen. I can't listen to him talk anymore.

I say, Don't fire him. Don't offer him the easy way out...while costing AU millions. This will answer a lot of questions. Buying him out answers nothing.

If he is going to be this stubborn, I want to see him humiliated on the sidelines. I don't care if we lose every game, I want to see what kind of human Gus Malzahn is.

You got two options Mr. Gus Malzahn.

1. Win

2. Lose

Either way, you are stuck on Auburn's sideline.

 

 

 

Sure, let's teach him a lesson while we all receive the punishment. That's a good plan. 

[TitanTiger 20,499]

3 minutes ago, keesler said:

But but but......we have to remember money is no issue!  

We can suck the hind teet on facility upgrades, we can even string along spurts of spending and piece-mill the projects along the way with JHS looking like an erector set - but those $$ men are cash heavy and even though they may be 10 months removed from inking a contract, they'll have no problem pushing their stacks All-In!

 

Assuming for a moment that the reason we don't have the money for various projects is that we really don't have the money, rather than the money people being unwilling to put up that money to help a coach they no longer believe in...

What is more important to the success of a football program:  facilities upgrades or the head coach/coaching staff?  If you had to choose one or the other, which do you think would pay dividends on the field faster?

[SumterAubie 3,031]

Malzahn does not need the Auburn fan base to humiliate him. He is perfectly capable of doing that on his own. And is.

[WarEagle1983 2,185]

The Liberty game worries me. For those that have not watched them play....that Troy win wasn't a fluke. I watched that game as i had a play on Troy😥Good team. 

[musicitytiger 281]

1 hour ago, SKIPPER_01 said:

Everything else has been already. Hear me on this...

Gus is stuck in this contract just like we are. 

Obviously. He is adapting slower than we want. Probably due to his ego that his offensive system is great and he is smarter than everyone.

During '15 & '16, we forced him to change OC and let go of playcalling. He has not genuinely done that. He is the most stubborn coach I've seen. I can't listen to him talk anymore.

I say, Don't fire him. Don't offer him the easy way out...while costing AU millions. This will answer a lot of questions. Buying him out answers nothing.

If he is going to be this stubborn, I want to see him humiliated on the sidelines. I don't care if we lose every game, I want to see what kind of human Gus Malzahn is.

You got two options Mr. Gus Malzahn.

1. Win

2. Lose

Either way, you are stuck on Auburn's sideline.

 

 

 

You’re embracing the darkness, and it’s beautiful:-)

 

thanks for this, it will allow me to enjoy it for the remainder of his tenure.

[NoALtiger 3,867]

44 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Golf, you have your pulse on things.  What odds would you put on him returning if we end up 6-6 or 5-7?

Golf has a pulse? 

[keesler 5,924]

2 minutes ago, gr82be said:

Sure, let's teach him a lesson while we all receive the punishment. That's a good plan. 

 

Ha!  Let him pad his bank account while we sit back an find out "what he's made of"!  

 

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

Assuming for a moment that the reason we don't have the money for various projects is that we really don't have the money, rather than the money people being unwilling to put up that money to help a coach they no longer believe in...

What is more important to the success of a football program:  facilities upgrades or the head coach/coaching staff?  If you had to choose one or the other, which do you think would pay dividends on the field faster?

You choose the coaching staff every time, hands down.

My only point and where the core of my sarcasm comes from is the fact that only 10 freaking months ago the exact same money people believed in him and they pushed for a "market-rate" contract guaranteed for an extended period of time.  Gus is no better and no worse than what he's proven as AU's HC for the past 5 yrs - he's the same - the program is relatively the same.  Now all of the sudden these money people are willing to fork out a massive chuck of cash because this season looks like it may end up like the end of 2014 or a real crap fest like 2015?  

It's frustrating Titan, and the people that work behind the scenes appear to be fickle and clueless - they have more money than common sense.

 

[IronMan70 3,277]

7 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Assuming for a moment that the reason we don't have the money for various projects is that we really don't have the money, rather than the money people being unwilling to put up that money to help a coach they no longer believe in...

What is more important to the success of a football program:  facilities upgrades or the head coach/coaching staff?  If you had to choose one or the other, which do you think would pay dividends on the field faster?

I've gone back and forth on this the last couple days. In some ways it would be nice to see something for the money instead of using it to buy out coaches like Chizik and Malzahn. I hear what you are saying though. The money boys don't want to spend it on facilities but will to buy out a coach.

[TitanTiger 20,499]

1 minute ago, keesler said:

My only point and where the core of my sarcasm comes from is the fact that only 10 freaking months ago the exact same money people believed in him and they pushed for a "market-rate" contract guaranteed for an extended period of time.  Gus is no better and no worse than what he's proven as AU's HC for the past 5 yrs - he's the same - the program is relatively the same.  Now all of the sudden these money people are willing to fork out a massive chuck of cash because this season looks like it may end up like the end of 2014 or a real crap fest like 2015?  

I think a lot of us wanted to believe that he was turning the corner. But the size of that contract was mostly on Leath.  And I've been told by some that Leath was cautioned by some of the movers and shakers at Auburn not to go crazy, but he panicked.

That said, sometimes you make a bad investment.  The question is, what do you do when you realize it's bad?  Do you throw more money at it?  Do you ride it out and do nothing?  Or do you cut your losses?  I bet smart money people make the hard choice and stop throwing good money after bad or just hoping it will turn around.  They sell at a loss and move on to more profitable ventures.

 

[keesler 5,924]

7 minutes ago, IronMan70 said:

I've gone back and forth on this the last couple days. In some ways it would be nice to see something for the money instead of using it to buy out coaches like Chizik and Malzahn. I hear what you are saying though. The money boys don't want to spend it on facilities but will to buy out a coach.

They'll buy out a coach that they cemented in place with this ridiculous contract only 10 months ago.

They'll spend $ to guaranteed a coach with a middling to mediocre W-L record.  They won't put $$ in the kitty for improvements, but they'll turn around only 10 months after inking that HC's contract and they'll unload a boatload of cash to jet his ass for possibly turning in a season like 2015. 

Gus was nothing to brag about when he & Sexton were pushing the Arkansas agenda last year - and Gus us nothing special today.  It's pretty much the same old $#!t we've seen for years now with the same complaints and the exact same comments on message boards.  

[IronMan70 3,277]

3 minutes ago, keesler said:

Ha!  Let him pad his bank account while we sit back an find out "what he's made of"!  

 

You choose the coaching staff every time, hands down.

My only point and where the core of my sarcasm comes from is the fact that only 10 freaking months ago the exact same money people believed in him and they pushed for a "market-rate" contract guaranteed for an extended period of time.  Gus is no better and no worse than what he's proven as AU's HC for the past 5 yrs - he's the same - the program is relatively the same.  Now all of the sudden these money people are willing to fork out a massive chuck of cash because this season looks like it may end up like the end of 2014 or a real crap fest like 2015?  

It's frustrating Titan, and the people that work behind the scenes appear to be fickle and clueless - they have more money than common sense.

 

I don't know if our hands are up, as in it's a holdup, or down at this point, lol. Maybe the best course is to cut a deal with the money boys on a football only facility so we are ready for the next guy. We fire him now for a couple more wins a year, don't have the building and repeat the 2012-2018 cycle again. I dunno at this point but it sure would be nice to have the facility for a new coach.

[keesler 5,924]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

I think a lot of us wanted to believe that he was turning the corner. But the size of that contract was mostly on Leath.  And I've been told by some that Leath was cautioned by some of the movers and shakers at Auburn not to go crazy, but he panicked.

That said, sometimes you make a bad investment.  The question is, what do you do when you realize it's bad?  Do you throw more money at it?  Do you ride it out and do nothing?  Or do you cut your losses?  I bet smart money people make the hard choice and stop throwing good money after bad or just hoping it will turn around.  They sell at a loss and move on to more profitable ventures.

 

I agree 100%. 

It's just unfortunate as hell that this is where AU Football sits today.  

[DAG 33,997]

This is what I will say. You either choose to make a decision to pull the plug now or continue to let the body rot. If he goes 5-7 and you basically choose to hold on to him for the buy out , then don’t complain when things don’t get any better in the next two years. Don’t complain about recruiting , don’t complain about losing to Mississippi State, don't complain about decreased ticket sales and fan support.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

11 minutes ago, IronMan70 said:

I've gone back and forth on this the last couple days. In some ways it would be nice to see something for the money instead of using it to buy out coaches like Chizik and Malzahn. I hear what you are saying though. The money boys don't want to spend it on facilities but will to buy out a coach.

My understanding is that there was always money for a football facility.  It was being held up by the PTB until Jacobs was gone.

[aujeff11 6,243]

17 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

What is more important to the success of a football program:  facilities upgrades or the head coach/coaching staff? 

Don’t think tbere is a clear cut answer. I’d rather us not have to force a hire. I am also going to consider it highly embarrassing that we have to fire a coach the next year after tbe guaranteed money heavyextension. It looks pretty bad on tbe fanbase that prides itself on family as well.  Lastly, I also think our pool of candidates will take that bipolarity factor under consideration which could hurt our chances of landing good candidates. 

[IronMan70 3,277]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

This is what I will say. You either choose to make a decision to pull the plug now or continue to let the body rot. If he goes 5-7 and you basically choose to hold on to him for the buy out , then don’t complain when things don’t get any better in the next two years. Don’t complain about recruiting , don’t complain about losing to Mississippi State, don't complain about decreased ticket sales and fan support.

That's true, you'd just have to accept a mediocre program in exchange for a football only facility (my scenario). If the money boys won't commit to that, cut the HC cord.