Sounds like someone is sowing some chaos.

[AUFAN78 3,942]

6 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

So you wouldn’t call it evil to take healthcare away from millions of people or Rob people of social security to pay for tax cuts for the wealthy?

Has your healthcare been taken away? Your social security?

[AUFAN78 3,942]

3 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

As long as we're all on the same page that words apparently don't matter anymore, I'm good.  Because that's the argument I'm reading from a lot of folks.

Simple answer: politics. It's a thing. Check it out. If you need examples I am here and will oblige. 

[AUFAN78 3,942]

Back to rhetoric: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/mar/6/trump-coverage-still-90-negative-says-new-study/

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

2 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Sorry, but this doesn't hold water.  Your example is saying "why didn't so get a standing O?"  This is a real life situation where the on-the-record to police excuse is essentially "the President said I could."  That's a really different conversation.

My point here is that some have argued that rhetoric doesn't directly lead to incidents of violence.  Well, here ya go.  The guy may have a criminal record, but there's absolutely no disputing what's in a freaking police report for the "fake news" crowd out there.  I didn't pull this out of butt either.  This happened earlier in the week.  

No my point is asking would I be held responsible for my actions or would people accept my transfer of blame to Robert De Niro. The standing ovation just demonstrated left societal support for his actions and words. Just like an influential man saying hey, its ok to grab women.... Trump.

Drop the fake news crap. I didn't even try and deny that the event didn't happen. I have no doubts he said what he did (article wanted me to pay to read).

Read this board, look at society, take a moment and take in how much of our society is based on shifting blames and being an a**hole with remarks.

Say I go to school event and pull a De Niro. People are shocked.... omg why did you do it!?!?..... I respond hey man did you see De Niro... he killed it with that. Now did De Niro make me do it really? Absolutely not, I know what is acceptable. Would I say he did to be a dick? Absolutely... mean I just yelled **** Trump at a children's event. Do you really think I care about societal norms?

Now just to be extreme. Let's say I go into a school that has liberal leanings and I shoot the place up. You go back to my house and find Trump clippings with highlighted phrases, list of names with strings connecting to supporting comments on Trump haters.... crap like that. Was my crazy ass influenced by the rhetoric then....absolutely.

Rhetoric can lead to violence yes. Not all violence is the result of rhetoric either.

Lol, then you got these guys.

 

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

10 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

As long as we're all on the same page that words apparently don't matter anymore, I'm good.  Because that's the argument I'm reading from a lot of folks.

No words do matter. So does the individual.

Like you. I have a hard time believing that any elected official or some celebrity could influence you to do something you did not want to do.

[GiveEmElle 1,559]

11 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Has your healthcare been taken away? Your social security?

Currently no. But that is the goal of the GOP.  And healthcare is essential for my chronically ill daughter. She will die without it.

 https://www.npr.org/2018/06/08/618263772/trump-administration-move-imperils-pre-existing-condition-protections

[Auburnfan91 1,407]

I know this might be another unpopular opinion, but could the bombs be a response to the poison letters sent a couple of weeks ago to Trump, Secretary of Defense James Mattis and Ted Cruz?

Quote

A flurry of suspicious envelopes targeting high-profile figures — including President Trump, Secretary of Defense James Mattis and Sen. Ted Cruz — were received in the past two days.

The Secret Service said in a Tuesday evening statement that it intercepted a "suspicious envelope" addressed to the president.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ricin-suspected-least-2-envelopes-sent-pentagon-mail-center-n915891

[AUDub 11,187]

Just now, Auburnfan91 said:

I know this might be another unpopular opinion, but could the bombs be a response to the poison letters sent a couple of weeks ago to Trump, Secretary of Defense James Mattis and Ted Cruz?

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ricin-suspected-least-2-envelopes-sent-pentagon-mail-center-n915891

Lordy, the news cycle is so fast right now it's hard to believe this happened earlier this month. 

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

1 hour ago, GiveEmElle said:

Both sides? No. It’s one person. Donald J. Trump. 

Two people. Donald Trump and this Georgetown Student!

 

[AUFAN78 3,942]

2 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

Currently no. But that is the goal of the GOP.  And healthcare is essential for my chronically ill daughter. She will die without it.

 https://www.npr.org/2018/06/08/618263772/trump-administration-move-imperils-pre-existing-condition-protections

I don't think so Elle. She'll grow to be a fine woman just like you. I'll be praying for you guys.

[AUFAN78 3,942]

5 minutes ago, AUDub said:

Lordy, the news cycle is so fast right now it's hard to believe this happened earlier this month. 

So true. Bottom line: crazies exist among us. No end in sight. 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

5 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

So true. Bottom line: crazies exist among us. No end in sight. 

And there will be no end as long as both sides blame the other as evidenced is spades here.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

22 minutes ago, Texan4Auburn said:

No words do matter. So does the individual.

Like you. I have a hard time believing that any elected official or some celebrity could influence you to do something you did not want to do.

Of course they couldn't in my case, but I'm a self admitted 100% grade-A jackass who has a disdain for people in general.  I find most to be incredibly dumb and usually prefer the company of smaller, well educated groups when I do socialize.  Which is also why I believe that such mental ineptitude can allow orators to convince people to do stupid things.  

For example (AND I'M NOT COMPARING TRUMP OR REPUBLICANS TO THIS), most Germans in the 1930s were pretty chill and peaceful. All of a sudden, a nut job comes along spouting off a bunch of crap that people buy into, rises to power, and the next thing you know, those same peaceful folks are condemning and perpetrating violence against their neighbors who they were once friendly with.  Nothing really changed to make such a dramatic shift except the rhetoric and tone of leadership.

We have academic research on the power of oratorical skill for a reason.  To dismiss it is, in my view, short-sighted and intellectually dishonest.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

48 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

I’m morally opposed to evil. The fact that that puts me in opposition to the GOP is a sad by product. And thank you for the compliment. 😘

Hate is evil so get off your moral high horse.

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

2 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

A couple of questions for civil discussion, if that's possible here. Based on what we know now:

1. Do you think the bomb maker intended to hurt anyone?

2. What do you think his motive is

For question one: First thing my grandfather taught me about a gun was never point it at anything you didn't intend to kill. I view sending a bomb the same way.

Question 2: My personal belief it is some jack-ass just wanting to cause chaos. It may sound silly, but in today's society I can see some ahole sitting around like the Joker going how can I best turn society in on itself.

[AUFAN78 3,942]

17 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

I'm a self admitted 100% grade-A jackass who has a disdain for people in general.  I find most to be incredibly dumb and usually prefer the company of smaller, well educated groups when I do socialize.

Damn. So I've known quite a few with this disease. Treatable with a good a$$ whipping. Let me know if you desire an adjustment. 

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

33 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

Currently no. But that is the goal of the GOP.  And healthcare is essential for my chronically ill daughter. She will die without it.

 https://www.npr.org/2018/06/08/618263772/trump-administration-move-imperils-pre-existing-condition-protections

This is one of the major reasons I will probably go with Beto.

Cruz's attempts on this. Now stating that he will not touch pre-existing conditions so late in the game. Can't buy it. Some other things also, but I have no faith in Cruz not to make a run at eliminating pre-existing conditions.

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

5 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Damn. So I've known quite a few with this disease. Treatable with a good a$$ whipping. Let me know if you desire an adjustment. 

Bring it on.  You won't be successful

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

33 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

As long as we're all on the same page that words apparently don't matter anymore, I'm good.  Because that's the argument I'm reading from a lot of folks.

That’s an irrational interpretation on your part. Granted, I haven’t read every post, so feel free to quote the words that lead you to decipher that insinuation.

I have gathered that this discussion focuses on the President’s rhetoric, and whether or not it culminated in the actions of some psycho mailing explosives to democratic leaders.

As to your referencing the sexual battery incident, you objectively lack any ability (as anyone else would) to demonstrate that President Trump “caused” the incident because of his rhetoric, thereby making him blameworthy. Yes the man referred to Trump’s words as indicated in the police report, but it clearly reads as an attempted excuse for a UNILATERAL decision to commit sexual battery against a woman. 

Do you think the act would not have occurred but-for the release of the recorded Trump audio?

Put another way, because of what Trump said, this man committed sexual battery. Is that how you would boil it down?

[AUFAN78 3,942]

1 minute ago, Brad_ATX said:

Bring it on.  You won't be successful

Good grief. Some here are a bit wound too tight. Enjoy the levity. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

33 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Good grief. Some here are a bit wound too tight. Enjoy the levity. 

I quite enjoy levity.  See the Tommy Tutone portion of the thread.  Just didn't think your post was all that creative or funny.  To each their own.

[SaltyTiger 7,890]

39 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

 

I have gathered that this discussion focuses on the President’s rhetoric

I think you are correct Nola. Could rain on home coming day at Auburn be President Trumps fault.

[AUFAN78 3,942]

2 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

I think you are correct Nola. Could rain on homing day at Auburn be President Trumps fault.

Nothing like a homing day. 

[TitanTiger 20,531]

3 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

No fair...that's a "whatabout."

How is it a "whatabout" when he's still talking about the president?

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

39 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

That’s an irrational interpretation on your part. Granted, I haven’t read every post, so feel free to quote the words that lead you to decipher that insinuation.

I really despise doing other folks' homework for them and you've admittedly not read the whole thread.  Feel free to say it's an irrational interpretation all you want.  I disagree and have read the whole thread.

I have gathered that this discussion focuses on the President’s rhetoric, and whether or not it culminated in the actions of some psycho mailing explosives to democratic leaders.

As to your referencing the sexual battery incident, you objectively lack any ability (as anyone else would) to demonstrate that President Trump “caused” the incident because of his rhetoric, thereby making him blameworthy. Yes the man referred to Trump’s words as indicated in the police report, but it clearly reads as an attempted excuse for a UNILATERAL decision to commit sexual battery against a woman. 

Do you think the act would not have occurred but-for the release of the recorded Trump audio?

It's certainly possible that it would have happened anyway.  But I've yet to see history from this individual that suggests it would have.  If something comes back that he's got a past of sexual misconduct, I'm happy to reconsider.  Just letting the facts lead me to conclusions, and right now, all facts point towards Trump's comments having a direct effect on this crime.

Put another way, because of what Trump said, this man committed sexual battery. Is that how you would boil it down?

I think it absolutely emboldened him to do so, yes.  His own words use POTUS as his primary defense.  To ignore that is folly and quite frankly, grasping at straws.  It's not much different than the many videos of closet racists coming out of the woodwork and shouting down those of other races in the name of Trump.  His demonizing of immigrants has absolutely led to a rise in overt actions by some by either using the exact language he's used or flat out saying "as Trump would say".  Just a few examples for you:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/25/us/video-diatribe-mexicans.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/12/04/high-school-sports-broadcasters-fired-after-racist-air-remarks-go-viral/919421001/

https://www.diversityinc.com/news/airbnb-racist-asian