Atlanta Shootings...

[homersapien 11,423]

54 minutes ago, Grumps said:

The cartoon misses the point. It is not about how many tyrants have been overthrown, it's about how many tyrannical leaders we have had. We have had zero, so the 2nd amendment has been 100% effective!

Yep.  Just like we won the Vietnam war because we kept the Viet Cong from invading California.

[homersapien 11,423]

38 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Whataboutism.

 

Well, Trump did try to incite an insurrection by promoting the lie the election was stolen from him.

I'd say that makes him a far better example of the risk an authoritarian POTUS than anyone else who has held the office - even worse than Nixon, which it perhaps the next best example.

But Biden????   That's absurd. 

 

 

[CoffeeTiger 5,154]

13 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

It is true that Hitler didn’t disarm every citizen, but the second part of my statement is the biggest reason he didn’t have to.  The media propaganda narrative convinced the German population that the Jews were the problem (along with any other *enemy of the state*) and he used the Weimar Republic’s gun registration law to root out gun owners of German Jews and other enemies of the state.

I found this pdf about the Nazi Party’s gun confiscation policy.

Adolph Hitler was named Chancellor of Germany on January 30, 1933. The Nazi regime immediately began a campaign to disarm and obliterate all enemies of the state, who were invariably designated “Communists.”

My Comments: Hitler started with ordinary citizens that designated as *Communists* and later, after Hitler had controlled the opposition his focus became the German Jews

Nazi repressive measures against Jewish firearms owners were facilitated by the 1928 Weimar gun control law, which banned firearms from “untrustworthy” persons and allowed the police to keep records on who acquired or carried firearms.  As the New York Times reported:
                                        Permission to Possess Arms Withdrawn From Breslau Jews
Breslau, April 21. The Police President of the city has decreed that “all persons now or formerly of the Jewish faith who hold permits to carry arms or shooting licenses must surrender them forthwith to the police authorities.”
The order is justified officially on the grounds that Jewish citizens have allegedly used their weapons for unlawful attacks on members of the Nazi organization and the police.
Inasmuch as the Jewish population “cannot be regarded as trustworthy,” it is stated, permits to carry arms will not in the future be issued to any member thereof.

https://www.independent.org/pdf/research_articles/2013-13-12-halbrook-arizona-journal.pdf

Notice it took less then 4 months to accomplish this.  The point being, once you disarm your opposition and control the rest of the people and the media, you can implement what ever policy you want.

The relaxing of gun laws you mentioned happened in 1938 when Hitler had complete control of the country and felt he could do so without opposition.

The article also mentioned *military weapons* could not be possessed by the citizens whether *Communists* or not.  Sounds somewhat familiar.

You mean Hitler used propaganda to blame all of Germany's troubles on minorities and political opponents by labeling them as  'Communist'? ...............(clears throat)...anyway. 

 

 1930's Germany just proves that a Government that controls the military and has popular support can abuse it's power regardless of if the people are armed or not. 

 

 

[homersapien 11,423]

Good discussion on American gun culture.

Conservatives are mad at Michael Moore again — because he's right about gun culture

Moore's dark joke about the Boulder shootings might not have been graceful, but it expressed something profound

By Chauncey DeVega

March 26, 2021

The right-wing "cancel culture" mob has once again grabbed their torches and pitchforks. Their newest target is documentary filmmaker and political commentator Michael Moore.

What is Moore's most recent offense?

In response to Monday's mass shooting in Boulder, Colorado, Moore tweeted "The life of Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa shows that people can come from all over the world and truly assimilate into our beloved American culture," and included an image of the Statue of Liberty.

Alissa is the alleged shooter in the Boulder tragedy. He was born in Syria but came to the United States as a child in 2002.

Reasonable persons may choose to disagree with Moore's timing, or his tone. But the fact remains that his comments about the Boulder mass shooting are largely correct.

Those on the right and elsewhere who are performatively "outraged" at Moore's comment are just angry because he spoke the truth about America's gun culture and our societal addiction to mass shootings and gun violence.

Moore's tweet about guns and American culture were even more triggering for conservatives and other members of the right because he included an image of the Statue of Liberty, a sacred object in the national imagination.

It is no coincidence that death anxieties are a key factor that correlate with high levels of support for Trumpism and other authoritarian movements.

Public opinion polls show that as mass shootings and other gun violence has increased in America, Republicans actually oppose gun safety efforts even more. Predictably — and far more logically — Democrats and liberals respond to mass shootings and other gun-violence tragedies with greater support for gun safety laws.

Death anxiety has a profound influence on American politics in other ways as well: In red-state regions where coronavirus rates (and death rates) are highest, support for Donald Trump during the 2020 Election was also at its highest. In essence, death and sickness have made Trump's followers increasingly loyal to him and the Republican Party.

Ultimately, America's inability to create and enforce effective gun laws is rooted in competing conceptions of freedom. Conservatives emphasize "negative freedom" and a belief that government should be shrunk down to the bare minimum, and that "freedom from" is the most important aspect of democracy and human existence.

Liberals, progressives and other more humane thinkers understand that government can play a positive role in society. In this conception, "positive freedom" means that citizens can live better and more productive lives where, for example, they are free from anxieties about being killed in a mass shooting, or free from the fear that they may fall ill and not have access to health care, or free from the fear that their environment is dangerously polluted.

To state this equation differently, a gun owner's freedom ends at the boundaries and limits of public safety. Likewise, the "personal freedom" not to wear a mask during the coronavirus pandemic ends at the health and safety of other people.

A healthy democracy always involves a balance between these positive and negative understandings of freedom.

What Michael Moore hinted at in his tweet about gun violence is the reality that we need to embrace a new form of American patriotism, one grounded in the facts and realities of American history, life and culture.

If the American people keep on lying to themselves about who they are, then the plague of mass shootings and gun violence will continue — and all the other existential problems in our society that feed into this epidemic of violence will keep getting worse as well.

https://www.salon.com/2021/03/26/conservatives-are-mad-at-michael-moore-again--because-hes-right-about-gun-culture/

[Grumps 3,704]

24 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Yep.  Just like we won the Vietnam war because we kept the Viet Cong from invading California.

Just like it.

[I_M4_AU 7,931]

29 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

You mean Hitler used propaganda to blame all of Germany's troubles on minorities and political opponents by labeling them as  'Communist'? ...............(clears throat)...anyway. 

 

 1930's Germany just proves that a Government that controls the military and has popular support can abuse it's power regardless of if the people are armed or not. 

 

 

Yes, he used propaganda to blame all of Germany’s problems on minorities, that’s what a tyrant does under the guise of being a socialist.  It’s up to the press and the citizens to call it out and they did not.  The press today can’t even ask a hard question of Biden, much less a decent follow up.  

Once again, if Germany and the Nazis thought it didn’t matter if the citizens were armed or not, he would not have started his regime out disarming his opposition.

[DKW 86 7,438]

[CoffeeTiger 5,154]

17 minutes ago, DKW 86 said:

Hey, at least this meme is being honest. It's not about overthrowing a tyrannical government or defending against a foreign invader. 

 

Gun rights/ownership is mainly about defending yourself against other destitute and/or mentally unstable American citizens who have very easy access to high powered weaponry. 

 

[aubaseball 2,647]

“Liberals, progressives and other more humane thinkers understand that government can play a positive role in society. “

This quote let’s you know that if you have a different opinion or thought it’s not even worth listening to.   For a minute there I thought I lived in the USA, guess I was wrong 

[I_M4_AU 7,931]

16 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

Hey, at least this meme is being honest. It's not about overthrowing a tyrannical government or defending against a foreign invader. 

 

Gun rights/ownership is mainly about defending yourself against other destitute and/or mentally unstable American citizens who have very easy access to high powered weaponry. 

 

I now understand your concept of gun ownership.  I hope you never own one.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

7 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I now understand your concept of gun ownership.  I hope you never own one.

No kidding! 

[CoffeeTiger 5,154]

46 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I now understand your concept of gun ownership.  I hope you never own one.

It's just the truth. A lot of people buy guns because their kleptomaniac/ meth head neighbor has a gun, or they live in a bad neighborhood where gangs run around waiving their guns around, Or there was a shootout in the parking lot of the place they shop at the other month, or their cousin got robbed at gun point one time. 

 

Yes, they'll brag on Facebook how they'll get a raging hard on while shooting imaginary communist storm troopers that Fox News or InfoWars told them the Democrats will send to take their guns away, but really for most people it's about self defense and preservation because they know America isn't always a safe and secure place to live. They know everyone else out there with bad intentions or just normal people who have a bad temper are also likely packing heat and you never know when your quiet American existence will suddenly turn into a war zone and you'll have to Rambo it up to protect you and yours. 

 

 Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to ban all guns,  but giving such open, unregulated access to weapons IS a unique American problem that has caused a lot of unique American issues and it'd be nice if Conservatives were more open to talking about the issue and working to fix them instead of screaming about how their 2nd amendment rights trumps the safety and security of Americas school children and citizens and that there can never be any compromise on the issue ever. 

[autigeremt 6,660]

8 hours ago, homersapien said:

Would that be the U.S. military?

See what on campus?

Military, government contractor and with DHS. 
 

A lot of Asians don’t care for Americans even when we allow them to get an advanced education on our college campuses. Frequently taking advantage of us or each other depending on the nationality. Humans are known for discrimination all over the world.