Happy independence day!!

[homersapien 11,637]

8 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

This is from California’s Sexual Orientation law passed in 2012:

(e) The American School Counselor Association’s position statement on professional school counselors and lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered, and questioning (LGBTQ) youth states: “It is not the role of the professional school counselor to attempt to change a student’s sexual orientation/gender identity but instead to provide support to LGBTQ students to promote student achievement and personal well-being. Recognizing that sexual orientation is not an illness and does not require treatment, professional school counselors may provide individual student planning or responsive services to LGBTQ students to promote self-acceptance, deal with social acceptance, understand issues related to coming out, including issues that families may face when a student goes through this process and identify appropriate community resources.”   Sounds reasonable to me

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201120120SB1172

So school councilors must promote the student’s perception of their gender without question.  Nonsense.  Counselers are not "required" to "promote" anything.  That's not what therapy is about.

In March, California lawmakers introduced a separate bill, the Confidentiality of Medical Information Act, that would hold health insurance companies criminally liable if they disclosed sensitive medical information to parents about their dependents, including treatment and procedures that have been done without their knowledge.

Democratic Gov. Gavin Newsom also approved a fund in September that earmarks taxpayer money for “gender-affirming health care services” including puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones for youth. Hundreds of health clinics are popping up on middle and high school campuses across the state.

https://wng.org/roundups/washington-erasing-parents-from-the-equation-1617220589

Washington state is considering the same legislation effectively taking the parents out of the equation.

The modern day conversion therapy is keeping the knowledge of a young child’s gender from those that might disagree with the child.  It is not an open discussion with all involved.

As you have already demonstrated, there is no modern day "conversion therapy".  There's no conversion therapy at all.  (I only referred to that as a presumption of what you considered was taking place.)

 

Do you think the parent should have knowledge of something as important as a gender change?

 

Well, I'll answer the last question first.

Yes, I think a parent should have knowledge of such a thing.  But that knowledge should come from the child, not required of the people who are treating him. 

I can easily envision situations where involving the parent would not be in the child's interest. No doubt that is what these laws are getting at -  protecting the child's best interests.

A "good" parent would already be aware of their child's issues with their self concept of gender or sex.  If they aren't, that means the child is concealing it from them.  There's a reason for that, and it's typically fear or shame.

So your concern of being left out of the "information loop" is perhaps an opportunity for introspection. A good parent should not find such things as their child's self concept of gender or sexuality a surprise, they would expect their child to tell them what's going on in their lives and not depend on a therapist to find out.

Meanwhile, like any good doctor, the therapists priority is the patient.

And I am still confused about your specific position on conversion therapy.  Do you support therapists attempting to "cure" a child's self-perception of their sexuality or not?   If so, what is the basis of that belief?

I get the distinct impression - based on your apparent opposition to these laws prohibiting "conversion therapy" that you would reinstate it's legitimacy.

If so, how would this be any different than allowing a doctor to practice something which has been disallowed by all reputable medical associations and authorities (a.k.a. malpractice)?

 

[PUB78 1,369]

8 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

"take back our country", "joining and supporting organizations and associations that support these values and are working to restore our country to its roots", MAGA

I am from Alabama.  I have known people in all of these organizations who were devout racists, tacit racists, merely prejudiced.  Those associations mean nothing.

 

I asked you specifically about the love of Jesus, the principles of Jesus.

Your answers are quite revealing. 

What organizations or groups that I mentioned are , in your mind, promoting. MAGA? 

[homersapien 11,637]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

To discuss gender identity with a 5 year old is ridiculous.  So one day that 5 year old wants to be Batman and the next an astronaut.  One day he believes he is a girl and announces that to the school counselor and from then on, to the school, he is a girl.  Don’t you think a parent should have the opportunity to discuss with the child if he knows what he is really saying?

According to some, that would be conversion therapy.

It has been stated that people’s brains are not fully developed until they are 25 or so, does it make sense to take a child word that he is a she at 5?

 

Who in hell has suggested or is suggesting that parents don't have - or shouldn't have - an opportunity to discuss whatever they want to discuss with their children?   

Man you really have some strange irrational fears about this.

Edited July 6, 2022 by homersapien

[I_M4_AU 8,153]

8 minutes ago, homersapien said:

And I am still confused about your specific position on conversion therapy. 

The conversion therapy is used by the LGBTQ community to shame a parent (or anybody else) to not even to try to talk their child out of their decision they made about their gender.

The issue I have is teaching young children that are not capable to understand the concept that is being taught.  It just confuses them.  Any curiosity the child has should be brought to the attention of the parents first.

I haven’t been a parent of a school aged child for decades, my youngest is 33.  I am not sure how I would proceed in today’s world, but I do know I would be upset if I wasn’t’t allowed the opportunity to mentor my child in such a difficult decision.

[I_M4_AU 8,153]

8 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Who in hell has suggested or is suggesting that parents don't have - or shouldn't have - an opportunity to discuss whatever they want to discuss with their children?   

Man you really have some strange irrational fears about this.

Schools hide transgender identity from the parents in California, Oregon and Washington among others.

An Ohio school district is the latest to adopt a policy restricting staff from informing parents if a child chooses to adopt a transgender identity unless compelled to do so by law.

The policy adopted by the Olentangy Local School District , near the state capital of Columbus, obtained by the parent activist group Parents Defending Education, expressly instructs staff to avoid notifying parents when their child chooses to express a transgender identity while on school grounds.

"School staff must not disclose information that may reveal a student’s transgender status to others, including parents and other staff, unless legally required to do so," the district's guidelines on transgender students say.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/community-family/ohio-school-district-adopts-policy-of-hiding-gender-transitions-from-parents

[I_M4_AU 8,153]

No, I’m not making this stuff up @CoffeeTiger

 

Attacking the vulnerable is what we are suppose to fight back against.

[homersapien 11,637]

2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Schools hide transgender identity from the parents in California, Oregon and Washington among others.

An Ohio school district is the latest to adopt a policy restricting staff from informing parents if a child chooses to adopt a transgender identity unless compelled to do so by law.

The policy adopted by the Olentangy Local School District , near the state capital of Columbus, obtained by the parent activist group Parents Defending Education, expressly instructs staff to avoid notifying parents when their child chooses to express a transgender identity while on school grounds.

"School staff must not disclose information that may reveal a student’s transgender status to others, including parents and other staff, unless legally required to do so," the district's guidelines on transgender students say.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/community-family/ohio-school-district-adopts-policy-of-hiding-gender-transitions-from-parents

Please read again, more carefully.

You said:

" Don’t you think a parent should have the opportunity to discuss with the child if he knows what he is really saying?"

My response was:

Who in hell has suggested parents don't have - or shouldn't have - an opportunity to discuss whatever they want to discuss with their children?   

 

Still waiting on a response.  It certainly wasn't in the stuff you posted.

 

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,637]

15 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

No, I’m not making this stuff up

 

Of course not. 

You found it on Tik Toc 

[I_M4_AU 8,153]

6 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Please read again, more carefully.

You said:

" Don’t you think a parent should have the opportunity to discuss with the child if he knows what he is really saying?"

My response was:

Who in hell has suggested or is suggesting that parents don't have - or shouldn't have - an opportunity to discuss whatever they want to discuss with their children?   

 

Still waiting on a response.  It certainly wasn't in the stuff you posted.

 

 

If the Ohio school board passes a policy that keeps the school from telling parents of the students gender identity, It would strongly suggests the the Ohio school board thinks parents shouldn’t have that opportunity.  If the parents find out, it won’t be because of any school official and if the school official thinks the parents are not a *trusted* person, the kids not telling either.

[I_M4_AU 8,153]

10 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Of course not. 

You found it on Tik Toc 

Do you dispute the content or the source?

[homersapien 11,637]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

If the Ohio school board passes a policy that keeps the school from telling parents of the students gender identity, It would strongly suggests the the Ohio school board thinks parents shouldn’t have that opportunity.  If the parents find out, it won’t be because of any school official and if the school official thinks the parents are not a *trusted* person, the kids not telling either.

You are crazy paranoid if you think a school actually wants to prevent you from discussing anything you - or your kid - would like to discuss together, simply because they have a policy of strict patient confidentiality.

I suggest it's up to you to provide the trusting, loving atmosphere in which your child feels comfortable in doing so. Let the child bring it up with you - or not - as he desires.

It would be irresponsible and careless for the school or a therapist to just assume that sort of relationship exists.  Often, it doesn't. And that  could potentially lead to a student suicide.

 

 

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,637]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Do you dispute the content or the source?

No, I am just agreeing that you "didn't just make it up". You found it on Tic Tok, where you can find anything you want to find, especially conspiracist propaganda. 

So there's no need to make it up,  right?  Someone on Tik Toc will  make it up for you.

 Now, care to point out the verified "facts" it contained? 

 

Edited July 7, 2022 by homersapien

[SaturdayGT 719]

On 7/5/2022 at 1:16 PM, icanthearyou said:

This is not true.  Politics, democracy should be the balancing of the interests of society at large with the interests of capital.  It cannot function when one interest effectively owns the government.

I do agree that most of us want this balance.  Unfortunately, we have become too naive, too indoctrinated to understand that at the heart of politics is civil class warfare.  We cannot accept that the classes are now 400 people versus 350,000,000.

We need to restore some balance.

God...that first paragraph is what I interpret as what was intended.  ...I dont think its the case today...I feel like politics now trys to distance us apart for political benefits. ..dirty politics is not new to anybody...they aren't trying to unite us ....I mean how does unity benefit politicians!? Lol......its division!! That's where the money's at...division is where they can "take action!" And look like they want to make efforts for unity....and the masses fawn all over them..seems easy with today's division...

 

[icanthearyou 4,465]

13 hours ago, SaturdayGT said:

God...that first paragraph is what I interpret as what was intended.  ...I dont think its the case today...I feel like politics now trys to distance us apart for political benefits. ..dirty politics is not new to anybody...they aren't trying to unite us ....I mean how does unity benefit politicians!? Lol......its division!! That's where the money's at...division is where they can "take action!" And look like they want to make efforts for unity....and the masses fawn all over them..seems easy with today's division...

 

Divide and conquer.   Jay Gould was once asked if he feared a popular uprising.  His answer was, "no, you can always pay one half of the masses to kill the other half."