Trump the Dictator

[SaltyTiger 7,863]

3 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

Yes,,, that closet full of MAGA merchandise is very indicative.

Lot of folks must have the stuff ready to pull out. Couple of articles the past few days liking Trumps chances 2024.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/yes-trump-can-win-2024-election-here-are-four-reasons-why-2023-12-12/

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-high-chances-winning-2024-141700785.html

“Trump, for the first time, had outpaced Biden in pre-election ratings, according to a poll by U.S. newspaper the Wall Street Journal on Dec. 9.

While Trump has relatively few supporters, estimated at 25–35% of the population, Motyl noted that the forecasts predicting his victory inspire not only his base but also other Republicans, exacerbating polarization between Republicans and Democrats.

“A month ago, he was only getting close to Biden himself, but now it seems he could win. Even everyone has started talking about Trump's inevitable victory," Motyl said.”

 

 

[icanthearyou 4,463]

4 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Lot of folks must have the stuff ready to pull out. Couple of articles the past few days liking Trumps chances 2024.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/yes-trump-can-win-2024-election-here-are-four-reasons-why-2023-12-12/

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-high-chances-winning-2024-141700785.html

“Trump, for the first time, had outpaced Biden in pre-election ratings, according to a poll by U.S. newspaper the Wall Street Journal on Dec. 9.

While Trump has relatively few supporters, estimated at 25–35% of the population, Motyl noted that the forecasts predicting his victory inspire not only his base but also other Republicans, exacerbating polarization between Republicans and Democrats.

“A month ago, he was only getting close to Biden himself, but now it seems he could win. Even everyone has started talking about Trump's inevitable victory," Motyl said.”

 

 

As I said. 

[KansasTiger 3,256]

7 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Lot of folks must have the stuff ready to pull out. Couple of articles the past few days liking Trumps chances 2024.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/yes-trump-can-win-2024-election-here-are-four-reasons-why-2023-12-12/

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-high-chances-winning-2024-141700785.html

“Trump, for the first time, had outpaced Biden in pre-election ratings, according to a poll by U.S. newspaper the Wall Street Journal on Dec. 9.

While Trump has relatively few supporters, estimated at 25–35% of the population, Motyl noted that the forecasts predicting his victory inspire not only his base but also other Republicans, exacerbating polarization between Republicans and Democrats.

“A month ago, he was only getting close to Biden himself, but now it seems he could win. Even everyone has started talking about Trump's inevitable victory," Motyl said.”

 

 

It's early. But anyone saying he doesn't have a chance is delusional. People have to keep in mind, through 2 elections, he's outperformed polls both times. Likely because libs like to shame Trump supporters (as seen in this forum) and Trump supporters just turn into silent supporters. If polls say he is up, by 1 poll as much as 10%, he's likely up by quite a bit.

[auburnatl1 5,056]

1 minute ago, KansasTiger said:

Then people better get to supporting Vivek real soon. Because there isn't a single other GOP candidate outside of him I'd support. Desantis is the face the establishment wear when they want to pretend theyre anti establishment.

If you're aren't really pissing people off in your own party, you're not the right candidate for me because the positions I and many like me hold, will piss off the establishment. 

If RFK was the dem nominee I'd strongly consider him. But as a third party candidate, he's unfortunately a throw away vote.

So to get things done we need a  one-liner crass contrarian to just “stick it to the man” right? Heres the problem - Congress. 60% vote. Compromise. It’s how this whole pesky democracy thing works. Because if you don’t it’s just executive orders (not laws) which can be unwound with a signature. Almost every single thing Trump did in 4 years was vaporized in 24hrs. And would happen again.

Vivek and trump are classic run your own thing, be provocative start up guys.  I see it all the time.They can’t run large companies. Or countries Look at musk - same type. Tesla startup guy,  quirky and brash.  Takes over Twitter, a massive multinational company  - and he’s almost completely destroyed its market value. But damn he’s brash.  IMO you’re enamored with change agent, blow it up  personalities vs guys that can actually run large, complex, political cultures and get things done that last.

 

[KansasTiger 3,256]

15 minutes ago, auburnatl1 said:

So to get things done we need a  one-liner crass contrarian to just “stick it to the man” right? Heres the problem - Congress. 60% vote. Compromise. It’s how this whole pesky democracy thing works. Because if you don’t it’s just executive orders (not laws) which can be unwound with a signature. Almost every single thing Trump did in 4 years was vaporized in 24hrs. And would happen again.

Vivek and trump are classic run your own thing, be provocative start up guys.  I see it all the time.They can’t run large companies. Or countries Look at musk - same type. Tesla startup guy,  quirky and brash.  Takes over Twitter, a massive multinational company  - and he’s almost completely destroyed its market value. But damn he’s brash.  IMO you’re enamored with change agent, blow it up  personalities vs guys that can actually run large, complex, political cultures and get things done that last.

 

You're partially right. I want a change agent. Trump actually wasn't enough of one the first time around IMO. I don't want the country to run the way it used to. So none of what you said was appealing to me. You still believe alot of the lies Washington feeds us. I've started seeing it as one party vs. the rest. Everyone over there is on the same side. The money and corruption side. At least ICantHearYou gets parts of this right (when I choose to unblock his posts). I want anyone I can to throw into that equation and break it. And if you can't be that person, I won't vote for you.

Edited December 15, 2023 by KansasTiger

[auburnatl1 5,056]

9 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

You're partially right. I want a blow it up change agent. Trump actually wasn't enough of one the first time around IMO. I don't want the country to run the way it used to. So none of what you said was appealing to me. You still believe alot of the lies Washington feeds us. I've started seeing it as one party vs. the rest. Everyone over there is on the same side. The money and corruption side. At least ICantHearYou gets parts of this right (when I choose to unblock his posts). I want anyone I can to throw into that equation and break it. And if you can't be that person, I won't vote for you.

If you break it you actually have to be able to  … fix it. I believe in finance reform, ending of lobbyists, and term limits. Different subjects. However, (using a military metaphor you might appreciate), I  think youre confusing  Patton with Eisenhower types. One is useful for bravado and taking Bastogne and territory - but with needless controversy and distracting chaos. The other is less sexy but better at diplomacy, strategy, and actually winning wars. And the peace.

 

[KansasTiger 3,256]

2 minutes ago, auburnatl1 said:

If you break it you actually have to be able to  … fix it. I believe in finance reform, ending of lobbyists, and term limits. Different subjects. However, (using a military metaphor you might appreciate), I  think youre confusing  Patton with Eisenhower types. One is useful for bravado and taking Bastogne and territory - but with needless controversy and distracting chaos. The other is less sexy but better at diplomacy, strategy, and actually winning wars. And the peace.

 

Ok, I can see the difference. But there isn't an Eisenhower type in this race. There's two and a half Pattons and a bunch of duplicitous corrupt bought and paid for politicians. I'm not saying they have to be a Trump. But that's my choice.

I also think that the system will turn any true anti establishment guy's image into a 'Patton' to continue the analogy, because that benefits them in the battle against them. Take RFK for example. Many of his statements have been taken wildly out of context, misquoted, and sometimes just flat out lied about, in an attempt by the msm to make him look like a Patton because they're easier to combat. Because the system isn't going to fairly cover someone that wants to upset their existence.

I think this also applies to Vivek and Trump, though Trump says plenty on his own that doesn't help, too.

[auburnatl1 5,056]

1 minute ago, KansasTiger said:

Ok, I can see the difference. But there isn't an Eisenhower type in this race. There's two and a half Pattons and a bunch of duplicitous corrupt bought and paid for politicians. I'm not saying they have to be a Trump. But that's my choice.

I also think that the system will turn any true anti establishment guy's image into a 'Patton' to continue the analogy, because that benefits them in the battle against them. Take RFK for example. Many of his statements have been taken wildly out of context, misquoted, and sometimes just flat out lied about, in an attempt by the msm to make him look like a Patton because they're easier to combat. Because the system isn't going to fairly cover someone that wants to upset their existence.

I think this also applies to Vivek and Trump, though Trump says plenty on his own that doesn't help, too.

I’m not a fan of Obama but he did things that lasted. Laws.  So has Biden. 10 years from now, is there anything that Trump or Vivek would do that would have legs? Theyre like energy drinks - you’re jacked and then it’s like you never had one. To be clear - I can’t stand trump and disagree with much of maga. So I’m not neutral. But even if I liked him, the guy can’t win any elections, build a wall, stay out of trouble, or pass any legislation. Nothing.  Always someone else’s fault when he fails.

But damn he’s brash. 

Kansas, some guy on a forum won’t change your mind - but imo you have a very forgiving definition of what success looks like.

[KansasTiger 3,256]

11 minutes ago, auburnatl1 said:

I’m not a fan of Obama but he did things that lasted. Laws.  So has Biden. 10 years from now, is there anything that Trump or Vivek would do that would have legs? Theyre like energy drinks - you’re jacked and then it’s like you never had one. To be clear - I can’t stand trump and disagree with much of maga. So I’m not neutral. But even if I liked him, the guy can’t win any elections, build a wall, stay out of trouble, or pass any legislation. Nothing.  Always someone else’s fault when he fails.

But damn he’s brash. 

Kansas, some guy on a forum won’t change your mind - but imo you have a very forgiving definition of what success looks like.

Yeah, there's way too many fallacies in your response for me to respond to all of them. Youve half tricked me into having a portion of a conversation i said i didnt want to have on this forum. This a beer conversation. Difference is, you've approached this respectfully where I'd actually enjoy this conversation over a beer with you. But not here.

I didn't know I was arguing about what success looks like. Success happens in stages, over years. One administration isn't going to magically fix this. But it can't even start while that wheel keeps spinning.

And one perspective thinks I'm dumb and have been duped by a con into supporting a traitor. The other thinks you all are dumb and have been duped by a con into supporting traitors. And life goes on.

[auburnatl1 5,056]

2 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

Yeah, there's way too many fallacies in your response for me to respond to all of them. Youve half tricked me into having a portion of a conversation i said i didnt want to have on this forum. This a beer conversation. Difference is, you've approached this respectfully where I'd actually enjoy this conversation over a beer with you. But not here.

I didn't know I was arguing about what success looks like. Success happens in stages, over years. One administration isn't going to magically fix this. But it can't even start while that wheel keeps spinning.

And one perspective thinks I'm dumb and have been duped by a con into supporting a traitor. The other thinks you all are dumb and have been duped by a con into supporting traitors. And life goes on.

Didn’t mean to trick you.  Not even sure what you mean. All is well. 

[KansasTiger 3,256]

Just now, auburnatl1 said:

Didn’t mean to trick you.  Not even sure what you mean. All is well. 

I'm not mad about it lol. More mad at myself for getting caught in the moment. I just don't trust the forum enough for it.

I'd even upgrade this convo to a bourbon conversation...mostly cause I have a collection.

[icanthearyou 4,463]

3 hours ago, KansasTiger said:

I've started seeing it as one party vs. the rest. Everyone over there is on the same side. The money and corruption side.

What you are observing is the power of capital.  Both parties are right wing (one moderate, one extreme).  Both serve capital.

Good government balances the interests of capital and society.  Capital has dominated politics for 5 decades.  We need to restore balance.  It will not happen until the people of this country unite in the effort to remove money from the political and governing processes.  Until then,,, enjoy the growing debt and, the stagnate wages.

Edited December 16, 2023 by icanthearyou

[SaltyTiger 7,863]

5 hours ago, KansasTiger said:

It's early. But anyone saying he doesn't have a chance is delusional. People have to keep in mind, through 2 elections, he's outperformed polls both times. Likely because libs like to shame Trump supporters (as seen in this forum) and Trump supporters just turn into silent supporters. If polls say he is up, by 1 poll as much as 10%, he's likely up by quite a bit.

Correct. A lot of people continue to view Trump as kiss my @$$ status quo Washington.