Let's hear it for Costco

[Bottomfeeder 244]

Lipitor 20 mg

Consumer Price (100 tablets): $272.37

Cost of general active ingredients: $5.80

Percent markup: 4,696%

http://www.bloginservice.com/cgi-bin/webbb...rames/read/3065

[WarTiger 3,916]

Well, here i am...Not sure what brought me in to the political forum, but here i am. First time for everything i guess. Anyway, this post intrigued me. The prescription drug industry in this country is only half the problem. I'm sure you realize how much it costs to get ONE drug approved by the FDA in this country, right?? In case you didn't know....$800 MILLION.... Now we have something else that is going to make its way in to the US very soon, if we don't do something to stope it. CODEX is coming folks. Without the paperwork in front of me, CODEX basicallly means that ALL OVER THE COUNTER supplements like, B12, Calcium, Zinc just to name a few will have a very low dosage available to the general public. What i mean is, lets say you curently take 100mg of calcium in a pill form everyday. Well, with CODEX, the FDA will then govern that calcium that you take. The FDA may come out with a standard like the average human only needs 5mg of calcium per day(just an arbitrary figure to prove my point). Anything over that will require a prescription from you doctor.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I take several supplements, and I don't want to have to go get a perscription from a doctor for them. But, if we dont stop it, thats what is going to happen. So many people are turning to alternative forms of medicine, it has affected the bottom line...And we all know what the bottom line is....MONEY. The FDA wants to regulate these supplements so they can reap the benefits financially.

[AURaptor 1,126]

Lipitor 20 mg

Consumer Price (100 tablets): $272.37

Cost of general active ingredients: $5.80

Percent markup: 4,696%

http://www.bloginservice.com/cgi-bin/webbb...rames/read/3065

219816[/snapback]

Canada is always right across the border. Don't know about Delta, but some airline is ready when you are.

[TrueBlue72 0]

Unfortunately the FDA has become simply a lackey for big Pharma. Whatever the big pharmaceutical companies want, the FDA will do.

I don't have a problem with pharmaceutical companies making a profit, but their fight to dominate and control the choices that consumers have by using the federal government is simply wrong.

My struggle with health problems over the last decade has taught me that there are a lot of "alternative" remedies that are just as effective or more effective than the standard prescription remedies and a lot more cost effective. They are not approved because there is no financial incentive to go through the process. The ONLY folks with the money required to run the FDA gauntlet are the big pharmaceutical companies. And they spend a lot of money to discredit the alternative remedies to stifle competition.

One example is Mygrafew, an herbal migrane remedy that is incredibly effective and costs about $6 per month if you order it online. The folks at the health food stores are prohibited from telling you that it works for migranes because of FDA regulations!!! You have to research it and find out for yourself or pay an exorbitant amount for an approved prescription that isn't nearly as effective. Tell me that is protecting the public! Through the use of many alternative remedies, I have lived much longer than my doctor predicted; I'm at 65 months now for a normal survival time of 18 to 20 months and the main reason is that I ignored my doctor's recommendation and took matters into my own hands.

I am concerned about CODEX, but it won't likely happen quickly enough to impact my situation. I'll have to leave that to the next generation of rebels against the AMA and FDA.

[WarTiger 3,916]

Unfortunately the FDA has become simply a lackey for big Pharma.  Whatever the big pharmaceutical companies want, the FDA will do.

I don't have a problem with pharmaceutical companies making a profit, but their fight to dominate and control the choices that consumers have by using the federal government is simply wrong. 

My struggle with health problems over the last decade has taught me that there are a lot of "alternative" remedies that are just as effective or more effective than the standard prescription remedies and a lot more cost effective.  They are not approved because there is no financial incentive to go through the process.  The ONLY folks with the money required to run the FDA gauntlet are the big pharmaceutical companies.  And they spend a lot of money to discredit the alternative remedies to stifle competition. 

One example is Mygrafew, an herbal migrane remedy that is incredibly effective and costs about $6 per month if you order it online.  The folks at the health food stores are prohibited from telling you that it works for migranes because of FDA regulations!!!  You have to research it and find out for yourself or pay an exorbitant amount for an approved prescription that isn't nearly as effective.  Tell me that is protecting the public!  Through the use of many alternative remedies, I have lived much longer than my doctor predicted; I'm at 65 months now for a normal survival time of 18 to 20 months and the main reason is that I ignored my doctor's recommendation and took matters into my own hands. 

I am concerned about CODEX, but it won't likely happen quickly enough to impact my situation.  I'll have to leave that to the next generation of rebels against the AMA and FDA.

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This is a prime example of why the FDA wants CODEX in the US. They know people are using alternative forms of healing, and the FDA doesn't make any money off of these people. The natural thing for them to do is regulate it, very sternly, so they can start making money on it, or make it impossible for people such as yourself to get the supplements that you've been using for years, which would force you to use the prescription DRUGS that the doctors are telling you you need...

[TitanTiger 20,509]

Lipitor 20 mg

Consumer Price (100 tablets): $272.37

Cost of general active ingredients: $5.80

Percent markup: 4,696%

http://www.bloginservice.com/cgi-bin/webbb...rames/read/3065

219816[/snapback]

There are many things to admire about Costco, how they compensate their people and provide affordable health insurance chief among them. But the rest of this post is malarky. The cost of a drug is not rightly determined by adding up the cost of the ingredients. Prescription drugs take upwards of 8-15 years of research, development, trial and error, testing, submissions for FDA approval and so on, with costs in the billions of dollars. Sometimes a drug goes through most or all of this process and never makes it to market at all because of problems with the final formula and so on. So the drugs that do make it also have to pay for all the ones that don't for a pharma company to be profitable.

Now, I'm not saying that pharma companies couldn't be a little more reasonable with their pricing. Many of them are quite profitable even with all of the above factors in mind and could cut sick people a break. But the bottom line is, adding up ingredients and extrapolating that into some rant about how big pharma is raping customers is just showing one's ignorance.

[otterinbham 0]

Bottomfeeder, you obviously don't own a business. And I'm guessing you've never had to take a business course either.

Sure, if you look at cost of raw materials that go into a pill, then I could see how you could reach that conclusion. However, the vast majority of costs in pharmaceuticals has to do with the cost of developing that pill. The legions of doctors, the laboratories, the technicians, the endless studies, and all the other overhead that goes into producing. So before the very first pill goes into the very first bottle, a pharmaceutical is already in the hole hundreds of millions of dollars.

Even then, you don't take into account that for every medicine that makes it to market, there are several that do not pass inspection. And yet each of those drugs required the same commitment of dollars over the same prolonged length of time. So that Lipitor has to cover the development costs for several other medicines that didn't make it to market. So essentially, you propose that the drug manufacturers stop performing research and development if you tie the cost of your prescription solely to the sunk costs on that one medicine.

What's more, you don't even begin to account for the legal liability a drug manufacturer faces for unanticipated side effects that don't show up in clinical trials.

So if you want reasonable drug costs, then you need to expect a laxer regulatory environment and a less rapacious legal system. Because you can't have one without the other.

[WarTiger 3,916]

Lipitor 20 mg

Consumer Price (100 tablets): $272.37

Cost of general active ingredients: $5.80

Percent markup: 4,696%

http://www.bloginservice.com/cgi-bin/webbb...rames/read/3065

219816[/snapback]

There are many things to admire about Costco, how they compensate their people and provide affordable health insurance chief among them. But the rest of this post is malarky. The cost of a drug is not rightly determined by adding up the cost of the ingredients. Prescription drugs take upwards of 8-15 years of research, development, trial and error, testing, submissions for FDA approval and so on, with costs in the billions of dollars. Sometimes a drug goes through most or all of this process and never makes it to market at all because of problems with the final formula and so on. So the drugs that do make it also have to pay for all the ones that don't for a pharma company to be profitable.

Now, I'm not saying that pharma companies couldn't be a little more reasonable with their pricing. Many of them are quite profitable even with all of the above factors in mind and could cut sick people a break. But the bottom line is, adding up ingredients and extrapolating that into some rant about how big pharma is raping customers is just showing one's ignorance.

220181[/snapback]

titan,

here's the disturbing part to me: How many drugs are approved by the FDA after all those years of research and all that money spent, only to be pulled off the shelf after a few years because they are known to cause heart attacks, and other problems. We've seen three prescription items pulled in the last year: VIOXX, Celebrex, and the Ortho Evra birth control patch. All of these were pulled because they found they could potentially cause heart attacks, strokes, heart disease, cancer, high blood pressure and even death. With all the years they test these drugs before "approval", why is it they are approving drugs that they know can do all this potential harm?? I just can't believe they don't know about this before they release the drug. The FDA is one of the worst things to happen to this country. I don't take prescription drugs, for this reason. As soon as the doctor tells me i need a certain drug, all thats going to do is possibly lead to side effects, to which he gives me another drug to relieve. The cycle is endless.

I admit taking the active ingrediant and showing the actual cost is stretching it a bit, but the FDA is in no way looking out for the american consumer. They are looking to fatten their wallets. Did you know these drug pushers (oops i mean pharmacutical(sp) reps, are offering incentives to doctors for writing a certain number of prescriptions a month for their particular drug? Write 30 a month, and we'll reward you with cruises, cash prizes, other trips.. I have this info first hand from a friend that was a nurse in a private practice and in a hospital ER. All the money that it costs for them to reward the doctors for writing the prescriptions could be applied to lower the cost of the drug for consumers.

I firmly believe that somewhere in this country or in the world is the cure for cancer and aides. I also believe the FDA and likely the federal government, is keeping it under wraps, because the FDA and the pharmaceutical industry are making way too much money off of the ones that are sick. My fiance's first husband died of Aides, and when he died, he was taking around 30 pills a day, and these drugs don't come cheap. They are some of the highest priced drugs on the market. Its all about the almighty dollar. I know I may get attacked for these statements, but thats ok, i know there are people out there that wouldn't possibly believe this would happen. I happen to be one that does believe it.

[TitanTiger 20,509]

The company that comes out with a drug that will cure cancer would make way too much money on that drug to ever keep it under wraps, so I just don't believe that. And I'm not defending everything pharmaceutical companies or the FDA do or don't do. But I'm not going to pile on with unsubstantiated and illogical attacks either. The truth of the matter is, the same market forces that cause abuses and ill-advised incentives and such to be used also drive pharma companies to come out with better and better medicines that are far more effective with fewer side effects overall than medicines from 10-20-30 years ago.

BTW, it was Bextra, not Celebrex, that was removed from the market. Celebrex did not have the side effects problems that Vioxx had, even after closer scrutiny was applied to it.

[WarTiger 3,916]

The truth of the matter is, the same market forces that cause abuses and ill-advised incentives and such to be used also drive pharma companies to come out with better and better medicines that are far more effective with fewer side effects overall than medicines from 10-20-30 years ago.

BTW, it was Bextra, not Celebrex, that was removed from the market.  Celebrex did not have the side effects problems that Vioxx had, even after closer scrutiny was applied to it.

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How exactly does providing trips and cash bonuses to doctors for prescribing their drug, lead to better medicines in the future?? This I don't buy. That is money thrown away. How much money do you think could be generated with a cure for cancer or aides?? I seriously doubt the money generated from ONE pill/treatment that could cure or prevent cancer or aides would come close to the $Billiions generated for the multiple medications used to treat the symptoms for these diseases. If they did in fact have the cure for cancer or aides(which i believe they do), chances are only the filthy rich would be able to afford to have it anyway because of the cost. The FDA is money driven, plain and simple, and the cure for cancer or aides,even if it was affordable for the average consumer, would eventually take Billions of dollars away from the FDA and the pharma companies..this is why it won't ever happen...

[TitanTiger 20,509]

How exactly does providing trips and cash bonuses to  doctors for prescribing their drug, lead to better medicines in the future?? This I don't buy.  That is money thrown away.

That specifically doesn't. But it's part of the bigger picture of a free enterprise system that utilizes a profit motive to spur companies and individuals to "invent a better mouse trap." If it wasn't profitable, there would be less incentive to spend the kind of time and money it takes to develop new medicines. The downside is that in that quest for profit, they also do things like this. But it's hard to perfectly eliminate the greed in a free market economy.

How much money do you think could be generated with a cure for cancer or aides??  I seriously doubt the money generated from ONE pill/treatment that could cure or prevent cancer or aides would come close to the $Billiions generated for the multiple medications used to treat the symptoms for these diseases.

Billions. Especially if you're the first to market with it because you'll be the exclusive source for the cure with a patent for a number of years before the generic would be available. And everyone with that kind of cancer would be clamoring for it. Their stock would shoot through the roof and they'd be wallowing in cash. No way they pass up that golden opportunity.

If they did in fact have the cure for cancer or aides(which i believe they do)

I don't.

, chances are only the filthy rich would be able to afford to have it anyway because of the cost.  The FDA is money driven, plain and simple, and the cure for cancer or aides,even if it was affordable for the average consumer, would eventually take Billions of dollars away from the FDA and the pharma companies..this is why it won't ever happen...

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Again, not defending everything the pharma companies or FDA do, but this is extremely cynical and conspiratorial, especially for you. I mean, it's one thing if I was reading this over at Democratic Underground or one of Bottomfeeder's UFO sites, but you're more level headed than this.

[WarTiger 3,916]

Again, not defending everything the pharma companies or FDA do, but this is extremely cynical and conspiratorial, especially for you. I mean, it's one thing if I was reading this over at Democratic Underground or one of Bottomfeeder's UFO sites, but you're more level headed than this.

Yeah. it may be a little over the top for me, but thats the way I feel. That aside, CODEX is what bothers me the most. I don't want to have to go to a doctor to be able to get a b12 or calcium supplement....It's coming, and its closer than most people think.