selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 The end of the world is near when we start celebrating gay people, GOD forbids this. Come back when you've got something logical to say. Being religious is fine. Using that religion as a club to oppress people isn't. Once again, I'm reminded of why I did a happy dance when I left The South. Earth will end someday, I'm just not sure it'll be because a man thought another man was hot and someone said hey good for them, angering someone in the clouds. If so this planet wouldve been cleaned a long, long time ago. The last estimate I saw is we have about 1 billion years before the sun is too hot to allow water vapor to freeze in the upper atmosphere. At that point earth's water will begin to escape into space and the planet will no longer be hospitable to life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dual-Threat Rigby 8,662 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I, for one, appreciate what he did very much. Agree or not with it, that takes some serious stones. If anyone's got a problem with him and his sexuality, I would daresay that he's a bigger man than they are. So his sexual orientation makes him a hero? I can tell you there are at least a couple dozen other character traits I would look for in a "bigger man" than that. Yes, it does make him a hero. He's blazing a trail that hopefully leads to a day that something like this is not shocking nor even a story. Shouldn't be a story anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I, for one, appreciate what he did very much. Agree or not with it, that takes some serious stones. If anyone's got a problem with him and his sexuality, I would daresay that he's a bigger man than they are. So his sexual orientation makes him a hero? I can tell you there are at least a couple dozen other character traits I would look for in a "bigger man" than that. Yes, it does make him a hero. He's blazing a trail that hopefully leads to a day that something like this is not shocking nor even a story. Shouldn't be a story anyway... You'll get no disagreement from me. Unfortunately, until all our fellow citizen are accepted equally this will be a story. I welcome the day an announcement like this isn't news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quietfan 233 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I read a caption from ESPN that called this young man a " role model " . I guess they meant to say " homosexual role model " . Man on Man sex is an unnatural ... perverted act ... period . I don't think homosexuals should be persecuted , but they should not be celebrated either . So labeling gays as unnatural perverts doesn't count as persecution? "Persecution is the systematic mistreatment of an individual or group by another individual or group." First off , you will not hijack the word gay to describe the unnatural perverted act of homosexuality with me . To call a soldier a soldier is simply a statement of fact . To call a murderer a murderer is simply a statement of fact . To say fire is hot is simply a statement of fact ....... it is not persecution or mistreatment of the fire . If your looking to bandy words with me on this subject your wasting your time . Man on Man sex is an unnatural and perverted act . You may argue to the counter if you so choose . ...not sure how anything that exists in nature, that has existed in nature for at least all of written history, and will probably always exist as long as our species exists can be labeled "unnatural". "Perversion", of course, is in the eye of the beholder, so while I disagree, I'll concede that someone might choose to use that term according to their beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKW 86 7,419 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 TLDNR this entire thread. Can we all agree to not perpetuate this topic on AUFAMILY? I don't feel like expressing my opinion about sexual preferences or anything related to the news of Michael Sams. I don't think any member of AUFAMILY should be compelled to opine on the issue. Put it this way. Anything you say or do can be held against you in the court of public opinion. If you agree with Sams' decision to announce this, some people will hate you. If you disagree with Sams' decision to announce this, some people will hate you. What is most important to me is that Auburn is worthy of everyone's admiration, regardless. I've spoken my piece. And that is why we are family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". I would have serious questions about any population that would legally allow such a relationship to be perpetuated. That's not a homosexual or heterosexual issue, that's a child protection issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". There are those among us,nambla comes to mind first, that say it is OK. I remember reading about some psychologist or somebody like that. This individual not only said it was OK he said it was good and healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". There are those among us,nambla comes to mind first, that say it is OK. I remember reading about some psychologist or somebody like that. This individual not only said it was OK he said it was good and healthy. Sorry, but that is patently absurd. A 10 year old child in a sexual relationship is being abused...regardless of sexual orientation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Which is fine, because one of the greatest things about this great nation you brought up is people are allowed to be different and think and feel different. Some seem to forget this. Again, because brave men and women fought and died for that right. Freedom isn't free. All Michael Sams is doing is taking the opportunity (before someone else does it for him) to use his civil right to speak out. By the way, his father was disheartened to hear of it. And he loves him. I guess that makes him a bigot like me. ;)/> http://bleacherrepor...ouncing-hes-gay You can be a hero for numerous reasons other than being in the military. Are you the only person allowed to label someone a hero? Nope, but I am entitled to an opinion and for the record i pick my heroes with a little higher standards in mind rather than simply coming out of the closet and telling the world sexual preferences. Thats heroic? Jesus, times certainly have changed when we start assigning hero status to gay people. BTW, military service has nothing to do with my remarks here but one obviously has many opportunities for heroism in the service of God and country. The idea that coming out of the closet is even remotely similar or praiseworthy is laughable IMO and thats my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Which is fine, because one of the greatest things about this great nation you brought up is people are allowed to be different and think and feel different. Some seem to forget this. Again, because brave men and women fought and died for that right. Freedom isn't free. All Michael Sams is doing is taking the opportunity (before someone else does it for him) to use his civil right to speak out. By the way, his father was disheartened to hear of it. And he loves him. I guess that makes him a bigot like me. ;)/> http://bleacherrepor...ouncing-hes-gay You can be a hero for numerous reasons other than being in the military. Are you the only person allowed to label someone a hero? Nope, but I am entitled to an opinion and for the record i pick my heroes with a little higher standards in mind rather than simply coming out of the closet and telling the world sexual preferences. Thats heroic? Jesus, times certainly have changed when we start assigning hero status to gay people. BTW, military service has nothing to do with my remarks here but one obviously has many opportunities for heroism in the service of God and country. The idea that coming out of the closet is even remotely similar or praiseworthy is laughable IMO and thats my opinion. It's not just the coming out of the closet that makes him a hero in my eyes. It's the fact that he's a high profile athlete in a sport sterotyped as full of over-the-top machismo. In my eyes, this is the equivalent of Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat and taking a stand for equality. You may not think it's a big deal but if it's not, why do our fellow citizens who happen to be homosexual having to fight for something as basic as equal marriage rights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". I would have serious questions about any population that would legally allow such a relationship to be perpetuated. That's not a homosexual or heterosexual issue, that's a child protection issue. My question was to point out the hypocrisy in calling others bigots, while being bigoted yourself. While calling others bigots for making assumptions on their beliefs, you have done the same. Let's not cast stones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I, for one, appreciate what he did very much. Agree or not with it, that takes some serious stones. If anyone's got a problem with him and his sexuality, I would daresay that he's a bigger man than they are. So his sexual orientation makes him a hero? I can tell you there are at least a couple dozen other character traits I would look for in a "bigger man" than that. Yes, it does make him a hero. He's blazing a trail that hopefully leads to a day that something like this is not shocking nor even a story. Shouldn't be a story anyway... Blazing a trail, huh? A'ight den. What i see happening is a guy heading off future problems by facing the inevitable. He's made a choice and has to live with the good and the bad just like everyone else has to live with their choices. Sorry, just dont buy the "born that way" PC crap. According to GLAAD, the gay and lesbian population amounts to 3.8% of the total in America. By virtue of that alone, being gay is a divergence from the norm ie a sexual deviancy. I am not persecuting anyone for choosing their path in life but dont expect me to celebrate a guy as a hero for simply coming out of the closet as a "proud gay man" Obviously, its his choice and he's free to live as he sees fit but he nor society has any basis upon which to expect that I praise him for it. In fact, I really dont care what he does, I just dont need to hear about it. For some reason, however, gay people wear their sexuality on their sleeves and are compelled to broadcast it as if it matters to anyone but them and their significant other...it doesn't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 And let it be known that I am on no one's side in this, other than the side of truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selias 2,398 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". I would have serious questions about any population that would legally allow such a relationship to be perpetuated. That's not a homosexual or heterosexual issue, that's a child protection issue. My question was to point out the hypocrisy in calling others bigots, while being bigoted yourself. While calling others bigots for making assumptions on their beliefs, you have done the same. Let's not cast stones. You're using pedophelia as the basis of your arguement? I don't care if an adult wants to go out and hump goats (as long as that person is the owner of the goats), but to make that leap to pedophelia is so laughable I struggle for the words. A child of that age doesn't have the maturity or sophistication to be able to enter into a sexual relationship willingly. Your comparison of what two consenting adults do to pedophelia is nearly reaching the levels of Godwin's Law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weegle777 78 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Lets not veer off now. My question has to do with bigotry, not homosexuality. The definition of bigotry. Nothing more. I never compared anyone to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Which is fine, because one of the greatest things about this great nation you brought up is people are allowed to be different and think and feel different. Some seem to forget this. Again, because brave men and women fought and died for that right. Freedom isn't free. All Michael Sams is doing is taking the opportunity (before someone else does it for him) to use his civil right to speak out. By the way, his father was disheartened to hear of it. And he loves him. I guess that makes him a bigot like me. ;)/> http://bleacherrepor...ouncing-hes-gay You can be a hero for numerous reasons other than being in the military. Are you the only person allowed to label someone a hero? Nope, but I am entitled to an opinion and for the record i pick my heroes with a little higher standards in mind rather than simply coming out of the closet and telling the world sexual preferences. Thats heroic? Jesus, times certainly have changed when we start assigning hero status to gay people. BTW, military service has nothing to do with my remarks here but one obviously has many opportunities for heroism in the service of God and country. The idea that coming out of the closet is even remotely similar or praiseworthy is laughable IMO and thats my opinion. It's not just the coming out of the closet that makes him a hero in my eyes. It's the fact that he's a high profile athlete in a sport sterotyped as full of over-the-top machismo. In my eyes, this is the equivalent of Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat and taking a stand for equality. You may not think it's a big deal but if it's not, why do our fellow citizens who happen to be homosexual having to fight for something as basic as equal marriage rights? They have to fight for equal marriage rights because marriage is a religious institution defined as a union between one man and one woman. Like it or not, that's just a bottom line fact. Dont give me the separation of church and state crap here, it just doesn't apply. You cannot take a religious concept and pervert it for the sake of accomodating a tiny segment of society and expect people to just lay down and say..a'ight, g'head and get married. A civil union is a more appropriate designation. It takes time for stark divergences from tradition, like this, to be recognized as it should IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlueVue 177 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Lets not veer off now. My question has to do with bigotry, not homosexuality. The definition of bigotry. Nothing more. I never compared anyone to anything. I have had long term business dealings with out of the closet gay people and got along just fine. We joked all the time about it. A few used to tell me routinely that, if I ever had any problems with my marriage to tell my wife there were several "queens" you know who would gladly take her place and we'd get a good laugh out of it. People are too sensitive about the topic. Im not a bigot, I have no problem with what other people choose to do with their life but, at the same time, i dont have to praise it or act like its a heroic path in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad_ATX 13,654 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 And let it be known that I am on no one's side in this, other than the side of truth. And herein lies your problem. In academic terms, truth is different for each individual. My world views shape my truth while your experiences and views shape yours. I don't expect a person from China to hold the same "truths" that I do. It's why in court, you're asked to tell the truth instead of the facts, because what one witness defines as the truth may be a very different set of circumstances from another witnesses definition of truth. Facts are hard evidence of something happening (like DNA evidence). If you base your ideology and world view on religion, then you are on the side of faith. And that's 100% OK. Just don't distort it as being anything other that your truth, because it may not be the same as your neighbor's. If you look at Michael Sam's quotes, he explicitly says that he wants to live in his truth. And again, that's 100% OK and with that, he deserves the same rights and privileges and anyone else living in their "truth" as long as that person isn't infringing upon someone's basic rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad_ATX 13,654 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Which is fine, because one of the greatest things about this great nation you brought up is people are allowed to be different and think and feel different. Some seem to forget this. Again, because brave men and women fought and died for that right. Freedom isn't free. All Michael Sams is doing is taking the opportunity (before someone else does it for him) to use his civil right to speak out. By the way, his father was disheartened to hear of it. And he loves him. I guess that makes him a bigot like me. ;)/> http://bleacherrepor...ouncing-hes-gay You can be a hero for numerous reasons other than being in the military. Are you the only person allowed to label someone a hero? Nope, but I am entitled to an opinion and for the record i pick my heroes with a little higher standards in mind rather than simply coming out of the closet and telling the world sexual preferences. Thats heroic? Jesus, times certainly have changed when we start assigning hero status to gay people. BTW, military service has nothing to do with my remarks here but one obviously has many opportunities for heroism in the service of God and country. The idea that coming out of the closet is even remotely similar or praiseworthy is laughable IMO and thats my opinion. It's not just the coming out of the closet that makes him a hero in my eyes. It's the fact that he's a high profile athlete in a sport sterotyped as full of over-the-top machismo. In my eyes, this is the equivalent of Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat and taking a stand for equality. You may not think it's a big deal but if it's not, why do our fellow citizens who happen to be homosexual having to fight for something as basic as equal marriage rights? They have to fight for equal marriage rights because marriage is a religious institution defined as a union between one man and one woman. Like it or not, that's just a bottom line fact. Dont give me the separation of church and state crap here, it just doesn't apply. You cannot take a religious concept and pervert it for the sake of accomodating a tiny segment of society and expect people to just lay down and say..a'ight, g'head and get married. A civil union is a more appropriate designation. It takes time for stark divergences from tradition, like this, to be recognized as it should IMO. So I have to ask, why should any married couples receive tax breaks if it is indeed a religious concept? Wouldn't that be a violation of the separation of church and state? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auctoritas 2,828 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Which is fine, because one of the greatest things about this great nation you brought up is people are allowed to be different and think and feel different. Some seem to forget this. Again, because brave men and women fought and died for that right. Freedom isn't free. All Michael Sams is doing is taking the opportunity (before someone else does it for him) to use his civil right to speak out. By the way, his father was disheartened to hear of it. And he loves him. I guess that makes him a bigot like me. ;)/> http://bleacherrepor...ouncing-hes-gay You can be a hero for numerous reasons other than being in the military. Are you the only person allowed to label someone a hero? Nope, but I am entitled to an opinion and for the record i pick my heroes with a little higher standards in mind rather than simply coming out of the closet and telling the world sexual preferences. Thats heroic? Jesus, times certainly have changed when we start assigning hero status to gay people. BTW, military service has nothing to do with my remarks here but one obviously has many opportunities for heroism in the service of God and country. The idea that coming out of the closet is even remotely similar or praiseworthy is laughable IMO and thats my opinion. It's not just the coming out of the closet that makes him a hero in my eyes. It's the fact that he's a high profile athlete in a sport sterotyped as full of over-the-top machismo. In my eyes, this is the equivalent of Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat and taking a stand for equality. You may not think it's a big deal but if it's not, why do our fellow citizens who happen to be homosexual having to fight for something as basic as equal marriage rights? They have to fight for equal marriage rights because marriage is a religious institution defined as a union between one man and one woman. Like it or not, that's just a bottom line fact. Dont give me the separation of church and state crap here, it just doesn't apply. You cannot take a religious concept and pervert it for the sake of accomodating a tiny segment of society and expect people to just lay down and say..a'ight, g'head and get married. A civil union is a more appropriate designation. It takes time for stark divergences from tradition, like this, to be recognized as it should IMO. Except that there are dozens of government rules regarding not only marriage rules, but benefits given only to people that the government calls "married." If what you say were the truth, all that anyone would need to do to get a divorce would be to get a church to approve it. That is clearly not the case. There are two kinds of marriage, religious and civil. Only one of them matters in the eyes of the state. That's why marriage vows end with "by the power vested in me by (insert state name here)." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auctoritas 2,828 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 And, btw, that separation of church and state "crap" cuts both ways. I am sure you will be all in favor of it when the government says that clergy can't be forced to perform same-sex marriages if it goes against their beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smackydoodle 200 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I don't understand the "I don't have to celebrate it"... who asked you to? We all have to live on this spinning rock, and we don't always have to celebrate the same thing. Do you throw a daily birthday party for everyone in the universe or do you just ignore it and go on with your life and only celebrate the birthdays that mean something to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
war eagle6 0 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 The end of the world is near when we start celebrating gay people, GOD forbids this. Come back when you've got something logical to say. Being religious is fine. Using that religion as a club to oppress people isn't. Once again, I'm reminded of why I did a happy dance when I left The South. Selias, it's called signs of the times! U of all people need to pay attention to it! We all gotta face death, what are u gonna do when he comes for u? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooltigger21 0 Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I am going to ask a question that disgusts me to ask, but I will do it anyway. And be honest with your answer. This is a yes or no question, not one to dance around. And this is in no way calling gay people pedophiles, it is an honest question. If a grown man were to have a sexual relationship with a willing 10 year old boy, would you consider it inappropriate if the law allowed it? If a grown man(or woman) were to have a sexual relationship with a child (10 year old boy or girl), it would be very inappropriate. A child of that age doesn't have the mental acuity to enter into such a relationship "willingly". There are those among us,nambla comes to mind first, that say it is OK. I remember reading about some psychologist or somebody like that. This individual not only said it was OK he said it was good and healthy. Sorry, but that is patently absurd. A 10 year old child in a sexual relationship is being abused...regardless of sexual orientation. I agree completely. I am only saying that that push to normalize it is starting and will keep going. They will not give up. I do not know when it will happen but eventually the Democratic party will embrace this idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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