US generics a better buy than Canadian drugs

[TitanTiger 20,708]

FDA: U.S. generics better buy than Canada drugs

Monday, January 19, 2004 Posted:  9:14 AM EST (1414 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Americans who buy drugs in Canada in hopes of saving money could pay significantly more for certain medicines than if they had purchased generic versions at home, according to new research by the Food and Drug Administration.

Canadian price controls mean that brand-name drugs there can cost as little as half the U.S. price. Those potential savings are enticing increasingly more people to import drugs from Canada even though the practice is illegal and the FDA calls it unsafe.

Generic versions cost much less than their brand-name counterparts, however, and the U.S. generics market is considered the world's most competitive. So FDA Commissioner Mark McClellan argues that for many people, buying more homegrown generics is a risk-free alternative to imports that could lower their drug costs.

"There are a lot of opportunities to save money while still making sure patients get the drugs they need," he said in an interview this month with The Associated Press.

To back that contention, the FDA analyzed price data collected by the medical research company IMS Health. Included were seven drugs whose generic versions are top-selling treatments for chronic disease: the anti-depressant Prozac; blood pressure medicines Lopressor, Prinivil and Vasotec; Xanax for anxiety; Klonopin for seizures; and Glucophage for diabetes.

Comparing both brand-name and generic versions in Canada, the U.S. generics proved significantly cheaper for all but the diabetes drug, the study concluded.

The study measured average price per milligram, not what the patient pays per bottle, which can vary in dose and pill number.

Among the findings:

• Xanax had the highest disparity. The Canadian brand was roughly nine times the price, per milligram, of the U.S. generic. Next was Vasotec, five times the price of the U.S. generic.

• Canada's generics ranged from fluoxetine, or generic Prozac, at 1.3 times the U.S. price to alprazolam, or generic Xanax, at four times the U.S. price. One generic, the version of Vasotec called enalapril, is not sold in Canada.

• Glucophage was the exception. The U.S. generic actually cost 39 percent more per milligram than Canada's brand-name version.

The study used the price that pharmacies paid for each drug in 2002, the latest full year that prices from both countries were available from IMS Health.

Generics not always available

"I think consumers think everything's cheaper in Canada. It's just not the case," the FDA's pharmacy affairs chief, Tom McGinnis, said in a recent interview.

He described a recent visit to a U.S. Customs facility in New York where inspectors were examining 10,000 packages of imported pharmaceuticals. McGinnis said he spotted a bottle of generic water pills for high blood pressure that cost a few cents a tablet in U.S. pharmacies.

Adding the shipping cost, whoever ordered that bottle from Canada spent about a third more than he would have at a local drugstore, McGinnis said.

Using generics is not an alternative for everyone because new drugs sell for several years before generic competition is allowed. Generics account for about half of U.S. prescriptions.

The FDA cannot say how big a role generics might play as an alternative to Canadian imports, either for individuals or for the two cities -- Springfield, Massachusetts, and Montgomery, Alabama -- currently buying Canadian drugs for their employees. States from New Hampshire to Wisconsin are considering similar programs.

But other, larger studies also have concluded that U.S. generics tend to be the world's cheapest.

"They're a great bargain," said University of Pennsylvania health financing specialist Patricia Danzon.

A Canadian study of 27 top-selling generics there concluded in 2001 that three-fourths of those drugs cost less in the United States, and Canadians could save millions by access to American versions.

The FDA also pointed to a Web site -- PharmacyChecker.com -- that provides consumers with real-time comparisons of drug prices listed in the United States and abroad.

For example, on Friday PharmacyChecker found the cheapest generic Prozac in this country, $13.19 for 100 20-mg pills. Abroad, the next best price was $49.78.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/01/19/gener...s.ap/index.html

[Donutboy 0]

FDA: U.S. generics better buy than Canada drugs

Monday, January 19, 2004 Posted:   9:14 AM EST (1414 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Americans who buy drugs in Canada in hopes of saving money could pay significantly more for certain medicines than if they had purchased generic versions at home, according to new research by the Food and Drug Administration.

Canadian price controls mean that brand-name drugs there can cost as little as half the U.S. price. Those potential savings are enticing increasingly more people to import drugs from Canada even though the practice is illegal and the FDA calls it unsafe.

Generic versions cost much less than their brand-name counterparts, however, and the U.S. generics market is considered the world's most competitive. So FDA Commissioner Mark McClellan argues that for many people, buying more homegrown generics is a risk-free alternative to imports that could lower their drug costs.

"There are a lot of opportunities to save money while still making sure patients get the drugs they need," he said in an interview this month with The Associated Press.

To back that contention, the FDA analyzed price data collected by the medical research company IMS Health. Included were seven drugs whose generic versions are top-selling treatments for chronic disease: the anti-depressant Prozac; blood pressure medicines Lopressor, Prinivil and Vasotec; Xanax for anxiety; Klonopin for seizures; and Glucophage for diabetes.

Comparing both brand-name and generic versions in Canada, the U.S. generics proved significantly cheaper for all but the diabetes drug, the study concluded.

The study measured average price per milligram, not what the patient pays per bottle, which can vary in dose and pill number.

Among the findings:

• Xanax had the highest disparity. The Canadian brand was roughly nine times the price, per milligram, of the U.S. generic. Next was Vasotec, five times the price of the U.S. generic.

• Canada's generics ranged from fluoxetine, or generic Prozac, at 1.3 times the U.S. price to alprazolam, or generic Xanax, at four times the U.S. price. One generic, the version of Vasotec called enalapril, is not sold in Canada.

• Glucophage was the exception. The U.S. generic actually cost 39 percent more per milligram than Canada's brand-name version.

The study used the price that pharmacies paid for each drug in 2002, the latest full year that prices from both countries were available from IMS Health.

Generics not always available

"I think consumers think everything's cheaper in Canada. It's just not the case," the FDA's pharmacy affairs chief, Tom McGinnis, said in a recent interview.

He described a recent visit to a U.S. Customs facility in New York where inspectors were examining 10,000 packages of imported pharmaceuticals. McGinnis said he spotted a bottle of generic water pills for high blood pressure that cost a few cents a tablet in U.S. pharmacies.

Adding the shipping cost, whoever ordered that bottle from Canada spent about a third more than he would have at a local drugstore, McGinnis said.

Using generics is not an alternative for everyone because new drugs sell for several years before generic competition is allowed. Generics account for about half of U.S. prescriptions.

The FDA cannot say how big a role generics might play as an alternative to Canadian imports, either for individuals or for the two cities -- Springfield, Massachusetts, and Montgomery, Alabama -- currently buying Canadian drugs for their employees. States from New Hampshire to Wisconsin are considering similar programs.

But other, larger studies also have concluded that U.S. generics tend to be the world's cheapest.

"They're a great bargain," said University of Pennsylvania health financing specialist Patricia Danzon.

A Canadian study of 27 top-selling generics there concluded in 2001 that three-fourths of those drugs cost less in the United States, and Canadians could save millions by access to American versions.

The FDA also pointed to a Web site -- PharmacyChecker.com -- that provides consumers with real-time comparisons of drug prices listed in the United States and abroad.

For example, on Friday PharmacyChecker found the cheapest generic Prozac in this country, $13.19 for 100 20-mg pills. Abroad, the next best price was $49.78.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/01/19/gener...s.ap/index.html

Gee, a govenment agency assuring us of something. Ask former EPA agency Christine Whitman how independent the agency is of federal interference. The Bush administration wants to protect the drug companies in this country that are doing their best to bankrupt American industry with their annual fleecing. I'm sure the timing of this report has NOTHING to do with the current push to regulate drug prices in this country, as they now are in Canada or the fact that more and more states are looking at Canada for health care cost savings. It couldn't be that the Bush administration would manipulate the EPA to help one of their wealthiest contributors.

Temperatures rise over move to cut drug costs

The medical profession, medical aid schemes and pharmacists were thoroughly rattled on Friday when the department of health threw them another curve ball - this time in the form of draft regulations to drastically limit the cost of medicines.

They all agreed that it was "a good thing" for the state to unravel the complicated pricing structures of medicines that had seen prices soar in recent years, but were sceptical about claims that the savings could be as high as 70 percent. .....

[TitanTiger 20,708]

Hey Donut, try this for once. Instead of your standard issue, knee-jerk reactions, actually do some research to prove your delusional rantings. They issued a report detailing the costs of US generics vs the Canadian imports. If you have evidence that contradicts that report, show it. Put up or shut up. Until then, you are just so much background noise as far as I'm concerned.

[Jenny AU-92 0]

The only problem with US generics is getting doctors to make sure they write the prescription so you can get them - notice that there are usually two lines at the bottom of a scrip - one says "Dispense as written" and the other allows substitution of generic if available. If the docs get their scrip pads "pre-printed" by the pharmaceutical companies, guess which line is omitted from the scrip sheet?

I had this happen with my birth control pills - they have a equivalent generic, but when my doc wrote the scrip, he used a pre-printed pad, and the pharmacist would only fill the name brand, which was about $40 more than generic, and because there was a generic available and not a medical reason why I HAD to have the name brand, my insurance wouldn't pay. I had to get the doc to re-write the scrip, which he did, but it was s huge hassle.

I would also rather buy a drug in the US than anywhere else - the USDA guarantee of safety is worth it to me - who KNOWS what is in the stuff you get across some border? Channel 11 here in Houston did a lab test on some stuff these local people were buying in Mexico, and one of them had toxic levels of mercury in it! One was the real stuff, and one was basically a placebo! Scary.

[Tiger Al 0]

The only problem with US generics is getting doctors to make sure they write the prescription so you can get them - notice that there are usually two lines at the bottom of a scrip - one says "Dispense as written" and the other allows substitution of generic if available. If the docs get their scrip pads "pre-printed" by the pharmaceutical companies, guess which line is omitted from the scrip sheet?

I had this happen with my birth control pills - they have a equivalent generic, but when my doc wrote the scrip, he used a pre-printed pad, and the pharmacist would only fill the name brand, which was about $40 more than generic, and because there was a generic available and not a medical reason why I HAD to have the name brand, my insurance wouldn't pay. I had to get the doc to re-write the scrip, which he did, but it was s huge hassle.

Moral of the story: Always tell your doctor that you want generics if available.

[MDM4AU 337]

Moral of the story: Always tell your doctor that you want generics if available.

DING-DING-DING-DING-DING-DING!

We have a winner!

Johnny, Tell 'em what he's won!

[in the long run this will save you not only now (when you purchase the Rx) but down the road in Claims experience. (That translates to premium dollars.)]

[Donutboy 0]

Hey Donut, try this for once. Instead of your standard issue, knee-jerk reactions, actually do some research to prove your delusional rantings. They issued a report detailing the costs of US generics vs the Canadian imports. If you have evidence that contradicts that report, show it. Put up or shut up. Until then, you are just so much background noise as far as I'm concerned.

Gee, we have the same identical opinion of one another. I've yet to see you "put up or shut up." I've yet to see your response to my AWOL posts in the MLK thread where you called me out on the issue and I provided government documents!! I anxiously await your rebuttal to "deserter George".

[MDM4AU 337]

Hey Donut, try this for once.  Instead of your standard issue, knee-jerk reactions, actually do some research to prove your delusional rantings.  They issued a report detailing the costs of US generics vs the Canadian imports.  If you have evidence that contradicts that report, show it.  Put up or shut up.  Until then, you are just so much background noise as far as I'm concerned.

Gee, we have the same identical opinion of one another. I've yet to see you "put up or shut up." I've yet to see your response to my AWOL posts in the MLK thread where you called me out on the issue and I provided government documents!! I anxiously await your rebuttal to "deserter George".

Are you on CRACK?

I've seen those documents and aside from people going back and forth asking for ratings, they don't prove your assertion that he deserted or was AWOL. He was suspended from flying for failure to have an annual medical exam. Big deal. He was "not observed" at his unit in Texas because a "civilian occupation made it necessary for him to move to Montgomery, Alabama" where he "...performed equivalent training in a non-flying status..." Again, big deal.

I could go on, but it's pointless.

Again, you prove yourself an imbecile!

[Tiger Al 0]

Hijack!!!

I was in the army and national guard. Nowhere in ANY of my records will you see the phrase: "Not observed at this station." Reason? I was never anywhere that I wasn't supposed to be.

[Donutboy 0]

Hey Donut, try this for once.  Instead of your standard issue, knee-jerk reactions, actually do some research to prove your delusional rantings.  They issued a report detailing the costs of US generics vs the Canadian imports.  If you have evidence that contradicts that report, show it.  Put up or shut up.  Until then, you are just so much background noise as far as I'm concerned.

Gee, we have the same identical opinion of one another. I've yet to see you "put up or shut up." I've yet to see your response to my AWOL posts in the MLK thread where you called me out on the issue and I provided government documents!! I anxiously await your rebuttal to "deserter George".

Are you on CRACK?

I've seen those documents and aside from people going back and forth asking for ratings, they don't prove your assertion that he deserted or was AWOL. He was suspended from flying for failure to have an annual medical exam. Big deal. He was "not observed" at his unit in Texas because a "civilian occupation made it necessary for him to move to Montgomery, Alabama" where he "...performed equivalent training in a non-flying status..." Again, big deal.

I could go on, but it's pointless.

Again, you prove yourself an imbecile!

Where his commander-in-chief has no recollection of EVER seeing him.

Again, I see no one answering my charges, verified by government documents. I see personal attacks asking if I'm on crack and calling me an imbecile. Your childish response merely proves that YOU'RE the imbecile here!! It rpoves the conservative approach. If you can't respond to the message, attack the messenger!! Rush has taught you well!!

[TitanTiger 20,708]

Is this really any different than telling your mechanic that you're willing to take non-OEM parts when fixing your car, or saying the same to the guy repairing your computer? I mean, why wouldn't you ask your doctor is the generic is just as good as the name-brand?

[TitanTiger 20,708]

Hey Donut, try this for once.  Instead of your standard issue, knee-jerk reactions, actually do some research to prove your delusional rantings.  They issued a report detailing the costs of US generics vs the Canadian imports.  If you have evidence that contradicts that report, show it.  Put up or shut up.  Until then, you are just so much background noise as far as I'm concerned.

Gee, we have the same identical opinion of one another. I've yet to see you "put up or shut up." I've yet to see your response to my AWOL posts in the MLK thread where you called me out on the issue and I provided government documents!! I anxiously await your rebuttal to "deserter George".

I read the documents you mentioned and don't see what they prove. Can you enlighten me? I thought I rebutted it pretty well without going through each and every one and essentially asking the same thing: so what?

[Jenny AU-92 0]

Where his commander-in-chief has no recollection of EVER seeing him.

Again, I see no one answering my charges, verified by government documents.

D-nut, we have already established that you have no actual military experience, and very little knowledge of the terminology or internal workings of same. (Example - your use of the term "Commander-in-chief" to describe Bush's commanding officer at whatever base you seem to think he was supposed to be at. The ONLY Commander In Chief is the President of the United States.). Yes, you linked images of a bunch of documents, which I and several other people have already interpreted and analyzed for you several times over in terms of what the "lingo" means to another military person. Your liberal/civilian interpretation of those same documents is just plain wrong - that would be like me trying to read computer code and tell someone what it says - so IMHO, your personal, uninformed, liberal interpretation is not equivalent to "Verified by government documents"

I am not going to re-re-re-paste the information that a military person gave in terms of interpreting those documents you included, but here's a link in case you need to read them again for yourself. The Truth Page 35 has the text of an article from George magazine that addresses the documents in detail, and page 3 has the military guy's explanation for the terminology.

As someone said earlier, just you and some pinko websites repeating the same thing over and over STILL does not make it true, especially in light of the facts that have been provided time and time again.

[Tiger Al 0]

D-nut, we have already established that you have no actual military experience, and very little knowledge of the terminology or internal workings of same. (Example - your use of the term "Commander-in-chief" to describe Bush's commanding officer at whatever base you seem to think he was supposed to be at. The ONLY Commander In Chief is the President of the United States.). Yes, you linked images of a bunch of documents, which I and several other people have already interpreted and analyzed for you several times over in terms of what the "lingo" means to another military person. Your liberal/civilian interpretation of those same documents is just plain wrong - that would be like me trying to read computer code and tell someone what it says - so IMHO, your personal, uninformed, liberal interpretation is not equivalent to "Verified by government documents"

I am not going to re-re-re-paste the information that a military person gave in terms of interpreting those documents you included, but here's a link in case you need to read them again for yourself. The Truth Page 35 has the text of an article from George magazine that addresses the documents in detail, and page 3 has the military guy's explanation for the terminology.

As someone said earlier, just you and some pinko websites repeating the same thing over and over STILL does not make it true, especially in light of the facts that have been provided time and time again.

Again, I WAS in the army and national guard. Nowhere in ANY of my records will you see the phrase: "Not observed at this station." Reason? I was never anywhere that I wasn't supposed to be.

[TitanTiger 20,708]

But then the documents went on to explain that Bush had tranferred to another base to continue his service in a "non-flying capacity" due to a civilian job. Still not seeing the big problem here.

[accau 0]

In many cases, that's not true....

In many other cases, generics are not available in the US although thet are available in Canada.....

Personally between my wife and I we save about $4/day on Canadian drugs......'Could save more on Canadian generics......even more on Brazilian but not gonna do that....

[TitanTiger 20,708]

I agree, it depends on the drug. But then again, you know what the end result will be on this. If Americans start buying from Canada in droves, an equilibrium will occur after a time. In other words, the drug companies will force Canada's gov't to pay more for the drugs and American prices will go down because right now, price controlled markets (like Canada) are being subsidized by non-price controlled ones (like the US). So in the end, it's going to be a wash.