How Do We Combat This?

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

WARNING-----don't watch this video unless you have a strong stomach. But it is what the U.S and our allies are going to have to deal with sooner or later. Our current gov't doesn't have a clue let alone a policy. These guys are a real threat to our children and grandchildren but even some here are in denial. All the victims in this video are guilty of is being Christians (infidels). Wake up folks.

http://www.asgraphic.org/videos/video382/index.htm

[Strychnine 1,804]

WARNING-----don't watch this video unless you have a strong stomach. But it is what the U.S and our allies are going to have to deal with sooner or later. Our current gov't doesn't have a clue let alone a policy. These guys are a real threat to our children and grandchildren but even some here are in denial. All the victims in this video are guilty of is being Christians (infidels). Wake up folks.

http://www.asgraphic...eo382/index.htm

Quite simply, we cannot. There is no policy to develop for dealing with them. The previous administration was foolish to think that they could, and the current one is equally foolish if they think that they can.

They cannot be negotiated with or reasoned with, as they have long since abandoned those concepts. It is frequently difficult to distinguish them from otherwise innocent civilians. They have little value for their lives (in the way we understand it at least), or the lives of others. They are much like a more ignorant and desperate version of Imperial Japanese troops. It cost Japan basically three of their major cities before they agreed to unconditional surrender.

Our military is simply outmatched by such a force, as they do not present themselves in a way our military can effectively combat. What do you bomb? With each misplaced bomb, we would gain additional enemies and they gain additional soldiers. They have no qualms with arbitrarily executing and dismembering all they capture. They negate our conventional might with guerrilla tactics and brutality. The only way our military could actually fight them effectively is to become them.

The only way you can deal with such people is to either leave them (and their whole area) alone to be the region's problem or until they are directly bothering you, or you can exterminate them. There is no middle ground. Fighting them will cost the lives of many of them, many of us, and many of everyone caught in between. The reality of America is that something like 9/11 only buys you so much military latitude, and it was all used up in Afghanistan and Iraq. At this point, the American people are not interested in our participation in the bloodbath.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

When do you decide they are "bothering us" and what do we do then. Kind of reminds me of the old joke.......How does a Frenchman know he is in trouble? Answer......when he sees German tanks coming done the street.

[AURaptor 1,137]

Moab ?

[Strychnine 1,804]

When do you decide they are "bothering us" and what do we do then. Kind of reminds me of the old joke.......How does a Frenchman know he is in trouble? Answer......when he sees German tanks coming done the street.

When they stop talking about attacking us again and actually do it, then the only thing we can do to them is exterminate them. They are not interested in peaceful coexistence with anyone. My point is that we lack the stomach for such a job. It was easier to maintain it in World War II as images of dismembered Americans and dead civilians were not coming to you live from the internet in HD quality. If you want to rid the world of such people, it is necessary to invade the entire region with ferocious brutality. If they have somewhere to hide and regroup, they will, so it is now necessary to cut off such retreat and kill everyone attempting it. They all hate us anyway. If they can hide among the people, then our enemy is now them AND the people. Sounds gruesome, does it not?

This is the region's problem to deal with, as they are the only ones that can actually get away with dealing with it. If we try, it's all-out Sunni Jihad against Shia-allied infidels.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

So we "invade" how? We have learned, I hope that we can't win a conventional war with them. The only way to exterminate them is to nuke them. OK with that?

[Strychnine 1,804]

So we "invade" how? We have learned, I hope that we can't win a conventional war with them. The only way to exterminate them is to nuke them. OK with that?

I am not advocating exterminating them, I am just saying that is literally the only way for US to combat them to the end of eliminating their threat. We (and the West in general) are their ideological arch-nemesis. They know no borders, and they have allies all over the region. We cannot attack their funding, as it comes from those within our allies in the Gulf States. We cannot attack their ideology, because they care not what we say.

If we are not going to exterminate them, then the only thing we can do is wash our hands of the region. The only thing that ever made it strategically valuable to us is irrelevant, as we do not import that much of their oil. Let someone else go mingle there and arouse their wrath. If the rest of the region wishes to sit by and watch these kind of people fight and behead the area back into the Middle Ages, so be it. Saudi Arabia is to the south, Iran to the east, Turkey to north, and eventually Israel is to the west. Any of the four are armed well enough to stop this themselves, so let them. It's time they learn that they can either grow up and act like civilized people to control and improve their region, or they can kill themselves in Jihadist martyrdom.

[autigeremt 6,970]

When do you decide they are "bothering us" and what do we do then. Kind of reminds me of the old joke.......How does a Frenchman know he is in trouble? Answer......when he sees German tanks coming done the street.

When they stop talking about attacking us again and actually do it, then the only thing we can do to them is exterminate them. They are not interested in peaceful coexistence with anyone. My point is that we lack the stomach for such a job. It was easier to maintain it in World War II as images of dismembered Americans and dead civilians were not coming to you live from the internet in HD quality. If you want to rid the world of such people, it is necessary to invade the entire region with ferocious brutality. If they have somewhere to hide and regroup, they will, so it is now necessary to cut off such retreat and kill everyone attempting it. They all hate us anyway. If they can hide among the people, then our enemy is now them AND the people. Sounds gruesome, does it not?

This is the region's problem to deal with, as they are the only ones that can actually get away with dealing with it. If we try, it's all-out Sunni Jihad against Shia-allied infidels.

I agree. The best we can hope for is for Iran to jump in.

[autigeremt 6,970]

So we "invade" how? We have learned, I hope that we can't win a conventional war with them. The only way to exterminate them is to nuke them. OK with that?

I am not advocating exterminating them, I am just saying that is literally the only way for US to combat them to the end of eliminating their threat. We (and the West in general) are their ideological arch-nemesis. They know no borders, and they have allies all over the region. We cannot attack their funding, as it comes from those within our allies in the Gulf States. We cannot attack their ideology, because they care not what we say.

If we are not going to exterminate them, then the only thing we can do is wash our hands of the region. The only thing that ever made it strategically valuable to us is irrelevant, as we do not import that much of their oil. Let someone else go mingle there and arouse their wrath. If the rest of the region wishes to sit by and watch these kind of people fight and behead the area back into the Middle Ages, so be it. Saudi Arabia is to the south, Iran to the east, Turkey to north, and eventually Israel is to the west. Any of the four are armed well enough to stop this themselves, so let them. It's time they learn that they can either grow up and act like civilized people to control and improve their region, or they can kill themselves in Jihadist martyrdom.

Maybe Russia gets involved at some point, but even they no longer need their oil. China? Doubt it.

[AURaptor 1,137]

The religion of peace is so misunderstood by those in the West.

[AURaptor 1,137]

To answer the question - there is a way to combat this.

But most don't want to go there.

So we won't.

[cooltigger21 0]

So we just wait until the next 9/11 type event happens. It is not a matter of if but when and in what way.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

What will we do when the whole region is controlled by the extremists and most of oil supply is cut off. So why aren't we opening the Keystone pipeline NOW?

I notice our Dem friends haven't chimed in. I guess they, like their inept leader, have all options on the table.

[Strychnine 1,804]

What will we do when the whole region is controlled by the extremists and most of oil supply is cut off. So why aren't we opening the Keystone pipeline NOW?

I notice our Dem friends haven't chimed in. I guess they, like their inept leader, have all options on the table.

That need not be our problem. In 2013, 17.2% of our imported crude oil came from Saudi Arabia, along with 4.4% and 4.2% from Iraq and Kuwait respectively. 33.3% came from Canada, from which we have been steadily increasing our dealings over the last decade. Mexico is 11%, along with Venezuela and Colombia at 9.8% and 4.8%. We could compensate for the complete loss of Middle East oil by increasing domestic production, increasing importation from our more stable sources, or a combination of the two. China has already signaled that they would rather deal with Russia than the Middle East.

As I have said in another thread, the best course of action for us (and the rest of the world) is to let these people have the fate they apparently wish for and stop buying the only thing they have that made them relevant in the modern world in the first place. When the Gulf States start feeling their wallets getting lighter, I bet you see them start reeling this nonsense in and promoting stability. They have been able to get away with doing nothing, while people in their countries funnel money to groups such as ISIS or Al-Qaeda, for entirely too long.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

I agree but it seems like every hiccup, like now in Iraq, causes gas prices to jump. Why are we not going forward with Keystone to further our independence?

[Strychnine 1,804]

I agree but it seems like every hiccup, like now in Iraq, causes gas prices to jump. Why are we not going forward with Keystone to further our independence?

That has more to do with some wealthy people that have a vested interest in rising oil prices, and they do not have a vested interest in the market stability that would come from complete US independence of the tumultuous Middle East. As for Keystone, everyone has been working around it via alternative arrangements instead of putting all their eggs in one basket.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

And wasting a lot of money in pursuing those alternatives, most of which have been proven not ready for prime time several times before.

Isn't it time for the gov't to get out and let the private sector pursue the more promising ones if they think they are ready for the free market.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

When do you decide they are "bothering us" and what do we do then. Kind of reminds me of the old joke.......How does a Frenchman know he is in trouble? Answer......when he sees German tanks coming done the street.

Its 1939 all over again but, some peoples dont no there history.

[AURaptor 1,137]

Some folks are far less funny than they know.

[homersapien 11,812]

Some folks are far less funny than they know.

Well, maybe it's you. After all, humor and irony reside on the same gene.

[AURaptor 1,137]

Making jokes as a reply to actual and serious world events has always been such a positive response to just about anything.

Anyone who doesn't comprehend that these folks would treat you, your loved ones and anyone else they could find in much the same manner as the men in the video , prolly would have also believed the Jews were being sent to summer camps, for their own safety, during WW2.

Just remeber to smile, and wave to the camera ! They really like that.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

Making jokes as a reply to actual and serious world events has always been such a positive response to just about anything.

Anyone who doesn't comprehend that these folks would treat you, your loved ones and anyone else they could find in much the same manner as the men in the video , prolly would have also believed the Jews were being sent to summer camps, for their own safety, during WW2.

Just remeber to smile, and wave to the camera ! They really like that.

Sorry if I'm not taking "these folks" seriously enough but, none of "these folks" live in my neighborhood. If one of "these folks" becomes a threat to me, or my family, I will kill them. "These folks" seem to be more interested in killing each other, than any of us. Unless of course, we decide we have to stop them. Nothing seems to piss "these folks" off, more than us getting in the middle of them killing and terrorizing one another.

If we now have the ability to export oil, screw them. If we leave them alone for a little while, they will figure out who the "great satan" really is. We are not their problem. We are not the solution to their problem. We are a distraction from their problem. Perhaps if we take a step away from the region, they will be able to clearly see that their problem is themselves.

[AURaptor 1,137]

I'm totally confident that if we just step away from the middle east, let them blow up the oil wells and refineries, then they'll eventually come around and realize that they're all just hurting themselves.

Yep.

[Strychnine 1,804]

I'm totally confident that if we just step away from the middle east, let them blow up the oil wells and refineries, then they'll eventually come around and realize that they're all just hurting themselves.

Yep.

What the region does with itself after we step away is irrelevant to us. It may ultimately accomplish nothing, but we already know that keeping the hornet's nest stirred up with our involvement will not produce the desired results. That being the case, it is foolish to continue or resume. As I said previously, we either enter the region and exterminate them utterly, or we leave them alone. There is no middle ground, and there are no alternatives. Since we are clearly not going to enter the region to exterminate them and occupy it indefinitely (and we shouldn't), there is little point in doing anything.

Diplomacy cannot work when one side is not at all interested in anything that you have to say, and groups like ISIS are not interested. Limited military action cannot work either, as best case scenario involves them experiencing defeat and withdrawing to somewhere they can regroup. That is ultimately the problem, there is always somewhere over in the region that groups of this sort can regroup. The rest of the region seems to feel like no action is necessary on their part, and as long as they can successfully maintain that position and status quo, groups like this can never be truly defeated or contained.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

I'm totally confident that if we just step away from the middle east, let them blow up the oil wells and refineries, then they'll eventually come around and realize that they're all just hurting themselves.

Yep.

So, let me see if I understand you. The problem is no longer their violence. Now the problem is oil and gas? Is that correct? What is your proposed solution?