Biden Sinks to New Low

[auburnatl1 4,973]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

Evangelicals / religious zealots scare the hell out of me.

Any zeolot should scare you.   And it does not stop at religion. It is a belief system that I’m right and anyone that disagrees is wrong - or worse, evil.  And in its worst form it’s an ends justifies the means mentality.You don’t have to be Islamic to embrace a jihad approach to solving things. Often ,  a weird combination of arrogance and not to bright.

IMO anyone that doesn’t have an open mind to new or different ideas, and is 100% certain about grey areas (ie anything involving….  people) probably isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer.

[homersapien 11,390]

2 hours ago, auburnatl1 said:

Any zeolot should scare you.   And it does not stop at religion. It is a belief system that I’m right and anyone that disagrees is wrong - or worse, evil.  And in its worst form it’s an ends justifies the means mentality.You don’t have to be Islamic to embrace a jihad approach to solving things. Often ,  a weird combination of arrogance and not to bright.

IMO anyone that doesn’t have an open mind to new or different ideas, and is 100% certain about grey areas (ie anything involving….  people) probably isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer.

I agree in principle.

Religion is not unique as an organizing principle for extremism. (See Fascism and Communism)  But one could argue religious extremism has historically been at the core of at least as many authoritarian movements as a key organizing principle, as simple political hegemony.  (But they typically go hand-in-hand.)

But at present, in the USA, Christian evangelism/dominionism is clearly a core organizing principle of right wing extremism.  Trump of course realizes this and is cynically using radical Christians as a vehicle to acquire authoritarian power. 

And of course it's cynical because Trump doesn't give a s*** about Christianity or anything it (should) represent. That's a weakness I suppose we should be grateful for. It could be worse. 

Regardless of his lack of faith, Trump will promote and ride "Christofascism" for all it's worth, to the detriment of our country (not to mention Christianity itself). 

That's the "clear and present danger" I am focused on.

Edited April 4 by homersapien

[auburnatl1 4,973]

48 minutes ago, homersapien said:

I agree in principle.

Religion is not unique as an organizing principle for extremism. (See Fascism and Communism)  But one could argue religious extremism has historically been at the core of at least as many authoritarian movements as an key organizing principle as simple political hegemony.  They typically go hand-in-hand. 

But at present, in the USA, Christian evangelism/dominionism is clearly a core organizing principle of right wing extremism.  Trump of course realizes this and is cynically using radical Christians as a vehicle to acquire authoritarian power. 

And of course it's cynical because Trump doesn't give a s*** about Christianity or anything it (should) represent. That's a weakness I suppose we should be grateful for. It could be worse. 

Trump will promote and ride "Christofascism" for all it's worth, to the detriment of our country (not to mention Christianity itself). 

That's the "clear and present danger" I am focused on.

It’s human nature to pick and choose what they like about anything. The Bible, science, whatever.

I believe you profess to be a man of science - ok let’s start with 2 tenets of modern physics - relativity and quantum mechanics. Relativity is fundamentally premised that nothing can exceed the speed of light. It’s an absolute. But no one can explain WHY the universe has that precise speed limit. Science  and mathematics literally has no idea. And the growing speculation is they never will.  Quantum physics (and also chemistry) is totally anchored on the  electron shell sequence  - the 2-8-8-18 rule.  Again an absolute that no one can begin to explain why those numbers.  Hell even the age of the universe and the Big Bang theory are now being challenged.

The point being science can’t answer why’s and rewrites itself constantly - but because it’s  based on local observation, you have “faith” in it. Which I get. It’s tangible. Religion instead is all about “why”s. Even though many write it off as voodoo. I personally try to fuse the 2, but both sides definitely have their zealots.   And before you say “yes but religion is worse”, remember what communism in Russia and China did to religious leaders during their early purges. 

Edited April 4 by auburnatl1

[homersapien 11,390]

1 hour ago, auburnatl1 said:

It’s human nature to pick and choose what they like about anything. The Bible, science, whatever.

I believe you profess to be a man of science - ok let’s start with 2 tenets of modern physics - relativity and quantum mechanics. Relativity is fundamentally premised that nothing can exceed the speed of light. It’s an absolute. But no one can explain WHY the universe has that precise speed limit. Science  and mathematics literally has no idea. And the growing speculation is they never will.  Quantum physics (and also chemistry) is totally anchored on the  electron shell sequence  - the 2-8-8-18 rule.  Again an absolute that no one can begin to explain why those numbers.  Hell even the age of the universe and the Big Bang theory are now being challenged.

The point being science can’t answer why’s and rewrites itself constantly - but because it’s  based on local observation, you have “faith” in it. Which I get. It’s tangible. Religion instead is all about “why”s. Even though many write it off as voodoo. I personally try to fuse the 2, but both sides definitely have their zealots.   And before you say “yes but religion is worse”, remember what communism in Russia and China did to religious leaders during their early purges. 

Not sure I understand that response. I wasn't trying to make make a philosophical - much less a value statement - regarding science or religion. 

Perhaps my style confused my message?

I was speaking strictly to your generalized comment of the danger of extremism no matter what produces it.  (Which I agreed with, "in principle".)  I really have no counter point to make regarding that.

My intent was to point out that, IMO, the greatest danger we currently have regarding extremism in this country, at this time comes from religion - particularly Christianity. 

It is not extremism founded on economics, political philosophy or simple hegemonic greed.  (Granted, those sources of extremism have often been equivalent dangers in different countries - including ours - at different times, as 20th century history so amply illustrated.)  

And BTW, the reason I have faith in science is not that is comes from "local observation".  It is because it is the only system that is capable of answering questions about the natural world.  As you point out, "local (scientific) observation" - can be wrong.  But science the system will eventually correct or modify such errors. 

But none of this has anything to do with the point I was trying to make.

I will admit to a general belief that (any) religion as being pointless and generally harmful to our species.  Religion doesn't define "why", it simply offers a (fanciful) explanation of "why". 

Nor do I agree with the notion that science typically produces "zealots".  The closest I can come to that on an individual basis is perhaps Edward Teller.  But I can't think of any group that has sought political power using science as the organizing element.

But let's save that debate for another thread.  

 

Edited April 4 by homersapien

[Son of A Tiger 561]

Interesting article/study regarding the transgender topic.

Groundbreaking New Study Destroys Transgender Narrative (trendingpoliticsnews.com)

[I_M4_AU 7,859]

1 hour ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Interesting article/study regarding the transgender topic.

Groundbreaking New Study Destroys Transgender Narrative (trendingpoliticsnews.com)

The Democrats have taken notice:

 

 

[auburnatl1 4,973]

28 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

The Democrats have taken notice:

 

 

Where do you all find this stuff? 

[I_M4_AU 7,859]

1 hour ago, auburnatl1 said:

Where do you all find this stuff? 

Babylon Bee, they are hilarious.  Obvious a satire outlet.

[DKW 86 7,429]

9 hours ago, homersapien said:

Evangelicals / religious zealots scare the hell out of me.

Evangelicals can be zealots. But Zealotry is a quantum level or more above mere hard-headed ignorance. Zealotry is taking views and stances that are not even part of your religion anymore. It is thinking, that You can force God to do what you want him to. See Masada and the Fall of Jerusalem. The saddest thing I ever read was Josephus, a good Jew writing about how screwed up the Zealots were in Jerusalem.