Are evangelicals the least Christian among us?

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

6 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

We have no power over those countries accepting refugees.  They don't want them because they don't want the headache of filtering out the militants.  They still don't want them slaughtered. 

Why not other allies like England, the Netherlands, France?  Why is Israel going alone in this?  Why are we not holding Hamas’ feet to the fire for the war crime on using its own citizens as shields?

You don’t have to answer the first question, it obvious.  Biden is suggesting we take Palestinian refugees here in the US and no other nation wants them because of the militants.  Something like his open border policy.  I’m sure he would run them through the APP and parole them in the US.

The 2nd question has always been at the root of the problem.

[auburnatl1 5,234]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Why not other allies like England, the Netherlands, France?  Why is Israel going alone in this?  Why are we not holding Hamas’ feet to the fire for the war crime on using its own citizens as shields?

You don’t have to answer the first question, it obvious.  Biden is suggesting we take Palestinian refugees here in the US and no other nation wants them because of the militants.  Something like his open border policy.  I’m sure he would run them through the APP and parole them in the US.

The 2nd question has always been at the root of the problem.

So what’s actually the solution? The answer needs to be a little more strategic than “getting Hamas” (which they won’t)

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

17 minutes ago, auburnatl1 said:

So what’s actually the solution? The answer needs to be a little more strategic than “getting Hamas” (which they won’t)

Take Rafah and the Gazan Hamas leaders, let Mossad take care of the ones in Qatar educate at least two generations of Palestine in something other than hate and let one of those educated in moderation govern the people of Palestine.

Now that I have given my thoughts on the matter, I’ll be waiting for Tex to come in and solve the problem like he always does.

[TexasTiger 13,120]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Take Rafah and the Gazan Hamas leaders, let Mossad take care of the ones in Qatar educate at least two generations of Palestine in something other than hate and let one of those educated in moderation govern the people of Palestine.

Now that I have given my thoughts on the matter, I’ll be waiting for Tex to come in and solve the problem like he always does.

Gonna have to wait a few generations to do that now.

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

15 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

Gonna have to wait a few generations to do that now.

Yeah two would be optimistic.

[CoffeeTiger 5,226]

14 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Take Rafah and the Gazan Hamas leaders, let Mossad take care of the ones in Qatar educate at least two generations of Palestine in something other than hate and let one of those educated in moderation govern the people of Palestine.

Now that I have given my thoughts on the matter, I’ll be waiting for Tex to come in and solve the problem like he always does.

 

the Union army burned some southern cities 160 years ago and there's plenty of Southerners around today who are still sour about it, and try to keep the 'culture' of a country that existed for 4 years relevant and celebrated to this day.  

 

Good luck teaching the Palestinians that the people who destroyed their entire country and killed their family and friends are REALLY actually the good guys in the world and that they shouldn't be so hateful. 

 

 

like I said...good luck. 

[Mims44 1,896]

38 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

the Union army burned some southern cities 160 years ago and there's plenty of Southerners around today who are still sour about it, and try to keep the 'culture' of a country that existed for 4 years relevant and celebrated to this day.  

 

Good luck teaching the Palestinians that the people who destroyed their entire country and killed their family and friends are REALLY actually the good guys in the world and that they shouldn't be so hateful. 

 

 

like I said...good luck. 

If whatever is done results in the worst part of Palestine just.... being sour and saying something akin to 'the south will rise again' I think everyone would count that as a huge victory.

160 years, like you said, how many other mass secession attempts have we seen? 

[CoffeeTiger 5,226]

19 minutes ago, Mims44 said:

If whatever is done results in the worst part of Palestine just.... being sour and saying something akin to 'the south will rise again' I think everyone would count that as a huge victory.

160 years, like you said, how many other mass secession attempts have we seen? 

Oh yeah, My point is that even in the absolute BEST case scenario, White Christian Americans trying to reintegrate with other white Christian Americans after a war, its very hard to eliminate the resentment and pride of resistance that the losing side harbors inside of their culture. 

 

Now try it in a soceity with different races, different cultures, different religions, and a whole lot more death, destruction and animosity. 

Honestly, the issue of Israel/Palestinians peace and reconciliation seems like an almost impossible outcome at this point. And neither Palestine nor Israel seems to want to compromise in anything to make it happen.  

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

the Union army burned some southern cities 160 years ago and there's plenty of Southerners around today who are still sour about it, and try to keep the 'culture' of a country that existed for 4 years relevant and celebrated to this day.  

 

Good luck teaching the Palestinians that the people who destroyed their entire country and killed their family and friends are REALLY actually the good guys in the world and that they shouldn't be so hateful. 

 

 

like I said...good luck. 

Are just taking a position or do you have a better plan?  And if so what is it?

54 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

Oh yeah, My point is that even in the absolute BEST case scenario, White Christian Americans trying to reintegrate with other white Christian Americans after a war, its very hard to eliminate the resentment and pride of resistance that the losing side harbors inside of their culture. 

 

Now try it in a soceity with different races, different cultures, different religions, and a whole lot more death, destruction and animosity. 

Honestly, the issue of Israel/Palestinians peace and reconciliation seems like an almost impossible outcome at this point. And neither Palestine nor Israel seems to want to compromise in anything to make it happen.  

Is this you plan?  Just give up?  I’m sure you can do better.

[auburnatl1 5,234]

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

the Union army burned some southern cities 160 years ago and there's plenty of Southerners around today who are still sour about it, and try to keep the 'culture' of a country that existed for 4 years relevant and celebrated to this day.  

 

Good luck teaching the Palestinians that the people who destroyed their entire country and killed their family and friends are REALLY actually the good guys in the world and that they shouldn't be so hateful. 

 

 

like I said...good luck. 

This war is seen as a direct attack on civilians by a vastly superior military force.  In fact calling it a war is a stretch.  It will have a legacy greater than the civil war.

Beyond the current moral  issues in this action by Israel, my longer term fear is that Israel has greatly increased their overall risk. Short sighted thinking imo.  Hamas is just a tactical threat. Israel exists only because of the support of the US and the world, and they’ve burned a ton of critical good will - while further raising Arab animosity. Mistake.

[CoffeeTiger 5,226]

Just now, I_M4_AU said:

Are just taking a position or do you have a better plan?  And if so what is it?

Is this you plan?  Just give up?  I’m sure you can do better.

Neither of us have any actual "Plans". The best diplomatic minds and Middle Eastern scholars in the world have tried for decades and decades to bring a peaceful end to the Israel/Palestine situation and have failed miserably.  

I'm not going to pretend that I know what the best solution or the path to reach that solution is. 

 

All I know is that whatever the solution is it's going to be hard and the solution isn't going to involve bombs, invasions, or hostages. 

[AU9377 5,135]

20 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Why not other allies like England, the Netherlands, France?  Why is Israel going alone in this?  Why are we not holding Hamas’ feet to the fire for the war crime on using its own citizens as shields?

You don’t have to answer the first question, it obvious.  Biden is suggesting we take Palestinian refugees here in the US and no other nation wants them because of the militants.  Something like his open border policy.  I’m sure he would run them through the APP and parole them in the US.

The 2nd question has always been at the root of the problem.

What more could we do?  We have supplied Israel with the weapons that they are justifiably using to destroy Hamas.  We have now built a pier for food and humanitarian aid to be delivered, so that people don't starve. 

Our actions won't change with another President.  Everything that happens in the world is not within our control.  Our European allies have all voiced support for Israel.  They have also voiced concern that Israel not forget their own humanity while undertaking this task. 

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

5 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

Neither of us have any actual "Plans". The best diplomatic minds and Middle Eastern scholars in the world have tried for decades and decades to bring a peaceful end to the Israel/Palestine situation and have failed miserably.  

I'm not going to pretend that I know what the best solution or the path to reach that solution is. 

 

All I know is that whatever the solution is it's going to be hard and the solution isn't going to involve bombs, invasions, or hostages. 

Then why criticize someone else’s plan.  I don’t have the answers, but was asked what I would do.

The war started with bombs, invasions and hostages and you are telling me the solution won’t involve those things?  Is that what the *new* world is all about now?

Terrorist use your thinking against us and that is why they are succeeding now.  The West has lost its quest for righteousness.  Bin Laden was right, draw out the conflict long enough and the West will fold.  Embarrassing really.  We aren’t even talking tough, just folding.

 

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

19 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

What more could we do?  We have supplied Israel with the weapons that they are justifiably using to destroy Hamas.  We have now built a pier for food and humanitarian aid to be delivered, so that people don't starve. 

Our actions won't change with another President.  Everything that happens in the world is not within our control.  Our European allies have all voiced support for Israel.  They have also voiced concern that Israel not forget their own humanity while undertaking this task. 

One thing is if we get intel pass it on to our allies.

 

I think the war might have take a turn on this news if Israel knew about it.

Another President definitely would have passed this information along.

Everything that happens may not be within America’s control, but we have a President that thinks it does.  That President likes to straddle the fence and has no thought of what is right and what is wrong.  He needs to go.  He won’t take a stand and the world knows it.

As to the humanity issue:  let the country that is without sin cast the first stone.  From what I understand the ratio between combatants and civilian deaths is the lowest in modern times, but lets make sure we handcuff Israel and not hold the terrorist that use human shields feet to the fire.

[AU9377 5,135]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

One thing is if we get intel pass it on to our allies.

 

I think the war might have take a turn on this news if Israel knew about it.

Another President definitely would have passed this information along.

Everything that happens may not be within America’s control, but we have a President that thinks it does.  That President likes to straddle the fence and has no thought of what is right and what is wrong.  He needs to go.  He won’t take a stand and the world knows it.

As to the humanity issue:  let the country that is without sin cast the first stone.  From what I understand the ratio between combatants and civilian deaths is the lowest in modern times, but lets make sure we handcuff Israel and not hold the terrorist that use human shields feet to the fire.

I don't believe our intelligence officials would do that.

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

9 hours ago, AU9377 said:

I don't believe our intelligence officials would do that.

Looks like Biden got played:

 

Just another reason the IDF should have gone into Rafah earlier.

[AU9377 5,135]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Looks like Biden got played:

 

Just another reason the IDF should have gone into Rafah earlier.

Nobody has said that they shouldn’t go into Rafah. They were warned not to use American large bombs on the areas of Rafah that would result in 30 thousand casualties and turn worldwide sympathy against Israel.  There is nothing that Biden or anyone not named Trump could do that you won’t have an issue with.

[I_M4_AU 8,052]

6 hours ago, AU9377 said:

Nobody has said that they shouldn’t go into Rafah

Come on.

 

This was on Feb 11th.

 

6 hours ago, AU9377 said:

There is nothing that Biden or anyone not named Trump could do that you won’t have an issue with.

The no named person would be better than Biden at most anything.  America needs Biden to move on ASAP.

[Son of A Tiger 571]

On 5/9/2024 at 1:49 PM, CoffeeTiger said:

 

Evangelicals have had numerous opportunities to pick someone else other than Trump to lead them, but they keep going to the same man. 

Is it because there are no Republican politicians who stand up for Christian values AND follows them in their persona lives, or what? 

You seem to lump all evangelists together, And yes there are GOP politicians who follow their Christian values/beliefs. A statue of one of the greatest evangelists of our time, Billy Graham, was unveiled in the Capitol this week with several GOP politicians paying tribute.

[VIDEO] Billy Graham Statue Points to Christ in U.S. Capitol

[TexasTiger 13,120]

5 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

You seem to lump all evangelists together, And yes there are GOP politicians who follow their Christian values/beliefs. A statue of one of the greatest evangelists of our time, Billy Graham, was unveiled in the Capitol this week with several GOP politicians paying tribute.

[VIDEO] Billy Graham Statue Points to Christ in U.S. Capitol

He was a decent man. He died six years ago and stopped being active long before that. Hid son’s little acorn brain fell far from the tree. A crazy wind must’ve blown it far from his father’s roots.

[Son of A Tiger 571]

20 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

He was a decent man. He died six years ago and stopped being active long before that. Hid son’s little acorn brain fell far from the tree. A crazy wind must’ve blown it far from his father’s roots.

I guess we just disagree. I think son Franklin is a good guy and Samaritans Purse is a great charity operation bar none. I give them a  lot of money.

[TexasTiger 13,120]

Just now, Son of A Tiger said:

I guess we just disagree. I think son Franklin is a good guy and Samaritans Purse is a great charity operation bar none. I give them a  lot of money.

Some good may come from his actions. But his dad strived to be nonpartisan in a way that made him able to reach more people. Franklin is deeply partisan and divisive. His father was far more "Christ-like".

[auburnatl1 5,234]

21 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

You seem to lump all evangelists together, And yes there are GOP politicians who follow their Christian values/beliefs. A statue of one of the greatest evangelists of our time, Billy Graham, was unveiled in the Capitol this week with several GOP politicians paying tribute.

[VIDEO] Billy Graham Statue Points to Christ in U.S. Capitol

I think there are 3 primary concerns I have about extreme evangelicals 1) they’ve blurred religion and politics and have become hyper activists - which is directly contrary to the gospels 2) a lack of tolerance for anything and everything different  3) a total Israel fixation which makes it difficult to execute a consistent foreign policy.

That being said, Billy Graham was a great man (ie he stood with MLK at a time when it was anything but safe to do so) and I respected him greatly.

[Son of A Tiger 571]

2 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

3 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

Some good may come from his actions. But his dad strived to be nonpartisan in a way that made him able to reach more people. Franklin is deeply partisan and divisive. His father was far more "Christ-like".

 

I think a LOT of good is done by Samaritans Purse. It is quite an operation and almost always the first helpers to get to a disaster situation.

[TexasTiger 13,120]

12 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

I think a LOT of good is done by Samaritans Purse. It is quite an operation and almost always the first helpers to get to a disaster situation.

I haven't knocked it. It's unfortunate he chooses to be polarizing.