NCG and the Snub.

[FootballFanatic 4]

How can we as fans honestly keep Hawaii out of the NCG.

After all the other teams in the top 25 earned 1st, second, or 3rd losses to sit atop the polls, how do we snub an 12-0 team (if they beat a 4-8 team this weekend).

I am just as guilty of conference and schedule critisizing as anyone else and if there were any other undefeated teams in the nation I would chuckle at the thought of hawaii going to the NCG but...

If a team is the ONLY undefeated team in the nation how can they not be one of the 2 participants in the BCS title game when one of the major requirements to go is win/loss record? Even against a weak schedule like Hawaii's the Ohio State Schedule is a joke and they are sitting in striking distance of playing in the NCG if anyone trips.

How do we snub Hawaii and say its okay that Ohio State goes to the NCG?

I am starting to think that its time we look in the mirror and be honest. If the only team in the country to win its conference and go undefeated all year is left out, we are doing to them what was done to Auburn in 2004. WAC or SEC, if there is only one undefeated team in the nation and no other options, why are we relegating them to the Sugar bowl at best?

[PChamp119 96]

Where was this argument last year when Boise State when undefeated?

If they want a shot at a National Title, tell their AD to schedule tougher OOC opponents. That is their school's fault.

[runswithscissors 33]

Where was this argument last year when Boise State when undefeated?

If they want a shot at a National Title, tell their AD to schedule tougher OOC opponents. That is their school's fault.

i agree. you really have to look at the situation objectively instead of just laying a blanket statement out saying if you go undefeated, you should be in the championship game.

for example, say you have one team that is undefeated, but never played a ranked team and only played teams with a losing record with the exception of 2 or 3 games. they are ranked in the top 10 because they were ranked highly in the preseason, and some teams ahead of them lost.

then you have a team with one loss who say played only ranked opponents. maybe they played 4 top 10 opponents and creamed them. how could you keep out a team with a more difficult schedule who might have lost one game, over a team who went undefeated because they beat a bunch of creampuffs?

i do really believe in the strength of schedule factor of the BCS ratings, but perhaps the way they figure that strength of schedule rating should be tweaked a little. i'm not 100% sure of the formula they calculate to figure a team's SOS.

[AUesquire 1]

Playoff...Playoff...Playoff!!!!

I agree that no one is going to argue with a straight face that Hawaii is one of the best two teams in the nation. But I do believe they deserve a shot to prove it. Arguing strength of schedule or strength of conferences is futile for the most part. You can believe what you want about which team or conference is better, but until it's proven on the field, it's just opinion.

My biggest problem with our current system is very simple. The NCAA allows more and more teams every year to compete on the Division 1 level. What are we up to now, about 120? BUT, at the start of the season, you can basically say to 60-70 of those teams....

"You can go 12-0 this year and win each and every game by 50 or more. But you will NOT get a shot at the title. Thanks for playing".

If you allow a team to play D-1, then you should allow them to get their shot. Hey, if Oklahoma is better than Boise State, then...oh wait, they aren't better than Boise State. That was proven on the field. My bad.

[AURainman 6]

Hawaii abso-frickin-lutely does NOT deserve to be in the national championship game. This team has only played TWO teams this year with a WINNING RECORD!!!! Nevada took them to overtime.

I can feel their pain, because its tough to schedule non-conference games when you're Hawaii. No one wants to travel there for a home-and-home and its just not financially viable to play at opponents' stadiums each year. I realize how much harder it is to schedule Hawaii.

However, the fact that they...

a. play a weak-a$# conference schedule AND

b. make NO effort to schedule BCS conference teams (Bammer's do-it-yourself bowl game excluded).

Means there administration is to blame for their snubbing. Hawaii doesn't even deserve a BCS bowl, much less the national championship game. Undefeated-schmeated. This isn't Auburn. This isn't a BCS team that has played in front of stadiums with capacities around 100k. This isn't a team that's played and beat 4 top ten teams. This isn't a team that has been put on the national stage time and time again and come away with impressive victory after impressive victory.

If we're talking Kansas undefeated, I'm on board. But I will NOT rally behind the Hawaii warriors.

[War Eagle 96 10]

They are not in a BCS conference.

[FootballFanatic 4]

Boise wasn't the only undefeated team in the country.

My point is, if the only undefeated team in the nation is snubbed simply because they are in a lower class conference, why invite them to bowl games or interconference play at all.

The system seems to allow teams to partially participate in the BCs but not fully. Why? They can play any team in the Div 1a level and be counted towards both teams records, they can get bowl appearances, but they can't play in the NCG ever unless they can figure out how to get USC or Ohio State to schedule them to get enough credit to even be considered?

I am all for a playoff, but in the current BS system we have the number one priority of any NCG contender is to win all their games. If any of the favorites for the shot miss that mark they have to wait for others to miss that mark.

The ONLY team with an undefeated record this year will play in a lower BCS bowl if things work out right for them. While a possible 2 loss team may compete for the NCG title.

My opinion is we can't have a grown up table and a little kids table, all teams need to be measured equally. If these teams can schedule games with any Div 1a school and play in Div 1a football then they should be a party to the whole system. Its a have/have nots system and without a playoff the have not conferences will never truely have a shot to show if they suck or are really good.

Last year a WAC team beat one of the years favorite NCG teams prior to a few trips along the way. If the WAC can pull an upset on Oklahoma when they were a possible NCG participant then we should be getting past this bias.

The idea that Ohio State has a shot with their weak schedule infuriates me but the fact another team in the nation gets no consideration at all and they are the only ones to get through their weak schedule without a loss is another level of irritated.

If there was any other team in the nation with no losses I could see the bias. Hawaii is the only undefeated team in Div 1a.

[PChamp119 96]

I like your argument, I do.

But IMO they don't deserve any consideration. I don't think their own head coach is even trying to make a case. I recall in 2004, when Urban Meyer came out and publicly stated that his Utah team was not in the same league as the other 3 and should not have been mentioned for the Championship game. Granted that was with 4 undefeated teams, but it is still in the same boat. It's almost the same as Michigan last year - they only lost to the #1 team on the road, doesn't that mean they should automatically be #2? And along those notes, ND only lost to really good teams last year, so shouldn't they be in the top 5 or top 10? If a team had the ideal schedule and goes 0-12, losing to the top 12 teams by 1 point, should they be #13?

I realize I got off tangent there and it probably didn't make any sense, nor should it be compared to the original topic. My point is, you can't necessarily judge a team purely based on how they do on the field either. There are many factors that I feel should be considered. Just because you are the only team to go undefeated, doesn't mean you should get a chance at the championship. If it were, no team would ever schedule anyone tough and why even be in a conference?

[CircleDrill 178]

Going undefeated is not the only thing that matters.

Back when you actually had to be good to win a MNC instead of just highly ranked pre-season (pre-BCS era), you had to "beat the best to be the best."

Hawaii has beaten no one. They do not deserve to be the best.

[FootballFanatic 4]

And yet their Quarterback has broken numerous records, their offense is one of the most dynamic fast paced offenses in the nation.

Seriously, we are looking at Missouri versus West Virginia in a title game. Its not like USC and Ohio state were the 2 1 loss teams looking to wrestle down. In the environment as it is today, we are going to alienate the only undefeated team in the nation in favor of 2 other teams that play in weak conferences as well.

How does that logic hold up?

Its definately time to have a playoff. This stuff is getting silly. If they can't compete like every other team in the Div 1a landscape, then send them to division 1aa or lower.

[AUChizad 0]

I agree Hawaii shouldn't be in the big game. But if we had even a plus one game, they should get one of the four slots.

They should be ranked higher than they are.

As mentioned, Ohio State's schedule is equally laughable this year, but they still have a shot 13 weeks in after losing a game.

THAT is the real travesty.

[BamaGrad03 0]

Hawaii's SOS is ranked 117/119. And that only takes into account D1 opponents.

They also played Northern Colorado and Charleston Southern.

They beat La Tech by 1 point. They beat 5-7 San Jose St on a prayer.

Their D1 opponents have a combined record of 37-63.

[TecmoBoJackson 65]

And yet their Quarterback has broken numerous records, their offense is one of the most dynamic fast paced offenses in the nation.

Seriously, we are looking at Missouri versus West Virginia in a title game. Its not like USC and Ohio state were the 2 1 loss teams looking to wrestle down. In the environment as it is today, we are going to alienate the only undefeated team in the nation in favor of 2 other teams that play in weak conferences as well.

How does that logic hold up?

Its definately time to have a playoff. This stuff is getting silly. If they can't compete like every other team in the Div 1a landscape, then send them to division 1aa or lower.

I have watched their offense and while they are good I believe that if you put them in a place where there are stronger opponets week in and week out that they would still be that good??? I for one do not think so and that is what holds them back.

Do you think a one or two loss SEC team wouldn't deserve a shot over them???

[FootballFanatic 4]

Boise state last year shocked the nation and beat Oklahoma. It was completely unexpected. They had a horribly under powered schedule with no real evidence that they could compete. They didn't just compete, they won.

I thought Boise put the concept of undeserving Div 1a teams out of the mindset when they embarressed Oklahoma.

So this year, another team with the same record is stepping out of WAC and the mindset is exactly the same? Little brother can play in the game, but you should hang back.

I can't honestly say that I truely believe that Hawaii is not getting what they deserve with a BCS bowl game in their future, but why have so many teams in DIV1A if we aren't going to expect the same results and give the same rewards for these teams when they do as expected?

Why not rebuild the Div 1a system, the one renamed Bowl Championship Division, that Hawaii is a part of to weed out these teams we believe do not belong.

[TigerStar 0]

And yet their Quarterback has broken numerous records, their offense is one of the most dynamic fast paced offenses in the nation.

Seriously, we are looking at Missouri versus West Virginia in a title game. Its not like USC and Ohio state were the 2 1 loss teams looking to wrestle down. In the environment as it is today, we are going to alienate the only undefeated team in the nation in favor of 2 other teams that play in weak conferences as well.

How does that logic hold up?

Its definately time to have a playoff. This stuff is getting silly. If they can't compete like every other team in the Div 1a landscape, then send them to division 1aa or lower.

Their QB has broken so many records because they have played such a weak schedule. If Cox played the same schedule, he would have broken the same records.

[AUesquire 1]

Listening to Tim Brando at lunch. He said UCLA would go to the Rose Bowl if they beat USC and Arizona beats ASU. Wow, UCLA in the "Grandaddy of them all"...the Rose Bowl. Just think.

Isn't Utah from the Mountain West or some conference like that? Sorry for the tangent. It's just that when someone mentions UCLA, I can't help but think how this PAC 10 team got smoked 44-6 by little ole Utah earlier this year. And to think UCLA had 18-19 starters returning from a team that beat mighty USC last year.

[BamaGrad03 0]

Boise state last year shocked the nation and beat Oklahoma. It was completely unexpected. They had a horribly under powered schedule with no real evidence that they could compete. They didn't just compete, they won.

I thought Boise put the concept of undeserving Div 1a teams out of the mindset when they embarressed Oklahoma.

So this year, another team with the same record is stepping out of WAC and the mindset is exactly the same? Little brother can play in the game, but you should hang back.

I can't honestly say that I truely believe that Hawaii is not getting what they deserve with a BCS bowl game in their future, but why have so many teams in DIV1A if we aren't going to expect the same results and give the same rewards for these teams when they do as expected?

Why not rebuild the Div 1a system, the one renamed Bowl Championship Division, that Hawaii is a part of to weed out these teams we believe do not belong.

Oklahoma also lost 3 games last year. UT trucked them by 18 and Oregon beat them too.

Last year Boise beat Utah, Oregon St, Hawaii, and Nevada. Beating the absolute pee water out of most of them. Their SOS last year was 52nd as opposed to Hawaii's 117.

[PChamp119 96]

And yet their Quarterback has broken numerous records, their offense is one of the most dynamic fast paced offenses in the nation.

Seriously, we are looking at Missouri versus West Virginia in a title game. Its not like USC and Ohio state were the 2 1 loss teams looking to wrestle down. In the environment as it is today, we are going to alienate the only undefeated team in the nation in favor of 2 other teams that play in weak conferences as well.

How does that logic hold up?

Its definately time to have a playoff. This stuff is getting silly. If they can't compete like every other team in the Div 1a landscape, then send them to division 1aa or lower.

Their QB has broken so many records because they have played such a weak schedule. If Cox played the same schedule, he would have broken the same records.

Do you wish to retract your statement? Come on now, we all know Tuberville doesn't throw the ball in the second half (if much in the 2nd quarter) once the game is in hand.

Colt Brennan can get these numbers because his defense can't keep the victory. They need him to post the offensive numbers to produce victories

[TigerStar 0]

And yet their Quarterback has broken numerous records, their offense is one of the most dynamic fast paced offenses in the nation.

Seriously, we are looking at Missouri versus West Virginia in a title game. Its not like USC and Ohio state were the 2 1 loss teams looking to wrestle down. In the environment as it is today, we are going to alienate the only undefeated team in the nation in favor of 2 other teams that play in weak conferences as well.

How does that logic hold up?

Its definately time to have a playoff. This stuff is getting silly. If they can't compete like every other team in the Div 1a landscape, then send them to division 1aa or lower.

Their QB has broken so many records because they have played such a weak schedule. If Cox played the same schedule, he would have broken the same records.

Do you wish to retract your statement? Come on now, we all know Tuberville doesn't throw the ball in the second half (if much in the 2nd quarter) once the game is in hand.

Colt Brennan can get these numbers because his defense can't keep the victory. They need him to post the offensive numbers to produce victories

Ok, Cox, IF HE PLAYED ON AN OFFENSE-MINDED TEAM, would have put up similar numbers.

Better?

[ssgaufan 0]

Hawaii doesn't deserve to play for the NC. Period. Neither does Ohio St. I mean is there a University, Junior College, or High School in the state of Ohio that they didn't play this year?

The current BCS system is screwed up, and we all know that, but the powers that be in the Universities that profit from the current system are not going to change it. Boise St keeps getting brought up, but any team can get "up", and bring their A game for one game a year. Just look at Ohio St. One other point that I would like to make here, if LSWho was to play Hawaii in the Sugar Bowl, what does our conference look like when CLM screws the pooch and Hawaii walks out with a win? We all know that LSWho has been EXTREMELY lucky this year, so it could happen.

[PChamp119 96]

I don't think there should even be a NC game this year

Don't forget Notre Dame!

[CCTAU 3,327]

On any given day, Hawaii could beat any team in the nation. Remember, they only have to win that one tough game. And they have proven that they know how to win. Your defense would have to absolutely shut down their offense. That would be tough. And then most offenses around the country just do not put up those kind of numbers. So I would not want to play them. They have more to gain. And when a team has more to gain than AU, we usually take a day off.

Should they be in the NCG? No. But they should be included in an 8 team playoff.

8 teams. Must win your conference to even be considered. Must be in the top 8 of the current system. If in the top 8 and did not win your conference, then you are excluded (aka. UGA, OSU). All conferences must have a championship game. SO if all these things were in place, then Hawaii could get the chance they deserve. Otherwise, their SOS was just too low.

And Cox could not put up those kind of numbers against anyone. Have you even seen Brennan play? Kid can throw the ball. Cox can't even hit a wide open Stewart at 20 yards. (I love BC, but that was sad)

[TheDrewYouKnew 3]

Hawaii doesn't deserve to play for the NC. Period. Neither does Ohio St. I mean is there a University, Junior College, or High School in the state of Ohio that they didn't play this year?

The current BCS system is screwed up, and we all know that, but the powers that be in the Universities that profit from the current system are not going to change it. Boise St keeps getting brought up, but any team can get "up", and bring their A game for one game a year. Just look at Ohio St. One other point that I would like to make here, if LSWho was to play Hawaii in the Sugar Bowl, what does our conference look like when CLM screws the pooch and Hawaii walks out with a win? We all know that LSWho has been EXTREMELY lucky this year, so it could happen.

LSU will RAPE Hawaii.

[AUesquire 1]

Since the first two games of the season, LSU hasn't raped anyone. In fact, they've struggled to get by in almost every single game they've played. Twice, they didn't.

Dorsey will collapse right back on his fat ass in the second quarter trying to rush the passer every play.

[townhallsavoy 2]

Hawaii doesn't deserve to play for the NC. Period. Neither does Ohio St. I mean is there a University, Junior College, or High School in the state of Ohio that they didn't play this year?

The current BCS system is screwed up, and we all know that, but the powers that be in the Universities that profit from the current system are not going to change it. Boise St keeps getting brought up, but any team can get "up", and bring their A game for one game a year. Just look at Ohio St. One other point that I would like to make here, if LSWho was to play Hawaii in the Sugar Bowl, what does our conference look like when CLM screws the pooch and Hawaii walks out with a win? We all know that LSWho has been EXTREMELY lucky this year, so it could happen.

LSU will RAPE Hawaii.

Gross.