Coach or recruiting

[Scooter1978 0]

3 months ago everyone was hoolering for Chiz head. Looking back would you have rather just got a new offensive coord. and defensive coord. or did what we did. We hung with Clemson the first game and had a shot of beating them and LSU, withv all of that we also keep our recruiting class. I believed Chiz deserved one more year. So if you could would you still want the same thing done.

[GenesChin 9]

I would have rather have Petrino, Fisher or Patterson but even with Gus we made the right move by getting rid of Chizik.

One recruiting class does not make or break a team. We have had straight top 10 classes yet we couldn't have a winning record let alone a top 25 ranking

This recruiting class, if we can pull Foster back in the fold, are only trimming the fat of players who do not fit our schemes well. We are still in position to have a stellar class. We also are recruiting a lot of the underrated prospects that we have missed out on in years pass because of their star value.

[Scooter1978 0]

We miss one recruiting class we are behind one year. What about Chiz winning NC,could he have had anything to do with that or was it all Gus.

[Scooter1978 0]

The first year Chiz coached people said he would not win more than 4 games,whose recruits were seniors this year.

[ellitor 33,284]

3 months ago everyone was hoolering for Chiz head. Looking back would you have rather just got a new offensive coord. and defensive coord. or did what we did. We hung with Clemson the first game and had a shot of beating them and LSU, withv all of that we also keep our recruiting class. I believed Chiz deserved one more year. So if you could would you still want the same thing done.

Chizik's arrogance and handcuffing the coaches were the problems. The only way he should have been allowed to stay was if he was willing to let the coaches do their jobs. Without him changing we would have just had another very talented recruiting class that would have not panned out and be underdeveloped because of Chiz.

[ellitor 33,284]

We miss one recruiting class we are behind one year. What about Chiz winning NC,could he have had anything to do with that or was it all Gus.

It was Gus, Superman, and the Beast. As bad as or D was that year it would have been quite a bit better had Chiz let Roof actually coach.

[GenesChin 9]

As Ellitor pointed out on TD earlier,

If we keep Reuben Foster and sign exclusively 3 stars and the rest of the class, we will still finish top 10-12. One year of top 10-12 class does not put us a "year behind"

Also, Ellitor puts it perfectly that we would have just had another talented class that wouldn't have been coached

[Rednilla 5,406]

I think it's unfair to discredit Chizik completely, and in fact think he did have a great deal to do with the NC in 2010. I base this on having heard from a couple of sources that something about him changed after that season, that he was irritated with the way he felt he'd been undersold as a part of that team; I think he started trying to make it all about him the last couple of years, to get all the credit, and that is what spelled his doom.

I believe we made the right move, both to fire Chizik and to hire Malzahn. I won't say that Gus was my first choice, but I don't think there is anyone we could have hired who would have made me any more comfortable about the future of the program. I would have liked Gary Patterson, but he is the only one whom I think we had a realistic shot at that comes close to Gus. I would have been happy with either of the Fishers or Franklin, ecstatic with Bob Stoops (though that was a pipe dream in and of itself), at least okay with Charlie Strong, and if not for the baggage that came with Petrino (particularly that which has yet to come to light), I'd have been plenty happy with him, too.

But Malzahn fits. He is a brainchild with a mind for the game in an atmosphere he already knows and loves, with players who were largely recruited to play in his offense. He's been successful every year as a college coach, with the lone exception being when he had handcuffs slapped on his wrists, and he won the conference championship in one year as a collegiate head coach despite returning virtually no starters from the year before. He has a real chance to become an elite coach in college football at Auburn in very short order. If last year was a perfect storm of what can go wrong, this seems to me to be a perfect storm for what can go right in hiring a new coach.

[ellitor 33,284]

I think it's unfair to discredit Chizik completely, and in fact think he did have a great deal to do with the NC in 2010. I base this on having heard from a couple of sources that something about him changed after that season, that he was irritated with the way he felt he'd been undersold as a part of that team; I think he started trying to make it all about him the last couple of years, to get all the credit, and that is what spelled his doom.

I believe we made the right move, both to fire Chizik and to hire Malzahn. I won't say that Gus was my first choice, but I don't think there is anyone we could have hired who would have made me any more comfortable about the future of the program. I would have liked Gary Patterson, but he is the only one whom I think we had a realistic shot at that comes close to Gus. I would have been happy with either of the Fishers or Franklin, ecstatic with Bob Stoops (though that was a pipe dream in and of itself), at least okay with Charlie Strong, and if not for the baggage that came with Petrino (particularly that which has yet to come to light), I'd have been plenty happy with him, too.

But Malzahn fits. He is a brainchild with a mind for the game in an atmosphere he already knows and loves, with players who were largely recruited to play in his offense. He's been successful every year as a college coach, with the lone exception being when he had handcuffs slapped on his wrists, and he won the conference championship in one year as a collegiate head coach despite returning virtually no starters from the year before. He has a real chance to become an elite coach in college football at Auburn in very short order. If last year was a perfect storm of what can go wrong, this seems to me to be a perfect storm for what can go right in hiring a new coach.

I am sorry that appears the discredit is complete. There were definitely other problems. Hence Gus firing the whole staff with few to no interviews. With that said Reality is when Chiz hired Gus then his offense became our team's identity and Chiz should have stuck with it. Chiz became envyous of Gus and the credit he and his offense was given. To the point where he put the clamps on Gus last year which in turn frustrated Gus to the point he took the Arky St. job. If Gene had danced with the girl who got him to the dance, namely Gus's offense, he would still be our HC and gus would have stayed as the OC. Gus may have very well been the new HC at Arky or Tennessee today.

[Rednilla 5,406]

I am sorry that appears the discredit is complete. There were definitely other problems. Hence Gus firing the whole staff with few to no interviews. With that said Reality is when Chiz hired Gus then his offense became our team's identity and Chiz should have stuck with it. Chiz became envyous of Gus and the credit he and his offense was given. To the point where he put the clamps on Gus last year which in turn frustrated Gus to the point he took the Arky St. job. If Gene had danced with the girl who got him to the dance, namely Gus's offense, he would still be our HC and gus would have stayed as the OC. Gus may have very well been the new HC at Arky or Tennessee today.

We will just have to agree to disagree then. The last two years, yes, Chizik is the reason we fell apart. I just think he deserves some credit, at least, for the first two years, as well. Yes, I think Malzahn was the primary reason for it, and that's why I am so fully supportive of his hiring, but I do think Chiz had something to do with it. If nothing else, he should get credit for having the foresight to hire Gus...

[ellitor 33,284]

I am sorry that appears the discredit is complete. There were definitely other problems. Hence Gus firing the whole staff with few to no interviews. With that said Reality is when Chiz hired Gus then his offense became our team's identity and Chiz should have stuck with it. Chiz became envyous of Gus and the credit he and his offense was given. To the point where he put the clamps on Gus last year which in turn frustrated Gus to the point he took the Arky St. job. If Gene had danced with the girl who got him to the dance, namely Gus's offense, he would still be our HC and gus would have stayed as the OC. Gus may have very well been the new HC at Arky or Tennessee today.

We will just have to agree to disagree then. The last two years, yes, Chizik is the reason we fell apart. I just think he deserves some credit, at least, for the first two years, as well. Yes, I think Malzahn was the primary reason for it, and that's why I am so fully supportive of his hiring, but I do think Chiz had something to do with it. If nothing else, he should get credit for having the foresight to hire Gus...

Agree on that part. I can;t give Chiz much credit for the first few years other than that. He took an Auburn team that was coached up well in terms of developing talent by Tubb's staff and was lucky enough to have Superman and Fairley. Heck, we would not have had Cam if Gus did not plead Chiz to take him.,,,With all that said Gene is an excellent man but just not a good coach right now. If he finds a way to humble himself professionally then he will be a good coach again someday.

[Mikey 16,781]

3 months ago everyone was hoolering for Chiz head. Looking back would you have rather just got a new offensive coord. and defensive coord. or did what we did. We hung with Clemson the first game and had a shot of beating them and LSU, withv all of that we also keep our recruiting class. I believed Chiz deserved one more year. So if you could would you still want the same thing done.

No, we needed to clean house. Just replacing a few assistant coaches would not have fixed the problem. Hiring new coordinators for the 2012 season only made things worse.

Chizik gets a lot of credit for the national championship. He made calls and decisions (onside kicks, fourth down go-fot-its) all season. No Chizik on the sidelines, no championship. You can't take that away from him.

I'm delighted with the Malzahn hire. I'd have also been happy with Jimbo Fisher, Kirby Smart or Charlie Strong.

I'm still hoping that when the whole new staff is in place we can bring some of our recruits that defected back into the fold. We have nearly the entire month of January to get that done.

[mustache eagle 2,430]

mikey, i agree with all you said.

the 2010 national championship is chizik's - not gus, not cam, not fairley ...

i argue that no other coach could or would have guided that team through that storm that year. at the time he was lauded on these boards for his sideline calls. i remember it distinctly ... cuz the opposite was being said at the same time about saban not being a great gameday coach.

chizik created a culture around the program that "fit" that years team ... he also had the dogged determination and conviction in his beliefs that he and Auburn were doing the right things - particularly when the whole camgate thing blew up. you think any other coach faces the media/ncaa/sec and that situation with the same self determination and belief in right and wrong to stand by Cam/Auburn in the stoic way that he did? absolutely not.

he was the right captain, at the right time, in the right situation to sail our team through that storm. nobody else. the other pieces, including gus, were pieces to the puzzle, but that was chiziks team.

now at the same time ... Those same self beliefs in what he was doing and his convictions in his views, i believe, also are what caused his ultimate downfall this year - and this was also chiziks team.

chiz gets credit for being a national championship coach, but also gets credit for the quickest collapse in bcs history. now that is a crazy dynamic.

[Warhead 0]

It certainly seems clear that Chizik's ego was bruised because of the credit Malzahn's offense received. It's unfortunate he couldn't overcome that, and it appeared to affect the way he coached the entire team — especially the past two years. I do think Chizik deserves a great deal of credit for 2010, though. He was still the head coach and made some key in-game decisions that year. The call that comes to mind the most is the fourth down conversion against Bama near midfield in the fourth quarter — when they lined up like Cam was going to pooch punt the ball, and he threw a completion to Darvin Adams. Yes, that was Gus' offensive play, but Chizik had to make the ultimate call to go for it. Lutzy was dancing in the end zone a couple of minutes later. If Chizik had not of made that decision alone,who knows if we win that game. And if we don't, there's no guarantee we're playing for the cheese in Arizona.

Chizik's faults were plenty, and they far outweighed his positives obviously by the time we got to the end, but he had his moments. Got to give him that. Not to mention the way he handled all of the Cam-NCAA mess. That could have so easily blown up internally and caused a major problem.

[TeBoneAU 89]

I think it's unfair to discredit Chizik completely, and in fact think he did have a great deal to do with the NC in 2010. I base this on having heard from a couple of sources that something about him changed after that season, that he was irritated with the way he felt he'd been undersold as a part of that team; I think he started trying to make it all about him the last couple of years, to get all the credit, and that is what spelled his doom.

I believe we made the right move, both to fire Chizik and to hire Malzahn. I won't say that Gus was my first choice, but I don't think there is anyone we could have hired who would have made me any more comfortable about the future of the program. I would have liked Gary Patterson, but he is the only one whom I think we had a realistic shot at that comes close to Gus. I would have been happy with either of the Fishers or Franklin, ecstatic with Bob Stoops (though that was a pipe dream in and of itself), at least okay with Charlie Strong, and if not for the baggage that came with Petrino (particularly that which has yet to come to light), I'd have been plenty happy with him, too.

But Malzahn fits. He is a brainchild with a mind for the game in an atmosphere he already knows and loves, with players who were largely recruited to play in his offense. He's been successful every year as a college coach, with the lone exception being when he had handcuffs slapped on his wrists, and he won the conference championship in one year as a collegiate head coach despite returning virtually no starters from the year before. He has a real chance to become an elite coach in college football at Auburn in very short order. If last year was a perfect storm of what can go wrong, this seems to me to be a perfect storm for what can go right in hiring a new coach.

Good observation I agree. Chizik's character and leadership was perfect for all the accusations and trials that the 2010team had to endure. IMO I don't think they win that championship without Chizik as the HC.

[aucanucktiger 1,818]

Recruiting's the lifeblood of college football, the engine, and coaching's either adding slicks or re-treads so not really an "either/or" question. There's lots of proof recruiting is by far the more important of the 2 though ...especially in the SEC. Many, many great recruiters that are dicey game day coaches have had wild success (e.g. Lou Holtz, Nick Saban, Bobby Bowden, Joe Paterno) while Terry Bowden and Tyrone Whillingham are perfect examples of very good game day coaches that tanked when somebody else's talent ran out. Having said that, Texas had top 10 recruting classes most years between 1980 and 1990 but their dreadful coaches did zero with improving talent over 4-5 years.

Looking back's silly now, I frequently posted Chizik (w/ significant staff changes) should be retained for one more full year because we owed it to him and because this recruiting class WAS phenomenal. Water under the bridge. Getting a great 1st recruiting class is a hallmark of great coaches and for all his assets, Gus is not a recruiting COORDINATOR.

[leglessdan 1,934]

Recruiting's the lifeblood of college football, the engine, and coaching's either adding slicks or re-treads so not really an "either/or" question. There's lots of proof recruiting is by far the more important of the 2 though ...especially in the SEC. Many, many great recruiters that are dicey game day coaches have had wild success (e.g. Lou Holtz, Nick Saban, Bobby Bowden, Joe Paterno) while Terry Bowden and Tyrone Whillingham are perfect examples of very good game day coaches that tanked when somebody else's talent ran out. Having said that, Texas had top 10 recruting classes most years between 1980 and 1990 but their dreadful coaches did zero with improving talent over 4-5 years.

Looking back's silly now, I frequently posted Chizik (w/ significant staff changes) should be retained for one more full year because we owed it to him and because this recruiting class WAS phenomenal. Water under the bridge. Getting a great 1st recruiting class is a hallmark of great coaches and for all his assets, Gus is not a recruiting COORDINATOR.

Gus has been here for 2 weeks. It's mind-boggling how anyone can pin this recruiting class on Gus. Next year, all you guys can flame away on Gus because it will be ALL his.

[Rednilla 5,406]

Recruiting's the lifeblood of college football, the engine, and coaching's either adding slicks or re-treads so not really an "either/or" question. There's lots of proof recruiting is by far the more important of the 2 though ...especially in the SEC. Many, many great recruiters that are dicey game day coaches have had wild success (e.g. Lou Holtz, Nick Saban, Bobby Bowden, Joe Paterno) while Terry Bowden and Tyrone Whillingham are perfect examples of very good game day coaches that tanked when somebody else's talent ran out. Having said that, Texas had top 10 recruting classes most years between 1980 and 1990 but their dreadful coaches did zero with improving talent over 4-5 years.

Looking back's silly now, I frequently posted Chizik (w/ significant staff changes) should be retained for one more full year because we owed it to him and because this recruiting class WAS phenomenal. Water under the bridge. Getting a great 1st recruiting class is a hallmark of great coaches and for all his assets, Gus is not a recruiting COORDINATOR.

Gus has been here for 2 weeks. It's mind-boggling how anyone can pin this recruiting class on Gus. Next year, all you guys can flame away on Gus because it will be ALL his.

Yeah, the first class that signed under Chizik had three impact players, total, who stuck around for more than a year (Blake, Lutzie, and OMac). Or, well, I guess Fairley was in that class as well, but both he and OMac (and maybe Lutz, too, but I don't remember) were committed before Chizik came on board. All indications are that Gus will retain, if no one else, Jeremy Johnson, Earnest Robinson, Jason Smith, and Dee Liner, all of whom have plenty of potential to be impact players...so I'd say at least for the moment, Malzahn is doing no worse than holding serve with how Chizik started out.

[mustache eagle 2,430]

Yeah, the first class that signed under Chizik had three impact players, total, who stuck around for more than a year (Blake, Lutzie, and OMac). Or, well, I guess Fairley was in that class as well, but both he and OMac (and maybe Lutz, too, but I don't remember) were committed before Chizik came on board. All indications are that Gus will retain, if no one else, Jeremy Johnson, Earnest Robinson, Jason Smith, and Dee Liner, all of whom have plenty of potential to be impact players...so I'd say at least for the moment, Malzahn is doing no worse than holding serve with how Chizik started out.

that is an interesting point of view.

[Scooter1978 0]

Well Ellitor you said Tubbs was the reason Fairly played so good his first year he did nothing, Chiz shows up for the wholesummer and he is top ten in the draft. Look back at the Florida game at the end Roof calleda defense then Chiz changed it and shoot them down at the end of the year.

[Scooter1978 0]

those were Tubbs recruits if I am sure hang on one second. Yes that was tubbs recruiting class. We had a defensive coord. that had not seen a running quarterback. Offensive coord. Chiz should have fired very early when he saw it would not work. He then shoul have let Luper be the coord. Gus already has great players on the team. If we can get to the top 12 that would be a great goal.

[Scooter1978 0]

Well from the same guy who told me about Gus getting hired the day before. Which he is a insider and I am not told me be careful you might see Trey,Foster,and Liner end up at UGA.Which would be a shocker like the prospects like to do. Ellitor I hope I did not get confused on what you said you would probably kick me of the board for twice in a row.

[Scooter1978 0]

I am sorry that appears the discredit is complete. There were definitely other problems. Hence Gus firing the whole staff with few to no interviews. With that said Reality is when Chiz hired Gus then his offense became our team's identity and Chiz should have stuck with it. Chiz became envyous of Gus and the credit he and his offense was given. To the point where he put the clamps on Gus last year which in turn frustrated Gus to the point he took the Arky St. job. If Gene had danced with the girl who got him to the dance, namely Gus's offense, he would still be our HC and gus would have stayed as the OC. Gus may have very well been the new HC at Arky or Tennessee today.

We will just have to agree to disagree then. The last two years, yes, Chizik is the reason we fell apart. I just think he deserves some credit, at least, for the first two years, as well. Yes, I think Malzahn was the primary reason for it, and that's why I am so fully supportive of his hiring, but I do think Chiz had something to do with it. If nothing else, he should get credit for having the foresight to hire Gus...

Agree on that part. I can;t give Chiz much credit for the first few years other than that. He took an Auburn team that was coached up well in terms of developing talent by Tubb's staff and was lucky enough to have Superman and Fairley. Heck, we would not have had Cam if Gus did not plead Chiz to take him.,,,With all that said Gene is an excellent man but just not a good coach right now. If he finds a way to humble himself professionally then he will be a good coach again someday.

[Scooter1978 0]

I am sorry that appears the discredit is complete. There were definitely other problems. Hence Gus firing the whole staff with few to no interviews. With that said Reality is when Chiz hired Gus then his offense became our team's identity and Chiz should have stuck with it. Chiz became envyous of Gus and the credit he and his offense was given. To the point where he put the clamps on Gus last year which in turn frustrated Gus to the point he took the Arky St. job. If Gene had danced with the girl who got him to the dance, namely Gus's offense, he would still be our HC and gus would have stayed as the OC. Gus may have very well been the new HC at Arky or Tennessee today.

We will just have to agree to disagree then. The last two years, yes, Chizik is the reason we fell apart. I just think he deserves some credit, at least, for the first two years, as well. Yes, I think Malzahn was the primary reason for it, and that's why I am so fully supportive of his hiring, but I do think Chiz had something to do with it. If nothing else, he should get credit for having the foresight to hire Gus...

Agree on that part. I can;t give Chiz much credit for the first few years other than that. He took an Auburn team that was coached up well in terms of developing talent by Tubb's staff and was lucky enough to have Superman and Fairley. Heck, we would not have had Cam if Gus did not plead Chiz to take him.,,,With all that said Gene is an excellent man but just not a good coach right now. If he finds a way to humble himself professionally then he will be a good coach again someday.

[Scooter1978 0]

Ellitor you are right on about him being a good guy. He has a lot of class. Maybe I should not report but have got in touch with about boys and girls ranch. I am not someone special,blessed and want to do good in the world. Not throwig religion on anyone just pray that something good comes out of all of this .