Looking on to 2017 (Merged)

[AUDynasty 585]

Here's how I look at it. 2018 is the season I'm the most worried about.

Even if we do run the table with Stidham and we capture the national championship, how can I be sure that stability will be the theme after 2017 season? I cannot. We had Cam and Nick, and we have not shown any signs of sustainment. 

So, bottom line-- if we do win it all, I am still not sold until at least 2018. We never had back to back 10 win seasons, and that is a stat that I can't get over with. 

[cole256 17,084]

No excuses?!? Lol. If nothing else has been proven these last couple of years is there is always an excuse. We could play one good game all year and people would say look at the offense when we had a 6 ft hb and a left handed qb.....we proved that the offense is good then..... Who cares if it was against nowhere st. It would've been the same against bammer if we just had a left handed qb. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, AUDynasty said:

Here's how I look at it. 2018 is the season I'm the most worried about.

Even if we do run the table with Stidham and we capture the national championship, how can I be sure that stability will be the theme after 2017 season? I cannot. We had Cam and Nick, and we have not shown any signs of sustainment. 

So, bottom line-- if we do win it all, I am still not sold until at least 2018. We never had back to back 10 win seasons, and that is a stat that I can't get over with. 

I doubt Stidham will jump after one year.  He's got 3 to play.  Even so, Gus has realized that he needs more bodies at QB... thus the addition of Malik Willis to the 2017 class. So in 2018, even if he jumps, we have Sean, Woody, Malik, and at least currently, Joey. My guess is that this will be the last year that Gus is lacking QB dept, no matter where he's coaching.  Very hard lesson learned.

[doc4aday 1,887]

1 hour ago, Eagle-1 said:

Me too. I also hope I win the lottery Friday.

I actually won $5,000.00 on a scratch off. That was about 2 years ago. JJ should give Gus a list of quality OCs that he must choose from. Remember that JJ should be under the microscope with his job on the line. If this is the case, his primary candidates should be 1. Lincoln Riley 2. Kendall Briles. Guys, after this I am not sure who would be a solid candidate for the OC position. Gus could balk and resign if he has to let Lashlee go. This could happen. Gus has gotten himself in a bind that has to be corrected asap. This should happen a few weeks after the letter of intent has been signed and delivered. I really want to see how you all think for a new OC.

[YankeeTiger24 98]

19 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

I doubt Stidham will jump after one year.  He's got 3 to play.  Even so, Gus has realized that he needs more bodies at QB... thus the addition of Malik Willis to the 2017 class. So in 2018, even if he jumps, we have Sean, Woody, Malik, and at least currently, Joey. My guess is that this will be the last year that Gus is lacking QB dept, no matter where he's coaching.  Very hard lesson learned.

I get what you're saying here Lionheart, however they are all just bodies on a depth chart until they can prove they can play, and this leads me to my biggest problem with the head coach: he seems to need to rely on QBs that were coached by other coaches before he gets them. Either he can't spot talent, or can't develop it. The way I see things now, Sitdham may be a band-aid on a gunshot wound. If he lights it up for two years, saves Malzahn's job and leaves early for the NFL, I don't know if Malzahn could develop any of those guys. And we would be back to where we are now afterward. I dislike that I am so down about this right now, but Malzahn really did damage to his reputation with me this year.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 minute ago, YankeeTiger24 said:

I get what you're saying here Lionheart, however they are all just bodies on a depth chart until they can prove they can play, and this leads me to my biggest problem with the head coach: he seems to need to rely on QBs that were coached by other coaches before he gets them. Either he can't spot talent, or can't develop it. The way I see things now, Sitdham may be a band-aid on a gunshot wound. If he lights it up for two years, saves Malzahn's job and leaves early for the NFL, I don't know if Malzahn could develop any of those guys. And we would be back to where we are now afterward. I dislike that I am so down about this right now, but Malzahn really did damage to his reputation with me this year.

I understand your position, but in order to take that position, you have to marginalize what Sean has been able to do when he is healthy. The only weakness of his game (outside of the fact that he apparently breaks easily) is his long ball, and that's less about coaching and more about a combination of strength training and lots of reps. The only way you can say Gus can't develop talent is to believe that Sean was fully developed in high school... which is highly doubtful.  

The other issue with that belief system is that both Stidham and Gatewood want to come to Auburn, and both have stated that one of the reasons is for the coaching. I can't believe that a quarterback who is making a major life decision knows less about our coaches capabilities then a bunch of people who watch games and chat online.

I often wonder if Malzahn's rep with a lot of people would have been far less damaged if those same people hadn't repeatedly read rantings about him online. He screwed the pooch against Clemson, there's no doubt about that, but if you had every bit of information available to you about the rest of the season, I think you'd find that he did a far better job than many give him credit for.

[auburn4ever 1,266]

Gus has already coached two Auburn teams to 8-5 records in his 4 years at AU. What more will it take to fire Malzahn? another Gene Chizik. 3-9 overall and 0-8 in the SEC.

[ellitor 33,114]

3 minutes ago, auburn4ever said:

Gus has already coached two Auburn teams to 8-5 records in his 4 years at AU. What more will it take to fire Malzahn? another Gene Chizik. 3-9 overall and 0-8 in the SEC.

A similar year or worse, a new President, & no JJ.

[Gowebb11 9,367]

I'm

On 1/3/2017 at 1:26 PM, thaitopher said:

Sorry, but there is no way in hell even a developed serviceable backup quarterback beats that Oklahoma team.  Not gonna happen, hence my comment on lack of rational thinking on the part of  a lot of posters in here.

A serviceable backup QB might not have beaten Oklahoma, but it wouldve indicated our coaching staff had actually developed players and prepared players to s step up when needed. I am very hopeful for 2017. But I'm not sold on the idea that this years issues can all be explained away by injures and bad luck like some believe. Auburn has 7 or 8 straight top 10 recruiting classes on its roster. Yet Gus is coming off of 3 straight 5 loss seasons. JJ regressed mightily each year he has been here. That's a development issue. JF3 had one other offer: Buffalo. Injures aside, nothing about SW or TQ remotely resembles dual threat QB material, which is the offense Gus runs. It's his job to recruit and develop the right players to execute it. When Saban ran a pro style offense, he recruited tall pocket passers. Now he runs a spread and recruits dual threat guys.  Those are coaching evaluation issues. The Clemson gameplan was laughable. Fast forward to the Sugar Bowl and we punt on 4th and inches, when everyone can plainly see our D is struggling to get of the field and our O is limited in options. Stoops went for it on 4th and 4 yards and made it. That's the difference in winning 10 games a year versus losing 5 a year.   Gus has some serious deficiencies that he needs to fix immediately and I'm not sure he willing to acknowledge that. Hopefully he will. I love my Tigers and will be there for them next season, but Gus needs to step up big time. 

[YankeeTiger24 98]

1 hour ago, lionheartkc said:

I understand your position, but in order to take that position, you have to marginalize what Sean has been able to do when he is healthy. The only weakness of his game (outside of the fact that he apparently breaks easily) is his long ball, and that's less about coaching and more about a combination of strength training and lots of reps. The only way you can say Gus can't develop talent is to believe that Sean was fully developed in high school... which is highly doubtful.  

The other issue with that belief system is that both Stidham and Gatewood want to come to Auburn, and both have stated that one of the reasons is for the coaching. I can't believe that a quarterback who is making a major life decision knows less about our coaches capabilities then a bunch of people who watch games and chat online.

I often wonder if Malzahn's rep with a lot of people would have been far less damaged if those same people hadn't repeatedly read rantings about him online. He screwed the pooch against Clemson, there's no doubt about that, but if you had every bit of information available to you about the rest of the season, I think you'd find that he did a far better job than many give him credit for.

If you are under the impression that online yahoos have influenced my opinion of Malzahn, you are mistaken. I have blocked quite a few posters on this board because I got sick of their "change the coach" nonsense every time something went wrong. Also, if you take my post as anti Sean White in any way, that is also not correct. I think White has done just fine, however I don't think the offense has ever been modified to do what he does best, intermediate range throws. When they allow him to do it, he does it well. Mostly, they've had him throwing short. He doesn't throw deep well, but I believe he is someone that can win alot of games. I think with different coaching he would be even better. But this isn't about Sean White, it's about Malzahn. I thought last year was his best coaching job. After finding out Jeremy Johnson couldn't play, having to kick Duke Williams off the team because Duke Williams is an a**hole, and that embarrassing beatdown at LSU, he held the team together and broke Sean White in as a starter. The team rebounded after.  I give him credit for that.

Malzahn was a massive disappointment this year. He drug the QB competition late into fall camp, despite the fact that  White helped save the season last year, Johnson was a bust, and JF III was not starting material.Why did he **** around with that, isn't QB the most important position on offense? It seems like that is the one position you would want to declare early so you can build your offense around what the guy taking the snaps can do. Why wasn't White named the starter when he was obviously the best player at the position? Why did he treat the first half of the Clemson game like a televised scrimmage when it came to the quarterback position?  Then there was the questionable in-game strategy: play action passes against Texas A &M, leaving Myles Garrett unblocked so your BACKSIDE guard can pull and try to block him. That's plain stupid.  I always thought a coach should tailor the game plan to account for the strengths and weaknesses of the team he's playing. Yeah, we got hot after that, mainly because Lashlee was given more control. After that game, I don't recall seeing that idiotic "hide the QB play" much and there was much less nonsense. So at least Lashlee has that going for him. Then there was his handling of White in season. I believe he mind-****** his own team when he pulled White at the last minute against Vandy, at least that's what the played like in the first half. Then of course, there was the time he let Sean White play despite all evidence available to him that White's shoulder was so screwed he couldn't throw a five yard out. But that's probably because he knew he had no back up. Which brings up another question, why not burn the shirt on Woody Barrett? You know Johnson sucks, and JFIII won't be here past next year. Why not see if Barrett can play in mop up time? 

These are some of the things I've been thinking about since the Clemson game, which served as a slap in the face to me. I appreciate that you are a Malzahn fan, and I am not one of these a**holes that are secretly hoping for a losing season next year. Hell, I hope Malzahn shuts me up and sets me straight next year. I would love nothing more, but I leave this season the most pessimistic about him that I have ever been. You can dig in my post and tear every sentence apart and refute everything I've typed, but you won't change my mind. Only the head coach can do that this fall.

 

 

[Win4AU 4,054]

Based on this years performance, when healthy, I believe 2017 could be a great year.  UGA, Bama, Mississippi schools at home.  LSU and Clemson on road will be tough.  aTm, Arky, and Ole Miss should be meh. 11-1 playoff contender best case, 9-3 middle of the road, 8-5 worst case.

[autan 750]

1 hour ago, Win4AU said:

Based on this years performance, when healthy, I believe 2017 could be a great year.  UGA, Bama, Mississippi schools at home.  LSU and Clemson on road will be tough.  aTm, Arky, and Ole Miss should be meh. 11-1 playoff contender best case, 9-3 middle of the road, 8-5 worst case.

Glad to finally see a post with something positive to say. Wouldn't expect much support or encouragement for coaches or players to come from most of this crew.

[AUwent 3,768]

1 hour ago, Win4AU said:

Based on this years performance, when healthy, I believe 2017 could be a great year.  UGA, Bama, Mississippi schools at home.  LSU and Clemson on road will be tough.  aTm, Arky, and Ole Miss should be meh. 11-1 playoff contender best case, 9-3 middle of the road, 8-5 worst case.

Very early prediction: we enter the IB having lost to Clemson and one of LSU or Georgia, which will mean another battle for the division crown.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

5 hours ago, YankeeTiger24 said:

If you are under the impression that online yahoos have influenced my opinion of Malzahn, you are mistaken. I have blocked quite a few posters on this board because I got sick of their "change the coach" nonsense every time something went wrong. Also, if you take my post as anti Sean White in any way, that is also not correct. I think White has done just fine, however I don't think the offense has ever been modified to do what he does best, intermediate range throws. When they allow him to do it, he does it well. Mostly, they've had him throwing short. He doesn't throw deep well, but I believe he is someone that can win alot of games. I think with different coaching he would be even better. But this isn't about Sean White, it's about Malzahn. I thought last year was his best coaching job. After finding out Jeremy Johnson couldn't play, having to kick Duke Williams off the team because Duke Williams is an a**hole, and that embarrassing beatdown at LSU, he held the team together and broke Sean White in as a starter. The team rebounded after.  I give him credit for that.

Malzahn was a massive disappointment this year. He drug the QB competition late into fall camp, despite the fact that  White helped save the season last year, Johnson was a bust, and JF III was not starting material.Why did he **** around with that, isn't QB the most important position on offense? It seems like that is the one position you would want to declare early so you can build your offense around what the guy taking the snaps can do. Why wasn't White named the starter when he was obviously the best player at the position? Why did he treat the first half of the Clemson game like a televised scrimmage when it came to the quarterback position?  Then there was the questionable in-game strategy: play action passes against Texas A &M, leaving Myles Garrett unblocked so your BACKSIDE guard can pull and try to block him. That's plain stupid.  I always thought a coach should tailor the game plan to account for the strengths and weaknesses of the team he's playing. Yeah, we got hot after that, mainly because Lashlee was given more control. After that game, I don't recall seeing that idiotic "hide the QB play" much and there was much less nonsense. So at least Lashlee has that going for him. Then there was his handling of White in season. I believe he mind-****** his own team when he pulled White at the last minute against Vandy, at least that's what the played like in the first half. Then of course, there was the time he let Sean White play despite all evidence available to him that White's shoulder was so screwed he couldn't throw a five yard out. But that's probably because he knew he had no back up. Which brings up another question, why not burn the shirt on Woody Barrett? You know Johnson sucks, and JFIII won't be here past next year. Why not see if Barrett can play in mop up time? 

These are some of the things I've been thinking about since the Clemson game, which served as a slap in the face to me. I appreciate that you are a Malzahn fan, and I am not one of these a**holes that are secretly hoping for a losing season next year. Hell, I hope Malzahn shuts me up and sets me straight next year. I would love nothing more, but I leave this season the most pessimistic about him that I have ever been. You can dig in my post and tear every sentence apart and refute everything I've typed, but you won't change my mind. Only the head coach can do that this fall.

I think there is a lot more to each situation than we may be aware of. For instance, the dragging out of the QB race. The more I think about it, the more I wonder if Gus was told the he had to get a dual threat at QB. The way it played out is out of character for him, especially with Franklin's known issues with ball protection.

As for playing Sean hurt, what choice did he have? Sean was saying he was ok, and both of our backups proved ineffective. Contrary to popular belief, if you rewatch that game, he was accurate on the majority of his throws. The blame for that loss can be spread around quite a bit.

In the case of Woody, from what I've heard, he has some maturity issues to deal with before he takes the field.

I wouldn'wouldn't call myself a Gus fan anymore. I, personally think the best thing Gus could do is replace Rhett with someone from a compatible but different system, so he could grow. That being said, the sheer hatered, buoyed by assumptions spoken as truths, that is seeping out of every crevice around here is a little disgusting.

[aubaseball 2,648]

Posters were all over me when I said OU was gonna be hard to beat and that it wasn't going to be fun to watch.   I don't khow how next year will turn out, but I know that stidham is the best QB we have signed since cam.   He is not the type of QB cam was in that he can run over someone for three yards and a first down.   But he is the best passer that has been at auburn in a long time.   If Gus and company can develop a plan to utilize his strengths, it will be an exciting year on offense 

[ToomersStreet 795]

2017 post Iron Bowl comments from Gus Malzahn:  We just didn't get it done today, but we are getting better and will get better. 

Reporter:  What do you think and about the disappointment this season has been?

Gus: It was a learning season.  We'll get better.

Reporter:  You seemed to struggle with injuries?

Gus: No doubt.

Reporter:  When will you start preparing for your bowl game?

Gus: No Doubt!

Reporter: In the future will you wear a hat or visor?

Gus: No Doubt!

[PatBoCamRob 30]

On 12/17/2016 at 3:24 PM, TAYLORKEETON said:

I do think if SW & KP would've stayed healthy the ending of the season wouldn't played out a little differently. 

A good team starts with good recruiting.  With a win of the MNC in 2010 and an appearance in 2013, not to mention the recruiting draw of "if you wanna play Bama, come here," we should be doing a better job of recruiting.  Period.  

See "Spurrier at USCe."  What was the difference between Spurrier at UF and Spurrier at USCe?  He wasn't recruiting like he could at Fla.  And, the result was he got athletes with legacy injuries that he rode until they got hurt again.  That's not a recipe for winning or for attracting new talent.  We need to win without cortisone. That takes solid players and depth.

As long as Sean White wears orange and blue, I'm a fan.  But the fact of the matter is that he couldn't stay on the field this year or last year.  And the reason Auburn has a starting quarterback that can't throw 40 yards or stay healthy is that the coaching staff misjudged, mismanaged, or failed to recruit at that position.  And Gus has shown he needs a QB to win.

Nick Marshall took on the mantle of athlete quarterback very well.  And the rest of the team did a superb job of adapting to him.  But, that's not the most likely outcome in most years.  

The Malzahn/Lashlee tandem believes itself to be such a sophisticated offensive scheme that, in the absence if SW- and sometimes when he's not hurt, it feels it is appropriate to substitute quarterbacks more frequently than halfbacks or receivers.  That's not football.  That's not going to win games.  

Honestly, if you had told me at the beginning of the season SW would have re-injured himself twice; and that the solution would have been to play musical chairs at the position, I would have settled for 4-8 starting (developing) Woody Barrett or Tyler Queen.  

 

I think that's what has many of us concerned.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, PatBoCamRob said:

we should be doing a better job of recruiting.  Period.

Wow... this is fascinating to me.  You do realize before 2009 we spent the majority of the time in the top 20-30 in recruiting and not the top 10 that we have been living in since the Chizik/Malzahn era, right? We are living in the Golden Age of Auburn Recruiting to date.  We are also directly competing with several of the hardest schools to recruit against, and are in direct rivalry with a team that buys whoever they want and strategically undermines us as often as they can.

Yes, the whole Franklin project was head scratching (I'm still not sure it wasn't dictated from on high), and Gus has learned some hard lessons about recruiting for depth and not counting on star players to finish their 4 years, but to claim that recruiting, in general, is our problem is questionable at best.

[AUsince72 11,084]

2 hours ago, lionheartkc said:

Wow... this is fascinating to me.  You do realize before 2009 we spent the majority of the time in the top 20-30 in recruiting and not the top 10 that we have been living in since the Chizik/Malzahn era, right? We are living in the Golden Age of Auburn Recruiting to date.  We are also directly competing with several of the hardest schools to recruit against, and are in direct rivalry with a team that buys whoever they want and strategically undermines us as often as they can.

Yes, the whole Franklin project was head scratching (I'm still not sure it wasn't dictated from on high), and Gus has learned some hard lessons about recruiting for depth and not counting on star players to finish their 4 years, but to claim that recruiting, in general, is our problem is questionable at best.

I don't know about this.

Seems to me that he needs to stop recruiting 8-5 players and start recruiting 14-0 players.  Isn't that how bammer does it?

[TAYLORKEETON 807]

2 hours ago, PatBoCamRob said:

A good team starts with good recruiting.  With a win of the MNC in 2010 and an appearance in 2013, not to mention the recruiting draw of "if you wanna play Bama, come here," we should be doing a better job of recruiting.  Period.  

See "Spurrier at USCe."  What was the difference between Spurrier at UF and Spurrier at USCe?  He wasn't recruiting like he could at Fla.  And, the result was he got athletes with legacy injuries that he rode until they got hurt again.  That's not a recipe for winning or for attracting new talent.  We need to win without cortisone. That takes solid players and depth.

As long as Sean White wears orange and blue, I'm a fan.  But the fact of the matter is that he couldn't stay on the field this year or last year.  And the reason Auburn has a starting quarterback that can't throw 40 yards or stay healthy is that the coaching staff misjudged, mismanaged, or failed to recruit at that position.  And Gus has shown he needs a QB to win.

Nick Marshall took on the mantle of athlete quarterback very well.  And the rest of the team did a superb job of adapting to him.  But, that's not the most likely outcome in most years.  

The Malzahn/Lashlee tandem believes itself to be such a sophisticated offensive scheme that, in the absence if SW- and sometimes when he's not hurt, it feels it is appropriate to substitute quarterbacks more frequently than halfbacks or receivers.  That's not football.  That's not going to win games.  

Honestly, if you had told me at the beginning of the season SW would have re-injured himself twice; and that the solution would have been to play musical chairs at the position, I would have settled for 4-8 starting (developing) Woody Barrett or Tyler Queen.  

 

I think that's what has many of us concerned.

Yeah man I agree 

[auburn4ever 1,266]

Another 8 wins next years should get Malzahn fired. Why? because that would Gus' 3rd 8 win season in 5 years.

[TigerNBham 3]

On ‎12‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 0:53 PM, tombigbeetiger said:

no, it won't be time to turn up the heat....if he doesn't win at least ten games, it time to replace him...no more excuses

I am a bottom line family member.  I will love my kin but if they can't do the job, I believe it is time for a change.  0 and 8 against UGA and Bama is just plan unacceptable. As is his bowl, 1 - 4 and record against top 10 teams.  Face it folks, we have a luvable guffaw.   Gus has to have 11 wins and both of those two IF IT WAS my decision next year.  Otherwise, and we keep him, Doug Barfield # 2 in my mind.  

[Tiger 8,830]

54 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

I don't know about this.

Seems to me that he needs to stop recruiting 8-5 players and start recruiting 14-0 players.  Isn't that how bammer does it?

I think we can win a national title with our roster next season. 90% of our yardage this season was by freshman and sophomores. I'm just not sure if our coaches will put our players in the best position to succeed though. That is my main concern.

[AUsince72 11,084]

14 minutes ago, Tiger said:

I think we can win a national title with our roster next season. 90% of our yardage this season was by freshman and sophomores. I'm just not sure if our coaches will put our players in the best position to succeed though. That is my main concern.

I believe wholeheartedly that AU can win the SEC and even Natty with next year's roster.  I was being facetious and might should chosen the poking a stick emoticon HAHA!

I agree with you.  Players (recruiting) ain't what's holding AU back right now.

[Tiger 8,830]

5 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

I believe wholeheartedly that AU can win the SEC and even Natty with next year's roster.  I was being facetious and might should chosen the poking a stick emoticon HAHA!

I agree with you.  Players (recruiting) ain't what's holding AU back right now.

Gotcha, 72. Totally agree with you too. It's like we are so close but still so far.