Al Borges?

[selias 2,398]

7 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

He is the part of the staff that Gus doesn’t talk with or listen to.

AKA Everyone but Gus

[caleb1633 1,418]

I don't understand why everyone thinks Borges is so great. He did great his first year with arguably the most talented team to take the field at Jordan Hare, but the offense's performance declined each year after that. Blame it on Tubberville's handcuffing or lack of recruiting if you want, but I saw Borges' creativity decline and he also failed to adjust when teams began figuring out his offense. 

With that said, he'd still do better with our offensive weapons than Gus is.

[clwn 336]

24 minutes ago, caleb1633 said:

I don't understand why everyone thinks Borges is so great. He did great his first year with arguably the most talented team to take the field at Jordan Hare, but the offense's performance declined each year after that. Blame it on Tubberville's handcuffing or lack of recruiting if you want, but I saw Borges' creativity decline and he also failed to adjust when teams began figuring out his offense. 

With that said, he'd still do better with our offensive weapons than Gus is.

Borges was 41-9 as Auburn's OC. That's why. Gulf Coast wasn't flashy, but it got the W.  05 was pretty fun to watch, especially the Iron Bowl that year. Also, look back at some of those "declining" years 06 and 07 UF games. Offense scored enough and when they didn't Defense/Special teams came through when needed.

I'd sure as hell loved to have him back in the orange and blue on the sidelines. Maybe we'd look like Auburn again.

[caleb1633 1,418]

We scored two TDs against UF in 07 and ZERO against them in 06. His offense wouldn't keep up with the ones we see today. We would be pulling our hair out because he had some similar tendencies to Gus. Well scripted first drive, then he'd be stalled and not show near as much the rest of the game. His creativity went out the window in 06 & 07 as well. In 04 and 05 he'd do end arounds, bunch formations, put two RBs on the field at the same time, etc. These all virtually disappeared in 06 & 07. We all conveniently forget how glad we were when he was let go.

[clwn 336]

Glad? Nah. Auburn stopped being Auburn when JJ demanded the Spread nonsense be brought in on the plains. We went against a nice formula of boring Pro-Style mixed with ferocious Defense. Now our 2 biggest rivals beat us pretty much every year as they get big Wins using that same formula. Go figure. Before the what about 2010 and 2013? Easy, Cam Newton literally carrying everything on his shoulders. And NM along with Tre and one hell of a line just running the damn ball down everyone's throat plus some wonderful divine intervention.

Before all that we could line up and just beat people, especially our rivals without relying on flukes.

 

[caleb1633 1,418]

1 hour ago, clwn said:

Glad? Nah. Auburn stopped being Auburn when JJ demanded the Spread nonsense be brought in on the plains. We went against a nice formula of boring Pro-Style mixed with ferocious Defense. Now our 2 biggest rivals beat us pretty much every year as they get big Wins using that same formula. Go figure. Before the what about 2010 and 2013? Easy, Cam Newton literally carrying everything on his shoulders. And NM along with Tre and one hell of a line just running the damn ball down everyone's throat plus some wonderful divine intervention.

Before all that we could line up and just beat people, especially our rivals without relying on flukes.

 

Bama and Georgia both have much more dynamic offenses than what was showcased the last two years under Borges. It isn't so much about whether it's spread or pro-style as it is being able to adjust your play calling to what the defense is doing. You can do that with spread or pro-style. Borges was unable to adjust his offense accordingly.

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,676]

1 hour ago, clwn said:

Glad? Nah. Auburn stopped being Auburn when JJ demanded the Spread nonsense be brought in on the plains. We went against a nice formula of boring Pro-Style mixed with ferocious Defense. Now our 2 biggest rivals beat us pretty much every year as they get big Wins using that same formula. Go figure. Before the what about 2010 and 2013? Easy, Cam Newton literally carrying everything on his shoulders. And NM along with Tre and one hell of a line just running the damn ball down everyone's throat plus some wonderful divine intervention.

Before all that we could line up and just beat people, especially our rivals without relying on flukes.

 

The game has changed though. I think with our current talent and 2 deep, we wouldn’t have a chance in hell beating Alabama just trying to run a pro style. FSU proved that and they’re one of 2 or 3 teams with actual Alabama talent. Maybe if that pro style includes heavy option packages for Malik (as well as throwing off those options), but Stidham just lining back and throwing it with no misdirection ...

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

12 hours ago, clwn said:

Glad? Nah. Auburn stopped being Auburn when JJ demanded the Spread nonsense be brought in on the plains. We went against a nice formula of boring Pro-Style mixed with ferocious Defense. Now our 2 biggest rivals beat us pretty much every year as they get big Wins using that same formula. Go figure. Before the what about 2010 and 2013? Easy, Cam Newton literally carrying everything on his shoulders. And NM along with Tre and one hell of a line just running the damn ball down everyone's throat plus some wonderful divine intervention.

Before all that we could line up and just beat people, especially our rivals without relying on flukes.

 

Make no mistake you absolutely can win with the spread. The problem with Malzahn is that the playcalling has been horrific. I was a critic of Lashlee for a long time, but with how Gus has the final say in play calling now, it's clear HE is the problem with the offense. This is quite odd because his offense is what he hired him for. BUT that is ABSOLUTELY on Gus and not the "spread" offense. Truth be told, something got to Gus...he lost HIS edge. That doesn't mean there is a flaw in the spread offensive scheme. I hate to say it, but Saban and Alabama right now is a once in a generation "thing." He has only lost 13 since 08. No coach has more than 2 wins over him since then. Gus has 1 (spread) Freeze has 2 (spread) and Meyer has 2 (spread) and Dabo has at least 1. So the spread absolutely can beat Alabama. Had Gus continued to recruit DT QBs, rather than trying to prove it could work with a pocket passer? Who knows what could of happened. But again, that's a problem with Malzahn, NOT the spread offense.

11 hours ago, Dual-Threat Rigby said:

The game has changed though. I think with our current talent and 2 deep, we wouldn’t have a chance in hell beating Alabama just trying to run a pro style. FSU proved that and they’re one of 2 or 3 teams with actual Alabama talent. Maybe if that pro style includes heavy option packages for Malik (as well as throwing off those options), but Stidham just lining back and throwing it with no misdirection ...

That is the whole issue with people wanting to change back to a pro style offense. This team has been recruited to win now with the right coach. Changing to a pro style offense will give us a few bad years of growing pains. Everything is different from the offensive linemen to running backs to wide outs, to tight ends. EVERYTHING has to be recruited differently. 2012 bring any flashbacks? I still believe Kiehl Fraizer could of excelled here had we stuck with a spread style OC rather than trying to force him to run an offense he was not recruited for and had never ran a day in his football career, which got in his head, but that's just my opinion.

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

And Al Broges was my man crush for the season (I got in late) but he absolutely should be taken advantage of, it's a shame he isn't. 

[PotPot 162]

Al Borges can absolutely coach offense. 2006-07 he was handicapped by an extremely limited QB. And that is not a knock against Brandon Cox. He is one of my all time favorites for playing through a medical condition that would have sidelined most and took a beating because of it. Auburn2Eugene, I have been saying for a while now that something happened to Gus. It might even follow the same timeline as whatever it was that happened to Jeremy Johnson. Gus coaches scared. Like psycho, clinical level (there is a phobia for this but I'm too lazy to look it up). Whenever the chips are down, he reverts to the safest play that he has. He harps incessantly about ball security. Only plays the guys that he completely trusts (and he's probably still playing some that he doesn't trust because the rules say you have to put 11 on the field) and he only lets them run the plays that he is most confident in them being able to run (see Clemson 2016 QB rotation, etc). That's not the Gus that we hired but I don't know where the other Gus went. This Gus is possibly just one step away from taking a knee three times and punting 

[Tiger 8,829]

I'm pretty sure Gus sold his soul to the devil for a run in 2013 and now we are seeing the result

[milehighfan 1,240]

I also read yesterday Gus the Great is not worried about his job security. I guess Gus the Great is living by Paulie in the movie Goodfellas.

Lost another game I should have won?  F..k you, pay me.

Still have no idea what I'm doing? F..k you,  pay me.

Still doing my best to completely ruin the football program? F..k you, pay me.

[TigerFanAU 586]

2 hours ago, PotPot said:

Al Borges can absolutely coach offense. 2006-07 he was handicapped by an extremely limited QB. And that is not a knock against Brandon Cox

Exactly. I love brandon Cox, but he was not Jason Campbell.  Much slower, and weaker arm. Borges was very limited in what he could do. I'd love to see Borges and his West Coast offense with Stidham.

[DyeCampAlum 335]

Borges didn't run West Coast late in his career, did he?

More to the point, he can make observations but he cannot communicate with the other coaches on game day in his position.

[auburn4ever 1,266]

Al needs to jump off the Gus bus while he still can. He's a good man and I hate to see him taken down.

[Auburn2Eugene 2,317]

4 hours ago, PotPot said:

Al Borges can absolutely coach offense. 2006-07 he was handicapped by an extremely limited QB. And that is not a knock against Brandon Cox. He is one of my all time favorites for playing through a medical condition that would have sidelined most and took a beating because of it. Auburn2Eugene, I have been saying for a while now that something happened to Gus. It might even follow the same timeline as whatever it was that happened to Jeremy Johnson. Gus coaches scared. Like psycho, clinical level (there is a phobia for this but I'm too lazy to look it up). Whenever the chips are down, he reverts to the safest play that he has. He harps incessantly about ball security. Only plays the guys that he completely trusts (and he's probably still playing some that he doesn't trust because the rules say you have to put 11 on the field) and he only lets them run the plays that he is most confident in them being able to run (see Clemson 2016 QB rotation, etc). That's not the Gus that we hired but I don't know where the other Gus went. This Gus is possibly just one step away from taking a knee three times and punting 

Well you know they say it' a fine line between genius and madness... Seems like he has taken that next step.

[caleb1633 1,418]

2 hours ago, TigerFanAU said:

Exactly. I love brandon Cox, but he was not Jason Campbell.  Much slower, and weaker arm. Borges was very limited in what he could do. I'd love to see Borges and his West Coast offense with Stidham.

He had Cox in 05 and put up good numbers as well. The issue wasn't near as much Cox as it was that he lost his creativity and his offense was figured out. Two plays he ran regularly in 04 and 05 were the FB wheel route and putting two RBs in the backfield, faking to one and throwing a swing pass to the other (first play of 04 UGA game). Both plays had great success his first two years, but were not near as successful his last two years. Why? DCs figured out his tricks. Neither of those plays require even a halfway gifted QB to execute.

[Beaker 2,457]

As stated:

Borges biggest contribution to this team would be the interim HC and do all the pressers.

Let the OC run with little interference and guide Chip with some experience here and there.  Stay out of Steele's way.

Declare to the free world we are hiring, before Tenn fires Butch and the other teams fire their HC.   

Possible open jobs in the SEC alone:  Ole Miss, UT, Auburn,    maybe even Ark, possibly aTm, possibly UK (Stoops could go where football is important), way outside chance is UF (5-7 record).   Too many jobs, not enough great candidates.

[PotPot 162]

19 hours ago, caleb1633 said:

He had Cox in 05 and put up good numbers as well. The issue wasn't near as much Cox as it was that he lost his creativity and his offense was figured out. Two plays he ran regularly in 04 and 05 were the FB wheel route and putting two RBs in the backfield, faking to one and throwing a swing pass to the other (first play of 04 UGA game). Both plays had great success his first two years, but were not near as successful his last two years. Why? DCs figured out his tricks. Neither of those plays require even a halfway gifted QB to execute.

After 2005, defensive coordinators had figured out that Cox couldn't throw beyond 30 yards and even if he did it would be a floater that any average db could catch up to if he was beaten. Always 9 in the box and no defender more than 10 yards from the line of scrimmage ever

[Tiger 8,829]

Also Borges' OLines were not particularly good in pass protection. I'm surprised Brandon Cox survived his entire career. That kid took an absolute beating.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

Holy crap at this thread. Al was shown the door at AU because he might have worked 6 hours a day? Hard to coach a team when you are at home with your young wife. And you have to recruit. Which Al wouldn't do. 

And did someone say JJ brought the spread to AU? Lol. Tubs did that trying to save his job. But his buddy Hugh derailed that. 

Lets stop with the Al for OC. That is a bigger joke than Gus. 

[AUApostle 7,651]

17 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Holy crap at this thread. Al was shown the door at AU because he might have worked 6 hours a day? Hard to coach a team when you are at home with your young wife. And you have to recruit. Which Al wouldn't do. 

And did someone say JJ brought the spread to AU? Lol. Tubs did that trying to save his job. But his buddy Hugh derailed that. 

Lets stop with the Al for OC. That is a bigger joke than Gus. 

Al fumbled the QB position just as bad or worse than Gus...it's why Trademark had to go out and recruit a JUCO to start.  He was gifted Campbell and Cox...all the ones he recruited were busts.

[Strychnine 1,802]

14 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Holy crap at this thread. Al was shown the door at AU because he might have worked 6 hours a day? Hard to coach a team when you are at home with your young wife. And you have to recruit. Which Al wouldn't do. 

And did someone say JJ brought the spread to AU? Lol. Tubs did that trying to save his job. But his buddy Hugh derailed that. 

Lets stop with the Al for OC. That is a bigger joke than Gus. 

 

If there is one thing Auburn fans seem to love, it is former head coaches not named Bowden, and assistant coaches.  I have lost count of how many times I have seen people advocating for Tuberville to replace Jay Jacobs over the years.  A recent one I have been seeing more of is Tuberville or Borges as interim head coach.  Why not make Chizik the interim head coach?  He did at least win a national championship.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

1 minute ago, AUDevil said:

Al fumbled the QB position just as bad or worse than Gus...it's why Gus had to go out and recruit a JUCO to start.  He was gifted Campbell and Cox...all the ones he recruited were busts.

Hard to get QB's when you won't leave and recruit.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

1 minute ago, Strychnine said:

 

If there is one thing Auburn fans seem to love, it is former head coaches not named Bowden, and assistant coaches.  I have lost count of how many times I have seen people advocating for Tuberville to replace Jay Jacobs over the years.  A recent one I have been seeing more of is Tuberville or Borges as interim head coach.  Why not make Chizik the interim head coach?  He did at least win a national championship.

Only two ex-coaches I'd love to see back at AU would be Trooper and Thig. Trooper has gotten the worst deal as far as what fans think than any coach in the last 30 years at AU. Most of what troop was accused of doing was Chiz's doing. 

Thig was the man also. 

Also Wouldn't mind Eddie Gran back in some capacity. He is also good peeps.