What should Gus and Bruce Pearl be learning

[Tiger 8,827]

47 minutes ago, dyehardfanAU said:

Depends on what you call "dirty" I guess.  I have a strong feeling that we're "playing the game" with the level of talent we're recruiting.

Oh I definitely know that we are but we are doing it within reason. Bruce ain't gonna get sloppy with it after all he's been through.

The Will Wades and Sean Millers and Bill Selfs of the world though, they're being reckless. I don't think we are reckless on the trail. And that's the happy medium. 

Those that want us to be as clean as the ivy schools are just gonna have to count the wins as they pile up through their disappointment. We have to "play the game" to keep up but there are more clever and smarter ways to do it than for the HC to tell a kids handler that he's looking at a strong ass offer. 

[abw0004 10,125]

3 hours ago, Tiger said:

To be fair our bball program isn't *dirty* like some are insinuating.

We had a rogue assistant going into business for himself. Nothing he was doing was giving AU an competitive advantage like what was going on at other schools in this FBI scandal. Bruce wasn't giving STRONG ASS OFFERS out here to kids to commit and help AU achieve success. This was Person's personal mission to steer kids to a financial adviser for his own financial gain. He was doing this on his own time, not on Bruce/our recruiting time. I think it's ok Bruce didn't know what was happening here with this and also I think in some of the transcripts released Person was recorded explicitly telling Danjel and Wiley not to mention this stuff to Bruce. This isn't Pitino implementing strippers into official visits to entice kids to sign. Is Bruce supposed to wipe Person's ass too? I get the HC should be on top of all his assistants but IMO a HC can only be in control of basketball related activities and recruiting when it comes to assistants and the Chuck Person BS was not happening in those quarters.

Compare with Will Wade who himself was facilitating payments to prospects. And all others who were looking to benefit their programs and gain a competitive advantage. Chuck was not trying to do that -- but yes, while trying to do that some kids lost eligibility -- and I think that is where the common ground stops when we are looking at our situation and other schools' situations.

Not trying to attack @keesler or @abw0004 with this post, and I apologize for the tone if it comes off as abrasive, it's just I'm salty at how we got our name thrown into this crap when we were just caught in the fray.  I just don't think we should be considered DIRTY when we weren't cheating. Yes, I understand it was against the rules to give Danjel and Wiley money but we, as a team, as a program, gained nothing from giving them money -- they were already on our roster.

I wasn’t necessarily saying we were dirty.  But when you look at everything so far, half of Bruce Pearl’s tenure here have been under investigation by the FBI.  Bruce has also been fired from a school for cheating.  Pearson was an employee of his which still reflects on him.  Not saying that is fair, but that is just how it is with any leadership position in any industry.  And after this we hired another assistant in Ira Bowman who is also under investigation.  You can only claim you were innocent so many times.  And I want to reiterate that I am a Bruce fan, and I hate to bring up what I just did.  I really does pain me to say those things.  

[AU64 10,122]

The NCAA is slow but relentless in many ways.  I don't think Wade is off the hook....maybe temporarily but I'm looking for LSU to get hammered too for allowing it and taking no action.....well other than firing their AD who tried to rein in WW.  

LSU is not a blue blood, despite their recent football success....and I see no reason for the NCAA to turn a blind eye to them like they do to the true "blue bloods".       JMO...The bengals will get theirs.....just might be a while.

[keesler 5,924]

16 hours ago, GwillMac6 said:

I am shocked he did not get fired over that stuff truthfully. I mean he was caught red handed on tapes talking about paying players. I give LSU credit for for having the balls to go against what literally everyone in the media were saying in that they had to fire him. For the most part all of that noise has died down and people have just accepted he is going to still be LSU Head Coach for now. The def weathered the storm in a big way.

The Will Wade tapes are locked down and no one will ever hear them, so LSU treats it as hearsay and the NCAA can't do a damn thing about it.  Joe Alleva was demoted from the AD position all because he suspended Wade for the tape recording.  LSU proved they are win at all cost and they want Wade leading that team.

[keesler 5,924]

14 hours ago, AU64 said:

The NCAA is slow but relentless in many ways.  I don't think Wade is off the hook....maybe temporarily but I'm looking for LSU to get hammered too for allowing it and taking no action.....well other than firing their AD who tried to rein in WW.  

LSU is not a blue blood, despite their recent football success....and I see no reason for the NCAA to turn a blind eye to them like they do to the true "blue bloods".       JMO...The bengals will get theirs.....just might be a while.

The NCAA will never hear those tapes, they are sealed.

But that doesn't change the fact that we all know what Will Wade is, and his reckless pursuit of cheating will eventually out him and LSU.  I doubt Mark Emmert will allow the NCAA to do anything drastic to his son-in-law's sports programs, but I'd still like to see it happen.

[keesler 5,924]

18 hours ago, Tiger said:

To be fair our bball program isn't *dirty* like some are insinuating.

We had a rogue assistant going into business for himself. Nothing he was doing was giving AU an competitive advantage like what was going on at other schools in this FBI scandal. Bruce wasn't giving STRONG ASS OFFERS out here to kids to commit and help AU achieve success. This was Person's personal mission to steer kids to a financial adviser for his own financial gain. He was doing this on his own time, not on Bruce/our recruiting time. I think it's ok Bruce didn't know what was happening here with this and also I think in some of the transcripts released Person was recorded explicitly telling Danjel and Wiley not to mention this stuff to Bruce. This isn't Pitino implementing strippers into official visits to entice kids to sign. Is Bruce supposed to wipe Person's ass too? I get the HC should be on top of all his assistants but IMO a HC can only be in control of basketball related activities and recruiting when it comes to assistants and the Chuck Person BS was not happening in those quarters.

Compare with Will Wade who himself was facilitating payments to prospects. And all others who were looking to benefit their programs and gain a competitive advantage. Chuck was not trying to do that -- but yes, while trying to do that some kids lost eligibility -- and I think that is where the common ground stops when we are looking at our situation and other schools' situations.

Not trying to attack @keesler or @abw0004 with this post, and I apologize for the tone if it comes off as abrasive, it's just I'm salty at how we got our name thrown into this crap when we were just caught in the fray.  I just don't think we should be considered DIRTY when we weren't cheating. Yes, I understand it was against the rules to give Danjel and Wiley money but we, as a team, as a program, gained nothing from giving them money -- they were already on our roster.

You cause no offense to me Tiger, none at all.  I think we view things in much the same way, I don't think Auburn is dirty by any means.  But that doesn't change the fact that there's evidence dirty things were done under the AU Brand.   I view the Persons case a little more realistically as it relates to the NCAA, and I don't see us skating on probation.

I'm hopeful that Auburn's Compliance handed down enough self-imposed sanctions to thwart any more penalties.  I mean we lost an entire freaking recruiting class, had to sit the two players for a season, fired coaches and may have served even more restrictions that we don't know of.  I would be shocked if we don't get NCAA probation, this could very well end up a Level I infraction just for the Persons/Wiley/Purifoy $$ crap + a possible a Level II/III for Bruce not knowing what members of his staff were doing. 

I hate that Auburn had their name thrown into this mess, but a former AU player turned Asst HC was making deals with other former AU players (the parents) of current AU knowing chose to break the rules and they drug their own school down in the mud.

 

[Tiger 8,827]

@keesler and @abw0004 You guys both have good points.  I'm just hoping that the way we compromised the eligibility of the kids are properly viewed as different from the transgressions going on at other schools that were caught by the FBI sting. I understand it doesn't look good. Especially Ira Bowman on the heels of Person. Even though that was a different and separate scandal altogether. The optics are just bad.

While I know it all looks bad, I'm glad this type of stuff was being found across the entire country. I think that may help us dodge an NCAA bullet (fingers crossed). Especially with how different in nature our issues were with those funneling money through shoe companies to the players during recruiting to secure commitments. I feel that is substantially less "dirty" than what other schools were caught doing. And of course that doesn't mean I don't think we play the game I just hope we're not so egregiously flippant towards the rules in the way Will Wade/Sean Miller/Bill Self are.

[McLoofus 35,182]

So would the SEC be able to swing any weight in all of that? I mean, I know that the rest of the world spends its time plotting to destroy Auburn, but the SEC has a vested interest in having teams in the tournament and making deep runs, right? Besides Kentucky and Auburn, are there any contenders? LSU, maybe? I realize this might be a naive take but it seems like Bruce Pearl at Auburn officially makes the SEC a lot more relevant in mens hoops and they'd be wise to offer any protection they can. But maybe there are reasons not to or maybe the SEC can't offer any help at all. 

[Tiger 8,827]

9 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

So would the SEC be able to swing any weight in all of that? I mean, I know that the rest of the world spends its time plotting to destroy Auburn, but the SEC has a vested interest in having teams in the tournament and making deep runs, right? Besides Kentucky and Auburn, are there any contenders? LSU, maybe? I realize this might be a naive take but it seems like Bruce Pearl at Auburn officially makes the SEC a lot more relevant in mens hoops and they'd be wise to offer any protection they can. But maybe there are reasons not to or maybe the SEC can't offer any help at all. 

I think Mike Slive might have. For some reason I get the feeling Sankey is not a Bruce fan. He looked like he was forced to give us the trophy during the SECT celebration. And I'm not usually a guy who buys into that type of thing but it felt like you couldn't pay the dude to smile.

[keesler 5,924]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

So would the SEC be able to swing any weight in all of that? I mean, I know that the rest of the world spends its time plotting to destroy Auburn, but the SEC has a vested interest in having teams in the tournament and making deep runs, right? Besides Kentucky and Auburn, are there any contenders? LSU, maybe? I realize this might be a naive take but it seems like Bruce Pearl at Auburn officially makes the SEC a lot more relevant in mens hoops and they'd be wise to offer any protection they can. But maybe there are reasons not to or maybe the SEC can't offer any help at all. 

I don't see Sankey doing anything to help protect Auburn.  He'll climb up Cal's greasy rearend at UK but he has no use for Pearl or Wade after the ish hit the fan that drug two SEC programs through the headlines and the ESPN scanner for all to see.

I'm not sure the SEC office has much pull with the NCAA investigations.  They didn't with the ridiculous Mizzou & Ole Miss cases, those teams were hammered relentlessly.

[GwillMac6 20,687]

2 minutes ago, keesler said:

I don't see Sankey doing anything to help protect Auburn.  He'll climb up Cal's greasy rearend at UK but he has no use for Pearl or Wade after the ish hit the fan that drug two SEC programs through the headlines and the ESPN scanner for all to see.

I'm not sure the SEC office has much pull with the NCAA investigations.  They didn't with the ridiculous Mizzou & Ole Miss cases, those teams were hammered relentlessly.

Though they are just ole Miss and Mizzou. I doubt the home office wants to throw their weight around for them.

We are one of their flag ship and most prominent schools though.

[keesler 5,924]

6 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

Though they are just ole Miss and Mizzou. I doubt the home office wants to throw their weight around for them.

We are one of their flag ship and most prominent schools though.

True.  I'm just not sure how much weight the conference heads carry with NCAA when our wrongdoing looked blatant and deliberate, (speaking solely about Persons and the coaches he roped in Sullivan/VanHurst).  Persons even coached the players/parents on the fact that it was against the ncaa rules and to keep it quiet.

[AURealist 2,185]

Gus has nothing to learn.  He should hold seminars on the art of striking insane contracts with people who have more dollars than sense.

Bruce needs to hold 15 minute pre-game 'How to Play the Game of Basketball' refreshers for his team.  Watching our basketball games is becoming

a lot like watching our football games.  

[abw0004 10,125]

On 1/29/2020 at 10:45 AM, keesler said:

You cause no offense to me Tiger, none at all.

Actually I was incredibly offended by @Tiger and I demand a written apology in 500 words or less from him.