Anti Vaxxer Honor Roll

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

@homersapienand @Leftfield, I agree it is hilarious.  Ever since the Reagan years and all the flu outbreaks he has remained behind the scenes.  Now, he is the main driver (unelected as he is) of policies because our current President doesn’t know how to take his information and decide for himself what is good for the American people.

[homersapien 11,461]

2 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

@homersapienand @Leftfield, I agree it is hilarious.  Ever since the Reagan years and all the flu outbreaks he has remained behind the scenes.  Now, he is the main driver (unelected as he is) of policies because our current President doesn’t know how to take his information and decide for himself what is good for the American people.

No, it was your response that was hilarious.

Glad to clear that up for you. And the only thing that has changed is Trump and his MAGAs.

Edited October 15, 2021 by homersapien

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Just another example of how stupid this is. 

The bright side of all this is I bet the dems get crushed in the mid term elections and hopefully the 2024 election as well. 

The chant will get louder......

Let's Go Brandon!!!!!!

Longtime News Anchor Fired for Not Getting COVID Shot After Doctor Told Him Not to (msn.com)

[TitanTiger 20,530]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

He didn’t become political until recently. 

He didn't make himself political.  He became political because dipshits who'd rather believe pseudoscience made everything surrounding COVID political and because he shot down their pet theories, they got big mad.

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

4 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

He didn't make himself political.  He became political because dipshits who'd rather believe pseudoscience made everything surrounding COVID political and because he shot down their pet theories, they got big mad.

You’re probably not going to believe this, but we disagree here.  

Dr Fauci told the Washington Post the US was in for a "whole lot of hurt".

He also offered an assessment of how both President Donald Trump and his Democratic rival, Joe Biden, are approaching the pandemic.

The US has recorded more deaths and cases than any other country.

According to data collated by Johns Hopkins University, deaths in the US have now passed 230,000, while more than nine million cases have been registered.

In his interview with the Post published on Saturday night, Dr Fauci warned that "all the stars are aligned in the wrong place as you go into the fall and winter season, with people congregating at home indoors."

"You could not possibly be positioned more poorly," he said.

When asked about the approaches of the two presidential candidates, Dr Fauci said Mr Biden was "taking it seriously from a public health perspective", while Mr Trump was "looking at it from a different perspective… the economy and reopening the country".

He said the US needed to make an "abrupt change" in public health practices and behaviours.

The comments drew a sharp rebuke from the White House, which accused Dr Fauci of attempting to bolster Mr Biden's bid for the presidency.

Spokesman Judd Deere said the comments were "unacceptable and breaking with all norms".

"As a member of the [US Coronavirus] Task Force, Dr Fauci has a duty to express concerns or push for a change in strategy, but he's not done that, instead choosing to criticise the president in the media and make his political leanings known by praising the president's opponent," he added in a statement.

https://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-54774137

So the actual date Fauci turned political was November 1, 2020 just days before the election and didn’t have anything to do with people that believe in pseudoscience.  Dr. Fauci was in charge of his own political future.

[Leftfield 2,676]

31 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

You’re probably not going to believe this, but we disagree here.  

Dr Fauci told the Washington Post the US was in for a "whole lot of hurt".

He also offered an assessment of how both President Donald Trump and his Democratic rival, Joe Biden, are approaching the pandemic.

The US has recorded more deaths and cases than any other country.

According to data collated by Johns Hopkins University, deaths in the US have now passed 230,000, while more than nine million cases have been registered.

In his interview with the Post published on Saturday night, Dr Fauci warned that "all the stars are aligned in the wrong place as you go into the fall and winter season, with people congregating at home indoors."

"You could not possibly be positioned more poorly," he said.

When asked about the approaches of the two presidential candidates, Dr Fauci said Mr Biden was "taking it seriously from a public health perspective", while Mr Trump was "looking at it from a different perspective… the economy and reopening the country".

He said the US needed to make an "abrupt change" in public health practices and behaviours.

The comments drew a sharp rebuke from the White House, which accused Dr Fauci of attempting to bolster Mr Biden's bid for the presidency.

Spokesman Judd Deere said the comments were "unacceptable and breaking with all norms".

"As a member of the [US Coronavirus] Task Force, Dr Fauci has a duty to express concerns or push for a change in strategy, but he's not done that, instead choosing to criticise the president in the media and make his political leanings known by praising the president's opponent," he added in a statement.

https://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-54774137

So the actual date Fauci turned political was November 1, 2020 just days before the election and didn’t have anything to do with people that believe in pseudoscience.  Dr. Fauci was in charge of his own political future.

Someone asked him a question, he answered truthfully, and you say that's him becoming political? Would you prefer that he lied? It's not like he held a press conference or released a written statement.

I wonder if you noticed that he was right? The surge began in earnest right around that time.

 

[TitanTiger 20,530]

9 minutes ago, Leftfield said:

Someone asked him a question, he answered truthfully, and you say that's him becoming political? Would you prefer that he lied? It's not like he held a press conference or released a written statement.

I wonder if you noticed that he was right? The surge began in earnest right around that time.

 

He’s got quite the talent for reading words and infallibility misinterpreting/misrepresenting them. 

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

2 hours ago, Leftfield said:

Someone asked him a question, he answered truthfully, and you say that's him becoming political? Would you prefer that he lied? It's not like he held a press conference or released a written statement.

I wonder if you noticed that he was right? The surge began in earnest right around that time.

 

Did you read this part?

Spokesman Judd Deere said the comments were "unacceptable and breaking with all norms".

"As a member of the [US Coronavirus] Task Force, Dr Fauci has a duty to express concerns or push for a change in strategy, but he's not done that, instead choosing to criticise the president in the media and make his political leanings known by praising the president's opponent," he added in a statement.

Yes, that’s being political for a non-elected bureaucrat whose serves at the pleasure of the President.

Yes, I noticed he was right, he was also right about the variants.  Science and Dr Fauci had no solution and more people have died in 2021 so far than all of 2020.

You asked if I preferred he lied.  Dr. Fauci should not have answered if he was truly apolitical.  Some people do not have critical thinking skills.

[Leftfield 2,676]

31 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Did you read this part?

Spokesman Judd Deere said the comments were "unacceptable and breaking with all norms".

"As a member of the [US Coronavirus] Task Force, Dr Fauci has a duty to express concerns or push for a change in strategy, but he's not done that, instead choosing to criticise the president in the media and make his political leanings known by praising the president's opponent," he added in a statement.

A Trump mouthpiece complaining about unacceptable comments and breaking norms? That would be the funniest thing I've read in a while if it weren't so pathetic.

Anyone who knew anything about the pandemic knew that Fauci disagreed with the way Trump was handling it. It was no secret - Fauci had been trying to steer him to handle it responsibly for months. He was as diplomatic with his answer as he could possibly be. Just because you didn't like his answer doesn't mean he was being political. While he serves at the pleasure of the President, his duty is to the American people. He saw the disaster that was about to happen, and spoke truthfully about what needed to be done. It would have been irresponsible for him to not be vocal about it.

 

42 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Yes, I noticed he was right, he was also right about the variants.  Science and Dr Fauci had no solution and more people have died in 2021 so far than all of 2020.

It's lovely how you admit he was right, then put all the blame on him and the scientific community, but none on the population that ignored their advice.

We've already gone over when the surges took place. The death rate from the winter surge began to peak shortly before Biden took office and stayed at that level for almost a month. That was not the Delta variant. Then when cases started going down too many states relaxed, including some blue states, but certainly leading the charge were the Trump lackey governors hell bent on fully opening and removing mask mandates because 'Murica. 

I wonder how you expected "Science and Dr. Fauci" to be able to quickly have a solution to the Delta variant? Just come up with a new vaccine by the time it reached the States and save us all, before the first vaccine had even been mass distributed yet? For someone who constantly preaches that we're all responsible for our own health and safety, you sure seem to put a lot of undue responsibility on the scientific community. When it suits your argument, at least. I guess that's critical thinking.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Just a little tidbit from Vermont........

76% of September Covid-19 deaths are vax breakthroughs – Vermont Daily Chronicle

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

11 hours ago, Leftfield said:

It's lovely how you admit he was right, then put all the blame on him and the scientific community, but none on the population that ignored their advice.

We've already gone over when the surges took place. The death rate from the winter surge began to peak shortly before Biden took office and stayed at that level for almost a month. That was not the Delta variant. Then when cases started going down too many states relaxed, including some blue states, but certainly leading the charge were the Trump lackey governors hell bent on fully opening and removing mask mandates because 'Murica. 

I wonder how you expected "Science and Dr. Fauci" to be able to quickly have a solution to the Delta variant? Just come up with a new vaccine by the time it reached the States and save us all, before the first vaccine had even been mass distributed yet? For someone who constantly preaches that we're all responsible for our own health and safety, you sure seem to put a lot of undue responsibility on the scientific community. When it suits your argument, at least. I guess that's critical thinking.

If you look at this issue from 35,000 ft and not in the weeds you notice there is only ONE person that has presided over more than 700,000 deaths.  He is the undisputed leader of *the science* and has been lifted to the level of an exalted leader.

Without a vaccine, COVID-19 was responsible for 352,000 deaths in 2020.  The way the government attacked the virus in 2020 was following the Constitution and letting each state deal with this issue with support from the Federal Government.  This was not the way *the science* thought it should be, but it is what it is.  The vaccine was developed in record time and even though that ONE person publicly said it wouldn’t happen as soon as reported, it was and now it is THE mitigating factor going forward. 

Now that we have this vaccine and the ONE person and *the science* (one in the same) has the ear of the Executive Branch, we see that the vaccine is being used as THE mitigating factor in the form of a mandate.  This mandate is being applied in spite of each state’s right to deal with their states issues as was the previous administration’s policy.  The present administration is using this mandate in a *I would rather ask forgiveness then ask permission* type of approach, basically a cramp down. 

This is the direct result of the Delta variant in which *the science* foresaw, but didn’t have any solution other than to double down on what didn’t work with the original virus.  I doubt *the science* could develop a new variant vaccine (booster) as he didn’t think the original could be done in such a time frame that it did.  So instead of focusing on therapeutics, that would truly save lives, it was decided to blame the population that ignored *the sciences’* advice.  As of a week or so ago, there have been 353,000 deaths in 2021.

If only the population would have obeyed the exalted ONE we would all be saved.  Alas, in all of human history 100% compliance is difficult to accomplish.  Undaunted, *the science* has decided it is better to ruin the unwashed lives by destroying their way of sustaining their lives.  That should do it.  *The science* will not allow any other science to penetrate it’s rule by any other ideas as *the science* is, well, *the science*.  This has been echoed by media that any other idea, whether pseudoscience or not, can not be true science and will be banned from thought.  After all, there is no data *the science* recognizes as good data and we shall not consider anything that may actually save the unwashed.  They are just not compliant.

Could *the science* have put more effort in developing a therapeutic or searching for a therapeutic that the previous administration did not mention as something that might work?  Maybe and maybe it might work, but it would undermine the exalted one’s message.  It is a true conundrum for the unwashed. 

I do wonder why, after more than 700,000 deaths, we shouldn’t take a fresh look at the problem before we ruin mores lives?  Alas, people will still follow the exalted one no matter what he foresees, but has no idea how to deal with the problem.

Stay afraid, very afraid.

Lefty, I hope you enjoyed the story.

[Leftfield 2,676]

2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Lefty, I hope you enjoyed the story.

I thought it was glorious. It's rare that someone puts that much effort into showing they have no idea what they're talking about.

 

[TitanTiger 20,530]

On 10/15/2021 at 10:20 PM, wdefromtx said:

Just a little tidbit from Vermont........

76% of September Covid-19 deaths are vax breakthroughs – Vermont Daily Chronicle

Let us do a little experiment in basic logic:

If a state had 100% of its population vaccinated, what percentage of breakthrough cases would be vaccinated people?

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

Let us do a little experiment in basic logic:

If a state had 100% of its population vaccinated, what percentage of breakthrough cases would be vaccinated people?

Is the population of that state allowed to travel to a state that is not 100% vaccinated?

[TitanTiger 20,530]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Is the population of that state allowed to travel to a state that is not 100% vaccinated?

Of course. Not sure how that changes the question, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. 

[I_M4_AU 8,012]

30 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Of course. Not sure how that changes the question, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. 

It doesn’t change the question, but it could change the answer.

In your hypothetical; is your vaccine very effective such as the MMR or polio, or as effective as the Covid-19?

For the MMR and Polio one does not have fear that there will be any breakthrough cases no matter where you traveled.

This is not the case with the Covid-19 vaccine, see Israel as they are heavily vaccinated and still get breakthrough cases.   They have shut down travel and so has Australia for fear of breakthrough infections.

If we are talking about just the Covid-19 vaccination if the state did not allow travel I would think there would be very few if any breakthrough cases.  However, if travel is allowed it would increase the chance of breakthrough cases.

[TitanTiger 20,530]

6 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

It doesn’t change the question, but it could change the answer.

In your hypothetical; is your vaccine very effective such as the MMR or polio, or as effective as the Covid-19?

For the MMR and Polio one does not have fear that there will be any breakthrough cases no matter where you traveled.

This is not the case with the Covid-19 vaccine, see Israel as they are heavily vaccinated and still get breakthrough cases.   They have shut down travel and so has Australia for fear of breakthrough infections.

If we are talking about just the Covid-19 vaccination if the state did not allow travel I would think there would be very few if any breakthrough cases.  However, if travel is allowed it would increase the chance of breakthrough cases.

It's irrelevant.  There will be breakthrough cases. It's multiple times less likely you'll even get infected if you're vaccinated than being unvaccinated.  That's a plain fact.  But to the point of my question, Vermont has 88% of their population vaccinated.  Basic mathematical odds tell you in such a situation, the cases you do see are likely to mostly be from vaccinated people.  There are hardly any unvaccinated folks left in the state.  What also is true of Vermont is that unlike Alabama and other places where people believe bull**** - their ICUs weren't overwhelmed.  Because they aren't seeing as many infections, neither in raw numbers or per capita.

The lesson here is:  Stop using stats to insinuate lies.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

9 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

It's irrelevant.  There will be breakthrough cases. It's multiple times less likely you'll even get infected if you're vaccinated than being unvaccinated.  That's a plain fact.  But to the point of my question, Vermont has 88% of their population vaccinated.  Basic mathematical odds tell you in such a situation, the cases you do see are likely to mostly be from vaccinated people.  There are hardly any unvaccinated folks left in the state.  What also is true of Vermont is that unlike Alabama and other places where people believe bull**** - their ICUs weren't overwhelmed.  Because they aren't seeing as many infections, neither in raw numbers or per capita.

The lesson here is:  Stop using stats to insinuate lies.

Lol, stats are stats. Just posting what they are seeing in Vermont. 

[TitanTiger 20,530]

34 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

Lol, stats are stats. Just posting what they are seeing in Vermont. 

Yeah, but what they are seeing in Vermont is completely reasonable.  It would be like saying "88% of people currently infected with COVID in Vermont are white" and using that as some insinuation that it tells us anything about the vulnerability of white people to the virus compared to others.  But then you look and see that Vermont is 92.5% white and realize that stat tells you nothing.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

32 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Yeah, but what they are seeing in Vermont is completely reasonable.  It would be like saying "88% of people currently infected with COVID in Vermont are white" and using that as some insinuation that it tells us anything about the vulnerability of white people to the virus compared to others.  But then you look and see that Vermont is 92.5% white and realize that stat tells you nothing.

No actually what it tells us is that at least in Vermont over that month you were statistically 0.001% less likely to die from Covid if you were vaccinated than if you were not. This is a far cry from the claimed 11x less likely to die from Covid if you are vaccinated.

BTW, Vermont is only about 67% fully vaccinated. 

The stats are what they are, you can't just start ignoring them if you don't like what they show.

[TitanTiger 20,530]

Just now, wdefromtx said:

No actually what it tells us is that at least in Vermont over that month you were statistically 0.001% less likely to die from Covid if you were vaccinated than if you were not. This is a far cry from the claimed 11x less likely to die from Covid if you are vaccinated.

What it actually tells us is that you don't know s*** about how to read or understand statistics.

Let's walk through the basics again.  If Vermont were 100% vaccinated, even if they had just one COVID death last month, it would mean 100% of the COVID deaths were vaccinated people.  What it would NOT tell you is that the stats on how less likely one is to die from COVID are somehow off.

Quit while you're behind.

 

Just now, wdefromtx said:

BTW, Vermont is only about 67% fully vaccinated. 

The stats are what they are, you can't just start ignoring them if you don't like what they show.

It's not that I don't like what they show.  It's that they don't show what you're trying to act like they do.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

2 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

What it actually tells us is that you don't know s*** about how to read or understand statistics.

Let's walk through the basics again.  If Vermont were 100% vaccinated, even if they had just one COVID death last month, it would mean 100% of the COVID deaths were vaccinated people.  What it would NOT tell you is that the stats on how less likely one is to die from COVID are somehow off.

Quit while you're behind.

 

It's not that I don't like what they show.  It's that they don't show what you're trying to act like they do.

No s*** sherlock......BUT GUESS WHAT?!? They aren't 100% vaccinated and as of now, there is practically ZERO difference between being vaccinated or not according to their numbers. 

 

[TitanTiger 20,530]

6 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

No s*** sherlock......BUT GUESS WHAT?!? They aren't 100% vaccinated and as of now, there is practically ZERO difference between being vaccinated or not according to their numbers. 

 

They are far more vaccinated than almost any other state in the union.  67% fully vaccinated (compared to about 40% for Alabama for instance) and 88% have received at least one dose.  And that doesn't even get into how much higher a percentage of Vermont's population is older compared to others.  You're looking at one month of data and extrapolating completely unwarranted conclusions from it.  But given your past arguments on the matter, it's completely par for the course.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Just now, TitanTiger said:

They are far more vaccinated than almost any other state in the union.  67% fully vaccinated (compared to about 40% for Alabama for instance) and 88% have received at least one dose.  And that doesn't even get into how much higher a percentage of Vermont's population is older compared to others.  You're looking at one month of data and extrapolating completely unwarranted conclusions from it.  But given your past arguments on the matter, it's completely par for the course.

Alabama's rate has no bearing on Vermont's. I agree that Vermont has a much older population, I suppose it is a shame that they thought they were being protected 11x more by the vaccine. 

Only time will tell, but I am willing to wager that in the end we will find out that the vaccines aren't near as effective as they try to spin the numbers to be.

In fact it is not looking good already. And why is it the health department is started to not fully breakdown the numbers?!?

I will give you a hint....................it is because they don't want this getting out!!!

I am sure we should just ignore this right?!?

57% of October Covid deaths “full vaccinated,” unvaxxed % unknown – Vermont Daily Chronicle

[TexasTiger 13,054]

3 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

Alabama's rate has no bearing on Vermont's. I agree that Vermont has a much older population, I suppose it is a shame that they thought they were being protected 11x more by the vaccine. 

Only time will tell, but I am willing to wager that in the end we will find out that the vaccines aren't near as effective as they try to spin the numbers to be.

In fact it is not looking good already. And why is it the health department is started to not fully breakdown the numbers?!?

I will give you a hint....................it is because they don't want this getting out!!!

I am sure we should just ignore this right?!?

57% of October Covid deaths “full vaccinated,” unvaxxed % unknown – Vermont Daily Chronicle

I’m sure you will reach that conclusion.